Asik trade rumors (deal reportedly off)

[sofutomygaha]

Not the easiest thing in the world to rank these players, but taking all factors and 5 minutes into account, that's my best shot at framing the discussion. Asik and Bogut is an interesting comparison- defensively they are very similar values. Offensively, Bogut is far superior. Durability-wise, Asik wins.

If I had my choice, I'd rather have Bogut than Asik. I like LooseCannon's tiers, though, for the most part. I think I'd prefer Asik to Al Jefferson or Nic Vucevic, for example.

Except that Bogut has fallen off a cliff after his injury, and is barely managing 6 shots a game these days. He's also  considerably more dependent on others creating for him rather than going to work offensively.

He's probably one of the worst starting centers in the league right now. Good for GSW that they're off the hook for his mammoth contract at the end of this season.

I admit that I haven't been following Bogut particularly closely in the last few weeks. I hope he's on the mend and getting back to something like himself, but you probably know more about it than I. The reason I threw that list out there is because it's easy to say "X is a top 5 Y" without thinking about the actual candidates. We do this all the time when we imagine Jeff Green as an all-star. If you actually lay out the competition in black and white, you usually end up reconsidering the superlatives.

Does anyone want to make the case that Asik is ahead of all but 9 other guys on that list?

Based on their current level of play, the only guys I'd rather have play center for me instead of Asik are the top 7 from your list + Drummond + DeAndre Jordan (barely). This makes him top 10 easily.

=) Actually it squeezes him in right at number 10... and we all think you might be a homer demoting Bosh like that.

[sofutomygaha]

FWIW, here's the blogger at Celticshub weighing in:

Brian Robb (@CelticsHub) : Definitely think it would have been a sell high situation for Bass. He's having arguably the best year of his career, especially rebounding the ball. As far as where Asik ranks among NBA centers, I'd put him 10-15 overall, and top 5 defensively.

[kozlodoev]

=) Actually it squeezes him in right at number 10... and we all think you might be a homer demoting Bosh like that.

Well, given how barely Jordan edges him, I wouldn't say squeeze.

As for Bosh, he's a 6'11 dude who rebounds like a small forward, and is not known for his defense. I'll never pick him to be my starting center voluntarily.

[TheBig3]

@jennydialcreech : Omer Asik had to leave today to go see a doctor for his knee. Had to walk out regular entrance cause Jay Z is here tonight.

[BleedGreen1989]

=) Actually it squeezes him in right at number 10... and we all think you might be a homer demoting Bosh like that.

Well, given how barely Jordan edges him, I wouldn't say squeeze.

As for Bosh, he's a 6'11 dude who rebounds like a small forward, and is not known for his defense. I'll never pick him to be my starting center voluntarily.

Agreed. Bosh is a natural PF. He gets away with playing C in Miami because they have Lebron.

He'd be a 4 on most teams in the league. I barely even consider him a C.

[j804]

@jennydialcreech : Omer Asik had to leave today to go see a doctor for his knee. Had to walk out regular entrance cause Jay Z is here tonight.

Yeah, have heard very little reports about this but his hamstring and knee reportedly has been bothering him which played a part in him getting shut down. Houston has been real quiet about it thats for sure could be a Bynum situation all over again.

[Who]

Not the easiest thing in the world to rank these players, but taking all factors and 5 minutes into account, that's my best shot at framing the discussion. Asik and Bogut is an interesting comparison- defensively they are very similar values. Offensively, Bogut is far superior. Durability-wise, Asik wins.

If I had my choice, I'd rather have Bogut than Asik. I like LooseCannon's tiers, though, for the most part. I think I'd prefer Asik to Al Jefferson or Nic Vucevic, for example.

Except that Bogut has fallen off a cliff after his injury, and is barely managing 6 shots a game these days. He's also  considerably more dependent on others creating for him rather than going to work offensively.

He's probably one of the worst starting centers in the league right now. Good for GSW that they're off the hook for his mammoth contract at the end of this season.

I think present day Bogut is a pretty good comp for Asik.

I'd take Bogut over Asik still due to Bogut's superior passing ability but other than that I think they are pretty closely matched nowadays.

[manl_lui]

Not the easiest thing in the world to rank these players, but taking all factors and 5 minutes into account, that's my best shot at framing the discussion. Asik and Bogut is an interesting comparison- defensively they are very similar values. Offensively, Bogut is far superior. Durability-wise, Asik wins.

If I had my choice, I'd rather have Bogut than Asik. I like LooseCannon's tiers, though, for the most part. I think I'd prefer Asik to Al Jefferson or Nic Vucevic, for example.

Except that Bogut has fallen off a cliff after his injury, and is barely managing 6 shots a game these days. He's also  considerably more dependent on others creating for him rather than going to work offensively.

He's probably one of the worst starting centers in the league right now. Good for GSW that they're off the hook for his mammoth contract at the end of this season.

I think present day Bogut is a pretty good comp for Asik.

I'd take Bogut over Asik still due to Bogut's superior passing ability but other than that I think they are pretty closely matched nowadays.

I'd take a healthy Bogut over Asik any time of the week!

[chambers]

=) Actually it squeezes him in right at number 10... and we all think you might be a homer demoting Bosh like that.

Well, given how barely Jordan edges him, I wouldn't say squeeze.

As for Bosh, he's a 6'11 dude who rebounds like a small forward, and is not known for his defense. I'll never pick him to be my starting center voluntarily.

Actually because he plays away from the basket in Miami his rebounding numbers go way down. He's one of the better NBA defenders a the center position.
He's playing next to two of the best players of all time.
In Toronto 3 years ago he was average 24 points a 13 rebounds a game as center and a back to basket+stretch center.
He's the same age as Rondo and if you put him in the middle as a go to guy again he'd dominate again.
It's why Lebron and Wade wanted him to come to Miami so badly.

Top 5 big man in the NBA EASILY.

[LooseCannon]

Not the easiest thing in the world to rank these players, but taking all factors and 5 minutes into account, that's my best shot at framing the discussion. Asik and Bogut is an interesting comparison- defensively they are very similar values. Offensively, Bogut is far superior. Durability-wise, Asik wins.

If I had my choice, I'd rather have Bogut than Asik. I like LooseCannon's tiers, though, for the most part. I think I'd prefer Asik to Al Jefferson or Nic Vucevic, for example.

Except that Bogut has fallen off a cliff after his injury, and is barely managing 6 shots a game these days. He's also  considerably more dependent on others creating for him rather than going to work offensively.

He's probably one of the worst starting centers in the league right now. Good for GSW that they're off the hook for his mammoth contract at the end of this season.

I think present day Bogut is a pretty good comp for Asik.

I'd take Bogut over Asik still due to Bogut's superior passing ability but other than that I think they are pretty closely matched nowadays.

I'd take a healthy Bogut over Asik any time of the week!

Now you just have to figure out the probability that you will have a healthy Bogut.

[Fafnir]

Bosh doesn't play outside defensively, his rebounding was always predicated on playing C and often with Bargs giving zero effort leaving him tons of uncontested rebounds.

[chambers]

So the mini deadline for re-trade-able players is when the clock strikes midnight and becomes the 20th of December or is it the entire day of the 20th of December?
Ultimate game of posturing ?
Danny did this with Clippers and when deal was approved the NBA stepped in lol.

Who's gonna get caught bluffing?

They still have 32 hours to get this deal done or 8?

[PhoSita]

FWIW, here's the blogger at Celticshub weighing in:

Brian Robb (@CelticsHub) : Definitely think it would have been a sell high situation for Bass. He's having arguably the best year of his career, especially rebounding the ball. As far as where Asik ranks among NBA centers, I'd put him 10-15 overall, and top 5 defensively.

Sounds spot on.

[Fafnir]

Eh it was already a made up deadline, I think they'll just sit pat until the actual trade deadline now.

[kozlodoev]

=) Actually it squeezes him in right at number 10... and we all think you might be a homer demoting Bosh like that.

Well, given how barely Jordan edges him, I wouldn't say squeeze.

As for Bosh, he's a 6'11 dude who rebounds like a small forward, and is not known for his defense. I'll never pick him to be my starting center voluntarily.

Actually because he plays away from the basket in Miami his rebounding numbers go way down. He's one of the better NBA defenders a the center position.
He's playing next to two of the best players of all time.
In Toronto 3 years ago he was average 24 points a 13 rebounds a game as center and a back to basket+stretch center.
He's the same age as Rondo and if you put him in the middle as a go to guy again he'd dominate again.
It's why Lebron and Wade wanted him to come to Miami so badly.

Top 5 big man in the NBA EASILY.

His career rebound rate is 15% in Toronto and 13% in Miami. These are small forward numbers. His career defensive rating is 105, he doesn't block shots, and even without digging, I challenge you to find one advanced metric by which he's a "better defender at the center position".

Also, he's very definitely not the same age as Rondo, unless Rondo aged a couple of years overnight.