Yes or No? Marcus Smart Our Next Superstar?

[JSD]

Smart will be a 2nd or 3rd tier superstar.

[max215]

No matter how effective Marcus becomes, there will be doubters on this forum, that simply will not like the taste of crow. He will simply never be a star to them, because his scoring average will never be "insane" enough.

If your the type of fan that enjoys the work of Draymond, or Kawhi you will appreciate Smart. Notice how quickly their respective teams signed them, know one got a chance to even think of making an offer to them.

People act like smart has arrived and people like me are in denial.  That's not even slows to being true.  Smart had a decent rookie year and has followed that up with a good a games and a not so good game in summer league.  Long long long way from eating crow.

And I'm glad you brought up draymond green because I think he's a good comp for smart's high point.  But then again, I don't think a guy like green is a true star.  He's a role player that only gets noticed because he's on a good team.  But he's not some multiple all star that's ever going to carry a team.  So basically smart can be very helpful on a good team, but I don see him ever carrying one.

You're joking, right? Smart is leading all of Summer League in ppg and apg. He had one good to great game and one perfect game. Complain about efficiency if you want, but calling 26 points, 8 assists, 5 boards, 2 steals, and a block a 'not so good game' is ridiculous.

[LarBrd33]

It's summer league. He should be dominating it.  Don't set yourself up to be disappointed.  We are seeing positive signs from smart, but we don't know if he can carry it over into the real league. As of right now I still see him as an offensively challenged defensive stud.  I'm seeing tiny hints of improvement, but how much of is it related to his progress over the past couple months and how much of it is related to a full season of playing NBA basketball?  We don't know if he's actually improved since the end of the year... The competition level is dramatically different in the NBA. 

[LarBrd33]

I wouldn't even bet on Smart becoming an all-star let alone a superstar.  He looks like he's made some progress in summer league, though.  I still don't think he's a good offensive player yet.

Bro, first you said he was going to be like Tony Allen before even giving him the chance to have a whole offseason to work on his game. We've talked about this before and you decided to judge him before letting his second season play out, haha. At least I admit when I'm wrong. Have you ever admitted you are wrong?

Now you're saying he made some progress? That makes no sense at all since you said he wouldn't make progress after his rookie year and called him Tony Allen.  Did you see how timid he was last year? IMO, he has made great progress, as much as I would expect after one season under his belt.

Anyways, we'll see how good Marcus Smart will be when the season starts. But I'll be laughing my butt off if he's an all star.

huh?

I've never discounted the possibility that Smart will eventually develop into a star.  I wanted us to tank all that year and land a Top 8 pick.  I had Smart 8th on my list.  He was a solid consolation prize and I've repeatedly said he's easily our best asset.  I just don't think he's going to be an allstar.  Too offensively challenged.   If he ever makes an all-star team, I'll be very happy... unless of course it's after we've traded him away.

Smart looks like he's made some progress.  This is summer league, though.  We'll see what happens in the NBA.  He's still got a ways to go until he's as good as Tony Allen was in his prime.  Here's hoping he gets there, and then surpasses it.

You compared him to Iman Shumpert in the thread below.

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=78960.120;topicseen

You keep saying he's offensively challenged but I don't see it. Smart is already going to be better than Bradley this year IMO. So I don't see the Shumpert comparison. You can't play both sides of the fence. You clearly are saying he won't be an allstar and I find it hilarious you based that assumption on one year.

His stats as a rookie were similar to Iman shumpert. I was just making an observation.

Again, I don't think you can look at those two summer league games and conclusively say he is better than he was at the end of the regular season.   He's probably better than he was last summer league, but that's to be expected considering the year he spent against NBA competition.

[TheFlex]

Yes. The fans should have high hopes for him.

[max215]

It's summer league. He should be dominating it.  Don't set yourself up to be disappointed.  We are seeing positive signs from smart, but we don't know if he can carry it over into the real league. As of right now I still see him as an offensively challenged defensive stud.  I'm seeing tiny hints of improvement, but how much of is it related to his progress over the past couple months and how much of it is related to a full season of playing NBA basketball?  We don't know if he's actually improved since the end of the year... The competition level is dramatically different in the NBA.

By that logic all top picks should dominate Summer League, meaning that the following players (who haven't thus far) have no offensive game: Towns, Russell, Okafor, Mudiay, Kaminsky, Winslow, and Randle.

[knuckleballer]

I wouldn't even bet on Smart becoming an all-star let alone a superstar.  He looks like he's made some progress in summer league, though.  I still don't think he's a good offensive player yet.

Bro, first you said he was going to be like Tony Allen before even giving him the chance to have a whole offseason to work on his game. We've talked about this before and you decided to judge him before letting his second season play out, haha. At least I admit when I'm wrong. Have you ever admitted you are wrong?

Now you're saying he made some progress? That makes no sense at all since you said he wouldn't make progress after his rookie year and called him Tony Allen.  Did you see how timid he was last year? IMO, he has made great progress, as much as I would expect after one season under his belt.

Anyways, we'll see how good Marcus Smart will be when the season starts. But I'll be laughing my butt off if he's an all star.

huh?

I've never discounted the possibility that Smart will eventually develop into a star.  I wanted us to tank all that year and land a Top 8 pick.  I had Smart 8th on my list.  He was a solid consolation prize and I've repeatedly said he's easily our best asset.  I just don't think he's going to be an allstar.  Too offensively challenged.   If he ever makes an all-star team, I'll be very happy... unless of course it's after we've traded him away.

Smart looks like he's made some progress.  This is summer league, though.  We'll see what happens in the NBA.  He's still got a ways to go until he's as good as Tony Allen was in his prime.  Here's hoping he gets there, and then surpasses it.

You compared him to Iman Shumpert in the thread below.

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=78960.120;topicseen

You keep saying he's offensively challenged but I don't see it. Smart is already going to be better than Bradley this year IMO. So I don't see the Shumpert comparison. You can't play both sides of the fence. You clearly are saying he won't be an allstar and I find it hilarious you based that assumption on one year.

His stats as a rookie were similar to Iman shumpert. I was just making an observation.

Again, I don't think you can look at those two summer league games and conclusively say he is better than he was at the end of the regular season.   He's probably better than he was last summer league, but that's to be expected considering the year he spent against NBA competition.

Probably better than last summer?

Why are you having such a tough time admitting that he's improving and better than you thought?  It's a good thing.

[chambers]

I think it's very possible that he at least becomes an Iguadala level star. Makes a few All Star games and locks down top offensive players on the wings.
Considering how quickly his 3 point shot improved, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and say he'll at least be a perennial contender for an All Star game.

I think that's what we'd hope to all be saying in two years from now.
Once he makes that level, then he'll have to keep working on his game and add pieces.

One thing is, he's got superstar work ethic to add those skills, piece by piece, which is what you need to even sniff getting to that level.

[I told you so]

Marcus Smart's development curve is waaaaaay ahead of Draymond Green's.  Here are Green's advanced stats as a 22-year-old rookie - PER 7.1, TS% .404, BPM -3.1, VORP -0.3.  Smart as a 20-year-old rookie was PER 11.0, TS% .491, BPM 1.1, VORP 1.4.

I'm not ready to project Marcus as a superstar, but I can certainly see him as a future all-star.

[TheFlex]

It's summer league. He should be dominating it.  Don't set yourself up to be disappointed.  We are seeing positive signs from smart, but we don't know if he can carry it over into the real league. As of right now I still see him as an offensively challenged defensive stud.  I'm seeing tiny hints of improvement, but how much of is it related to his progress over the past couple months and how much of it is related to a full season of playing NBA basketball?  We don't know if he's actually improved since the end of the year... The competition level is dramatically different in the NBA.

By that logic all top picks should dominate Summer League, meaning that the following players (who haven't thus far) have no offensive game: Towns, Russell, Okafor, Mudiay, Kaminsky, Winslow.

You forgot Julius Randle, another player LB insists is as valuable as Smart.

[D.o.s.]

Pierce was definitely a better player than Garnett. Garnett proved during his tenure at Minnesota he couldn't carry a team on his own. Missed the playoffs 3 years in a row during his prime. That's not superstar material.

Pierce, of course, had the advantage of playing in the height of the (L)Eastern Conference, but we won't talk about that.

In reality land, there was no point in NBA history where Paul Pierce was actually a better player than KG prior to KG's 2009 knee injury, and that has nothing to do with respect or disrespect -- it's just factual. Love Pierce, Love KG, KG was the better player. End of story. It's like saying Russell was a better player than Parish: it's not a slight, just  a fact.

It's summer league. He should be dominating it.

Absolutely. Legitimate NBA players crush Summer league the same way they destroy the D-League. It's probably worth pointing out that Fab Melo destroyed in the D-League.

However: and to bring it full circle: I don't think any of us* expect Marcus Smart to  be the next Paul Pierce-level talent on the Celtics. That doesn't mean he can't be a solid starter on a playoff team and can't be a player worth holding onto for his tenure in the NBA.

*I say any of us, but I mean people thinking reasonably, not the people that wouldn't trade Smart for Kevin Durant et. al. That's just utterly indefensible if you lay any claim to objective thinking.

[max215]

It's summer league. He should be dominating it.  Don't set yourself up to be disappointed.  We are seeing positive signs from smart, but we don't know if he can carry it over into the real league. As of right now I still see him as an offensively challenged defensive stud.  I'm seeing tiny hints of improvement, but how much of is it related to his progress over the past couple months and how much of it is related to a full season of playing NBA basketball?  We don't know if he's actually improved since the end of the year... The competition level is dramatically different in the NBA.

By that logic all top picks should dominate Summer League, meaning that the following players (who haven't thus far) have no offensive game: Towns, Russell, Okafor, Mudiay, Kaminsky, Winslow.

You forgot Julius Randle, another player LB insists is as valuable as Smart.

TP. I intended to mention him, I'll add him. Randle was quite bad in just about every way.

[j804]

It's summer league. He should be dominating it.  Don't set yourself up to be disappointed.  We are seeing positive signs from smart, but we don't know if he can carry it over into the real league. As of right now I still see him as an offensively challenged defensive stud.  I'm seeing tiny hints of improvement, but how much of is it related to his progress over the past couple months and how much of it is related to a full season of playing NBA basketball?  We don't know if he's actually improved since the end of the year... The competition level is dramatically different in the NBA.

By that logic all top picks should dominate Summer League, meaning that the following players (who haven't thus far) have no offensive game: Towns, Russell, Okafor, Mudiay, Kaminsky, Winslow.

You forgot Julius Randle, another player LB insists is as valuable as Smart.

Thats laughable.

[D.o.s.]

Not unless you hold a broken leg against him. Randle's potential for playing in the NBA remains largely the same as it was drafted -- you contrast that against Smart's year in the league, and you determine where it goes from there. For example, Exum was drafted ahead of Smart based on that potential.

And before you say "he missed a year he's obviously damaged goods" I would suggest taking a look at Blake Griffin's perceived trade value after he lost a year to that knee injury.

edit: and again, before my stance is misconstrued -- I was all for drafting Smart with the #6 pick. I was not for drafting Randle. I am not playing favorites here.

[Rondo9]

It's summer league. He should be dominating it.  Don't set yourself up to be disappointed.  We are seeing positive signs from smart, but we don't know if he can carry it over into the real league. As of right now I still see him as an offensively challenged defensive stud.  I'm seeing tiny hints of improvement, but how much of is it related to his progress over the past couple months and how much of it is related to a full season of playing NBA basketball?  We don't know if he's actually improved since the end of the year... The competition level is dramatically different in the NBA.

By that logic all top picks should dominate Summer League, meaning that the following players (who haven't thus far) have no offensive game: Towns, Russell, Okafor, Mudiay, Kaminsky, Winslow.

You forgot Julius Randle, another player LB insists is as valuable as Smart.

TP. I intended to mention him, I'll add him. Randle was quite bad in just about every way.

He played in the Summer League? How was he?