Official Discuss your CB Draft team

[KCattheStripe]

Guards; Chris Duhon, Courtney lee
Forwards: Battier, Amar'e. Griffin
Center: Okafor, Blair

Mascot:

A solid big man rotation will drive this team, and should be able to absorb the "Amar'e's defense sucks" arguments (I think the talk of his D is overrated, but I additionally think that Emeka is less talented in the interior that others do, so I guess it cancels out). You've surrounded Stoudemire with guys known for playing with heart, and they won't let him quit on them, which is great.

However, your guards need help. Duhon's value is a product of the D'Antoni system (and he faded badly down the stretch both this year and last). Lee is a nice rotation piece, but I don't know if he can be a starter for a good team yet. However, with Amare/Griffin, I think he's a good piece to have as a kick-out shooter, but you still need a dominant guard to really make this team click.

One note, Lee was a starter for an NBA finals team. Other than that I agree with most of your analysis, although I think Duhon will do better if he';s expected to do less like he will be on this team.

[Donoghus]

Guards; Chris Duhon, Courtney lee
Forwards: Battier, Amar'e. Griffin
Center: Okafor, Blair

Mascot:

Love your frontcourt.  Lots of depth.  You have defense and scoring via mixing & matching.

However, I'm not really sure what to make of your backcourt.  I'm not a big Duhon fan and I'm ho-hum on Lee.  

Your frontcourt is certainly going to strike fear into people, though.

[riah32]

Also, Brandon Rush is an incredibly frustrating player. I had Pacers season tickets the past two years, and every time he takes a step forward on the court, he seems to take two steps back the next week. I'm not sure that you'd want to rely on him as a starter. He can put up 25 points one night and completely disappear the next - and his defense is the same way.

Still, the components are there for a really nice team.

I think you can say the exact same thing about JR Smith.

One place you could improve drastically is trading Smith or Rush for a more team oriented player. Kirk Hinrich comes to mind, so does JJ Reddick.

No, them being white doesn't have anything to do with them being 'team oriented'.

Also you could trade for Mike Miller, Nick Collison, or Luke Ridnour.

Solid points. In this case I think a less talented player with a more defined role would be a good pickup here, though it may seem counter-intuitive. I think you could get a player that's a better fit for this team easily because of the solid players you could dangle.

no one seems to want to make me an offer for anyone...if anyone wants anyone not named Rondo or Bogut pm an offer. Might even be inclined to move bogut for the right offer.

[Lucky17]

Would appreciate some feedback on my squad: good, bad, or indifferent:

Head Coach: Jeff Van Gundy
PG: Tony Parker
SG: Caron Butler, Aron Afflalo
SF: Danny Granger, [Butler]
PF: J.J. Hickson
C:  Samuel Dalembert, Zaza Pachulia

Love the coach. Good choice.

I think your weakness will be your frontcourt. I think Parker, Butler, Afflalo and Granger are a great combination of talent and offensive scoring ability from just about any way possible(long range shooting, mid range shooting, fast break, passing, taking it off the dribble and to the whole to finish). Afflalo and Parker are a very good defensive back court as Afflalo can pick up the slack defensively where Parker is weak. really like this part of your team.

But up front, there is absolutely zero offensively. Dalambert and Pachulia are a good defensive, rebounding, physical center combo but without a PF who can create his own offense and be that "guy" in the front court, their contributions will go for not.

Sorry, I'm not sold on Hickson. He has to have that prove it to me year before I give him the starting nod on a team that has the ability that your wings and back court does. I think the frontcourt will be this teams downfall as you will get little to no offense from it on a nightly basis.

Thanks, nick. TP.

Really can't argue much with anything said. Hickson hasn't proven it yet. I'm bullish on him, but the proof is in the pudding.

[Kwhit10]

Also, Brandon Rush is an incredibly frustrating player. I had Pacers season tickets the past two years, and every time he takes a step forward on the court, he seems to take two steps back the next week. I'm not sure that you'd want to rely on him as a starter. He can put up 25 points one night and completely disappear the next - and his defense is the same way.

Still, the components are there for a really nice team.

I think you can say the exact same thing about JR Smith.

One place you could improve drastically is trading Smith or Rush for a more team oriented player. Kirk Hinrich comes to mind, so does JJ Reddick.

No, them being white doesn't have anything to do with them being 'team oriented'.

Also you could trade for Mike Miller, Nick Collison, or Luke Ridnour.

Solid points. In this case I think a less talented player with a more defined role would be a good pickup here, though it may seem counter-intuitive. I think you could get a player that's a better fit for this team easily because of the solid players you could dangle.

Just so you know Ridnour, Redick and Hinrich are all my team if you want to trade JJ 

[Fafnir]

You mean Pacers, Roy.    Well, in my eyes:

Post-gasol:  I'll do this first since it's freshest.  I'd say slightly inferior.  I mean the 1,2 are the same.  Pietrus could be argued to be a little worse than Artest(?), but I had them both in the same boat of SFs I was intent on getting (along with Battier, Ariza) with no particular preference of the 4.  Marc Gasol I'd rather have over Bynum because of Bynum's injuries and Gasol is a far superior passer.  He still gives you the same scoring, length, rebounding, and shot blocking that Bynum does.  Thomas is a significant downgrade over Pau.  No question about that.  Defensively, I think they are even maybe I'd even prefer Thomas.  Offensively, Pau is a huge upgrade.

I can understand the health argument, but Gasol doesn't provide the same length as Bynum. He's also not as good of a defender when both are fully healthy. Bynum is a plus defender at the C, Gasol is adequete.

Tyrus Thomas compared to Gasol, is a complete downgrade though. The only thing Thomas does better is block shots, defensively Pau is far superior and can guard two positions at an above average level. Thomas has more defensive potential, but he hasn't fulfilled it. How will make him into a world class defender?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/tiny.cgi?id=tOCTB

As for the bench.  I think Flynn is a considerably better pg than Farmar.  Korver is better than any wing the Lakers had.  Krstic is a slight downgrade from Odom.  And I haven't finished filling out the bench yet.

So, I say for my starting lineup I'm really only losing a good chunk at my starting PF spot, while my bench as a whole is slightly better.

Odom is only slightly better than Kristic? You're going to have to explain that one to me.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/tiny.cgi?id=x9zN1
Odom is a better rebounder, scorer, passer, more versatile, and is a whole world better on defense.

Odom made the Laker's bench, yours is better at other positions, but worse overall.

Also, Flynn and Farmmar are a wash in my mind. Both aren't all that good right now:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/tiny.cgi?id=rmyWU

[Fafnir]

What about the new look Celtics

pg:Rondo
Sg:Brandon Rush
Sf:Maggette
Pf Harrington
C:Bogut

Sixth Man: JR Smith

I think your team is going to struggle to score at times because Rush and Harrington are your only shooters in your starting line up.

Harrington will shoot you right out of games and Rush isn't the most reliable player either.

Overall you have to address your backup PF spot. Harrington is a poor defender, rebounder, and passer at the PF position. He'll help you space the floor, but other than that he hurts your team. (he's not even an efficient scorer but he'll take more shots than anyone if you let him)

I love J.R. Smith and Rondo paired up together however.

[Fafnir]

Sorry, I'm not sold on Hickson. He has to have that prove it to me year before I give him the starting nod on a team that has the ability that your wings and back court does. I think the frontcourt will be this teams downfall as you will get little to no offense from it on a nightly basis.

I think Lucky is right, Hickson will start this season at the 4 for Cleveland, and he might very well be a 18 and 8 player.

But, Nick has a real point. How good is JJ Hickson going to be for 82 games? As a starting forward last season he only put up 8.2 PPG, and only scored at a 18.9 per48mins clip.

Hickson over a $13 million Jamison? I beg to differ.

I've read press releases, both with Antawn Jamison stating that he would be okay returning to the sixth man role, and Byron Scott saying JJ Hickson is going to be integral to their style next season.

I've also read that Scott intends to give Jamison serious minutes at the 3.

Its pretty much the assumption that Hickson is starting..assuming he doesn't flop training camp.

I haven't read that but I'll take your word for it. I can't imagine Jamison content with coming off the bench for a sub .500 team, though.

Trade that needs to happen:

Boobie and Jamison

For

Rip and Tay

Why would the Pistons do that?

[Fafnir]

Brandon Jennings
Mike Miller
Lebron James
Ersan Ilyasova
Joakim Noah

I know, I know. Forever it will be known as "the trade". You guys have your opinions on it, I have mine..its done now. Now this is my team.

In my eyes...
Random thoughts on offense: Ilyasova and Miller are both elite 3pt shooters for their respective positions. Jennings and James are both at their best when they are driving, and Noah is mobile and explosive enough to be a fantastic pick and roll player to the rim. Not 20 points per game fantastic, but good enough to get his 10+ a night. James and Jennings are both about average, with Jennings at 37% and James at 33%. This inside-out dynamic I feel will allow for minimum clogging in the lane to stop LeBron and Jennings from driving, and good spacing on the floor. I wish Noah had a better post game, but he's not exactly inept either.

I think you've essentially become the Cleveland Cavaliers of the past two years. Your offensive is going to be incredibly dependent on LeBron. That's okay though, he's the best offensive player in the game by a huge margin. With Brandon Jennings you absolutely have to get a backup PG to even things out. The guy is streaky as all heck. The good news is he's a passable 3 point shooter, I'd suggest coaching on taking a spot up 3.

I love Noah and Ilyasova for LeBron to play off of. They're both great complimentary scorers for what he does. Noah is very equivalent in game to AV and should fit extremely well. Meanwhile Ilyasova can shoot and drift out to create space.

I think you need a veteran PG, a bench scorer, and a PF/C with some nastiness and beef to defend bigger guys.

I think your team is still going to be a factor in the EC.

[Fafnir]

So lets say all middle linebackers are like 6'2, 250 or so...

And lets say there is one middle linebacker that is like 6'1, 220 that was way faster had a knack for sniffing out the ball.

Now you don't let that backer just sit on the 1 and 2 holes. He'll get eaten alive if those big linemen get their paws on him. No, you want that backer roving around, making plays, making the defense always be looking over their shoulder for where he's going to come from next.

That's what Josh Smith is, but in basketball. That's why you don't let him play the 4 straight up, and you don't have him play the 3 straight up...you give up some of those short yardage situations but in the end you get a lot more from those big sacks and tackles for losses and fumbles he's capable of.

/rant.

Actually, that's a pretty solid analogy.

Lets just say if smith was starting at small forward. That doesn't mean hes going to do everything a typical small forward does.  Smith just has such a unique game...and you can't say that because smith is starting at small forward means i'm gonna win 10 fewer games...i think that's crazy to say that.

Its really not.

Josh Smith at the 3 would be a great rebounder, and a above average defender. But he'd be an offensive liability at this point.

Josh Smith at the 4 is an asset offensively, a good rebounder, and is a good defender (though he should be all-nba with his talent).

I wouldn't go as far as ten games difference, but I can easily see 5 or 6. Your team will have trouble scoring if it plays this as one of its main lineups.

Guards: Stephen Curry, Brandon Roy
Forwards: Michael Beasley, Josh Smith
Center: Tyson Chandler

Only having two players that can shoot is a big problem. Even worse such a line up will certainly induce Beasley and Smith to take a bunch of jump shots. That's a very bad thing.

[Fafnir]

CLEVELAND CAVS after todays picks and trade.

 The BEST BEST team around!!

PG: Mike Conley Jr.
SG: Monta Ellis
SF: Carmelo Anthony-James Posey
PF: Troy Murphy-Jason Thompson
C : Shaq O'Neil-Joel Pryzbila

I thought Conley and Monta would work better than Monta and Caron also Murph is a Dbl Dbl.

Good trade; I really didn't see a Monta/Caron backcourt working.  I like this team offensively.  This team should put up close to 100 per game.  I think working of 'Melo will make Monta more of an efficient offensive player.  I don't like this team defensively.  Your best defenders are bench players who will see most of their playing time against other bench players.  I don't see anybody on your team who is quick enough to guard Kobe or Wade.  I also see this team struggling defending athletic bigs.  

Prognosis:  50 wins.

Great analyzing job! i didn't see this earlier you are good at analyzing... I stink at it. I figured my team was about 56 win team.

Defensively, your team is kinda behind the pack by a significant margin though Gomesfan...Conley and Monta..neither one has shown a particular ability to defend all that well. Monta barely breaks even at SG (meaning he scores about as many points as he allows his own matchup to score), and Conely is behind.

Carmelo should always score more than his counterpart, but defensively he is kind of like a kid with ADD (SQUIRREL!), in that he's there one minute, focused, and gone the next.

Murphy is as much a center as he is a 4, and he usually lets in more than he scores, and as we've all seen Shaq is not really a top tier defender anymore.

Pryzbilla and Posey are both good defenders, but there is good reason to question just exactly how well they will fare next season. Posey is coming off of a largely inefficient and unmotivated year, and he's going to a team that should be firmly out of playoff contention, and Pryzbilla is coming off his 5th NBA season of less than 50 games played because of injury, and he's only played 10 years total.

I think he should bit the bullet and play Monta as his primary PG. He can run his offense through Monta and Carmello and still get the same scoring he would with them at the 2/3.

Defensively it'd help them out immensely.

[action781]

You mean Pacers, Roy.    Well, in my eyes:

Post-gasol:  I'll do this first since it's freshest.  I'd say slightly inferior.  I mean the 1,2 are the same.  Pietrus could be argued to be a little worse than Artest(?), but I had them both in the same boat of SFs I was intent on getting (along with Battier, Ariza) with no particular preference of the 4.  Marc Gasol I'd rather have over Bynum because of Bynum's injuries and Gasol is a far superior passer.  He still gives you the same scoring, length, rebounding, and shot blocking that Bynum does.  Thomas is a significant downgrade over Pau.  No question about that.  Defensively, I think they are even maybe I'd even prefer Thomas.  Offensively, Pau is a huge upgrade.

I can understand the health argument, but Gasol doesn't provide the same length as Bynum. He's also not as good of a defender when both are fully healthy. Bynum is a plus defender at the C, Gasol is adequete.

Tyrus Thomas compared to Gasol, is a complete downgrade though. The only thing Thomas does better is block shots, defensively Pau is far superior and can guard two positions at an above average level. Thomas has more defensive potential, but he hasn't fulfilled it. How will make him into a world class defender?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/tiny.cgi?id=tOCTB

As for the bench.  I think Flynn is a considerably better pg than Farmar.  Korver is better than any wing the Lakers had.  Krstic is a slight downgrade from Odom.  And I haven't finished filling out the bench yet.

So, I say for my starting lineup I'm really only losing a good chunk at my starting PF spot, while my bench as a whole is slightly better.

Odom is only slightly better than Kristic? You're going to have to explain that one to me.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/tiny.cgi?id=x9zN1
Odom is a better rebounder, scorer, passer, more versatile, and is a whole world better on defense.

Odom made the Laker's bench, yours is better at other positions, but worse overall.

Also, Flynn and Farmmar are a wash in my mind. Both aren't all that good right now:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/tiny.cgi?id=rmyWU

Thank you for the thoughtful critique, Faf.  TP.

I completely agree that I have a significant downgrade at PF.  There is no question about that.  Perhaps I'm seeing too much talent/potential and not enough results when I say that Pau and Ty Thomas are even and I'd maybe prefer Thomas.  I really do like to watch him play.

I don't know whether you're correct or not when saying that Odom is a better scorer.  Last season, Krstic scored more pp36 min and shot at a higher %.  Granted, stats don't tell the whole story, but if there's one think Krstic can do in this league, it's score and he did it for the Nets also.  And that's why I drafted him - for some offense when Gasol rests.  But you're correct that Odom's a better rebounder and passer.  I don't particularly like Odom defensively (dominated by big 4's, and 4 is his position), but yes, he's even still a better defender.  Which is why I say for my team, he's a slight downgrade.  Either player could start for a playoff team, but you'd have to question if that team could be a champion.  I still concede that Krstic is a downgrade from Odom, just not majorly.

Flynn gives you more pp36 and assists per 36.  He's a 2nd year player and has room to improve, where I don't really see much room for improvement in Farmar's game, which is mostly surviving on high bball IQ.  You say they aren't very good.  But were talking about backup pgs here.

Anyways, thanks for the post and for pointing some things out.

[Rondo2287]

Loving my team right now

PG: Kidd/Jack
SG:Rip Hamilton
SF: Prince/Barnes
PF: Dirk
C: Gortat/Turiaf

[Celtic Fan Forever]

My Dallas Mavericks

PG: Andre Miller/Shannon Brown
SG: Stephen Jackson
SF: Trevor Ariza/Rasual Butler
PF: Charlie Villanueva/Taj Gibson
C: Tim Duncan

Would love some comments/suggestions.

[Fafnir]

I don't know whether you're correct or not when saying that Odom is a better scorer.  Last season, Krstic scored more pp36 min and shot at a higher %.  Granted, stats don't tell the whole story, but if there's one think Krstic can do in this league, it's score and he did it for the Nets also.  And that's why I drafted him - for some offense when Gasol rests.  But you're correct that Odom's a better rebounder and passer.  I don't particularly like Odom defensively (dominated by big 4's, and 4 is his position), but yes, he's even still a better defender.  Which is why I say for my team, he's a slight downgrade.  Either player could start for a playoff team, but you'd have to question if that team could be a champion.  I still concede that Krstic is a downgrade from Odom, just not majorly.

Kristic scored 1 point more per 36 minutes, at less effiency than Odom. Odom scores more though because he can play more minutes than Kristic. For their careers there scoring rates are equal, but Odom is more efficient. Odom also is a better scorer in my book because he has a versatile offensive game. He gets to the line some, shoots 3s, and is a great tranisition player. Kristic is a C who shoots jumpers.

But beyond that Kristic is worse in every other phase of the game. He's not a flexible player like Odom is. Its a huge downgrade.

Flynn gives you more pp36 and assists per 36.  He's a 2nd year player and has room to improve, where I don't really see much room for improvement in Farmar's game, which is mostly surviving on high bball IQ.  You say they aren't very good.  But were talking about backup pgs here.

He also turns it over more per 36, double Farmar's. His scoring is inefficient, his TS% is worse, and he uses A LOT of possessions. His usage is around Baron Davises, he's a bit of a chucker. His rebounding rate is roughly the same as Farmar's.

Flynn might improve, but he's currently not an upgrade over Farmar.