olynyk/sully upfront duo potential to be like zbo/gasol?

[bfrombleacher]

A good defensive big alongside those two, like Asik, would give us a monster frontcourt. Even if you project quite modestly.

an asik/olynyk front court scares nobody. just letting you know.

I guess we'll need to tank for Wiggins

[LilRip]

Im ok with comparing sully to bb. Sully will b better though

But olynyk to barney? What has barney done? You might as well say danny drafted a bust already

Well, I know I have said that on many occassions. It got to the point where one Olynyk quoted me in his SIG saying it to ....I don't know......show that I am wrong if Olynyk is good. I hope I am wrong and will say so if I am but Bargs could well be what Olynyk's high side expectations are.

no. I promise you olynyk is already better than Barney.

You see Bargnani has alot of talent. No doubt about it. The nowitzki comparisons were made when he first came into the league because he could move pretty well, handle the ball like a sf not pf/c, shoot lights out and pass for a 7 ft guy. But as you take off your goggles, you see a guy who can't move as quick as nowitski, doesn't want to mix it up underneath the basket, playing with fire only sometimes, didn't develop a post game and ultimately ended up positionless.

If he isn't already, he is considered the biggest #1 pick bust so far in the nba.  Darko the biggest #2 pick bust. Go figure

So i can see why some ppl were sick to their stomach that Olynyk was drafted. But the thing that seperates olynyk to these two busts, is that when he plays game in and game out, he competes.  If you watch videos of him, he is pushing guys around. He pushes/forearms players for position under the basket and quite often pulls a "kg" and pushes/forearms guys out of the way. Not enought to be whistled but still a dirty old school move. 

I can accept olynyk bargnani comparison, but if its Bargnani plus passion/intensity. And that is dangerous potential

I know it's been commented on a few times, but not sure how you could see Bargnani as a bust at all, never mind the biggest bust.  Not really his fault that he came out in a very weak draft.  Most years he would not have been #1, but even still, if the draft were held today with 7-year hindsight available, AB would probably be the 4th or 5th pick (assuming he recovers from his injury).   Aldridge, Rondo, Gay and then probably Bargnani.  Brandon Roy had a great start, but is done.

AND -- not to get started on #2 busts, but Sam Bowie is up there.  And Jay Williams was definitely a bigger bust than Darko.

Kyle Lowry would go over him.  Millsap and Redick tii.  Even Roy because if you're drafting them right now for their careers, I'd much rather take Roy's abbreviated career over anything Bargnani has done and will do.

Bargnani isn't the biggest bust of all time but he's been a bust.  You get into bust status if you're not a good player and he hasn't been.  It's not an issue of him not meeting the expectations of a no.1 overall pick, it's him not meeting the standards of an average player.  The only thing he does decently is score; otherwise every other facet of his game is below-average and his rebounding might be the worst ever from a big.

So in that draft, you would draft him at... 7th? 8th? That still isn't so bad.

Bargs is a decent player. On a contending/good team, he can come off the bench and be an offensive spark plug (which is what i think he will be with the Knicks). A bust would be guys like Adam Morrison (#3), Patrick O'Bryant (#9) or Mouhamed Sene (#10), all who were drafted in the top 10 of that same draft class but did nothing. Bargs has proven himself to NOT be a franchise player or someone you can build around - heck he's not even allstar material - but that doesn't mean he can't be a role player.

Back to Olynyk, we don't know how his career will turn out just yet, but I imagine he will be much closer to Bargs rather than Marc Gasol. A scorer and a role player rather than reigning DPOY and the anchor to a league-best defense.

[Tr1boy]

Im ok with comparing sully to bb. Sully will b better though

But olynyk to barney? What has barney done? You might as well say danny drafted a bust already

Well, I know I have said that on many occassions. It got to the point where one Olynyk quoted me in his SIG saying it to ....I don't know......show that I am wrong if Olynyk is good. I hope I am wrong and will say so if I am but Bargs could well be what Olynyk's high side expectations are.

no. I promise you olynyk is already better than Barney.

You see Bargnani has alot of talent. No doubt about it. The nowitzki comparisons were made when he first came into the league because he could move pretty well, handle the ball like a sf not pf/c, shoot lights out and pass for a 7 ft guy. But as you take off your goggles, you see a guy who can't move as quick as nowitski, doesn't want to mix it up underneath the basket, playing with fire only sometimes, didn't develop a post game and ultimately ended up positionless.

If he isn't already, he is considered the biggest #1 pick bust so far in the nba.  Darko the biggest #2 pick bust. Go figure

So i can see why some ppl were sick to their stomach that Olynyk was drafted. But the thing that seperates olynyk to these two busts, is that when he plays game in and game out, he competes.  If you watch videos of him, he is pushing guys around. He pushes/forearms players for position under the basket and quite often pulls a "kg" and pushes/forearms guys out of the way. Not enought to be whistled but still a dirty old school move. 

I can accept olynyk bargnani comparison, but if its Bargnani plus passion/intensity. And that is dangerous potential

I know it's been commented on a few times, but not sure how you could see Bargnani as a bust at all, never mind the biggest bust.  Not really his fault that he came out in a very weak draft.  Most years he would not have been #1, but even still, if the draft were held today with 7-year hindsight available, AB would probably be the 4th or 5th pick (assuming he recovers from his injury).   Aldridge, Rondo, Gay and then probably Bargnani.  Brandon Roy had a great start, but is done.

AND -- not to get started on #2 busts, but Sam Bowie is up there.  And Jay Williams was definitely a bigger bust than Darko.

Kyle Lowry would go over him.  Millsap and Redick tii.  Even Roy because if you're drafting them right now for their careers, I'd much rather take Roy's abbreviated career over anything Bargnani has done and will do.

Bargnani isn't the biggest bust of all time but he's been a bust.  You get into bust status if you're not a good player and he hasn't been.  It's not an issue of him not meeting the expectations of a no.1 overall pick, it's him not meeting the standards of an average player.  The only thing he does decently is score; otherwise every other facet of his game is below-average and his rebounding might be the worst ever from a big.

So in that draft, you would draft him at... 7th? 8th? That still isn't so bad.

Bargs is a decent player. On a contending/good team, he can come off the bench and be an offensive spark plug (which is what i think he will be with the Knicks). A bust would be guys like Adam Morrison (#3), Patrick O'Bryant (#9) or Mouhamed Sene (#10), all who were drafted in the top 10 of that same draft class but did nothing. Bargs has proven himself to NOT be a franchise player or someone you can build around - heck he's not even allstar material - but that doesn't mean he can't be a role player.

Back to Olynyk, we don't know how his career will turn out just yet, but I imagine he will be much closer to Bargs rather than Marc Gasol. A scorer and a role player rather than reigning DPOY and the anchor to a league-best defense.

Bargnani plays with no consistency or intensity on both ends of the court, so thats why it mystifies me that you can compare him to Olynyk. Sure there are similiarities, such as height, offensive skills (though Barg is a better three point shooter and Olynyk better post skills) but thats it. Olynyk is much better than him defensively. Trust me, i watch enough raptors to know the difference already. Outside of injuries the last few years, bargnani isn't a starter and sometimes doesn't even get to come off the bench. So he has been put in a position to be a part time off the bench guy/3 point specialist. And in all of this plays such bad defense its shameful.

The only reason or logic i can come up why you compare Olynyk to Bargnani is that you are underrating Olynyks defense.

[Tr1boy]

Please check out these videos and tell me these guys are not going to be at least competent nba defenders, sooner than later

Olynyk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8aLZY7JmN0

watch 5:40 , there is less than 10 seconds left in a pretty tight game. Nice effort and it wasn't even his man

Sullinger

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XF-mKoeEeY

watch 0:02 sec, 1:15 sec, 1:37 sec, and especially 2:05 sec.  And this is against Chandler, one of the better centers in the nba.

Olynyk's 5:40 and Sullingers 2:05 proves that they have good enough lateral quickness, doesn't it??  Again it's the iq , motor , competativeness. So where is the negativity or we will get killed with these two upfront coming from??

[bfrombleacher]

Please check out these videos and tell me these guys are not going to be at least competent nba defenders, sooner than later

Olynyk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8aLZY7JmN0

watch 5:40 , there is less than 10 seconds left in a pretty tight game. Nice effort and it wasn't even his man

Sullinger

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XF-mKoeEeY

watch 0:02 sec, 1:15 sec, 1:37 sec, and especially 2:05 sec.  And this is against Chandler, one of the better centers in the nba.

Olynyk's 5:40 and Sullingers 2:05 proves that they have good enough lateral quickness, doesn't it??  Again it's the iq , motor , competativeness. So where is the negativity or we will get killed with these two upfront coming from??

Chandler is offensively crippled.

But, yes, smart, hustles and less talented >>>> moron and/or lazy and super talented.

And Sully/Olynyk are not elite physical talent but:
Sully has great wingspan, long, decent size for a 4
Olynyk is a mobile and 7 foot tall

Their "ceilings" are "limited" because they're not athletic freaks but they'll go further than some of them other "high ceiling guys" who never get it.

[Tr1boy]

Please check out these videos and tell me these guys are not going to be at least competent nba defenders, sooner than later

Olynyk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8aLZY7JmN0

watch 5:40 , there is less than 10 seconds left in a pretty tight game. Nice effort and it wasn't even his man

Sullinger

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XF-mKoeEeY

watch 0:02 sec, 1:15 sec, 1:37 sec, and especially 2:05 sec.  And this is against Chandler, one of the better centers in the nba.

Olynyk's 5:40 and Sullingers 2:05 proves that they have good enough lateral quickness, doesn't it??  Again it's the iq , motor , competativeness. So where is the negativity or we will get killed with these two upfront coming from??

Chandler is offensively crippled.

But, yes, smart, hustles and less talented >>>> moron and/or lazy and super talented.

And Sully/Olynyk are not elite physical talent but:
Sully has great wingspan, long, decent size for a 4
Olynyk is a mobile and 7 foot tall

Their "ceilings" are "limited" because they're not physical athletic freak but they'll go further than some of them other "high ceiling guys" who never get it.

+1

[guava_wrench]

Of those 4 guys, the 2 most talented will probably always be the Memphis duo.

[nickagneta]

triboy, I just don't see how you can be so sure that Olynyk will be better defendively than Bargs. I watched him in college and he was poor to average, at that level, defensively, given the level of talent he played most of the time. In the Summer League he was no better except for some come from behind blocks on fast breaks.

His pick and roll defense is just poor. He's not strong enough or physical enough to guard bigger stronger players one on one down low as he often gets moved off the block. His foot speed laterally is not good enough to guard PFs on the perimeter and if he has to switch or rotate, a SF, SG or PG will just blow by him.

He's smart so he will get professional rotational defenses but who knows if he will arrive there on time to draw a charge or deflect a pass. He's also, very very far from being a rim protector because of a lack of ups and wingspan.

I've seen him play 4-5 times in college and every Summer League game. He is not a good defensive player and if he fails in the pros and busts out, still a very good possibility, it will be because of his defense and an inability to get his shot off versus average or better defensively, NBA PFs.

[Tr1boy]

triboy, I just don't see how you can be so sure that Olynyk will be better defendively than Bargs. I watched him in college and he was poor to average, at that level, defensively, given the level of talent he played most of the time. In the Summer League he was no better except for some come from behind blocks on fast breaks.

His pick and roll defense is just poor. He's not strong enough or physical enough to guard bigger stronger players one on one down low as he often gets moved off the block. His foot speed laterally is not good enough to guard PFs on the perimeter and if he has to switch or rotate, a SF, SG or PG will just blow by him.

He's smart so he will get professional rotational defenses but who knows if he will arrive there on time to draw a charge or deflect a pass. He's also, very very far from being a rim protector because of a lack of ups and wingspan.

I've seen him play 4-5 times in college and every Summer League game. He is not a good defensive player and if he fails in the pros and busts out, still a very good possibility, it will be because of his defense and an inability to get his shot off versus average or better defensively, NBA PFs.

Your analysis is your opinion but i dont agree. Did you see the clip of olynyk above? Did that guard blow by him for tye last sec layup, or was it nicely contested?

Why would such a poor defensive player be left out in a crucial part of the game? How did gonzaga go 35-3 in the regular season with such a weak defender down the middle? Can that be even possible? At worse doesnt that mean he is a good team defender? Why was it in the summer leagues when he was on the court we were a plus team and when he sat down an avg to a minus team? (Some games he only scored like 12 pts)

If you can answer these questions with your negative spin about his defense then i might understand your viewpoint. But if you cant for most , than you might have to rewatch games again and re evalute.

[Tr1boy]

Also going back to olynyk to bargnani comparison especially on the defensive end, why olynyk is already better is bc of his intensity, iq and not backing down from rough play. Things bargnani struggled to do on a consistent basis. He let guys 6'7 like a carl landry power shots in, he let them out rebound the ball, he rarely gave another effort to contest perimeter jump shot of guys he wasnt assigned to, he is frozen out there instead of moving, setting multiple picks, seeing the play unraveling on the floor. These are things olynyk already does and he hasnt played a real nba game yet

[nickagneta]

triboy, I just don't see how you can be so sure that Olynyk will be better defendively than Bargs. I watched him in college and he was poor to average, at that level, defensively, given the level of talent he played most of the time. In the Summer League he was no better except for some come from behind blocks on fast breaks.

His pick and roll defense is just poor. He's not strong enough or physical enough to guard bigger stronger players one on one down low as he often gets moved off the block. His foot speed laterally is not good enough to guard PFs on the perimeter and if he has to switch or rotate, a SF, SG or PG will just blow by him.

He's smart so he will get professional rotational defenses but who knows if he will arrive there on time to draw a charge or deflect a pass. He's also, very very far from being a rim protector because of a lack of ups and wingspan.

I've seen him play 4-5 times in college and every Summer League game. He is not a good defensive player and if he fails in the pros and busts out, still a very good possibility, it will be because of his defense and an inability to get his shot off versus average or better defensively, NBA PFs.

Your analysis is your opinion but i dont agree. Did you see the clip of olynyk above? Did that guard blow by him for tye last sec layup, or was it nicely contested?

Why would such a poor defensive player be left out in a crucial part of the game? How did gonzaga go 35-3 in the regular season with such a weak defender down the middle? Can that be even possible? At worse doesnt that mean he is not a good team defender? Why was it in the summer leagues when he was on the court we were a plus team and when he sat down an avg to a minus team? (Some games he only scored like 12 pts)

If you can answer these questions with your negative spin about his defense then i might understand your viewpoint. But if you cant for most , than you might have to rewatch games again and re evalute.

He was left in games because the alternative was worse than him both offensively and defensively.

Gonzaga went 35-3 because they had the 75th easiest schedule in the nation and their conference schedule was considered the 169th easiest schedule in the nation.

+/- is a very deceiving stat and even more so given he was playing in Summer league. I don't even consider Summer League stats because it is a developmental league with very little team structure. His offensive skill set seemed very good. His shooting form excellent. He had a nice array of offensive post moves. But his defense was poor for all the reasons I discussed in my previous post.

Stop watching vids. They only show you highlights.

Olynyk has potential but he has limitations physically. Whether he will be able to get his shot off versus average to elite defensive PFs is a major concern as is his defensive abilities.

[Tr1boy]

triboy, I just don't see how you can be so sure that Olynyk will be better defendively than Bargs. I watched him in college and he was poor to average, at that level, defensively, given the level of talent he played most of the time. In the Summer League he was no better except for some come from behind blocks on fast breaks.

His pick and roll defense is just poor. He's not strong enough or physical enough to guard bigger stronger players one on one down low as he often gets moved off the block. His foot speed laterally is not good enough to guard PFs on the perimeter and if he has to switch or rotate, a SF, SG or PG will just blow by him.

He's smart so he will get professional rotational defenses but who knows if he will arrive there on time to draw a charge or deflect a pass. He's also, very very far from being a rim protector because of a lack of ups and wingspan.

I've seen him play 4-5 times in college and every Summer League game. He is not a good defensive player and if he fails in the pros and busts out, still a very good possibility, it will be because of his defense and an inability to get his shot off versus average or better defensively, NBA PFs.

Your analysis is your opinion but i dont agree. Did you see the clip of olynyk above? Did that guard blow by him for tye last sec layup, or was it nicely contested?

Why would such a poor defensive player be left out in a crucial part of the game? How did gonzaga go 35-3 in the regular season with such a weak defender down the middle? Can that be even possible? At worse doesnt that mean he is not a good team defender? Why was it in the summer leagues when he was on the court we were a plus team and when he sat down an avg to a minus team? (Some games he only scored like 12 pts)

If you can answer these questions with your negative spin about his defense then i might understand your viewpoint. But if you cant for most , than you might have to rewatch games again and re evalute.

He was left in games because the alternative was worse than him both offensively and defensively.

Gonzaga went 35-3 because they had the 75th easiest schedule in the nation and their conference schedule was considered the 169th easiest schedule in the nation.

+/- is a very deceiving stat and even more so given he was playing in Summer league. I don't even consider Summer League stats because it is a developmental league with very little team structure. His offensive skill set seemed very good. His shooting form excellent. He had a nice array of offensive post moves. But his defense was poor for all the reasons I discussed in my previous post.

Stop watching vids. They only show you highlights.

Olynyk has potential but he has limitations physically. Whether he will be able to get his shot off versus average to elite defensive PFs is a major concern as is his defensive abilities.

Lots of excuses nick. And the clip above does provide real proof that he is not going to get blasted by so easily like you said he will.

He knows how to play the game and is a fiery competitor. After all he shown in the summer league. Not stat wise but the array of offensive skills you are worried how he is going to shoot over athletic pfs? Nick i think you have little to no confidence/underrating this kid.

[LilRip]

triboy, I just don't see how you can be so sure that Olynyk will be better defendively than Bargs. I watched him in college and he was poor to average, at that level, defensively, given the level of talent he played most of the time. In the Summer League he was no better except for some come from behind blocks on fast breaks.

His pick and roll defense is just poor. He's not strong enough or physical enough to guard bigger stronger players one on one down low as he often gets moved off the block. His foot speed laterally is not good enough to guard PFs on the perimeter and if he has to switch or rotate, a SF, SG or PG will just blow by him.

He's smart so he will get professional rotational defenses but who knows if he will arrive there on time to draw a charge or deflect a pass. He's also, very very far from being a rim protector because of a lack of ups and wingspan.

I've seen him play 4-5 times in college and every Summer League game. He is not a good defensive player and if he fails in the pros and busts out, still a very good possibility, it will be because of his defense and an inability to get his shot off versus average or better defensively, NBA PFs.

Your analysis is your opinion but i dont agree. Did you see the clip of olynyk above? Did that guard blow by him for tye last sec layup, or was it nicely contested?

Why would such a poor defensive player be left out in a crucial part of the game? How did gonzaga go 35-3 in the regular season with such a weak defender down the middle? Can that be even possible? At worse doesnt that mean he is not a good team defender? Why was it in the summer leagues when he was on the court we were a plus team and when he sat down an avg to a minus team? (Some games he only scored like 12 pts)

If you can answer these questions with your negative spin about his defense then i might understand your viewpoint. But if you cant for most , than you might have to rewatch games again and re evalute.

He was left in games because the alternative was worse than him both offensively and defensively.

Gonzaga went 35-3 because they had the 75th easiest schedule in the nation and their conference schedule was considered the 169th easiest schedule in the nation.

+/- is a very deceiving stat and even more so given he was playing in Summer league. I don't even consider Summer League stats because it is a developmental league with very little team structure. His offensive skill set seemed very good. His shooting form excellent. He had a nice array of offensive post moves. But his defense was poor for all the reasons I discussed in my previous post.

Stop watching vids. They only show you highlights.

Olynyk has potential but he has limitations physically. Whether he will be able to get his shot off versus average to elite defensive PFs is a major concern as is his defensive abilities.

Lots of excuses nick. And the clip above does provide real proof that he is not going to get blasted by so easily like you said he will.

He knows how to play the game and is a fiery competitor. After all he shown in the summer league. Not stat wise but the array of offensive skills you are worried how he is going to shoot over athletic pfs? Nick i think you have little to no confidence/underrating this kid.

y'know what will be really ironic? if Kris Kardashian gets more minutes than Olynyk this year, which just might be the case. So much for being Marc Gasol. He'd need to get on Humphries' defensive level first. Then maybe Asik. Then maybe we can talk about Marc Gasol.

And i consider video evidence to be one of the weakest arguments one can put forward simply because everyone looks good in a highlight video. i typed in "Andrea Bargnani highlights 2013" in the search bar on youtube and this is the first vid that came up:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRQyUQoCzRo

note that Bargs is doing that against NBA-level competition. he looks like a monster.

meanwhile, check out this scouting report. I recommend you skip ahead to 7:30 though since you already know so much about Olynyk's strengths:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0UYG1Ksrnm4

At the very least, it's a more in-depth video than a 5-minute highlight montage of a game when Olynyk scored his season high 33 pts.

and furthermore, a piece of advice: don't put too much stock into summer league play. Even guys like Kedrick Brown, JR Bremer and Sebastian Telfair have looked extremely promising in SL play. I don't think Olynyk will be a bust, but i also don't think he's going to be the defender Marc Gasol is.

[vinnie]

triboy, I just don't see how you can be so sure that Olynyk will be better defendively than Bargs. I watched him in college and he was poor to average, at that level, defensively, given the level of talent he played most of the time. In the Summer League he was no better except for some come from behind blocks on fast breaks.

His pick and roll defense is just poor. He's not strong enough or physical enough to guard bigger stronger players one on one down low as he often gets moved off the block. His foot speed laterally is not good enough to guard PFs on the perimeter and if he has to switch or rotate, a SF, SG or PG will just blow by him.

He's smart so he will get professional rotational defenses but who knows if he will arrive there on time to draw a charge or deflect a pass. He's also, very very far from being a rim protector because of a lack of ups and wingspan.

I've seen him play 4-5 times in college and every Summer League game. He is not a good defensive player and if he fails in the pros and busts out, still a very good possibility, it will be because of his defense and an inability to get his shot off versus average or better defensively, NBA PFs.

Your analysis is your opinion but i dont agree. Did you see the clip of olynyk above? Did that guard blow by him for tye last sec layup, or was it nicely contested?

Why would such a poor defensive player be left out in a crucial part of the game? How did gonzaga go 35-3 in the regular season with such a weak defender down the middle? Can that be even possible? At worse doesnt that mean he is not a good team defender? Why was it in the summer leagues when he was on the court we were a plus team and when he sat down an avg to a minus team? (Some games he only scored like 12 pts)

If you can answer these questions with your negative spin about his defense then i might understand your viewpoint. But if you cant for most , than you might have to rewatch games again and re evalute.

He was left in games because the alternative was worse than him both offensively and defensively.

Gonzaga went 35-3 because they had the 75th easiest schedule in the nation and their conference schedule was considered the 169th easiest schedule in the nation.

+/- is a very deceiving stat and even more so given he was playing in Summer league. I don't even consider Summer League stats because it is a developmental league with very little team structure. His offensive skill set seemed very good. His shooting form excellent. He had a nice array of offensive post moves. But his defense was poor for all the reasons I discussed in my previous post.

Stop watching vids. They only show you highlights.

Olynyk has potential but he has limitations physically. Whether he will be able to get his shot off versus average to elite defensive PFs is a major concern as is his defensive abilities.

This. Good stuff, Nick. Hoping for the best, but posturing that Olynk/Sullinger will potentially equal Gasol/Randolph just seems a little more than silly to me at this point.

[Tr1boy]

triboy, I just don't see how you can be so sure that Olynyk will be better defendively than Bargs. I watched him in college and he was poor to average, at that level, defensively, given the level of talent he played most of the time. In the Summer League he was no better except for some come from behind blocks on fast breaks.

His pick and roll defense is just poor. He's not strong enough or physical enough to guard bigger stronger players one on one down low as he often gets moved off the block. His foot speed laterally is not good enough to guard PFs on the perimeter and if he has to switch or rotate, a SF, SG or PG will just blow by him.

He's smart so he will get professional rotational defenses but who knows if he will arrive there on time to draw a charge or deflect a pass. He's also, very very far from being a rim protector because of a lack of ups and wingspan.

I've seen him play 4-5 times in college and every Summer League game. He is not a good defensive player and if he fails in the pros and busts out, still a very good possibility, it will be because of his defense and an inability to get his shot off versus average or better defensively, NBA PFs.

Your analysis is your opinion but i dont agree. Did you see the clip of olynyk above? Did that guard blow by him for tye last sec layup, or was it nicely contested?

Why would such a poor defensive player be left out in a crucial part of the game? How did gonzaga go 35-3 in the regular season with such a weak defender down the middle? Can that be even possible? At worse doesnt that mean he is not a good team defender? Why was it in the summer leagues when he was on the court we were a plus team and when he sat down an avg to a minus team? (Some games he only scored like 12 pts)

If you can answer these questions with your negative spin about his defense then i might understand your viewpoint. But if you cant for most , than you might have to rewatch games again and re evalute.

He was left in games because the alternative was worse than him both offensively and defensively.

Gonzaga went 35-3 because they had the 75th easiest schedule in the nation and their conference schedule was considered the 169th easiest schedule in the nation.

+/- is a very deceiving stat and even more so given he was playing in Summer league. I don't even consider Summer League stats because it is a developmental league with very little team structure. His offensive skill set seemed very good. His shooting form excellent. He had a nice array of offensive post moves. But his defense was poor for all the reasons I discussed in my previous post.

Stop watching vids. They only show you highlights.

Olynyk has potential but he has limitations physically. Whether he will be able to get his shot off versus average to elite defensive PFs is a major concern as is his defensive abilities.

Lots of excuses nick. And the clip above does provide real proof that he is not going to get blasted by so easily like you said he will.

He knows how to play the game and is a fiery competitor. After all he shown in the summer league. Not stat wise but the array of offensive skills you are worried how he is going to shoot over athletic pfs? Nick i think you have little to no confidence/underrating this kid.

y'know what will be really ironic? if Kris Kardashian gets more minutes than Olynyk this year, which just might be the case. So much for being Marc Gasol. He'd need to get on Humphries' defensive level first. Then maybe Asik. Then maybe we can talk about Marc Gasol.

And i consider video evidence to be one of the weakest arguments one can put forward simply because everyone looks good in a highlight video. i typed in "Andrea Bargnani highlights 2013" in the search bar on youtube and this is the first vid that came up:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRQyUQoCzRo

note that Bargs is doing that against NBA-level competition. he looks like a monster.

meanwhile, check out this scouting report. I recommend you skip ahead to 7:30 though since you already know so much about Olynyk's strengths:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0UYG1Ksrnm4

At the very least, it's a more in-depth video than a 5-minute highlight montage of a game when Olynyk scored his season high 33 pts.

and furthermore, a piece of advice: don't put too much stock into summer league play. Even guys like Kedrick Brown, JR Bremer and Sebastian Telfair have looked extremely promising in SL play. I don't think Olynyk will be a bust, but i also don't think he's going to be the defender Marc Gasol is.

1st i never said Olynyk will be as good as Gasol defensively. I never said Olynyk will win DPOY. And i doubt he ever will. What I merely stated was that at potential reach/peak could a sully/olynyk duo play as solid defense as a non great quick/athletic but high iq, motor duo as Zbo/Gasol. Offensively it has been agreed by some that Sullinger/Olynyk hi lo game could become really good.

And a few people like yourself downgrade comparing Olynyk to Bargnani as his future potential/defensive capabilities. Thats why its not understandable. You posted a clip of Bargnani above , dancing around and flashing his skills(no one denies he has skills). But why is there no defensive highlight in that clip?? Bc the truth is , he is that bad. I bet there isn't not even one defensive clip anywhere from youtube to espn of Bargnani doing anything good on the defensive end. In addition i'm happy you pointed parts of the highlights where it shows Olynyk weaknesses. But as people can see, at least he is trying, rotating, moving.  Watch Tony Mitchell below. Stunning shot blocking, what speed on the perimeter, what athleticism. Now go to the weaknesses and suddenly it doesn't matter if he can do these stunning things. He doesn't run back hard, he doesn't box out properly and in general at times looks completely lost. This is how you lose games. These little things are not what Olynyk screws up on.  These little things is what goes on 85 percent of the time in the defensive end.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4QjuMpOQdJc