Author Topic: 2011 CB Draft Western Playoffs: 1st Round  (Read 44906 times)

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Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Kings(1) V Suns (8)
« Reply #45 on: August 02, 2011, 10:16:20 AM »

Offline nickagneta

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Just to be clear the Kings feel the real series changing matchup here is not Bynum-Chandler or Manu-Matthews or Kidd-Billups or Odom-Millsap/Diaw or Gordon-Jennings.

Its LeBron-Williams/Pietrus.

The Suns just have no answer for LeBron offensively or defensively and he should wreak havoc on the Suns on both sides of the ball. As Who(the GM of the Suns) said a few days ago: "Lebron will not be denied".

Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Blazers (2) V Spurs (7)
« Reply #46 on: August 02, 2011, 10:16:41 AM »

Offline indeedproceed

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This has the makings of a good series. San Antonio definitely has the X factor in Westbrook.

I agree. Russell Westbrook is a huge factor in this series. He's the X-Factor because he's what many people describe as the biggest reason behind the Thunder's collapse against the Mavericks. He's the biggest factor because despite playing alongside two of the best young scorers in the NBA, and arguably its best scorer in Durant, Westbrook maintains one of the worst Assist Ratios of starting points in the league, behind other 'shoot first' guards like Mo Williams, JJ Barea, Mike Bibby, and Jerryd Bayless. Here is what Seth Pollack has to say about it (and Seth Pollack is one of the main writers for SB Nation.com's NBA site)

The fact is James Harden has been a better all around basketball player in the 2011 NBA Playoffs then the highly touted (and in my opinion, overrated) Russell Westbrook.

If you've been watching the Thunder at all, you've seen the offense stall countless times with the ball in Westbrook's hands as he drives into traffic and takes bad shots.

At the end of the third quarter of Thursday's Game 3 in Dallas, coach Scott Brooks had enough. After yet another turnover, Brooks benched Westbrook for the fourth quarter and instead of blowing a 16-point lead like they did against the Grizzlies, the Thunder out-scored the Mavericks 29-24 and won a huge road playoff game.

I love James Harden and had the pleasure of watching him play at Arizona State so clearly there's a bias. I've interviewed both players several times and it's obvious between the two who is more mature and shows more signs of being a great leader. All that aside, however, the numbers are also clearly in favor of Harden.

-Russell Westbrook leads all players in the 2011 NBA Playoffs with 62 turnovers. Number two on that list is Derrick Rose with 46. Westbrook has 16 more turnovers than the MVP despite playing similar minutes and the same amount of games.

-Harden on 44 possessions as the pick and roll ball handler in the playoffs has converted on 46.2 percent of his attempts. That ranks the 21-year-old shooting guard as "Very Good" according to Synergy Sports Tech data.

-Westbrook on 141 possessions at the pick and roll ball handler in the 2011 NBA Playoffs has shot 33.6 percent which is rated "Below Average".

-Harden (.762 aFG%) has been better in transition than Westbrook (.574 aFG%) and far better in isolation (Harden, .955 aFG%. Westbrook, .355 aFG%). In fact, James Harden is 9-11 in isolation which makes him the top-ranked player in the 2011 NBA Playoffs in that category.

It's decision making that really sets the two apart. Former coach and ESPN analyst Jeff Van Gundy has said time and again on the broadcast that Harden is the better passer with the better court vision and does a much better job setting up his teammates.

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I think Vince Carter gives you something off the bench too. I think this could be an upset.


I think of the two benches, mine is the one more likely to be a difference maker (Williams, Sessions, Morrow, Jerebko). 

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Anyway anyone could provide H2H stats of Amare V Boozer and Kaman V Bogut?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=bogutan01&p2=kamanch01
-Kaman outscores Bogut career-wise and in their most recent game (over a year time-wise and an NBA-season ago), but they've been playing since Bogut was a rookie, and not as often in the last 2-3 years due to injuries on both their parts. Chris Kaman in his prime though (look at games from 07-08 on) has been less than consistent against Bogut, and since Kaman's not bringing much to the table that isn't on the stat-sheet, (Bad passer, defender esp), I'm not worried about this matchup. 13 points or so for Bogut, and 15 or so for Kaman is about what their recent play predicts, especially since they haven't played each other since Bogut was 23 years old.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=stoudam01&p2=boozeca01

-Amare shoots better, scores better, and rebounds worse. Career-wise Amare is a 54% shooter, against Boozer in 19 games over the total of his career, he's a 54% shooter. Boozer is a career 54% shooter. In 19 games over the totality of his career against Amar'e Stoudemire, Boozer is a 50% shooter. This is a big win for the Blazers.

Plus, lets consider how well Boozer played in the playoffs next to a score-first point guard who was maybe the only starting point guard to pass the ball LESS often than Russell Westbrook.

Boozer won't have the ball in his hands because Westbrook can't get it there, and he won't be able to do nearly as much damage.

IP, i know your squad is capable of really getting up and down the court - but i don't know if i'd want to turn this into a track meet with the Spurs.  You have the far superior half-court offense with a couple of big men who should each see the ball every time down court.  They should have a huge advantage on the block.  I think you're more likely to contain Westbrook and force mistakes from him in that type of tempo.

I'm very interested to know how the 6th men will effect this series.  Two big wildcards in Vinsanity and The Rook.

Point 1) I agree, that I don't want to run-first. Its my second option. My first option is a half-court set with Lowry and Harden dominating in a pick and roll-setting with Amar'e and Bogut. Both guys are gifted passers and good decision makers, and both guys can finish in traffic. When Bogut is out there, I'm only looking to get out in transition when the opportunity presents its self, ie blocks, steals, long rebounds.

Point 2) I think that Vince is going to have a tough time of it. Between James Harden and Carlos Deflino, if Vince shows any life I've got a capable defender ready to get out there and try to slow his choking-butt down.

Derrick Williams however isn't all peaches and herb either. I don't worry about him when he's matched up against Grant Hill; he's just too strong and too gifted a scorer. I don't worry about him matched up against Amir Johnson, he's too quick, too strong and too gifted a scorer.

But I do wonder how he'll matchup against Al-Farouq Aminu. They never played each other in college, and TBH I've never seen Aminu play extended minutes. However, Aminu has the size and quickness to matchup with Williams, but not the strength.

On the bright side though Aminu isn't bringing much offensive production, and I think my over-stated concerns aside, Derrick Williams will be fine against him as well.


"You've gotta respect a 15-percent 3-point shooter. A guy
like that is always lethal." - Evan 'The God' Turner

Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Blazers (2) V Spurs (7)
« Reply #47 on: August 02, 2011, 10:17:17 AM »

Offline indeedproceed

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And guys, I'm moving today, so I'm going to be MIA for a while.

"You've gotta respect a 15-percent 3-point shooter. A guy
like that is always lethal." - Evan 'The God' Turner

Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Blazers (2) V Spurs (7)
« Reply #48 on: August 02, 2011, 10:20:54 AM »

Online Who

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Amare is too quick and explosive for Boozer to cover defensively.

C.Boozer and C.Kaman are too weak in terms of pick and roll defense and overall team defense to cause Portland's offense any trouble. The Blazers will be able to pick them apart easily enough. Especially Harden / Lowry and Amare in the pick and roll.

I think Westbrook has a big series but it won't be enough to overcome his big men's defensive deficiencies.

Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Blazers (2) V Spurs (7)
« Reply #49 on: August 02, 2011, 10:24:23 AM »

Offline StartOrien

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To counter the anti Westbrook piece IP posted;

Most of the Thunder players - either because of the coaching or the players themselves - are fairly miserable moving without the ball. I thought a lot of times Westbrook took the blame for that.

Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Blazers (2) V Spurs (7)
« Reply #50 on: August 02, 2011, 10:36:53 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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To counter the anti Westbrook piece IP posted;

Most of the Thunder players - either because of the coaching or the players themselves - are fairly miserable moving without the ball. I thought a lot of times Westbrook took the blame for that.
Its a chicken and egg argument though, are they less enthusastic about moving off the ball because they know that Westbrook/Durant won't be hitting them in stride for a quality chance to score?

Neither Westbrook or Durant has great vision and timing when it comes to passing.

Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Jazz (3) V Nuggets (6)
« Reply #51 on: August 02, 2011, 10:40:52 AM »

Offline Kwhit10

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I'm on my phone on vacation. So I'll do my best here.

The starting line up will be.
Calderon
JJ
Luc ricard  mbah a moute
Bosh
nene

if thank will be playing a lot we may have calderon guarding him since we aren't worried about hours offense.  While jj will be on baron. With  mbah a  moute on pierce.

Baron has slow down a lot and gotten fat. Everyone says he will return to what he was but ge hadn't been anything in years. How's not an efficient shooter either.

This team is pretty slow and older.  I can see a lineup of hill wright jj bosh nene running circle around themn 

The main bench players used will be wright, hill, and davis.

I'll try to get on a computer later to give stats to back my reasonings.

Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Grizzlies (4) V Warriors (5)
« Reply #52 on: August 02, 2011, 10:41:17 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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Interesting matchup.  Which superstar goes off more, Rose vs. Curry/Terry, or Dirk vs. Humphries?

How about Sam Young trying to chase Ray around those screens?

Rather see Batum or Brewer do that.

I'd like to see Nic Batum on Derrick Rose

I think Rose gets his no matter what. Let him be the ball dominant scorer making Ray Allen a spectator.
I don't think this is true. Rose was very effective at creating 3 point shots for Kyle Korver, with a Korver/Rose backcourt they had an extremely efficient offense.

Ray Allen is a cut above Korver, and would just make things even easier for Rose....

Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Jazz (3) V Nuggets (6)
« Reply #53 on: August 02, 2011, 10:49:22 AM »

Online Who

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if thank will be playing a lot we may have calderon guarding him since we aren't worried about hours offense.  While jj will be on baron. With  mbah a  moute on pierce.
Guessing that was meant to be Thabo. Probably the spell check on the phone.


if thank will be playing a lot we may have calderon guarding him since we aren't worried about hours offense.  While jj will be on baron. With  mbah a  moute on pierce.

Baron has slow down a lot and gotten fat. Everyone says he will return to what he was but ge hadn't been anything in years. How's not an efficient shooter either.

I think Calderon can defend Baron Davis well enough. He has the size and strength to battle him. Davis doesn't have a quickness advantage vs Calderon anymore.

I have that PG battle firmly in Denver's favour. I think Calderon will add a lot more to his team with his exceptional efficiency and facilitating offensively than Baron will with his inefficient shot-happy ways. Davis will provide a bit more defensively and in terms of possession creation (steals mainly) but not enough to make up the difference offensively.

Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Grizzlies (4) V Warriors (5)
« Reply #54 on: August 02, 2011, 10:53:18 AM »

Offline wdleehi

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Interesting matchup.  Which superstar goes off more, Rose vs. Curry/Terry, or Dirk vs. Humphries?

How about Sam Young trying to chase Ray around those screens?

Rather see Batum or Brewer do that.

I'd like to see Nic Batum on Derrick Rose

I think Rose gets his no matter what. Let him be the ball dominant scorer making Ray Allen a spectator.
I don't think this is true. Rose was very effective at creating 3 point shots for Kyle Korver, with a Korver/Rose backcourt they had an extremely efficient offense.

Ray Allen is a cut above Korver, and would just make things even easier for Rose....


I think Ray is more talented at getting open the Korver.  Korver is a stand and wait player.  Ray will work off screens and find the hole. 

Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Blazers (2) V Spurs (7)
« Reply #55 on: August 02, 2011, 10:53:26 AM »

Offline RebusRankin

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All right, for the Spurs, yes we will be leaning heavily on Westbrook. We feel he is quicker and just plain better than Lowery (IP is overrating his abilities on D). We know Westbrook needs to give us 25-30 and feel he can.

Boozer struggles with longer bigs, so if it was Garnett or Gasol we'd be worried but its Amare, who's weak defensively. We feel Boozer can still be effective.

Hill and his vet savvy should win the 3 match-up versus Delfino.

Vince Cater can, must and will be an X factor off the bench.

As for Derrick Williams, didn't we see the same arguments about Evan Turner and Wesley Johnson last year? How'd those work out?

Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Grizzlies (4) V Warriors (5)
« Reply #56 on: August 02, 2011, 10:53:55 AM »

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I think Rose gets his no matter what. Let him be the ball dominant scorer making Ray Allen a spectator. Batum would be very difficult to get shots against. This past season showed that no defense can really stop Rose. Look at his playoff stats also compared to his Regular season stats. His shooting percentages drop as he shoots more shots. Let Rose get his and don't let the others beat you is what I am getting at. I mean none of those other guys can create on their own and if you don't allow Rose to do that for them then I think you make this Memphis team a very inefficient Offensive team.

I think both are viable strategies.

I'd lean towards limiting D.Rose (with Nic Batum) instead of going after his supporting cast because I don't think it'll cost Golden State too much in terms of giving up quality shots to other players.

Ray will be more effective with Steph Curry on him (who will struggle to adequately contest shots coming off of screens) but I'd live with that to slow down Rose. I think you gain more (containing Rose) than you lose (with Ray).

Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Grizzlies (4) V Warriors (5)
« Reply #57 on: August 02, 2011, 10:55:45 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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I think Ray is more talented at getting open the Korver.  Korver is a stand and wait player.  Ray will work off screens and find the hole. 
I don't disagree that Ray is a much more talented player, but Korver isn't a stand still shooter. He's pretty good at using screens to get open, just not nearly as good as Ray. He's a bigger body and not nearly as quick or skilled at it.

Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Kings(1) V Suns (8)
« Reply #58 on: August 02, 2011, 10:59:47 AM »

Offline Rondo2287

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bump
CB Draft LA Lakers: Lamarcus Aldridge, Carmelo Anthony,Jrue Holiday, Wes Matthews  6.11, 7.16, 8.14, 8.15, 9.16, 11.5, 11.16

Re: 2011 CB Western 1st Round: Kings(1) V Suns (8)
« Reply #59 on: August 02, 2011, 11:00:13 AM »

Offline nickagneta

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Okay so I can't confirm or deny that these players were guarding each other during these head to heads but if they weren't, then I am assuming someone even better defensively was trying to guard LeBron and yet here are the head to head matchups for:

LeBron vs Williams

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=jamesle01&p2=willima02

Lebron 30.8 PPG, 8.0 RPG, 6.5 APG, 2.1 SPG, 0.9 BPG, 51.7% FG%, 37% 3PT%

Williams 11.1 PPG, 5.0 RPG, 1.4 APG, 0.8 SPG, 0.4 BPG, 44% FG%, 30% 3PT%


LeBron vs Pietrus

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=jamesle01&p2=pietrmi01

Lebron 28.7 PPG, 8.1 RPG, 7.0 APG, 1.5 SPG, 0.6 BPG, 47.5% FG%, 40.8% 3PT%

Pietrus 5.6 PPG, 2.7 RPG, 1.2 APG, 0.5 SPG, 0.3 SPG, 40.9% FG%, 27.3% 3PT%