Bucher: Bulls shopping Butler

[tankcity!]

One thing to consider if deciding between AB and Crowder: Jae and Jimmy are not exactly best buds.

I was under the impression that they had a very good relationship

Same here, and I think they are. They had a spat earlier in the year in one of our games against them, but that was nothing big.

IIRC reports at the time were that they're not pals. I'll try to find an article.

Found it:

Just told by someone in the know that Jimmy Butler and Jae Crowder -- ex-Marquette teammates -- not exactly boys.

https://twitter.com/GoodmanESPN/status/791812523360194560

Tweet is from during the game in which the altercation occurred.

But if u scroll down thru the replies from that tweet...there is a pic of the 2 hanging out getting din din after a game......hmmmm

I really dunno much bout their relationship but interesting

So I guess we don't really know, but I did remember some mention of them not being particularly close.

Jeff Goodman isn't very reliable, and he has a pretty strong anti-Celtics bias that is well-known.

I remember Crowder talking after the incident about it, and he was talking about how he was surprised, too, since they are good friends.

EDIT: Here you go.  It was Butler saying Jae was his "guy" lol http://www.masslive.com/celtics/index.ssf/2016/10/boston_celtics_jae_crowder_on_1.html

They were teammates at Marquette, so I imagine they have a fairly good relationship.

They seem to be very good friends
https://www.instagram.com/p/BARJ6m1B7nC/?taken-by=jimmybutler&hl=en
https://www.instagram.com/p/BASrL0WMFP2/?taken-by=bossmann99&hl=en
https://www.instagram.com/p/BJ6fT_AAZ16/?taken-by=jimmybutler&hl=en
In the last one he is working out with Brown but uses the caption #imcomingforyoualsojaecrowder. Certainly doesnt seem like in a malicious way.
http://nbpa.com/life-on-mars-how-jae-crowder-has-carved-his-own-lane-with-the-celtics/

Beyond his family, Crowder has found motivation through one of his closest friends, Bulls star Jimmy Butler, who was his teammate at Marquette during the 2010-11 season. Between both players attending junior college and being overlooked in the NBA draft—Crowder was the 34th pick in 2012 and Butler went 30th in 2011—they have very similar stories.

“Last time we broke bread and talked over dinner, he wanted to work out with me and vice versa because I know he’s going to push me to a limit, and we just want to make each other better,” Crowder said. “We want to start working out together in the summer time. We talk a lot and we go out to dinner when we play one another. That’s one of my best friends in the NBA. That’s my brother.”

“It’s a blue-collar mentality,” Crowder said of Marquette. “Me and Jimmy, we played in the Big East when it was really tough. It helped mold us and grew us to become everyday-type players. That’s the way our coach coached us when we were at Marquette. You don’t play unless you play hard and unless you play with a certain type of swag.”

“I think you always have a bond when you go to the same school and go to war with a guy like Jae under Buzz [Williams],” Butler told the NBPA. “He went to Juco just like I went to the Juco, so that just shows even more how much we have in common—overlooked in the draft, made our mark in this league and we’re here to stay. More than a basketball player, he’s an incredible human being, a great father and somebody that these kids can look up to because he’s the definition of what hard work and dedication can get you in this life.”

https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2015/01/17/bulls-jimmy-butler-praises-former-college-teammate-jae-crowder/E0Lo5RirK1H2oJR8iAYBsO/story.html

conclusion: they are really close

Yeah, seems like Goodman was probably wrong (or worse).

Yeah, Goodman is a... less than likable person, let's say. He's had a lot of pretty anti-Celtics biased stuff, even though he covers us a lot.

It's weird because he is a Celtics fan. He was right about Rondo though.

[TheSundanceKid]

it doesn't matter if they hang up.

would any team offer that much? 3 top 4 picks? i really doubt it. eventually the bulls will answer and make a counteroffer

unless they are not very interested in trading

Exactly. If the Bulls don't want to talk trades then fine, it's a short conversation. But some of the suggestions here are way above what other teams would offer, so why should we?

[TheSundanceKid]

What exactly is that future?

It's people wagering that Ainge can draft a champion.

And you know where I stand on that.

It's fine to have no faith in Ainge. But that shouldn't affect the value of the trade package as other teams see it. They won't sit there and think "Ainge has to trade them because we all know how lousy he is"

[tankcity!]

Some of you guys are absolutely delirious if you think you can get Butler without giving up some important pieces. Terry Rozier and the 18 BRK pick is not gonna cut it. And, if Jaylen Brown, spare parts, and the 2 BRK picks are what it cost for Butler, we should dive Brown to the airport ASAP to make that deal.

Butler is a borderline top 10 player this year. You need to give up something good to get him. He scored 25 ppg, plays elite defense, and is signed for 3.5 years on a relatively cheap contract in regards to the new CBA/salary cap.

We're better off building through the draft. The market dictates Butler's value. Not you nor the Bulls. Let's see what they can get in return. They still haven't traded him because clearly no one is biting on their high price.

[tankcity!]

Were I Gar Forman, I'd hang up on Ainge if the two Nets picks weren't on the table.

And they can keep Butler and continue to suck haha. Good for them. Let him hit free agency in three years and his trade value depreciate.

[CoachBo]

What exactly is that future?

It's people wagering that Ainge can draft a champion.

And you know where I stand on that.

It's fine to have no faith in Ainge. But that shouldn't affect the value of the trade package as other teams see it. They won't sit there and think "Ainge has to trade them because we all know how lousy he is"

This isn't about Ainge; it's about equity for Butler in the market. Other teams don't see the Celtics as the majority of this blog does; you can rest assured of that.

[tankcity!]

What exactly is that future?

It's people wagering that Ainge can draft a champion.

And you know where I stand on that.

It's fine to have no faith in Ainge. But that shouldn't affect the value of the trade package as other teams see it. They won't sit there and think "Ainge has to trade them because we all know how lousy he is"

This isn't about Ainge; it's about equity for Butler in the market. Other teams don't see the Celtics as the majority of this blog does; you can rest assured of that.

How do you even know this? Kevin O'Connor said his sources say that Bulls wanted No. 3 pick, No. 16, and Crowder. We said no. A Bulls reporter also reported that. Are you just ignoring people who cover the league and just talking out of your butt?

[PAOBoston]

Some of you guys are absolutely delirious if you think you can get Butler without giving up some important pieces. Terry Rozier and the 18 BRK pick is not gonna cut it. And, if Jaylen Brown, spare parts, and the 2 BRK picks are what it cost for Butler, we should dive Brown to the airport ASAP to make that deal.

Butler is a borderline top 10 player this year. You need to give up something good to get him. He scored 25 ppg, plays elite defense, and is signed for 3.5 years on a relatively cheap contract in regards to the new CBA/salary cap.

We're better off building through the draft. The market dictates Butler's value. Not you nor the Bulls. Let's see what they can get in return. They still haven't traded him because clearly no one is biting on their high price.

Having a high price is one thing. But lowball offers like the ones beng thown around here is different. It's going to cost a lot to get any superstar via trade.

Building for the draft is going to take another 5-10 years if you get lucky.

[tankcity!]

Some of you guys are absolutely delirious if you think you can get Butler without giving up some important pieces. Terry Rozier and the 18 BRK pick is not gonna cut it. And, if Jaylen Brown, spare parts, and the 2 BRK picks are what it cost for Butler, we should dive Brown to the airport ASAP to make that deal.

Butler is a borderline top 10 player this year. You need to give up something good to get him. He scored 25 ppg, plays elite defense, and is signed for 3.5 years on a relatively cheap contract in regards to the new CBA/salary cap.

We're better off building through the draft. The market dictates Butler's value. Not you nor the Bulls. Let's see what they can get in return. They still haven't traded him because clearly no one is biting on their high price.

Having a high price is one thing. But lowball offers like the ones beng thown around here is different. It's going to cost a lot to get any superstar via trade.

Building for the draft is going to take another 5-10 years if you get lucky.

So you're just going to ignore the what the Bulls wanted from the Celtics in last years draft? It was widely reported by numerous sources they wanted on Brooklyn pick, Crowder, and a low to mid first round pick?

Where are you getting your assumption from exactly?

[Donoghus]

Some of you guys are absolutely delirious if you think you can get Butler without giving up some important pieces. Terry Rozier and the 18 BRK pick is not gonna cut it. And, if Jaylen Brown, spare parts, and the 2 BRK picks are what it cost for Butler, we should dive Brown to the airport ASAP to make that deal.

Butler is a borderline top 10 player this year. You need to give up something good to get him. He scored 25 ppg, plays elite defense, and is signed for 3.5 years on a relatively cheap contract in regards to the new CBA/salary cap.

We're better off building through the draft. The market dictates Butler's value. Not you nor the Bulls. Let's see what they can get in return. They still haven't traded him because clearly no one is biting on their high price.

Having a high price is one thing. But lowball offers like the ones beng thown around here is different. It's going to cost a lot to get any superstar via trade.

Building for the draft is going to take another 5-10 years if you get lucky.

Good thing that the Celtics aren't just building through the draft then.

[Irish Stew]

Some of you guys are absolutely delirious if you think you can get Butler without giving up some important pieces. Terry Rozier and the 18 BRK pick is not gonna cut it. And, if Jaylen Brown, spare parts, and the 2 BRK picks are what it cost for Butler, we should dive Brown to the airport ASAP to make that deal.

Butler is a borderline top 10 player this year. You need to give up something good to get him. He scored 25 ppg, plays elite defense, and is signed for 3.5 years on a relatively cheap contract in regards to the new CBA/salary cap.

This. TP. That wonderful contract may drive the asking price even higher.

[TheSundanceKid]

What exactly is that future?

It's people wagering that Ainge can draft a champion.

And you know where I stand on that.

It's fine to have no faith in Ainge. But that shouldn't affect the value of the trade package as other teams see it. They won't sit there and think "Ainge has to trade them because we all know how lousy he is"

This isn't about Ainge; it's about equity for Butler in the market. Other teams don't see the Celtics as the majority of this blog does; you can rest assured of that.

I agree, but the value assigned to Butler has two aspects;

1) The minimum the Bulls will accept

2) The maximum another team will pay

At the moment those two don't correlate. There is no team currently offering close to what the Bulls were asking for from us at the draft last year.

If we put a Nets pick on the table and add Bradley or Crowder to the offer then that is already more than other teams seem willing to offer, so why would we go higher? The only reason is if the Bulls don't budge, in which case we say "See you again in a year when this offer is still the best you'll get" or we then look to increase the offer further.

Equally though if the Bulls are trending towards getting rid, which it seems like they are then there is a time limit on when to trade him so there is pressure for them to move the asking price down. So there's no point in starting with offering the moon when its unnecessary

[Kuberski33]

Butler's not going anywhere.  He's got a guaranteed 5 year deal that's going to wind up being below market rate once the new collective bargaining agreement goes into effect. 

You change the coach, GM and then every other player on the roster before you move him.

Disagree. They know he's not a superstar and they can get much more for him now then they could later on. Look at the Kings for example or the Hawks. They're players contracts are expiring and they are losing trade value by the day. Have you seen the market for Milsap? Not great. The Pelicans are offering a lottery protected first round pick haha.

Put yourself in the shoes of one of the Bull's top customers - you have season tickets in the good seats and you're dropping a few hundred dollars each game to see your Bulls.  They deal their best player - who's in his prime and just signed a 5 year deal for a bunch of what ifs - how are you feeling about your entertainment investment?

This is why superstars - especially ones on good contracts - rarely ever move in the league.  It's hard enough to get these guys - your fan base will crucify you if you deal one for lesser talent.

Fact of life in the NBA which 95% of the fans don't get. 

[PAOBoston]

Some of you guys are absolutely delirious if you think you can get Butler without giving up some important pieces. Terry Rozier and the 18 BRK pick is not gonna cut it. And, if Jaylen Brown, spare parts, and the 2 BRK picks are what it cost for Butler, we should dive Brown to the airport ASAP to make that deal.

Butler is a borderline top 10 player this year. You need to give up something good to get him. He scored 25 ppg, plays elite defense, and is signed for 3.5 years on a relatively cheap contract in regards to the new CBA/salary cap.

We're better off building through the draft. The market dictates Butler's value. Not you nor the Bulls. Let's see what they can get in return. They still haven't traded him because clearly no one is biting on their high price.

Having a high price is one thing. But lowball offers like the ones beng thown around here is different. It's going to cost a lot to get any superstar via trade.

Building for the draft is going to take another 5-10 years if you get lucky.

So you're just going to ignore the what the Bulls wanted from the Celtics in last years draft? It was widely reported by numerous sources they wanted on Brooklyn pick, Crowder, and a low to mid first round pick?

Where are you getting your assumption from exactly?

1. We do not know with certainty if that was the case. If it was as simple as that, Ainge would have made the move. My take was he was ready but it was the Bulls who backed away because they wanted to keep him and get more for him  by giving him a new deal.
2. Butler is now signed long term on a very affordable contract
3. He's putting up even better numbers than last year

Butler's value is not the same as it was last draft. He's worth more now.

[tankcity!]

Some of you guys are absolutely delirious if you think you can get Butler without giving up some important pieces. Terry Rozier and the 18 BRK pick is not gonna cut it. And, if Jaylen Brown, spare parts, and the 2 BRK picks are what it cost for Butler, we should dive Brown to the airport ASAP to make that deal.

Butler is a borderline top 10 player this year. You need to give up something good to get him. He scored 25 ppg, plays elite defense, and is signed for 3.5 years on a relatively cheap contract in regards to the new CBA/salary cap.

We're better off building through the draft. The market dictates Butler's value. Not you nor the Bulls. Let's see what they can get in return. They still haven't traded him because clearly no one is biting on their high price.

Having a high price is one thing. But lowball offers like the ones beng thown around here is different. It's going to cost a lot to get any superstar via trade.

Building for the draft is going to take another 5-10 years if you get lucky.

So you're just going to ignore the what the Bulls wanted from the Celtics in last years draft? It was widely reported by numerous sources they wanted on Brooklyn pick, Crowder, and a low to mid first round pick?

Where are you getting your assumption from exactly?

1. We do not know with certainty if that was the case. If it was as simple as that, Ainge would have made the move. My take was he was ready but it was the Bulls who backed away because they wanted to keep him and get more for him  by giving him a new deal.
2. Butler is now signed long term on a very affordable contract
3. He's putting up even better numbers than last year

Butler's value is not the same as it was last draft. He's worth more now.

Yeah, I'll take people who cover the league's word for it instead of yours. I don't think you have any idea what Ainge would do. I myself wouldn't either since I don't work there and it isn't my job.