BBD- Which size player will come back from the Offseason?!

[winsomme]

  I'm not that down on him, I'm just being realistic. The fact that his conditioning isn't better coupled with the fact that his per minute numbers didn't improve over the season isn't a good thing, either by themselves or together.

well his stats IMO are explained by the situation he is playing in.  the fall off from first to second half really doesn't concern me that much. i mean if we was getting a ton of minutes and looking crappy i might be a less enamored, but he was getting very scattered minutes.

just out of curiosity, you said before you think he can be a good player. what are you basing that off of?

  In terms of his stats, it's pretty typical to see improvement over the course of the year for younger players. And he has the skill and BBIQ to be a decent player although he is a bit short. I don't think he will (or should) ever be skinny, but I think he accomplishes what he does in spite of his excess weight, not because of it. He needs to have a body more like Perk, who's strong but not chubby.

but how are you assessing his skill and BBIQ?

  I'm not sure what you're asking, unless the correct answer is "by watching him play".

i guess what i'm getting at is that you see specific skills that you like that are not supported by the stats that you are giving here....that's also why i added the question about what the specific skills are that you see and like....

let's say for a second that he lost the weight and actually became the good player that you think he could become, what would that player be good at doing?

[BballTim]

  I'm not that down on him, I'm just being realistic. The fact that his conditioning isn't better coupled with the fact that his per minute numbers didn't improve over the season isn't a good thing, either by themselves or together.

well his stats IMO are explained by the situation he is playing in.  the fall off from first to second half really doesn't concern me that much. i mean if we was getting a ton of minutes and looking crappy i might be a less enamored, but he was getting very scattered minutes.

just out of curiosity, you said before you think he can be a good player. what are you basing that off of?

  In terms of his stats, it's pretty typical to see improvement over the course of the year for younger players. And he has the skill and BBIQ to be a decent player although he is a bit short. I don't think he will (or should) ever be skinny, but I think he accomplishes what he does in spite of his excess weight, not because of it. He needs to have a body more like Perk, who's strong but not chubby.

but how are you assessing his skill and BBIQ?

  I'm not sure what you're asking, unless the correct answer is "by watching him play".

i guess what i'm getting at is that you see specific skills that you like that are not supported by the stats that you are giving here....that's also why i added the question about what the specific skills are that you see and like....

let's say for a second that he lost the weight and actually became the good player that you think he could become, what would that player be good at doing?

  If he lost some weight and got a little quicker his defense would probably improve (it certainly wouldn't get worse, he'd probably rebound a little better, and he'd be more effective putting the ball on the floor.

[winsomme]

  I'm not that down on him, I'm just being realistic. The fact that his conditioning isn't better coupled with the fact that his per minute numbers didn't improve over the season isn't a good thing, either by themselves or together.

well his stats IMO are explained by the situation he is playing in.  the fall off from first to second half really doesn't concern me that much. i mean if we was getting a ton of minutes and looking crappy i might be a less enamored, but he was getting very scattered minutes.

just out of curiosity, you said before you think he can be a good player. what are you basing that off of?

  In terms of his stats, it's pretty typical to see improvement over the course of the year for younger players. And he has the skill and BBIQ to be a decent player although he is a bit short. I don't think he will (or should) ever be skinny, but I think he accomplishes what he does in spite of his excess weight, not because of it. He needs to have a body more like Perk, who's strong but not chubby.

but how are you assessing his skill and BBIQ?

  I'm not sure what you're asking, unless the correct answer is "by watching him play".

i guess what i'm getting at is that you see specific skills that you like that are not supported by the stats that you are giving here....that's also why i added the question about what the specific skills are that you see and like....

let's say for a second that he lost the weight and actually became the good player that you think he could become, what would that player be good at doing?

  If he lost some weight and got a little quicker his defense would probably improve (it certainly wouldn't get worse, he'd probably rebound a little better, and he'd be more effective putting the ball on the floor.

but that doesn't sound like a very good player to me. i mean you said he was the worst of our rebounders this season and if he lost weight he would only get a little better? how does that translate into a good player.

i mean, what are the things that you saw him do this year that you liked?

[Sweet17]

Lots of people love BBD because he is chubby and lovable - and he has quick feet. But he lacks the work ethic and is LESS athletic then Tractor Traylor. Tractor could get up okay back in the day. I saw him and was just feet away from him at a McDonald's game. He wasn't the unathletic fat guy he ended up. The traylor comparison is right on point. Just like the Gerald Green Kedrick Brown comparison was (much to the chagrin of Gerald Green fans).

BBD is just the next in a long line of african american guys who have eaten their way out of the league. And yes its often african americans as culturally I don't think they have great diet habits. We need Ray Allen and Tony Allen teaching courses on nutrition or something. Salmon and mashed potatoes...forget the PBJ's KG...

Actually PBJ not that bad with whole wheat bread..but I digress..

Pete

[MaxPowers]

That's funny! In a Fuzzy Zoeller sort of way. I think nationality has no difference in what these people do. If Big Baby works on his 15 footer and keeps in descent shape you will be eating crow. It was sweet....17, but your racial views are outdated. You should watch what you say. Just because you have a voice in this forum, doesn't mean you can say $#!% like that.

[Casperian]

Isn´t it depressing how an undersized, overweight and lazy guy with no mid-range game made it to the NBA, and we didn´t? 

And if that wasn`t enough, he already has a ring and a productive finals appearance.

I think we can`t argue about his condition, since that would require more scientific facts.

All right. You're comments can be thrown right out the window. He has a "productive finals appearance"?! He played 15 minutes of garbage time in the closeout game while we were up almost 40 pts. He didn't play a single minute the rest of the finals!!! Did you even watch any of the games?!

Seriously man, lighten up.

This was meant as a final, half serious post to a discussion that I thought was already over, no need to go through the roof. The key word is "appearance". It wasn´t even directed at the topic, it was directed at the post two above mine, which was pretty ridiculous, imo.

Fact is, you can´t argue his condition without scientific facts. How about that argument? You seem to ignore it since I first made it. We´re not talking basketball here, we´re talking medical science.

[kenmaine]

OK, my two cents.

He's definitely overweight.
Virtually no vertical leap.
We really don't know if he has the proper work ethic.
He regressed during the season(not based on stats, just my observation).

On the positive side-
Really nice inside moves.
Certainly carves out space
BBIQ seems high.
Good ballhandler for his size.
He's fun.

Soooo, is he a keeper?, will he have a good career?  I really hope so.

[Sweet17]

That's funny! In a Fuzzy Zoeller sort of way. I think nationality has no difference in what these people do. If Big Baby works on his 15 footer and keeps in descent shape you will be eating crow. It was sweet....17, but your racial views are outdated. You should watch what you say. Just because you have a voice in this forum, doesn't mean you can say $#!% like that.

It's not racial - it's cultural. And it's quite easily documented. Much of it is related to economic differences between the races. It's annoying that SOME people like to repeat this we are all the same mantra. It's simply not true. Well to do white people have much lower levels of obesity then southern blacks for example

Oddly, the report also found that over 20 percent of minority children and approximately 12 percent of white children were at or above the 95th percentile in body mass (the definition of the body mass index, or BMI, appears below) and hence considered obese.

http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/WhosCounting/Story?id=98097&page=2

In fairness you probably don't have enough first hand experience with the african-american community to understand what I am talking about.. African Americans also have shockingly high percentages of things like diabetes. It's not a joke or a racial slight. It's just some sad facts.

Pete

[Roy Hobbs]

Enough with the sociology discussions.  Whether BBD gets in shape has absolutely nothing to do with his ethnic background.  If 20% of black children are obese, that means there are 80% that aren't, right? It's an individual choice, and as a very wealthy young man, BBD certainly is in a better position to control his weight than most people.

All bringing discussions of race into this does is lead to stereotypes and rhetoric being thrown around by both sides.  Since political discussions are no permitted on this blog at this time, this discussion should end now.

[Birdbrain]

In no way is this anymore than a red herring.  And just because you thought Doc was good doesn't make you some student of the game.  I thought Doc was good and I thought we didn't need any other PGs and I think BBD will be fine.  So you can be wrong just as well as you were right on some things.

Sorry the Tractor Traylor comparison isn't even close.  And cute and lovable makes even less sense. If he works hard he'll be fine.  Which is pretty much what you could you say for 100% of the guys in the league although with him being naturally a big guy it's even more of a necessity.

He's got more skills then Powe so anyone that thinks he's not talented enough to stay in the league is not correct either.  Now If Danny wants to make a move he may go because I would assume most GMs see what I see and would prefer him to Powe.

[Brickowski]

Actually BBD would be a great fit for a number of teams.  He'd be perfect for the Lakers, who have no beef inside whatsoever.

[EJPLAYA]

Isn´t it depressing how an undersized, overweight and lazy guy with no mid-range game made it to the NBA, and we didn´t? 

And if that wasn`t enough, he already has a ring and a productive finals appearance.

I think we can`t argue about his condition, since that would require more scientific facts.

All right. You're comments can be thrown right out the window. He has a "productive finals appearance"?! He played 15 minutes of garbage time in the closeout game while we were up almost 40 pts. He didn't play a single minute the rest of the finals!!! Did you even watch any of the games?!

Seriously man, lighten up.

This was meant as a final, half serious post to a discussion that I thought was already over, no need to go through the roof. The key word is "appearance". It wasn´t even directed at the topic, it was directed at the post two above mine, which was pretty ridiculous, imo.

Fact is, you can´t argue his condition without scientific facts. How about that argument? You seem to ignore it since I first made it. We´re not talking basketball here, we´re talking medical science.

So you can make a "half serious" post yet I can't?! If you think that's going through the roof maybe it isn't me that needs to lighten up...

Fact is that you can argue a persons conditioning without scientific fact. It doesn't take scientific fact to know 100% for sure that BBD is fatter right now than he was at the first of the year. It doesn't take scientific fact to look at a guy like Perk who came back from the previous off season having gone from a little pudgy to completely ripped. It doesn't take scientific fact to know that if a guy has 25+ extra pounds of fat then he isn't going to be as productive as he could be.

You made a comment in support of this comment about Davis having this highly productive finals, when in fact he only played 1 game. In garbage time. The only players he was more productive than were Scal and Pruitt. Make realistic comments if you want to be taken seriously.   

[EJPLAYA]

I just saw the Youtube clip at the front page and am going to reinforce the comment that BBD is 30+ lbs overweight. Take a look at him with his shirt off and there is no question!

[PRIDE]

NBA players can not be overweight. All excess body fat must be eliminated. It will cause injuries and shorten the career of most players.

Champ Baby needs to ditch the fat and get some lift to his game. Taller players easily get rebounds away from him because they naturally get to the ball faster. Theres a reason why you "cant teach height". If Baby can get off the ground quicker then he can can to the ball quicker. It will also help him finish at the rim, something else BBD will need to be able to do to succeed at this level.

Leon Powe is about the same height as Big Baby but has way more lift and is  more explosive. Powe doesn't struggle with the things BBD does as much  because of this.

[Jon]

I don't know.  I think he needs to shed a few pounds, but when I saw him at the parade about 5 feet from me with his shirt off, he didn't look nearly as fat as I would have thought.  He certainly had no six pack, but he wasn't all that flabby.