2011 CB Draft Western Playoffs: 1st Round

[wdleehi]

I think Ray is more talented at getting open the Korver.  Korver is a stand and wait player.  Ray will work off screens and find the hole. 

I don't disagree that Ray is a much more talented player, but Korver isn't a stand still shooter. He's pretty good at using screens to get open, just not nearly as good as Ray. He's a bigger body and not nearly as quick or skilled at it.

He is no where close to Ray's level at getting open.  Nor does he need as little room as Ray. 

Throw out there the weakness at SG, the attention Rose draws, Ray should have a field day.

[Rondo2287]

Okay so I can't confirm or deny that these players were guarding each other during these head to heads but if they weren't, then I am assuming someone even better defensively was trying to guard LeBron and yet here are the head to head matchups for:

LeBron vs Williams

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=jamesle01&p2=willima02

Lebron 30.8 PPG, 8.0 RPG, 6.5 APG, 2.1 SPG, 0.9 BPG, 51.7% FG%, 37% 3PT%

Williams 11.1 PPG, 5.0 RPG, 1.4 APG, 0.8 SPG, 0.4 BPG, 44% FG%, 30% 3PT%


LeBron vs Pietrus

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=jamesle01&p2=pietrmi01

Lebron 28.7 PPG, 8.1 RPG, 7.0 APG, 1.5 SPG, 0.6 BPG, 47.5% FG%, 40.8% 3PT%

Pietrus 5.6 PPG, 2.7 RPG, 1.2 APG, 0.5 SPG, 0.3 SPG, 40.9% FG%, 27.3% 3PT%

these are based on Lebron 40 Minutes per game vs williams 31 mpg

and Lebron 40 mpg vs Pietrus 21 mpg

[nickagneta]

I think the key here is not how much Rose and Dirk torch their defenders, they will, but how. If Memphis can body up Dirk and keep him outside he will still score but at least you keep him off the boards on that end.

Rose has to drive the lane, pick up shooting fouls, collapse the defense some and than find Ray and Prince open for the long and medium range games they possess.

If Memphis does this they stand a good chance of winning.

Big if though. Especially when you consider the damage that Lee-Dirk can do to the Memphis front court. I usually prefer defensive matchups in the playoffs but I see a lot of 110-107 and 115-112 games in this series.

With homecourt I have to say probably advantage GSW.

[Donoghus]

Aww man...I'm facing Champ?

I think this matchup is certainly a case of matchups.  From a stengths standpoint, we seem to be at opposite ends of the spectrum here although I do think that some people are underestimating Roy Hibbert (to an extent, I understand it).

Certainly a high-scoring series but I do think that Rose will not be denied and cause Golden State fits with his penetration.  This will open up looks for my outside guys and I do see Ray having a high-scoring series.  Tayshaun is a wily veteran and will be consistent from both ends of the floor.  

Collapsing on Rose will only create opportunities for my other guys and this is not simply the Derrick Rose show.

[nickagneta]

Okay so I can't confirm or deny that these players were guarding each other during these head to heads but if they weren't, then I am assuming someone even better defensively was trying to guard LeBron and yet here are the head to head matchups for:

LeBron vs Williams

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=jamesle01&p2=willima02

Lebron 30.8 PPG, 8.0 RPG, 6.5 APG, 2.1 SPG, 0.9 BPG, 51.7% FG%, 37% 3PT%

Williams 11.1 PPG, 5.0 RPG, 1.4 APG, 0.8 SPG, 0.4 BPG, 44% FG%, 30% 3PT%


LeBron vs Pietrus

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=jamesle01&p2=pietrmi01

Lebron 28.7 PPG, 8.1 RPG, 7.0 APG, 1.5 SPG, 0.6 BPG, 47.5% FG%, 40.8% 3PT%

Pietrus 5.6 PPG, 2.7 RPG, 1.2 APG, 0.5 SPG, 0.3 SPG, 40.9% FG%, 27.3% 3PT%

these are based on Lebron 40 Minutes per game vs williams 31 mpg

and Lebron 40 mpg vs Pietrus 21 mpg

Yeah so we are talking 16-17 games for significant minutes in those games so these aren't what one would call a small sampling.

This HAS to be matchup that people look at when considering difference making points in this series.

[Who]

I thought the Hawks team defense's failings (particularly the lack of interior help) were more to blame for LeBron's big nights against them than Marvin's individual defense on LeBron. I actually thought Marvin played pretty solid defense on him.

The numbers LeBron posted against Pietrus were largely down to SVG's defensive strategy. He left Pietrus on an island against LeBron in an effort to shut down the rest of Cleveland's offensive options. I thought Pietrus did well on LeBron. He allowed Orlando to defend LeBron straight up. Limited the amount of help they needed to send which allowed them to stay home on the Cavs shooters.

Sure, LeBron went off and posted incredible numbers but the rest of Cleveland's shooters failed to get quality shots and Orlando won the series in part due to that defensive strategy.

Similar to how Russell's Celtics would beat Wilt's teams despite Wilt scoring huge numbers. They'd live with his numbers if they could shut the rest of the team down. Or how Atlanta beat Orlando this past playoffs by letting Dwight Howard score while shutting down the rest of Orlando's options.

[nickagneta]

I think Portland probably takes this matchup as Lowry can slow down Westbrook enough and Bogut and Amare should have their way offensively on Kaman and Boozer but I can see Kaman and Boozer doing well offensively on Amare and Bogut as well.

I think relying so much on the rookie Williams is a mistake, especially against a productive veteran like Grant Hill who is one of the sweeter passers from the SF position in the league.

I think Afflalo could have a very good series and his defense and outside shooting could be a big factor in a couple of games.

Portland takes this but I see it being very difficult. 6 maybe 7 games.

[Fafnir]

I think Portland probably takes this matchup as Lowry can slow down Westbrook enough and Bogut and Amare should have their way offensively on Kaman and Boozer but I can see Kaman and Boozer doing well offensively on Amare and Bogut as well.

I think relying so much on the rookie Williams is a mistake, especially against a productive veteran like Grant Hill who is one of the sweeter passers from the SF position in the league.

I think Afflalo could have a very good series and his defense and outside shooting could be a big factor in a couple of games.

Portland takes this but I see it being very difficult. 6 maybe 7 games.

I really don't see Grant Hill as the kind of player who can abuse anyone anymore. The best he could do is get Williams in foul trouble, just not the sort of player to hammer anyone.

[nickagneta]

I thought the Hawks team defense's failings (particularly the lack of interior help) were more to blame for LeBron's big nights against them than Marvin's individual defense on LeBron. I actually thought Marvin played pretty solid defense on him.

The numbers LeBron posted against Pietrus were largely down to SVG's defensive strategy. He left Pietrus on an island against LeBron in an effort to shut down the rest of Cleveland's offensive options. I thought Pietrus did well on LeBron. He allowed Orlando to defend LeBron straight up. Limited the amount of help they needed to send which allowed them to stay home on the Cavs shooters.

Sure, LeBron went off and posted incredible numbers but the rest of Cleveland's shooters failed to get quality shots and Orlando won the series in part due to that defensive strategy.

Similar to how Russell's Celtics would beat Wilt's teams despite Wilt scoring huge numbers. They'd live with his numbers if they could shut the rest of the team down. Or how Atlanta beat Orlando this past playoffs by letting Dwight Howard score while shutting down the rest of Orlando's options.

Except lebron isn't on an island with Mo Williams, Boobie Gibson, Anderson Varejao, Delonte West and the other limited offensive players that Cleveland had. He is on a team with "Mr. Big Shot" Chauncey Billups, Paul Millsap, Wesley Matthews, Brandon Jennings, Boris Diaw and Mike Miller. All accomplished outside shooters or offensively gifted players.

Shutting down all those other players to let Lebron go off is a lot easier said than done, especially given the fact that Kidd and Manu are aging and slowing and Gordon doesn't play very good defense and the fact that if Odom gets frustrated offensively, he suffers on the defensive end.

[Who]

I thought the Hawks team defense's failings (particularly the lack of interior help) were more to blame for LeBron's big nights against them than Marvin's individual defense on LeBron. I actually thought Marvin played pretty solid defense on him.

The numbers LeBron posted against Pietrus were largely down to SVG's defensive strategy. He left Pietrus on an island against LeBron in an effort to shut down the rest of Cleveland's offensive options. I thought Pietrus did well on LeBron. He allowed Orlando to defend LeBron straight up. Limited the amount of help they needed to send which allowed them to stay home on the Cavs shooters.

Sure, LeBron went off and posted incredible numbers but the rest of Cleveland's shooters failed to get quality shots and Orlando won the series in part due to that defensive strategy.

Similar to how Russell's Celtics would beat Wilt's teams despite Wilt scoring huge numbers. They'd live with his numbers if they could shut the rest of the team down. Or how Atlanta beat Orlando this past playoffs by letting Dwight Howard score while shutting down the rest of Orlando's options.

Except lebron isn't on an island with Mo Williams, Boobie Gibson, Anderson Varejao, Delonte West and the other limited offensive players that Cleveland had. He is on a team with "Mr. Big Shot" Chauncey Billups, Paul Millsap, Wesley Matthews, Brandon Jennings, Boris Diaw and Mike Miller. All accomplished outside shooters or offensively gifted players.

Agreed -- which is why I think you win the series.

[nickagneta]

I thought the Hawks team defense's failings (particularly the lack of interior help) were more to blame for LeBron's big nights against them than Marvin's individual defense on LeBron. I actually thought Marvin played pretty solid defense on him.

The numbers LeBron posted against Pietrus were largely down to SVG's defensive strategy. He left Pietrus on an island against LeBron in an effort to shut down the rest of Cleveland's offensive options. I thought Pietrus did well on LeBron. He allowed Orlando to defend LeBron straight up. Limited the amount of help they needed to send which allowed them to stay home on the Cavs shooters.

Sure, LeBron went off and posted incredible numbers but the rest of Cleveland's shooters failed to get quality shots and Orlando won the series in part due to that defensive strategy.

Similar to how Russell's Celtics would beat Wilt's teams despite Wilt scoring huge numbers. They'd live with his numbers if they could shut the rest of the team down. Or how Atlanta beat Orlando this past playoffs by letting Dwight Howard score while shutting down the rest of Orlando's options.

Except lebron isn't on an island with Mo Williams, Boobie Gibson, Anderson Varejao, Delonte West and the other limited offensive players that Cleveland had. He is on a team with "Mr. Big Shot" Chauncey Billups, Paul Millsap, Wesley Matthews, Brandon Jennings, Boris Diaw and Mike Miller. All accomplished outside shooters or offensively gifted players.

Agreed -- which is why I think you win the series.

TP Who.

I have to say I really liked your team as it reminded me of my team last year with Manu, Bynum, Scola, Felton and Wilson Chandler. I thought the Suns were a lock for a 5th seed and thought we would be seeing you in the second round not the first.

If you were in the East you would be easily moving on to the second round of the playoffs, IMHO.

[Kane3387]

I'm on my phone on vacation. So I'll do my best here.

The starting line up will be.
Calderon
JJ
Luc ricard  mbah a moute
Bosh
nene

if thank will be playing a lot we may have calderon guarding him since we aren't worried about hours offense.  While jj will be on baron. With  mbah a  moute on pierce.

Baron has slow down a lot and gotten fat. Everyone says he will return to what he was but ge hadn't been anything in years. How's not an efficient shooter either.

This team is pretty slow and older.  I can see a lineup of hill wright jj bosh nene running circle around themn 

The main bench players used will be wright, hill, and davis.

I'll try to get on a computer later to give stats to back my reasonings.

if thank will be playing a lot we may have calderon guarding him since we aren't worried about hours offense.  While jj will be on baron. With  mbah a  moute on pierce.

That is fine. I like Calderon on Thabo. Thabo while not a great shooter is a long and athletic player. He is more then capable of slashing to the basket on Calderon much like Marquise Daniels and getting layups from great passers like Davis, Pierce, and KG. Calderon will give up more offensive rebounds then you think trying to box out Thabo.

Baron has slow down a lot and gotten fat. Everyone says he will return to what he was but ge hadn't been anything in years. How's not an efficient shooter either.

Based off my rankings I think it is assumed Davis comes in, in shape, and focused. Also he is the no higher then the third or fourth guy on offense. He has never played on a team where he was a role player. Playing in a smaller role and with great players for him to play off of for once will only make him more efficient then he has ever been.

This team is pretty slow and older.  I can see a lineup of hill wright jj bosh nene running circle around themn

Bosh and Nene are no Greyhounds and Hill is a reserve. The Spurs knew when to sell high and I trust the Spurs here. Plus when was the last time an older veteran team didn't win it all?

Mavs
Lakers
Lakers
Celtics
Spurs
Heat
Spurs
Pistons

For the most part these teams were veteran teams and you have no one on your team as good as Wade in Miami.

The main bench players used will be wright, hill, and davis.

Jamal Crawford, Thabo/Caron Butler, and Haywood are better and more experienced then guys like Dorell Wright and Ed Davis. Thus I believe my depth gives me an edge even more.

[Kane3387]

if thank will be playing a lot we may have calderon guarding him since we aren't worried about hours offense.  While jj will be on baron. With  mbah a  moute on pierce.

Guessing that was meant to be Thabo. Probably the spell check on the phone.

if thank will be playing a lot we may have calderon guarding him since we aren't worried about hours offense.  While jj will be on baron. With  mbah a  moute on pierce.

Baron has slow down a lot and gotten fat. Everyone says he will return to what he was but ge hadn't been anything in years. How's not an efficient shooter either.

I think Calderon can defend Baron Davis well enough. He has the size and strength to battle him. Davis doesn't have a quickness advantage vs Calderon anymore.

I have that PG battle firmly in Denver's favour. I think Calderon will add a lot more to his team with his exceptional efficiency and facilitating offensively than Baron will with his inefficient shot-happy ways. Davis will provide a bit more defensively and in terms of possession creation (steals mainly) but not enough to make up the difference offensively.

Sounds like he is gonna do a lot of cross switches on defense here. Fine with me when I am fast breaking. Calderoon is a good backup but a poor starter. He can't penetrate and he is purely a set shooter for the most part. He gives nothing on the defensive end. Baron Davis averaged 19.5 pts and 9.5 assts per game last year against him. Also 2.5 steals. It was one of his better matchups.

Davis won the matchup vs Calderon last year in a season where he was mentally not at his best. You underrate Davis ball handling and overrate his defense. To say George Hill is better then Jamal Crawford is crazy to me. They both play similar roles (6th men) but Crawford is someone you gameplan for.

[Fafnir]

Davis won the matchup vs Calderon last year in a season where he was mentally not at his best. You underrate Davis ball handling and overrate his defense. To say George Hill is better then Jamal Crawford is crazy to me. They both play similar roles (6th men) but Crawford is someone you gameplan for.

I think the problem with Davis on your team is that he won't allow the more talented offensive players to control the offense. He's not the kind of guy who will setup Jeferson/Pierce/KG to thrive at the expense of his own shots.

I do think he'll do well against Calderon on an individual offensive basis though.

[StartOrien]

This is going to be a real tough matchup to call. I like both of these teams a lot.