CB DRAFT FINALS THREAD: Sixers Win!!!!!!!

[indeedproceed]

Eh...  I wonder how much people are voting the GM here, rather than the team.  There's no doubt IP is a great guy, and hey, if folks want to give him the lifetime achievement award, I'll pat him on the back and say that he deserves it.  mgent has been a bit prickly in these debates, and I understand if people don't warm up to him the same way the do a beloved member of the mod staff and this year's commissioner.

However, there's simply no way in my mind that a team of Varejao/West/Iggy/Wade/Hinrich/Kmart/Barbosa loses to Bogut/Amare/Delfino/Harden/Lowry/Williams/Sessions.  Philly has a better defense, much more experience, much more depth, more talent, and a better superstar.

IP is a better arguer than mgent, I think, and some might think he's a nicer guy.  I admire him greatly, and am rooting for him, despite voting against him.  However, there's simply no way his team is better. 

That's completely unfair, and unfounded, and honestly, it seems to me anyways, that the only votes cast have been against my team, not for it.

"IP's a great guy and everything, but his team is really crappy and you shouldn't vote for him?"

Come on man, just say you don't think my team could win and leave it at that. I've worked too hard on this to be dismissed as a [dang] lifetime achievement award. That's a complete low-blow.   

[wdleehi]

Eh...  I wonder how much people are voting the GM here, rather than the team.  There's no doubt IP is a great guy, and hey, if folks want to give him the lifetime achievement award, I'll pat him on the back and say that he deserves it.  mgent has been a bit prickly in these debates, and I understand if people don't warm up to him the same way they do a beloved member of the mod staff and this year's commissioner.  I count IP as a friend, and he put together a good team.

However, there's simply no way in my mind that a team of Varejao/West/Iggy/Wade/Hinrich/Kmart/Barbosa loses to Bogut/Amare/Delfino/Harden/Lowry/Williams/Sessions.  Philly has a better defense, much more experience, much more depth, more talent, and a better superstar.

IP is a better arguer than mgent, I think, and some might think he's a nicer guy.  I admire him greatly, and am rooting for him, despite voting against him.  However, there's simply no way his team is better.  

Some of us are not as high on players like AI2, Kmart, Sideshow V.

[KCattheStripe]

Eh...  I wonder how much people are voting the GM here, rather than the team.  There's no doubt IP is a great guy, and hey, if folks want to give him the lifetime achievement award, I'll pat him on the back and say that he deserves it.  mgent has been a bit prickly in these debates, and I understand if people don't warm up to him the same way the do a beloved member of the mod staff and this year's commissioner.

However, there's simply no way in my mind that a team of Varejao/West/Iggy/Wade/Hinrich/Kmart/Barbosa loses to Bogut/Amare/Delfino/Harden/Lowry/Williams/Sessions.  Philly has a better defense, much more experience, much more depth, more talent, and a better superstar.

IP is a better arguer than mgent, I think, and some might think he's a nicer guy.  I admire him greatly, and am rooting for him, despite voting against him.  However, there's simply no way his team is better. 

That's completely unfair, and unfounded, and honestly, it seems to me anyways, that the only votes cast have been against my team, not for it.

"IP's a great guy and everything, but his team is really crappy and you shouldn't vote for him?"

Come on man, just say you don't think my team could win and leave it at that. I've worked too hard on this to be dismissed as a [dang] lifetime achievement award. That's a complete low-blow.   

Mod Fight.


MOD FIGHT!


MOD FIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHT!

[Roy H.]

Eh...  I wonder how much people are voting the GM here, rather than the team.  There's no doubt IP is a great guy, and hey, if folks want to give him the lifetime achievement award, I'll pat him on the back and say that he deserves it.  mgent has been a bit prickly in these debates, and I understand if people don't warm up to him the same way the do a beloved member of the mod staff and this year's commissioner.

However, there's simply no way in my mind that a team of Varejao/West/Iggy/Wade/Hinrich/Kmart/Barbosa loses to Bogut/Amare/Delfino/Harden/Lowry/Williams/Sessions.  Philly has a better defense, much more experience, much more depth, more talent, and a better superstar.

IP is a better arguer than mgent, I think, and some might think he's a nicer guy.  I admire him greatly, and am rooting for him, despite voting against him.  However, there's simply no way his team is better.  

That's completely unfair, and unfounded, and honestly, it seems to me anyways, that the only votes cast have been against my team, not for it.

"IP's a great guy and everything, but his team is really crappy and you shouldn't vote for him?"

Come on man, just say you don't think my team could win and leave it at that. I've worked too hard on this to be dismissed as a [dang] lifetime achievement award. That's a complete low-blow.  

It's not meant as a low blow, and I've paid homage to your team many times.  In fact, I voted it into the Finals.  However, I think Philly is far and away better.  

When I see people start to discount D. Wade, though, it's crazy to me.  It's like some are stretching for ways to criticize Philly and/or to elevate Portland.  I think we're all susceptible to subtle biases, and like Fafnir suggested earlier, mgent's fairly abrasive manner of arguing probably turned some people off.  The same can probably be said of my arguments, but I call things as I see them.  The way I see it in this series, there's nobody to check Wade, and until people quit sweeping that under the rug, I'm going to wonder what the heck's going on.

If people want to articulate why Wade is going to be ineffective in this series, I may change my mind.  However, Wade has been dominating in two NBA Finals, he's been dominating against the best defense in the NBA, he's been dominant against Harden, dominant against Lowry, and dominant against Delfino.  Amare and Bogut aren't going to matter, because the Blazers' relatively weak defense on Wade is going to result in those guys spending 10 - 15 minutes per night on the bench. 

[KCattheStripe]

Eh...  I wonder how much people are voting the GM here, rather than the team.  There's no doubt IP is a great guy, and hey, if folks want to give him the lifetime achievement award, I'll pat him on the back and say that he deserves it.  mgent has been a bit prickly in these debates, and I understand if people don't warm up to him the same way the do a beloved member of the mod staff and this year's commissioner.

However, there's simply no way in my mind that a team of Varejao/West/Iggy/Wade/Hinrich/Kmart/Barbosa loses to Bogut/Amare/Delfino/Harden/Lowry/Williams/Sessions.  Philly has a better defense, much more experience, much more depth, more talent, and a better superstar.

IP is a better arguer than mgent, I think, and some might think he's a nicer guy.  I admire him greatly, and am rooting for him, despite voting against him.  However, there's simply no way his team is better. 

That's completely unfair, and unfounded, and honestly, it seems to me anyways, that the only votes cast have been against my team, not for it.

"IP's a great guy and everything, but his team is really crappy and you shouldn't vote for him?"

Come on man, just say you don't think my team could win and leave it at that. I've worked too hard on this to be dismissed as a [dang] lifetime achievement award. That's a complete low-blow.   

It's not meant as a low blow, and I've paid homage to your team many times.  In fact, I voted it into the Finals.  However, I think Philly is far and away better. 

When I see people start to discount D. Wade, though, it's crazy to me.  It's like some are stretching for ways to criticize Philly and/or to elevate Portland.  I think we're all susceptible to subtle biases, and like Fafnir suggested earlier, mgent's fairly abrasive manner of arguing probably turned some people off.  The same can probably be said of my arguments, but I call things as I see them.  The way I see it in this series, there's nobody to check Wade.

I have yet to see anyone criticize DWade other than to say, " Hey man, I don't think he can take over a series the way he did in 06 without bigs the opposing team needs to double."

[Donoghus]

Eh...  I wonder how much people are voting the GM here, rather than the team.  There's no doubt IP is a great guy, and hey, if folks want to give him the lifetime achievement award, I'll pat him on the back and say that he deserves it.  mgent has been a bit prickly in these debates, and I understand if people don't warm up to him the same way they do a beloved member of the mod staff and this year's commissioner.  I count IP as a friend, and he put together a good team.

However, there's simply no way in my mind that a team of Varejao/West/Iggy/Wade/Hinrich/Kmart/Barbosa loses to Bogut/Amare/Delfino/Harden/Lowry/Williams/Sessions.  Philly has a better defense, much more experience, much more depth, more talent, and a better superstar.

IP is a better arguer than mgent, I think, and some might think he's a nicer guy.  I admire him greatly, and am rooting for him, despite voting against him.  However, there's simply no way his team is better.  

Some of us are not as high on players like AI2, Kmart, Sideshow V.

Seriously.  Sorry if we're not conforming to the way that certain people think we should be thinking.   

[dark_lord]

Eh...  I wonder how much people are voting the GM here, rather than the team.  There's no doubt IP is a great guy, and hey, if folks want to give him the lifetime achievement award, I'll pat him on the back and say that he deserves it.  mgent has been a bit prickly in these debates, and I understand if people don't warm up to him the same way the do a beloved member of the mod staff and this year's commissioner.

However, there's simply no way in my mind that a team of Varejao/West/Iggy/Wade/Hinrich/Kmart/Barbosa loses to Bogut/Amare/Delfino/Harden/Lowry/Williams/Sessions.  Philly has a better defense, much more experience, much more depth, more talent, and a better superstar.

IP is a better arguer than mgent, I think, and some might think he's a nicer guy.  I admire him greatly, and am rooting for him, despite voting against him.  However, there's simply no way his team is better.  

That's completely unfair, and unfounded, and honestly, it seems to me anyways, that the only votes cast have been against my team, not for it.

"IP's a great guy and everything, but his team is really crappy and you shouldn't vote for him?"

Come on man, just say you don't think my team could win and leave it at that. I've worked too hard on this to be dismissed as a [dang] lifetime achievement award. That's a complete low-blow.  

i think theres truth behind what hobbs says though IP.  i know where ur coming from and agree with what u said, but i think hobbs' statement has some legitimacy behind it.

i think people voted (in general, not specifically with matchups involving ur team) in the following ways:

-voted objectively and what they thought was legit
-voted looking at potential matchups that would directly or not directly impact their team's chances
-reactionary....for example, if a team lost, they wouldnt vote for the team that beat them
-they "bought" the arguments that were presented, thus being a strong debater helped
-their feelings about the other gm's


im not saying everyone did any of these (after the first one), but im pretty confident some people did one (or more) at some point during this process. to not think this didnt happen (even if minimally), i think one would have the proverbial wool pulled over their eyes.

im not going to lie, i have been a jerk in the past, voting against people i didnt care for (and i wasnt even involved).  this was the first year i was allowed to vote, and i did so honestly and objectively throughout the process for the integrity of the game and out of respect of the participants that put a lot of time and energy into this.  im glad i was given the opportunity and i hope people can see my objectivity and honesty.  

hell, i voted for rondo/nick a lot....who would have thunk it (not a cheap shot at either of u, just proving my point).

i hope people can appreciate one "outsider's" opinions in this process. and dont take things personally (at least with me)

[KCattheStripe]

Subjective game is subjective.

[wdleehi]

Has this debate really broken down into this?



People are voting for the GM argument?  




Where is the fun in this argument?

[dark_lord]

Has this debate really broken down into this?



People are voting for the GM argument?  




Where is the fun in this argument?

doesnt this type of thing, or mod conspiracy, happen every year as the game progresses each round and people's teams are eliminated.  everyone says it is fun and respectful, etc in the beginning, but it is competitive and time consuming...so the blame game is bound to come up sometimes.

not saying i agree with it, but im being honest

[Donoghus]

Subjective game is subjective.

Exactly.

[Fafnir]

Has this debate really broken down into this?



People are voting for the GM argument?  




Where is the fun in this argument?

Mgent isn't here to debate IP, it sucks some of the life out of it. Hopefully he'll be on later today.

[Roy H.]

Has this debate really broken down into this?



People are voting for the GM argument?  




Where is the fun in this argument?

It's my opinion, based upon my evaluation of some of the arguments being made in the Blazers' favor.  I'm not asking anybody to share in my opinion.

If people want to vigorously debate why the Blazers are better, that's cool.  I don't see a lot of that, though.  Rather, I'm seeing simplified, shorthand arguments without any in-depth treatment of Philly's strengths, or Portland's weaknesses.  

[wdleehi]

Has this debate really broken down into this?



People are voting for the GM argument?  




Where is the fun in this argument?

It's my opinion, based upon my evaluation of some of the arguments being made in the Blazers' favor. 

If people want to vigorously debate why the Blazers are better, that's cool.  I don't see a lot of that, though.  Rather, I'm seeing simplified, shorthand arguments without any in-depth treatment of Philly's strengths, or Portland's weaknesses. 

And sometimes you start out with a simple idea of how you vote and let the GM tell you why they think it is right or not right. 

Let them pick the path of the argument instead of being so specific that you chose the path.  This is their teams.  They should be framing this argument, not the rest of us. 


How are they going to play this. 

[KCattheStripe]

Has this debate really broken down into this?



People are voting for the GM argument?  




Where is the fun in this argument?

It's my opinion, based upon my evaluation of some of the arguments being made in the Blazers' favor.  I'm not asking anybody to share in my opinion.

If people want to vigorously debate why the Blazers are better, that's cool.  I don't see a lot of that, though.  Rather, I'm seeing simplified, shorthand arguments without any in-depth treatment of Philly's strengths, or Portland's weaknesses.  

Shorthand arguments? ON THE INTERNET?