Author Topic: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick  (Read 58358 times)

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Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #150 on: March 19, 2014, 07:57:08 PM »

Offline D.o.s.

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It's not trollish to say that the best prospects don't play four years of NCAA ball. It's a fact.

I guess Tim Duncan wasn't considered a good prospect
Fair enough. Brandon Roy was also a four year prospect. So was one of your favorites -- David Lee. And Steve Nash. And Jameer Nelson. And Damian Lillard. There are good and great players who are four year guys.

However Duncan's been on the record saying that he wanted to graduate before he went pro. Doug McDermott stayed in school to (rightly) improve his draft stock. So that's Apples to chainsaws.

Also, out of the 450 NBA players in the league, that's about half a roster's worth of players. Food for thought.

I think these charts are pretty interesting:

« Last Edit: March 19, 2014, 08:04:45 PM by D.o.s. »
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Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #151 on: March 19, 2014, 08:03:51 PM »

Offline D.o.s.

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Also, this is a pretty great read, and deserves its own post:
http://nba.si.com/2014/03/19/doug-mcdermott-nba-draft-college-four-year-one-and-done/
At least a goldfish with a Lincoln Log on its back goin' across your floor to your sock drawer has a miraculous connotation to it.

Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #152 on: March 19, 2014, 08:52:05 PM »

Offline Tr1boy

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Also, this is a pretty great read, and deserves its own post:
http://nba.si.com/2014/03/19/doug-mcdermott-nba-draft-college-four-year-one-and-done/

Mcdermotts 1st year stat is better than some players 3rd, 4th years. Every year its been the same advanced production

He needed to get stronger/quicker and refine his game(minor tweaks) and thats why he stayed imo. He also wants to go further in MM.

If he wanted to get drafted at a nice spot he could of left last year. Why would you risk going in this years , when its much stronger ?

Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #153 on: March 19, 2014, 09:35:23 PM »

fitzhickey

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Blasphemer!

Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #154 on: March 19, 2014, 09:46:09 PM »

Offline Tr1boy

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Blasphemer!

man those cheerleaders are ugly

Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #155 on: March 20, 2014, 12:53:15 AM »

Offline EvilEmpire

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Mcdermott, Sully, and Olynyk on the floor at the same time/   :-\

Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #156 on: March 20, 2014, 03:18:48 AM »

Offline Galeto

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McDermott's 45 point game on March 8th against Providence is available on youtube so I watched its entirety to break down one of his greatest games.  Those interested can watch it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQYAlQguFwY

Overall totals:

45 pts
17-25 FG, 5-7 from 3
6-9 FT
7 RB
2 assist
3 TO

Of his 12 makes from 2-point range, all were at the rim.  All 18 of his 2-point FGAs were from 2 feet and in.  He had one transition dunk and three post up finishes.  Everything else was drives to the rim.  He is capable of driving with either hand but seems to favor his left.  He is the human embodiment of the Houston Rockets' offensive philosophy realized in its purest form.

As impressive as his game was, he was guarded by bigs about 95 percent of the time, bigs who were too slow to stay in front of him off the dribble and way out of their depth to prevent an open look from three.  The rarely seen big on big screen and roll resulted in Providence's bigs screwing up monumentally a few times and leaving one of the greatest college shooters of all time with acres of open space from three.

One of the definitive takeaways was already known: McDermott is a dynamite shooter with a lightning quick release and NBA range (he had several threes from NBA range).  His release is as quick as Ray's or Korver's.  He's not an one-note three point shooter either.  He had a few threes in transition that were reminiscent of Pierce's three point barrage in game 1 of the 2008 Finals in addition to a three off a nice crossover and small step back.

As impressive as his numbers were, it's questionable just how much of his driving game will translate.  To his credit, he's good at keeping his defender on his shoulder and continuing to the rim, where he shows nice touch.  However, he barely gets any lift and the help defense by Providence was laughable.  Not only is the help defense in the NBA exponentially better but a driver of McDermott's speed is going to give bigs time to rotate and contest at the rim as well as smalls to set up for potential charges.  I wouldn't bet on him finishing with anywhere near the same proficiency.   

His handle is actually pretty good.  Again it was mostly against bigs who couldn't defend dribble penetration but against one overmatched 7 footer, he sequenced several moves together with several nifty dribble moves that was impressive regardless of the defender.  He did however get picked cleanly on one of the few occasions a guard defended him.  Against the same defender later in the game, he did manage to drive by him and get to the line but I question how effective the combination of his quickness and handle is going to be against NBA perimeter defenders.

On defense, he mostly defended non-threats on offense so he was rarely attacked but on the two occasions players attempted to take him off the dribble, they succeeded pretty easily.  He did not show a lot of lateral quickness.  If he's going to be a small forward, I don't see any way he's not a defensive sieve.

Overall, my impressions didn't change.  He's very enjoyable to watch and I admire how relentlessly he attacks the rim even with his otherworldly shooting touch.  I'm still skeptical his inside the arc game will translate. 

Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #157 on: March 20, 2014, 07:50:01 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Are you comparing Providence players to NBA ones????

I think you lost all credibility with that one statement....

Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #158 on: March 20, 2014, 09:28:20 AM »

Offline D.o.s.

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Also, this is a pretty great read, and deserves its own post:
http://nba.si.com/2014/03/19/doug-mcdermott-nba-draft-college-four-year-one-and-done/

Mcdermotts 1st year stat is better than some players 3rd, 4th years. Every year its been the same advanced production

He needed to get stronger/quicker and refine his game(minor tweaks) and thats why he stayed imo. He also wants to go further in MM.

If he wanted to get drafted at a nice spot he could of left last year. Why would you risk going in this years , when its much stronger ?

He's playing against better competition, which reflects better on him in the draft. He's also playing a whole lot better this year, and the Blue Jays have been playing a pretty high-visibility system.

Someone already said it -- he was projected to go in the second round of last year's draft, so he decided to roll the dice and try to raise his draft stock, which worked, obviously.


Was watching the game last night though, and I'd much rather have McDermott at the 4 than KO, as far as spacing goes.
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Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #159 on: March 20, 2014, 09:49:00 AM »

Offline MBunge

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Also, this is a pretty great read, and deserves its own post:
http://nba.si.com/2014/03/19/doug-mcdermott-nba-draft-college-four-year-one-and-done/

Mcdermotts 1st year stat is better than some players 3rd, 4th years. Every year its been the same advanced production

He needed to get stronger/quicker and refine his game(minor tweaks) and thats why he stayed imo. He also wants to go further in MM.

If he wanted to get drafted at a nice spot he could of left last year. Why would you risk going in this years , when its much stronger ?

He's playing against better competition, which reflects better on him in the draft. He's also playing a whole lot better this year

Doug McDermott's per 40 minute averages

Last season - 29.3 pts, 9.7 rebs, 57% shooting, 49% from 3.
This season - 32.1 pts, 8.3 rebs, 56% shooting, 46% from 3.

No, he's NOT playing a "whole lot better this year" and those numbers would seem to indicate that he's not really playing against THAT much better competition.  AND last year's draft was, by every opinion, massively weaker than this year's.

Mike

Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #160 on: March 20, 2014, 10:00:11 AM »

Offline cb8883

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He's Jimmer 2.0. But he would help well with being a future bench option. Would certainly help drive the 2015 tank

Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #161 on: March 20, 2014, 10:08:45 AM »

Offline D.o.s.

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Also, this is a pretty great read, and deserves its own post:
http://nba.si.com/2014/03/19/doug-mcdermott-nba-draft-college-four-year-one-and-done/

Mcdermotts 1st year stat is better than some players 3rd, 4th years. Every year its been the same advanced production

He needed to get stronger/quicker and refine his game(minor tweaks) and thats why he stayed imo. He also wants to go further in MM.

If he wanted to get drafted at a nice spot he could of left last year. Why would you risk going in this years , when its much stronger ?

He's playing against better competition, which reflects better on him in the draft. He's also playing a whole lot better this year

Doug McDermott's per 40 minute averages

Last season - 29.3 pts, 9.7 rebs, 57% shooting, 49% from 3.
This season - 32.1 pts, 8.3 rebs, 56% shooting, 46% from 3.

No, he's NOT playing a "whole lot better this year" and those numbers would seem to indicate that he's not really playing against THAT much better competition.  AND last year's draft was, by every opinion, massively weaker than this year's.

Mike

You don't think that the new Big East constitutes stronger competition than than the MVC? How about the idea that leading your team to13-5 in the MVC isn't nearly as impressive as leading your team to 14-4 in the Big East.

Statistically, you're right, he's on track to be the same player he was last year, but doing that against stronger competition, leading the nation in scoring, and bringing your team into the tournament are all things that bump someone's draft stock up significantly.

I don't know why you wouldn't see that?

There's also really no reason to use per 40 numbers when he played 31 minutes last year and 33 this year.
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Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #162 on: March 20, 2014, 10:39:34 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Quote
You don't think that the new Big East constitutes stronger competition than than the MVC?

It's way better but in the NBA every one is an alpha-dog and Doug is slow and can't jump.  I would not draft him before 16 in this draft.   While he may be better than some guys his upside is finite and thereby his potential limited.

I think Oly is a better passer but Doug is a better shooter.   Both are slow and smart but limited on D.

Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #163 on: March 20, 2014, 12:22:20 PM »

Online slamtheking

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Also, this is a pretty great read, and deserves its own post:
http://nba.si.com/2014/03/19/doug-mcdermott-nba-draft-college-four-year-one-and-done/

Mcdermotts 1st year stat is better than some players 3rd, 4th years. Every year its been the same advanced production

He needed to get stronger/quicker and refine his game(minor tweaks) and thats why he stayed imo. He also wants to go further in MM.

If he wanted to get drafted at a nice spot he could of left last year. Why would you risk going in this years , when its much stronger ?

He's playing against better competition, which reflects better on him in the draft. He's also playing a whole lot better this year

Doug McDermott's per 40 minute averages

Last season - 29.3 pts, 9.7 rebs, 57% shooting, 49% from 3.
This season - 32.1 pts, 8.3 rebs, 56% shooting, 46% from 3.

No, he's NOT playing a "whole lot better this year" and those numbers would seem to indicate that he's not really playing against THAT much better competition.  AND last year's draft was, by every opinion, massively weaker than this year's.

Mike

You don't think that the new Big East constitutes stronger competition than than the MVC? How about the idea that leading your team to13-5 in the MVC isn't nearly as impressive as leading your team to 14-4 in the Big East.

Statistically, you're right, he's on track to be the same player he was last year, but doing that against stronger competition, leading the nation in scoring, and bringing your team into the tournament are all things that bump someone's draft stock up significantly.

I don't know why you wouldn't see that?

There's also really no reason to use per 40 numbers when he played 31 minutes last year and 33 this year.
This year's Big East?  no.

much of the conference's backbone (i.e. top-conference credentials) have moved on.  Providence won the tourney for crying out loud -- over Creighton.  This is not the Big East that people have known -- it doesn't boost anyone's or any team's standings (at this point at least--let's see if the realigned conference still attracts top talent and gets itself back at the top of the conferences).

Having said that, I think Mcdermott will be another player that has a great college career that doesn't do much in the pros.

Re: If Mcdermott is available by our 2nd 1st pick
« Reply #164 on: March 20, 2014, 01:46:49 PM »

Offline MBunge

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Also, this is a pretty great read, and deserves its own post:
http://nba.si.com/2014/03/19/doug-mcdermott-nba-draft-college-four-year-one-and-done/

Mcdermotts 1st year stat is better than some players 3rd, 4th years. Every year its been the same advanced production

He needed to get stronger/quicker and refine his game(minor tweaks) and thats why he stayed imo. He also wants to go further in MM.

If he wanted to get drafted at a nice spot he could of left last year. Why would you risk going in this years , when its much stronger ?

He's playing against better competition, which reflects better on him in the draft. He's also playing a whole lot better this year

Doug McDermott's per 40 minute averages

Last season - 29.3 pts, 9.7 rebs, 57% shooting, 49% from 3.
This season - 32.1 pts, 8.3 rebs, 56% shooting, 46% from 3.

No, he's NOT playing a "whole lot better this year" and those numbers would seem to indicate that he's not really playing against THAT much better competition.  AND last year's draft was, by every opinion, massively weaker than this year's.

Mike

You don't think that the new Big East constitutes stronger competition than than the MVC? How about the idea that leading your team to13-5 in the MVC isn't nearly as impressive as leading your team to 14-4 in the Big East.

Statistically, you're right, he's on track to be the same player he was last year, but doing that against stronger competition, leading the nation in scoring, and bringing your team into the tournament are all things that bump someone's draft stock up significantly.

I don't know why you wouldn't see that?

Let me state this again.  Last year's draft sucked.  This year's draft is so good, teams have been making moves related to it for at least two or three years.  You're totally ignoring that factor.  McDermott's play has not improved THAT much.  His weaknesses as a player have not been reduced THAT much.  This version of the Big East isn't THAT much better than the MVC to explain a guy going from middle of the 2nd round in a weak draft to late-lottery pick in a stacked one.

Chad Ford was either underrating McDermott last year or he's overrating him this year.  We'll find out which but there's no reasonable justification for Ford changing his draft status the way he did.  Last year he had McDermott rated at the same level as...

Raulzinho Neto - 9 pts, 3.3 asts, 44% from the field in 25 minutes a game in Spain
Ryan Kelly - 7.6 pts, 3.4 rebs, 43% from the field in 21 minutes a game for one of the worst teams in the league, the Lakers
Erick Murphy - .3 pts, .3 rebs, 23% from the field in 2.7 minutes for the Bulls

There's no reason why he should have gone from that to a lottery pick in this year's draft.

Mike