BBD- Which size player will come back from the Offseason?!

[TradeProposalDude]

I think he'll be about 10 pounds lighter, but still the same player.

Face it people, we love Big Baby because he's BIG BABY, but he's still a severely limited basketball player.

He is a 6'7" SF (you heard it) who's being labeled as a PF/C  because he's too fat to get into the kind of shape to play the perimeter and be effective at EITHER end, let alone be able to hold his fort on both.

I love his energy, and the crowd feeds off of him when he's out there - but skills, production, and efficiency wise, everyone and their mother knows there are better players out there. Let's see if we can grab hold of a stud at #30 who can bang & bruise and also give you some points on the board.

[winsomme]

i don't understand why people keep trying to proclaim a consensus about Big Baby and how he's way overweight and not that good of a prospect and on the verge of being out of the league. it's very strange to me.

this supposed "consensus" does not exist. BBD is a highly skilled player IMO and simply not that overweight. he is a rookie who needs to work on his conditioning and his game and he will be well on his way to being a terrific player.

[TradeProposalDude]

i don't understand why people keep trying to proclaim a consensus about Big Baby and how he's way overweight and not that good of a prospect and on the verge of being out of the league. it's very strange to me.

this supposed "consensus" does not exist. BBD is a highly skilled player IMO and simply not that overweight. he is a rookie who needs to work on his conditioning and his game and he well be well on his way to being a terrific player.

He is a highly skilled player? I don't know man. He is nimble for a guy that size, but being nimble and having the ability to shoot a basketball from 15 feet out and finishing around the basket but doing them very seldom  during a game does not make a player a special prospect. He's a tweener who is only good at hustling. You can find players of his worth or slightly greater right now on the FA market at no cost at all. Linton Johnson? Darvin Ham? etc? Those types of players are very, very replacable! I will however go on record for saying that Leon Powe is a much more refined and fundamentally sound big man.

[winsomme]

i don't understand why people keep trying to proclaim a consensus about Big Baby and how he's way overweight and not that good of a prospect and on the verge of being out of the league. it's very strange to me.

this supposed "consensus" does not exist. BBD is a highly skilled player IMO and simply not that overweight. he is a rookie who needs to work on his conditioning and his game and he well be well on his way to being a terrific player.

He is a highly skilled player? I don't know man. He is nimble for a guy that size, but being nimble and having the ability to shoot a basketball from 15 feet out and finishing around the basket but doing them very seldom  during a game does not make a player a special prospect. He's a tweener who is only good at hustling. You can find players of his worth or slightly greater right now on the FA market at no cost at all. Linton Johnson? Darvin Ham? etc? Those types of players are very, very replacable! I will however go on record for saying that Leon Powe is a much more refined and fundamentally sound big man.

like i said, you are entitled to your opinion. but why do you have to try and present it as some kind of consensus opinion.

he was a rookie on a championship team and got little consistent playing time. making definitive statements on a rookie -  like he is "only good at hustling" - is at best premature. and for me flat out inaccurate.

his defensive PER is very respectable and while seen only in spurts this year, his skill level has shown flashes of being very high. good BBIQ passing, finishing equally well with either hand and nice balance moving in the paint.

he is also VERY strong and effective at carving out space for himself. and 6-8 is really not that undersized.

for a ROOKIE getting little playing time, i think he had a great first season and look forward to his improvements next season.

[PRIDE]

If Big Baby Davis develops a hook shot he would be nasty. They are incredibly hard to block and it would help him shoot over other bigs. I think he has the body control to perfect the art.

[EJPLAYA]

i don't understand why people keep trying to proclaim a consensus about Big Baby and how he's way overweight and not that good of a prospect and on the verge of being out of the league. it's very strange to me.

this supposed "consensus" does not exist. BBD is a highly skilled player IMO and simply not that overweight. he is a rookie who needs to work on his conditioning and his game and he well be well on his way to being a terrific player.

He is a highly skilled player? I don't know man. He is nimble for a guy that size, but being nimble and having the ability to shoot a basketball from 15 feet out and finishing around the basket but doing them very seldom  during a game does not make a player a special prospect. He's a tweener who is only good at hustling. You can find players of his worth or slightly greater right now on the FA market at no cost at all. Linton Johnson? Darvin Ham? etc? Those types of players are very, very replacable! I will however go on record for saying that Leon Powe is a much more refined and fundamentally sound big man.

like i said, you are entitled to your opinion. but why do you have to try and present it as some kind of consensus opinion.

he was a rookie on a championship team and got little consistent playing time. making definitive statements on a rookie -  like he is "only good at hustling" - is at best premature. and for me flat out inaccurate.

his defensive PER is very respectable and while seen only in spurts this year, his skill level has shown flashes of being very high. good BBIQ passing, finishing equally well with either hand and nice balance moving in the paint.

he is also VERY strong and effective at carving out space for himself. and 6-8 is really not that undersized.

for a ROOKIE getting little playing time, i think he had a great first season and look forward to his improvements next season.

No one is trying to force you to re-think your opinion as to his level of skill. People are just trying to say that it is 100% fact that the guy is way overweight. You can't look at that picture with his shirt off and the belly rolling over the sides of his pants, the manboobs, fat face, and absolutely NO definition in his body, and say the guy is only slightly (10-15 per you) overweight. THAT is the issue we should all be in consensus on. It is not debatable.

I think that if BBD would drop 30 lbs, add about 10-15 of muscle in the process, that he would be a really good NBA player because of the skills you mention. I am not disagreeing with those abilities at all. I am just saying that the guy doesn't have the work ethic to be the player he should, and his current level of play is just not good enough to get him many minutes as an undersized PF. If he did, he wouldn't have been the fat guy he was in college, and the increasingly fat guy he is now. The only time that you have seen him obviously work out is between his last year and the draft workouts. Other than that he is content to be FBD (fat baby davis). I hope he comes back from the offseason  with a transformation like Big Al had if he isn't traded away. I think he could really be good and earn some serious time as a backup to KG and Perk.

[winsomme]

i don't understand why people keep trying to proclaim a consensus about Big Baby and how he's way overweight and not that good of a prospect and on the verge of being out of the league. it's very strange to me.

this supposed "consensus" does not exist. BBD is a highly skilled player IMO and simply not that overweight. he is a rookie who needs to work on his conditioning and his game and he well be well on his way to being a terrific player.

He is a highly skilled player? I don't know man. He is nimble for a guy that size, but being nimble and having the ability to shoot a basketball from 15 feet out and finishing around the basket but doing them very seldom  during a game does not make a player a special prospect. He's a tweener who is only good at hustling. You can find players of his worth or slightly greater right now on the FA market at no cost at all. Linton Johnson? Darvin Ham? etc? Those types of players are very, very replacable! I will however go on record for saying that Leon Powe is a much more refined and fundamentally sound big man.

like i said, you are entitled to your opinion. but why do you have to try and present it as some kind of consensus opinion.

he was a rookie on a championship team and got little consistent playing time. making definitive statements on a rookie -  like he is "only good at hustling" - is at best premature. and for me flat out inaccurate.

his defensive PER is very respectable and while seen only in spurts this year, his skill level has shown flashes of being very high. good BBIQ passing, finishing equally well with either hand and nice balance moving in the paint.

he is also VERY strong and effective at carving out space for himself. and 6-8 is really not that undersized.

for a ROOKIE getting little playing time, i think he had a great first season and look forward to his improvements next season.

No one is trying to force you to re-think your opinion as to his level of skill. People are just trying to say that it is 100% fact that the guy is way overweight. You can't look at that picture with his shirt off and the belly rolling over the sides of his pants, the manboobs, fat face, and absolutely NO definition in his body, and say the guy is only slightly (10-15 per you) overweight. THAT is the issue we should all be in consensus on. It is not debatable.

I think that if BBD would drop 30 lbs, add about 10-15 of muscle in the process, that he would be a really good NBA player because of the skills you mention. I am not disagreeing with those abilities at all. I am just saying that the guy doesn't have the work ethic to be the player he should, and his current level of play is just not good enough to get him many minutes as an undersized PF. If he did, he wouldn't have been the fat guy he was in college, and the increasingly fat guy he is now. The only time that you have seen him obviously work out is between his last year and the draft workouts. Other than that he is content to be FBD (fat baby davis). I hope he comes back from the offseason  with a transformation like Big Al had if he isn't traded away. I think he could really be good and earn some serious time as a backup to KG and Perk.

EJ, there was a poster AT the rally who just said the same thing as me about him not being that overweight. i actually thought him taking off his shirt at the rally showed exactly what i was saying - that the guy simply is not as overweight as you are claiming...

I don't know.  I think he needs to shed a few pounds, but when I saw him at the parade about 5 feet from me with his shirt off, he didn't look nearly as fat as I would have thought.  He certainly had no six pack, but he wasn't all that flabby. 

we can go round and round on this, but there is no consensus on:

1  how overweight he is
2  what his skill level is
3  what his potential is

[fan33]

I just wanted to mention how very valuable grith is in carving out space and even getting a shot off. From personal experience playing against a round big grith guy of a certain level of cardio conditioning of his being able to haul his 280lbs up and down the court, do NOT look at the body and compare it to typical baller bodys and conclude wrongly about ability, IME!!!

Yes, I expect BBD to push the weights, run and practice/play into better cardio game shape, than being on the road and perhaps drop 15 lbs doing so. But remember muscle weighs more than excess fat so don't expect to see the scales tip wildly either.


Grith is his advantage as well as his lower body strenth and mass, I think he is ahead of schedule for the role player that he is on this team!

BBD is a unique body type, but of course he must improve and certainly not eat himself out of the league, which i just dont see happening either now that he is back to training and not on the road type living half the time.

His ability advantage is on the offensive boards, especially great hand for put backs learning to draw fouls doing so therefore his FT percentages must become efficient as well as developing that 15 foot open jumper. He showed great hand in recieving displayed in that Detroit game when they doubled off of him, so he takes away the double on others or makes them pay. I really like his being used in situations and this then comes down to smart coaching, all in place. he's a keeper and should develop nicely on this team! 

[PRIDE]

BBD does have a unique body type. He will only develop into a solid player if he develops his body the way he needs to. He is naturally strong and is very balanced for a guy his size. Losing weight wont hurt his ability to carve out space under the rim. He needs to get in better shape so he can carve out that space, then finish at the rim.

[BballTim]

I don't know.  I think he needs to shed a few pounds, but when I saw him at the parade about 5 feet from me with his shirt off, he didn't look nearly as fat as I would have thought.  He certainly had no six pack, but he wasn't all that flabby. 

  He's not overweight for normal people, he's overweight for nba players. Pierce looks awfully thin in person or in interviews but he's a pretty bulky sf. Not fat, mind you, but you see the difference.

  When you watch the Celts with Davis in there you can always pick him out on the court. The only player that I saw him matched up against Davis who was anywhere near his size was Antione. winsomme, I just think you're in denial. You said that Turiaf is about as overweight as Davis, but I saw them on the court together in a replay of game 6 and it isn't even close. There's no way that Davis could get in anywhere near as good of shape as the other players without gaining a significant amount of quickness, agility and explosiveness. Whether people want to call it 5lbs, 15 lbs or 30lbs he's significantly chubbier than anyone else on the court, and that excess fat is slowing him down.

[EJPLAYA]

i don't understand why people keep trying to proclaim a consensus about Big Baby and how he's way overweight and not that good of a prospect and on the verge of being out of the league. it's very strange to me.

this supposed "consensus" does not exist. BBD is a highly skilled player IMO and simply not that overweight. he is a rookie who needs to work on his conditioning and his game and he well be well on his way to being a terrific player.

He is a highly skilled player? I don't know man. He is nimble for a guy that size, but being nimble and having the ability to shoot a basketball from 15 feet out and finishing around the basket but doing them very seldom  during a game does not make a player a special prospect. He's a tweener who is only good at hustling. You can find players of his worth or slightly greater right now on the FA market at no cost at all. Linton Johnson? Darvin Ham? etc? Those types of players are very, very replacable! I will however go on record for saying that Leon Powe is a much more refined and fundamentally sound big man.

like i said, you are entitled to your opinion. but why do you have to try and present it as some kind of consensus opinion.

he was a rookie on a championship team and got little consistent playing time. making definitive statements on a rookie -  like he is "only good at hustling" - is at best premature. and for me flat out inaccurate.

his defensive PER is very respectable and while seen only in spurts this year, his skill level has shown flashes of being very high. good BBIQ passing, finishing equally well with either hand and nice balance moving in the paint.

he is also VERY strong and effective at carving out space for himself. and 6-8 is really not that undersized.

for a ROOKIE getting little playing time, i think he had a great first season and look forward to his improvements next season.

No one is trying to force you to re-think your opinion as to his level of skill. People are just trying to say that it is 100% fact that the guy is way overweight. You can't look at that picture with his shirt off and the belly rolling over the sides of his pants, the manboobs, fat face, and absolutely NO definition in his body, and say the guy is only slightly (10-15 per you) overweight. THAT is the issue we should all be in consensus on. It is not debatable.

I think that if BBD would drop 30 lbs, add about 10-15 of muscle in the process, that he would be a really good NBA player because of the skills you mention. I am not disagreeing with those abilities at all. I am just saying that the guy doesn't have the work ethic to be the player he should, and his current level of play is just not good enough to get him many minutes as an undersized PF. If he did, he wouldn't have been the fat guy he was in college, and the increasingly fat guy he is now. The only time that you have seen him obviously work out is between his last year and the draft workouts. Other than that he is content to be FBD (fat baby davis). I hope he comes back from the offseason  with a transformation like Big Al had if he isn't traded away. I think he could really be good and earn some serious time as a backup to KG and Perk.

EJ, there was a poster AT the rally who just said the same thing as me about him not being that overweight. i actually thought him taking off his shirt at the rally showed exactly what i was saying - that the guy simply is not as overweight as you are claiming...

I don't know.  I think he needs to shed a few pounds, but when I saw him at the parade about 5 feet from me with his shirt off, he didn't look nearly as fat as I would have thought.  He certainly had no six pack, but he wasn't all that flabby. 

we can go round and round on this, but there is no consensus on:

1  how overweight he is
2  what his skill level is
3  what his potential is

I don't need a poster at the rally to tell me what I see in that picture that confirms what I was saying. He has ROLLS over his pants with his arms up in the air!!! If those were at his side they would even be bigger. Deny it all you want, but the man is too fat to be effective. LOOK AT THE PICTURE!!

As far as points 2 and 3, I think we are all in consensus on here. He has tremendous upside and potential because of his skill set if he is willing to take care of the fat. I LIKE BBD and his game. I just wish he'd put himself in a physical position to be more effective and get more consistent PT. There has to be a connection with the fatter he got throughout the year the less he played. No way that is coincidence...

[winsomme]

i don't understand why people keep trying to proclaim a consensus about Big Baby and how he's way overweight and not that good of a prospect and on the verge of being out of the league. it's very strange to me.

this supposed "consensus" does not exist. BBD is a highly skilled player IMO and simply not that overweight. he is a rookie who needs to work on his conditioning and his game and he well be well on his way to being a terrific player.

He is a highly skilled player? I don't know man. He is nimble for a guy that size, but being nimble and having the ability to shoot a basketball from 15 feet out and finishing around the basket but doing them very seldom  during a game does not make a player a special prospect. He's a tweener who is only good at hustling. You can find players of his worth or slightly greater right now on the FA market at no cost at all. Linton Johnson? Darvin Ham? etc? Those types of players are very, very replacable! I will however go on record for saying that Leon Powe is a much more refined and fundamentally sound big man.

like i said, you are entitled to your opinion. but why do you have to try and present it as some kind of consensus opinion.

he was a rookie on a championship team and got little consistent playing time. making definitive statements on a rookie -  like he is "only good at hustling" - is at best premature. and for me flat out inaccurate.

his defensive PER is very respectable and while seen only in spurts this year, his skill level has shown flashes of being very high. good BBIQ passing, finishing equally well with either hand and nice balance moving in the paint.

he is also VERY strong and effective at carving out space for himself. and 6-8 is really not that undersized.

for a ROOKIE getting little playing time, i think he had a great first season and look forward to his improvements next season.

No one is trying to force you to re-think your opinion as to his level of skill. People are just trying to say that it is 100% fact that the guy is way overweight. You can't look at that picture with his shirt off and the belly rolling over the sides of his pants, the manboobs, fat face, and absolutely NO definition in his body, and say the guy is only slightly (10-15 per you) overweight. THAT is the issue we should all be in consensus on. It is not debatable.

I think that if BBD would drop 30 lbs, add about 10-15 of muscle in the process, that he would be a really good NBA player because of the skills you mention. I am not disagreeing with those abilities at all. I am just saying that the guy doesn't have the work ethic to be the player he should, and his current level of play is just not good enough to get him many minutes as an undersized PF. If he did, he wouldn't have been the fat guy he was in college, and the increasingly fat guy he is now. The only time that you have seen him obviously work out is between his last year and the draft workouts. Other than that he is content to be FBD (fat baby davis). I hope he comes back from the offseason  with a transformation like Big Al had if he isn't traded away. I think he could really be good and earn some serious time as a backup to KG and Perk.

EJ, there was a poster AT the rally who just said the same thing as me about him not being that overweight. i actually thought him taking off his shirt at the rally showed exactly what i was saying - that the guy simply is not as overweight as you are claiming...

I don't know.  I think he needs to shed a few pounds, but when I saw him at the parade about 5 feet from me with his shirt off, he didn't look nearly as fat as I would have thought.  He certainly had no six pack, but he wasn't all that flabby. 

we can go round and round on this, but there is no consensus on:

1  how overweight he is
2  what his skill level is
3  what his potential is

I don't need a poster at the rally to tell me what I see in that picture that confirms what I was saying. He has ROLLS over his pants with his arms up in the air!!! If those were at his side they would even be bigger. Deny it all you want, but the man is too fat to be effective. LOOK AT THE PICTURE!!

As far as points 2 and 3, I think we are all in consensus on here. He has tremendous upside and potential because of his skill set if he is willing to take care of the fat. I LIKE BBD and his game. I just wish he'd put himself in a physical position to be more effective and get more consistent PT. There has to be a connection with the fatter he got throughout the year the less he played. No way that is coincidence...

i'm not asking you to let another poster tell you what you see, i'm asking that you recognize that there is a difference of opinion amongst people looking at the exact same info.

i mean, how is you opinion about BBDs weight any more legit than the poster who saw him at the parade? why are you better able to visually determine how overweight someone is than anybody else here?

again, this is your opinion and you are entitled to it. but it is not a fact and many here have a different assessment of how overweight BBD is. why can't we leave it that?

[winsomme]

I don't know.  I think he needs to shed a few pounds, but when I saw him at the parade about 5 feet from me with his shirt off, he didn't look nearly as fat as I would have thought.  He certainly had no six pack, but he wasn't all that flabby. 

  He's not overweight for normal people, he's overweight for nba players. Pierce looks awfully thin in person or in interviews but he's a pretty bulky sf. Not fat, mind you, but you see the difference.

  When you watch the Celts with Davis in there you can always pick him out on the court. The only player that I saw him matched up against Davis who was anywhere near his size was Antione. winsomme, I just think you're in denial. You said that Turiaf is about as overweight as Davis, but I saw them on the court together in a replay of game 6 and it isn't even close. There's no way that Davis could get in anywhere near as good of shape as the other players without gaining a significant amount of quickness, agility and explosiveness. Whether people want to call it 5lbs, 15 lbs or 30lbs he's significantly chubbier than anyone else on the court, and that excess fat is slowing him down.

"significantly overweight" is a relative term.

for me, i would call the Oliver Miller's of the world "significantly overweight". Mike Sweetney. Tractor Traylor....

that is why i don't think those comparisons work. they are in a totally different league as far as weight problems go.

If BBD gets on a decent conditioning program and knocks off 10-15 lbs, he will be fine...

you guys think i am in denial and i think you guys are overstating the problem. we're are right where have always been on this topic.

IMO his more important off season work will be on his game with a guy like Clifford Ray.

[Evantime34]

I think Big Baby will come into next year in the best shape of his life. Players who have weight problems usually gain weight after success and when they feel comfortable (via a large contract). BBD is fighting with Powe for time, he has proven nothing and there is no reason for him to get complacent. Also the C's staff is good at molding the bodies of young players (Perk has lost like 30 pounds since when he came into the league).