Shams: Porzingis to Boston?

[Neurotic Guy]

Well I'll hand it to Brad. Thought we were going to just run it back. But he's making big changes to the roster

Yeah, I am surprised too. Aggressive move. Big time risk to take (injury risk, cost of contract extension, possible limitation of future flexability as a result). That risk taking by PBS surprises me also.

I will say though how much more of an injury risk is he than brogdon?

Brogdon played the highest amount of games in his career since his rookie season last year.

And then ended up getting hurt in the playoffs, resulting in him laying a massive egg against Miami.

Porzingis and Brogdon are both injury-prone, but I would much rather take a chance on Porzingis' ceiling than Brogdon's.

That's logical -- but I really did like Brogdon on this team in 22-23.  Will miss him.   Roster is better balanced with KP - though losing Grant and Malcolm, pushes the C's 3-point shooting % down a notch.  Gallo didn't play obviously, but he would have been a logical replacement for some of the lost 3-point % - but he'll be gone too.  I hope this leads to an offense less invested in the 3 -- somehow that doesn't feel likely.

[Valid]

still surprised Brad making this type of trade. this is like a Danny "fireworks" shoot for the stars trade to try and get the team over the top

also indicates us going more back towards a more traditional lineup and less small ball? Although I do wonder if Boston didn't expect White to improve as much as he did which kind of created a redundancy/logjam with Smart/White/Brogdon.

I think it's just more of the fact that Porzingis is one of the best talents in the league and would vastly improve this team so long as he stays healthy (which is obviously a big if, but it's not like Brogdon and Gallinari ever stay healthy, anyway). Imagine a defensive frontline of Porzingis and Robert Williams. Good luck scoring at the rim.

The only downside of this move is the potential loss of Grant Williams if the Celtics end up not being able to afford to keep him.

[Valid]

Well I'll hand it to Brad. Thought we were going to just run it back. But he's making big changes to the roster

Yeah, I am surprised too. Aggressive move. Big time risk to take (injury risk, cost of contract extension, possible limitation of future flexability as a result). That risk taking by PBS surprises me also.

I will say though how much more of an injury risk is he than brogdon?

Brogdon played the highest amount of games in his career since his rookie season last year.

And then ended up getting hurt in the playoffs, resulting in him laying a massive egg against Miami.

Porzingis and Brogdon are both injury-prone, but I would much rather take a chance on Porzingis' ceiling than Brogdon's.

That's logical -- but I really did like Brogdon on this team in 22-23.  Will miss him.   Roster is better balanced with KP - though losing Grant and Malcolm, pushes the C's 3-point shooting % down a notch.  Gallo didn't play obviously, but he would have been a logical replacement for some of the lost 3-point % - but he'll be gone too.  I hope this leads to an offense less invested in the 3 -- somehow that doesn't feel likely.

Keep in mind we have free agency to fill those slots. I'm sure Brad can find a couple of cheap guys who can shoot the 3-ball. Those players are always out there.

And this is assuming the Celtics even lose Grant. They can still re-sign him, but it would just cost a bit in tax.

[cman88]

still surprised Brad making this type of trade. this is like a Danny "fireworks" shoot for the stars trade to try and get the team over the top

also indicates us going more back towards a more traditional lineup and less small ball? Although I do wonder if Boston didn't expect White to improve as much as he did which kind of created a redundancy/logjam with Smart/White/Brogdon.

I think it's just more of the fact that Porzingis is one of the best talents in the league and would vastly improve this team so long as he stays healthy (which is obviously a big if, but it's not like Brogdon and Gallinari ever stay healthy, anyway). Imagine a defensive frontline of Porzingis and Robert Williams. Good luck scoring at the rim.

The only downside of this move is the potential loss of Grant Williams if the Celtics end up not being able to afford to keep him.

Yeah I think we will miss Grant williams defensive versatility and 3 point shooting. we didn't get to see too much of it this playoffs because Milwaukee went out in the 1st round

Granted Brad still has a possible grant S&T, free agency and $5million MLE to add guys

[SHAQATTACK]

We still need a Head Coach.

Fire joe

[Who]

I have a strong sense that Porzingis will not make a big impact here in Boston. The main reason being that he usually does not throughout his career. His impact tends to be less than his at times guady stats. Not an empty stats player but a less than player.

That said, Porzingis doesn't need to make a big impact here in order to be a success. This team is so close to winning a title than even a small impact could be enough to put this team over the top and win the Championship. That is exciting.

[jay]

Regarding the G. Will situation, it seems like Dallas wants him super badly. Would something like G. Will for Bullock and Josh Green be interesting for anyone? A role player and an interesting young player to fill out our wing depth. Honestly, I have a hard time predicting how much the league values G. Will, so this may be off base.

I actually brought that up on page 11 on this thread. I think it balances the roster.

Bigs - KP, AL, Rob, Muscala?

Wings - JT, JB, Green, Bullock, Hauser

Guards - Smart, White, PP

[Who]

Great deal for the Clippers.

Sorta like us last year. Getting Brogdon for a steal. Just one late first for a player as good as Brogdon is fantastic business.

[keevsnick]

The Boston Celtics will be $8M below the second tax apron with 12 players after acquiring Kristaps Porzingis. If Grant Williams doesn’t return, they still have enough flexibility to use the $5M tax MLE. Re-signing him would take them over the second apron, eliminating the MLE.

I can't imagine we match any offer for Grant.

The 2nd apron doesn't really matter much this year. The only thing you lose is the MLE, the other penalties don't kick in this year. So really the question is what is

a) Grant on whatever contract he gets offered
b) 5 Million MLE guy + tax savings.

They could easily re-sign grant, it would just cost them  a lot in tax.

And it would lock them into a midrange contract that they couldn't afford to keep, and would start the clock on a repeater tax.

They are going to be in the repeater tax no matter what, the line for that is the luxury tax line not the second apron so that's not really an issue.  The "locked in" contract thing is only a big deal if its a contract you don't think will be movable for an asset.

Basically this boils down to Grant isn't going to be here long term, but if the contract he ends up getting offered is good value they should match it then trade him down the lien for an asset. If its good value but the other team is willing to give you an asset in a S&T do that. If its not good value let him walk.

What you consider "good value" is in the eye of the beholder. But if some team comes and offers 10M/year just to tries and snipe him the c's SHOULD match, because all it costs this year is money. My point is if they don't it would be for no other real reason than saving money this year.

Of course if some team wants to get stupid with an offer he'll be gone, but that was always the case.

[libermaniac]

I have a strong sense that Porzingis will not make a big impact here in Boston. The main reason being that he usually does not throughout his career. His impact tends to be less than his at times guady stats. Not an empty stats player but a less than player.

That said, Porzingis doesn't need to make a big impact here in order to be a success. This team is so close to winning a title than even a small impact could be enough to put this team over the top and win the Championship. That is exciting.

Ya. Pretty sure he’s always been the #2 option on his other teams. Here, he’d be the third. Hopefully it’s a big difference.

[GreenEnvy]

Well I'll hand it to Brad. Thought we were going to just run it back. But he's making big changes to the roster

Yeah, I am surprised too. Aggressive move. Big time risk to take (injury risk, cost of contract extension, possible limitation of future flexability as a result). That risk taking by PBS surprises me also.

I will say though how much more of an injury risk is he than brogdon?

Brogdon played the highest amount of games in his career since his rookie season last year.

And then ended up getting hurt in the playoffs, resulting in him laying a massive egg against Miami.

Porzingis and Brogdon are both injury-prone, but I would much rather take a chance on Porzingis' ceiling than Brogdon's.

That's logical -- but I really did like Brogdon on this team in 22-23.  Will miss him.   Roster is better balanced with KP - though losing Grant and Malcolm, pushes the C's 3-point shooting % down a notch.  Gallo didn't play obviously, but he would have been a logical replacement for some of the lost 3-point % - but he'll be gone too.  I hope this leads to an offense less invested in the 3 -- somehow that doesn't feel likely.

I think I read that KP’s 3PT rate was only .352, so he’s not just a 3pt shooter and I hope Joe and co don’t try to turn him into one. He ranked 1st (in the entire league) is post scoring at 1.29 ppp. He has a very versatile repertoire.

I really wonder how they are going to set their lineup. Do they go huge with KP AND Horford/Williams alongside him?

Smart
Brown
Tatum
Horford
Porzingis

Yeah, I like that.

[Who]

I have a strong sense that Porzingis will not make a big impact here in Boston. The main reason being that he usually does not throughout his career. His impact tends to be less than his at times guady stats. Not an empty stats player but a less than player.

That said, Porzingis doesn't need to make a big impact here in order to be a success. This team is so close to winning a title than even a small impact could be enough to put this team over the top and win the Championship. That is exciting.

Ya. Pretty sure he’s always been the #2 option on his other teams. Here, he’d be the third. Hopefully it’s a big difference.

I expect it to work the other way. I look at Porzingis as a player who does better in bigger roles and worse in smaller roles. So shifting to a lesser role in Boston will negatively impact him.

I am also thinking of Chris Bosh going from #1 in Toronto to #3 in Miami. Kevin Love #1 in Minnesota to #3 in Cleveland. How their on-court impact decreased a lot with the shift into a smaller role.

Bosh a high BBIQ player and smart team defender who became more of an intangibles guy than a star player in Miami. Kevin Love did not have the defensive chops to do what Bosh did defensively and K Love never found his role offensively next to LeBron & Kryrie so he disappointed even more.

I look at Porzingis as a guy with defensive talent (unlike K Love) but a low BBIQ. I don't think he finds his role in a team offense well. And I do not trust him to dedicate himself to defense because whenever he hasn't gotten the ball enough on offense his defensive effort has dropped off.

[keevsnick]

Well I'll hand it to Brad. Thought we were going to just run it back. But he's making big changes to the roster

Yeah, I am surprised too. Aggressive move. Big time risk to take (injury risk, cost of contract extension, possible limitation of future flexability as a result). That risk taking by PBS surprises me also.

I will say though how much more of an injury risk is he than brogdon?

Brogdon played the highest amount of games in his career since his rookie season last year.

And then ended up getting hurt in the playoffs, resulting in him laying a massive egg against Miami.

Porzingis and Brogdon are both injury-prone, but I would much rather take a chance on Porzingis' ceiling than Brogdon's.

That's logical -- but I really did like Brogdon on this team in 22-23.  Will miss him.   Roster is better balanced with KP - though losing Grant and Malcolm, pushes the C's 3-point shooting % down a notch.  Gallo didn't play obviously, but he would have been a logical replacement for some of the lost 3-point % - but he'll be gone too.  I hope this leads to an offense less invested in the 3 -- somehow that doesn't feel likely.

I think I read that KP’s 3PT rate was only .352, so he’s not just a 3pt shooter and I hope Joe and co don’t try to turn him into one. He ranked 1st (in the entire league) is post scoring at 1.29 ppp. He has a very versatile repertoire.

I really wonder how they are going to set their lineup. Do they go huge with KP AND Horford/Williams alongside him?

Smart
Brown
Tatum
Horford
Porzingis

Yeah, I like that.

A .352 #PA rate isn't high overall in basketball terms, but its pretty high for center. Its about the same as JB last year.

[jmen788]

Why can't we give up Pritchard instead of Gallo? Our bench has no depth or pop now. If it were Pritchard instead of Gallo I would love the deal, but now I don't. KP is intriguing for sure but he is hurt a lot and on top of it we have no depth for when/if he gets hurt. Do not like this unless there is another domino to fall.

I like the fit of KP a lot more but based on us giving up hot garbage for Brogdon and LAC doing the same, but us now giving him up plus Gallo, don't like the value. Great value for us last year and for LAC this year, though.

[goCeltics]

If, when the trade goes thru, the c's could target morris if he gets bought out to fill the grant role with the taxpayer mle.