NBA Season 2022-23

[celticsclay]

Feels like Simmons has moved into a similar territory as Rondo did after leaving the Celtics. Rondo was still a really good player but he was such an awkward fit with his lack of jump-shooting that he was too hard to fit in for most teams. So his contracts went way down, it felt like he was looking for a new team each year.

And Simmons is playing worse and MIA in more games than Rondo was back then.

I don't think Simmons is going to find a new home. I think he is going to become a journeyman player going from team to team that is willing to try a non-shooting forward before deciding they'd rather have someone that doesn't screw up their floor spacing. Just like what happened with Rondo at PG.

Possibly, but I think Simmons's physical gifts will keep him on more teams and in the league longer than Rondo, provided he still wants to play basketball.

Wow people still have crazy high hopes. Rondo was in league till he was 36. I would be probably the most shocked of anything I have seen in basketball my whole life if simmons was in the league longer than that. What exactly is he doing at 35 as a non shooter that has lost his athleticism? At least rondo improved his shot throughout his career significantly.

Well, for starters, Rondo was 35 at the end of his NBA career. Further, his age (like the age of most athletes) is largely incidental to do with his NBA career, for reasons that should be obvious - i.e. it lets us presume that the half-season he played at the end of his career is as important as the seasons he played as the starting PG for an NBA Finals calibre team.

Instead, it might make more sense to look at games played. Rondo notched 957, Simmons is just under a third of the way there so far with 312. Simmons has missed two seasons as a DNP, and is a third of the way to the GP mark at 4.5 seasons. He has two more years under his current contract - since he's averaging about 68 games per season when he decides to play, that would put him at about 130 more games at the end of his current deal, or 400-ish overall, since that 312 includes the 42 he's already played this year.

Again, assuming Ben Simmons cares about basketball, I think he can very easily hit 900ish games in the NBA, simply because he's just like Rondo but has the advantage of being taller, more athletic [ed: based on his return so far vs latter-day Rondo, I should specify], and the potential of being a better defender owing to those immutable attributes. I wouldn't say that's high hopes, I'd say that's a basic understanding of mathematics.

But, if you want to hang your hat on age, here is a question for you: if there was a place in the league for Rondo to limp along as a bench player for four seasons starting at the age of 32, how is it a massive leap to see Simmons do the same thing, save his apparent indifference for basketball?

If you are gonna correct me, at least make sure you are right. That is a bit obnoxious. Rondo is 37. He finished the end of the season last year at 36 years old and was still playing double digit minutes.
https://www.espn.com/nba/player/gamelog/_/id/3026/rajon-rondo

As for your other questions, simmons has already proven to be a distraction sitting out basically an entire season cause his feelings were hurt. He also has done interviews this season where he continues to whine and complain about how Philly treated him. Yes rondo had his issues in Dallas, but he had nothing to this level of an ongoing saga. Also saying rondo limped along as a bench player is a bit ridiculous. He was considered by many to be the lakers third best player during their recent championship.  He averaged 26 minutes 9 points 6 assists and 5 rebounds in the finals.

You also asked a reason he couldn’t do it which I already provided and is pretty huge. He already can’t stay healthy in his mid twenties. He has had a back issue for 4 years now. How is that just magically getting better in his mid 30’s? It’s funny you call this a matter of “understanding mathematics.”

[Phantom255x]

Just to put this to bed. Simmons is owed 77 million fully guaranteed over next two years. No team is taking that in the NBA except for maybe heat with Robinson but even then probably takes a first at least. Getting him for an expiring contract and taking on an extra 40 million of dead money for Charlotte? This is insane. I’m gonna give the benefit of the doubt that people didn’t understand how bad his contract was.

Ben is overpaid, but a team like the Spurs could use him to play alongside Johnson and Vasell. Not like free agents are lining up to go play in San Antonio.

Simmons for McDermott, Grahm, and Birch works in the trade machine. Those 3 players aren’t going to be part of the rebuild in SA anyway.

Are the nets giving up three first round picks as part of this trade? Cause otherwise no. This is very baffling to me. 77 million guaranteed to a small market team for a guy that hasn’t played in two years. Can someone try to make a coherent discussion on why Charlotte or spurs would consider this even if they got picks? Charlotte has been trying to dump salary all season for guys like rozier and oubre that actually are decent nba players.

Sure. Nets give up Simmons, plus a first and get McDermott, Grahm, and Birch from SA. So the Spurs are giving up 3 players that aren’t part of the rebuild and roll the dice on Simmons fitting in with Vasell and Johnson. If Ben can get back to 80% of what he was in Philly, that’s a pretty solid trio. Makes sense for both teams.

I would imagine the most owed salary the spurs have ever taken on in a trade is less than simmons makes the next two years. You are really underselling how bad simmons contract is. If any team would consider it would be a big market team but even then he has to show he can stay on the court for even 20 games before anyone would even start to consider touching him.

Normally I'd completely agree with you, but I feel like we say that all the time yet these guys like Simmons, Westbrook, John Wall, etc. end up traded anyways. And sometimes in exchange for other disgruntled, flawed players, but teams can become desperate and hope something works.

I don't think San Antonio is likely though. Idk if Pop retires after this season, but I also wonder if after the whole Kawhi saga near the end of his Spurs tenure that the organization probably wants to avoid another set of potential drama with Simmons.

Portland IMO is a sleeper team. The fit in theory looks good, and if the Blazers have an early playoff exit again, I could see them adding Simmons and hoping a change of scenery to a mid-market team (not big-market) could help. Lillard could help reign him in. And I'm sure BKN would have to add an asset or two to make it work.

Portland on some level makes sense, but the trade does not.  The only salaries they have over the summer to trade are Lillard, Simons, Nurkic, Sharpe, Johnson Brown III, Walker.  Of those Nurkic is the only guy that would make sense to move in the trade, but his 16 million or so is no where near enough to acquire Simmons.  They don't have a good way to clear the cap space either.  I suppose a sign and trade of Grant for Simmons could potentially work, but that isn't a good trade off for Portland, they need to keep Grant and add Simmons for it to make sense.

Yeah I'll admit I didn't look at the NBA Trade Machine before saying that, but I remember seeing on the Blazers Reddit page some posts about trading for Simmons this offseason.

Portland's kind of in that no-man's land position. They need to find that other star to pair with Lillard and Simons, but idk if that's there. Butler? Bam? Embiid if he asks out this summer? Idk.

This one potentially works monetarily and may have the value right

Simmons, Bridges for Simons, Nurkic, and salary filler

I'm not sure either team would do that and I don't really know how either team would view Bridges and Simons in the trade, but I do think Bridges is better than Simons, so Portland would upgrade there, and while taking on Simmons money, get a look at him.  That would be an interesting trade.

Idk, because apparently there were rumors that teams were willing to offer 3-4 first round picks for Bridges alone after the Nets acquired him. I doubt they'd be willing to trade him away in a "salary-dump" move or for those pieces if that was actually the asking price for him at the deadline

[Moranis]

Just to put this to bed. Simmons is owed 77 million fully guaranteed over next two years. No team is taking that in the NBA except for maybe heat with Robinson but even then probably takes a first at least. Getting him for an expiring contract and taking on an extra 40 million of dead money for Charlotte? This is insane. I’m gonna give the benefit of the doubt that people didn’t understand how bad his contract was.

Ben is overpaid, but a team like the Spurs could use him to play alongside Johnson and Vasell. Not like free agents are lining up to go play in San Antonio.

Simmons for McDermott, Grahm, and Birch works in the trade machine. Those 3 players aren’t going to be part of the rebuild in SA anyway.

Are the nets giving up three first round picks as part of this trade? Cause otherwise no. This is very baffling to me. 77 million guaranteed to a small market team for a guy that hasn’t played in two years. Can someone try to make a coherent discussion on why Charlotte or spurs would consider this even if they got picks? Charlotte has been trying to dump salary all season for guys like rozier and oubre that actually are decent nba players.

Sure. Nets give up Simmons, plus a first and get McDermott, Grahm, and Birch from SA. So the Spurs are giving up 3 players that aren’t part of the rebuild and roll the dice on Simmons fitting in with Vasell and Johnson. If Ben can get back to 80% of what he was in Philly, that’s a pretty solid trio. Makes sense for both teams.

I would imagine the most owed salary the spurs have ever taken on in a trade is less than simmons makes the next two years. You are really underselling how bad simmons contract is. If any team would consider it would be a big market team but even then he has to show he can stay on the court for even 20 games before anyone would even start to consider touching him.

Normally I'd completely agree with you, but I feel like we say that all the time yet these guys like Simmons, Westbrook, John Wall, etc. end up traded anyways. And sometimes in exchange for other disgruntled, flawed players, but teams can become desperate and hope something works.

I don't think San Antonio is likely though. Idk if Pop retires after this season, but I also wonder if after the whole Kawhi saga near the end of his Spurs tenure that the organization probably wants to avoid another set of potential drama with Simmons.

Portland IMO is a sleeper team. The fit in theory looks good, and if the Blazers have an early playoff exit again, I could see them adding Simmons and hoping a change of scenery to a mid-market team (not big-market) could help. Lillard could help reign him in. And I'm sure BKN would have to add an asset or two to make it work.

Portland on some level makes sense, but the trade does not.  The only salaries they have over the summer to trade are Lillard, Simons, Nurkic, Sharpe, Johnson Brown III, Walker.  Of those Nurkic is the only guy that would make sense to move in the trade, but his 16 million or so is no where near enough to acquire Simmons.  They don't have a good way to clear the cap space either.  I suppose a sign and trade of Grant for Simmons could potentially work, but that isn't a good trade off for Portland, they need to keep Grant and add Simmons for it to make sense.

Yeah I'll admit I didn't look at the NBA Trade Machine before saying that, but I remember seeing on the Blazers Reddit page some posts about trading for Simmons this offseason.

Portland's kind of in that no-man's land position. They need to find that other star to pair with Lillard and Simons, but idk if that's there. Butler? Bam? Embiid if he asks out this summer? Idk.

This one potentially works monetarily and may have the value right

Simmons, Bridges for Simons, Nurkic, and salary filler

I'm not sure either team would do that and I don't really know how either team would view Bridges and Simons in the trade, but I do think Bridges is better than Simons, so Portland would upgrade there, and while taking on Simmons money, get a look at him.  That would be an interesting trade.

Idk, because apparently there were rumors that teams were willing to offer 3-4 first round picks for Bridges alone after the Nets acquired him. I doubt they'd be willing to trade him away in a "salary-dump" move or for those pieces if that was actually the asking price for him at the deadline

Simons is 23, signed long term, and is averaging 21.4 ppg, 4.2 apg, and 2.7 rpg with a respectable TS% of 58.7%.  He plays solid defense.  He is potentially still on the upswing as well as he has improved significantly each of the last couple of seasons.  Bridges is a better rebounder, worse passer.  He has basically the same TS% on the year on less shots so is scoring less (though he is scoring more in BKN).  He is a better defender.  He is 26, though has steadily improved each year. 

I think Bridges is a bit better, but it isn't like it is a big downgrade to go to Simons.

[Kernewek]

Feels like Simmons has moved into a similar territory as Rondo did after leaving the Celtics. Rondo was still a really good player but he was such an awkward fit with his lack of jump-shooting that he was too hard to fit in for most teams. So his contracts went way down, it felt like he was looking for a new team each year.

And Simmons is playing worse and MIA in more games than Rondo was back then.

I don't think Simmons is going to find a new home. I think he is going to become a journeyman player going from team to team that is willing to try a non-shooting forward before deciding they'd rather have someone that doesn't screw up their floor spacing. Just like what happened with Rondo at PG.

Possibly, but I think Simmons's physical gifts will keep him on more teams and in the league longer than Rondo, provided he still wants to play basketball.

Wow people still have crazy high hopes. Rondo was in league till he was 36. I would be probably the most shocked of anything I have seen in basketball my whole life if simmons was in the league longer than that. What exactly is he doing at 35 as a non shooter that has lost his athleticism? At least rondo improved his shot throughout his career significantly.

Well, for starters, Rondo was 35 at the end of his NBA career. Further, his age (like the age of most athletes) is largely incidental to do with his NBA career, for reasons that should be obvious - i.e. it lets us presume that the half-season he played at the end of his career is as important as the seasons he played as the starting PG for an NBA Finals calibre team.

Instead, it might make more sense to look at games played. Rondo notched 957, Simmons is just under a third of the way there so far with 312. Simmons has missed two seasons as a DNP, and is a third of the way to the GP mark at 4.5 seasons. He has two more years under his current contract - since he's averaging about 68 games per season when he decides to play, that would put him at about 130 more games at the end of his current deal, or 400-ish overall, since that 312 includes the 42 he's already played this year.

Again, assuming Ben Simmons cares about basketball, I think he can very easily hit 900ish games in the NBA, simply because he's just like Rondo but has the advantage of being taller, more athletic [ed: based on his return so far vs latter-day Rondo, I should specify], and the potential of being a better defender owing to those immutable attributes. I wouldn't say that's high hopes, I'd say that's a basic understanding of mathematics.

But, if you want to hang your hat on age, here is a question for you: if there was a place in the league for Rondo to limp along as a bench player for four seasons starting at the age of 32, how is it a massive leap to see Simmons do the same thing, save his apparent indifference for basketball?

If you are gonna correct me, at least make sure you are right. That is a bit obnoxious. Rondo is 37. He finished the end of the season last year at 36 years old and was still playing double digit minutes.
https://www.espn.com/nba/player/gamelog/_/id/3026/rajon-rondo

As for your other questions, simmons has already proven to be a distraction sitting out basically an entire season cause his feelings were hurt. He also has done interviews this season where he continues to whine and complain about how Philly treated him. Yes rondo had his issues in Dallas, but he had nothing to this level of an ongoing saga. Also saying rondo limped along as a bench player is a bit ridiculous. He was considered by many to be the lakers third best player during their recent championship.  He averaged 26 minutes 9 points 6 assists and 5 rebounds in the finals.

You also asked a reason he couldn’t do it which I already provided and is pretty huge. He already can’t stay healthy in his mid twenties. He has had a back issue for 4 years now. How is that just magically getting better in his mid 30’s? It’s funny you call this a matter of “understanding mathematics.”

Should we wait for you to try again, or are you happy with this post?

In other words: you agree there’s no real reason why Simmons couldn’t have a career as long as Rondo’s? And, yes, Rondo was an end of bench guy who had one great series after the age of 32.

[celticsclay]

Feels like Simmons has moved into a similar territory as Rondo did after leaving the Celtics. Rondo was still a really good player but he was such an awkward fit with his lack of jump-shooting that he was too hard to fit in for most teams. So his contracts went way down, it felt like he was looking for a new team each year.

And Simmons is playing worse and MIA in more games than Rondo was back then.

I don't think Simmons is going to find a new home. I think he is going to become a journeyman player going from team to team that is willing to try a non-shooting forward before deciding they'd rather have someone that doesn't screw up their floor spacing. Just like what happened with Rondo at PG.

Possibly, but I think Simmons's physical gifts will keep him on more teams and in the league longer than Rondo, provided he still wants to play basketball.

Wow people still have crazy high hopes. Rondo was in league till he was 36. I would be probably the most shocked of anything I have seen in basketball my whole life if simmons was in the league longer than that. What exactly is he doing at 35 as a non shooter that has lost his athleticism? At least rondo improved his shot throughout his career significantly.

Well, for starters, Rondo was 35 at the end of his NBA career. Further, his age (like the age of most athletes) is largely incidental to do with his NBA career, for reasons that should be obvious - i.e. it lets us presume that the half-season he played at the end of his career is as important as the seasons he played as the starting PG for an NBA Finals calibre team.

Instead, it might make more sense to look at games played. Rondo notched 957, Simmons is just under a third of the way there so far with 312. Simmons has missed two seasons as a DNP, and is a third of the way to the GP mark at 4.5 seasons. He has two more years under his current contract - since he's averaging about 68 games per season when he decides to play, that would put him at about 130 more games at the end of his current deal, or 400-ish overall, since that 312 includes the 42 he's already played this year.

Again, assuming Ben Simmons cares about basketball, I think he can very easily hit 900ish games in the NBA, simply because he's just like Rondo but has the advantage of being taller, more athletic [ed: based on his return so far vs latter-day Rondo, I should specify], and the potential of being a better defender owing to those immutable attributes. I wouldn't say that's high hopes, I'd say that's a basic understanding of mathematics.

But, if you want to hang your hat on age, here is a question for you: if there was a place in the league for Rondo to limp along as a bench player for four seasons starting at the age of 32, how is it a massive leap to see Simmons do the same thing, save his apparent indifference for basketball?

If you are gonna correct me, at least make sure you are right. That is a bit obnoxious. Rondo is 37. He finished the end of the season last year at 36 years old and was still playing double digit minutes.
https://www.espn.com/nba/player/gamelog/_/id/3026/rajon-rondo

As for your other questions, simmons has already proven to be a distraction sitting out basically an entire season cause his feelings were hurt. He also has done interviews this season where he continues to whine and complain about how Philly treated him. Yes rondo had his issues in Dallas, but he had nothing to this level of an ongoing saga. Also saying rondo limped along as a bench player is a bit ridiculous. He was considered by many to be the lakers third best player during their recent championship.  He averaged 26 minutes 9 points 6 assists and 5 rebounds in the finals.

You also asked a reason he couldn’t do it which I already provided and is pretty huge. He already can’t stay healthy in his mid twenties. He has had a back issue for 4 years now. How is that just magically getting better in his mid 30’s? It’s funny you call this a matter of “understanding mathematics.”

Should we wait for you to try again, or are you happy with this post?

In other words: you agree there’s no real reason why Simmons couldn’t have a career as long as Rondo’s? And, yes, Rondo was an end of bench guy who had one great series after the age of 32.

You came at me and incorrectly tried to correct me and we’re objectively wrong. It would be better discourse here to admit you made a mistake. Secondly, I’ve said this twice but I’ll say it again.

Ben Simmons has a chronic back injury that has bothered him for years This is the worst kind of injury for basketball players. If it is repeatedly causing him to miss time and have surgeries it is extremely unusual for guys with bad backs like this to be playing in their mid thirties. Then you throw in he is now out for the season with his knee. If you are gonna ignore this point a third time don’t bother responding.

Lastly, it wasn’t just “one series.” Rondo averaged 9, 7 and 4 throughout the playoffs and also shot 40% on threes (50 attempts in playoffs). He also was playing very well for bulls and many on here thought we only beat them in the playoffs that year cause he got hurt. He was averaging nearly a triple double. He also was very effective for NOP and Lakers first stint. You could really only say he limped along for the last two season but even then he still had his moments.

[Roy H.]

Make your arguments without making it personal, guys.

[celticsclay]

Make your arguments without making it personal, guys.

I get it roy. I edited it. Just get annoyed when someone ignores what I wrote repeatedly and asks me to try again. Apologies

[Phantom255x]

AD out tonight vs. OKC. D-Lo also out for the Lakers.

I think people underestimated the fact that with Lebron out, even though LAL has a better team now after the trades, there's also the actual question of if AD and the others can stay healthy too. So far, not really. AD injured his foot again yesterday apparently. Guarantee you that'll be something that lingers over the next month. That feels like AD's career now, play a few games, put up big numbers but then suffer some injury and miss time. He's no alpha. LAL might hang in there because of the teams around them but I don't think LAL making the play-in tournament is a given at all

[gouki88]

Wow, Jokic with 40pts on a ridiculous 14-21 FGA and 12-15 FTA along with 17 rebounds and 10 assists. That is insane production and efficiency.

3 steals for good measure as well.

To me this is the most wild stat about Jokic's season:

Per ESPN: Jokic ties the record for most consecutive games shooting at least 50%, joining Robert Williams at 48 straight games.

It's impressive enough for Rob to have part of that record, but he's scoring mostly on lobs, layups and put-backs.  Jokic has an all-around offensive game, and he's barely missing.

That's incredible. It doesn't even make sense that he has been able to do that with all the long shots, midrange shots and difficult shots he takes. And with that volume of shots too.

Yeah, Jokic nearly triples the amount of PPG of RWIII and is the main (sometimes only) focus of opposition defences.

Shaq only shot better from the field than Jokic has this season once, and it was his brief stint in Boston.

If Jokic is the main focus of opposition defenses, how come he isn't even in the top 20 players who face double teams? 
https://nbacourtoptix.nba.com/en/metrics/double-teams

Lol, are you serious? That is the be-all and end-all?

Here's a hint: Jokic is the best passer in the entire NBA, and one of the best passers ever. Double teaming him would be a death sentence immediately

[gouki88]

Feels like Simmons has moved into a similar territory as Rondo did after leaving the Celtics. Rondo was still a really good player but he was such an awkward fit with his lack of jump-shooting that he was too hard to fit in for most teams. So his contracts went way down, it felt like he was looking for a new team each year.

And Simmons is playing worse and MIA in more games than Rondo was back then.

I don't think Simmons is going to find a new home. I think he is going to become a journeyman player going from team to team that is willing to try a non-shooting forward before deciding they'd rather have someone that doesn't screw up their floor spacing. Just like what happened with Rondo at PG.

Possibly, but I think Simmons's physical gifts will keep him on more teams and in the league longer than Rondo, provided he still wants to play basketball.

Wow people still have crazy high hopes. Rondo was in league till he was 36. I would be probably the most shocked of anything I have seen in basketball my whole life if simmons was in the league longer than that. What exactly is he doing at 35 as a non shooter that has lost his athleticism? At least rondo improved his shot throughout his career significantly.

Well, for starters, Rondo was 35 at the end of his NBA career. Further, his age (like the age of most athletes) is largely incidental to do with his NBA career, for reasons that should be obvious - i.e. it lets us presume that the half-season he played at the end of his career is as important as the seasons he played as the starting PG for an NBA Finals calibre team.

Instead, it might make more sense to look at games played. Rondo notched 957, Simmons is just under a third of the way there so far with 312. Simmons has missed two seasons as a DNP, and is a third of the way to the GP mark at 4.5 seasons. He has two more years under his current contract - since he's averaging about 68 games per season when he decides to play, that would put him at about 130 more games at the end of his current deal, or 400-ish overall, since that 312 includes the 42 he's already played this year.

Again, assuming Ben Simmons cares about basketball, I think he can very easily hit 900ish games in the NBA, simply because he's just like Rondo but has the advantage of being taller, more athletic [ed: based on his return so far vs latter-day Rondo, I should specify], and the potential of being a better defender owing to those immutable attributes. I wouldn't say that's high hopes, I'd say that's a basic understanding of mathematics.

But, if you want to hang your hat on age, here is a question for you: if there was a place in the league for Rondo to limp along as a bench player for four seasons starting at the age of 32, how is it a massive leap to see Simmons do the same thing, save his apparent indifference for basketball?

I think this is an enormous assumption to make. Rondo was still a valuable role-player post-prime, whereas Simmons has become a complete shell of himself. I don't know if there's a compromise to be made between Simmons' real value (very low) and his ego/greed when he becomes a FA

[celticsclay]

Wow, Jokic with 40pts on a ridiculous 14-21 FGA and 12-15 FTA along with 17 rebounds and 10 assists. That is insane production and efficiency.

3 steals for good measure as well.

To me this is the most wild stat about Jokic's season:

Per ESPN: Jokic ties the record for most consecutive games shooting at least 50%, joining Robert Williams at 48 straight games.

It's impressive enough for Rob to have part of that record, but he's scoring mostly on lobs, layups and put-backs.  Jokic has an all-around offensive game, and he's barely missing.

That's incredible. It doesn't even make sense that he has been able to do that with all the long shots, midrange shots and difficult shots he takes. And with that volume of shots too.

Yeah, Jokic nearly triples the amount of PPG of RWIII and is the main (sometimes only) focus of opposition defences.

Shaq only shot better from the field than Jokic has this season once, and it was his brief stint in Boston.

If Jokic is the main focus of opposition defenses, how come he isn't even in the top 20 players who face double teams? 
https://nbacourtoptix.nba.com/en/metrics/double-teams

Lol, are you serious? That is the be-all and end-all?

Here's a hint: Jokic is the best passer in the entire NBA, and one of the best passers ever. Double teaming him would be a death sentence immediately

This is where I am at as well. I raised this point earlier. People are certainly better off double teaming a player like jaylen brown that has a higher chance of committing a turnover (especially if Tatum is not in). Another factor is who the teammates are. The lakers had such awful shooters the first part of the season so they still double teamed Lebron a decent amount even though he is a good passer. You want to let a wide open Westbrook shoot? Go ahead.  The stat is pretty irrelevant as to whether he is their number one option (and as someone that watches the nuggets in person a lot he is definitely the main focus of opposing defenses). Murray has not returned to the player he once was so far, Gordon is very limited offensively and Porter is a good shooter and can create some but isn’t a star.

[footey]

Wow, Jokic with 40pts on a ridiculous 14-21 FGA and 12-15 FTA along with 17 rebounds and 10 assists. That is insane production and efficiency.

3 steals for good measure as well.

To me this is the most wild stat about Jokic's season:

Per ESPN: Jokic ties the record for most consecutive games shooting at least 50%, joining Robert Williams at 48 straight games.

It's impressive enough for Rob to have part of that record, but he's scoring mostly on lobs, layups and put-backs.  Jokic has an all-around offensive game, and he's barely missing.

That's incredible. It doesn't even make sense that he has been able to do that with all the long shots, midrange shots and difficult shots he takes. And with that volume of shots too.

Yeah, Jokic nearly triples the amount of PPG of RWIII and is the main (sometimes only) focus of opposition defences.

Shaq only shot better from the field than Jokic has this season once, and it was his brief stint in Boston.

If Jokic is the main focus of opposition defenses, how come he isn't even in the top 20 players who face double teams? 
https://nbacourtoptix.nba.com/en/metrics/double-teams

Lol, are you serious? That is the be-all and end-all?

Here's a hint: Jokic is the best passer in the entire NBA, and one of the best passers ever. Double teaming him would be a death sentence immediately

This is where I am at as well. I raised this point earlier. People are certainly better off double teaming a player like jaylen brown that has a higher chance of committing a turnover (especially if Tatum is not in). Another factor is who the teammates are. The lakers had such awful shooters the first part of the season so they still double teamed Lebron a decent amount even though he is a good passer. You want to let a wide open Westbrook shoot? Go ahead.  The stat is pretty irrelevant as to whether he is their number one option (and as someone that watches the nuggets in person a lot he is definitely the main focus of opposing defenses). Murray has not returned to the player he once was so far, Gordon is very limited offensively and Porter is a good shooter and can create some but isn’t a star.

Unfortunately Perk on ESPN has turned the Jokic v Embiid debate into a racial issue.

https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status/1631029611638259717?s=20

[gouki88]

Wow, Jokic with 40pts on a ridiculous 14-21 FGA and 12-15 FTA along with 17 rebounds and 10 assists. That is insane production and efficiency.

3 steals for good measure as well.

To me this is the most wild stat about Jokic's season:

Per ESPN: Jokic ties the record for most consecutive games shooting at least 50%, joining Robert Williams at 48 straight games.

It's impressive enough for Rob to have part of that record, but he's scoring mostly on lobs, layups and put-backs.  Jokic has an all-around offensive game, and he's barely missing.

That's incredible. It doesn't even make sense that he has been able to do that with all the long shots, midrange shots and difficult shots he takes. And with that volume of shots too.

Yeah, Jokic nearly triples the amount of PPG of RWIII and is the main (sometimes only) focus of opposition defences.

Shaq only shot better from the field than Jokic has this season once, and it was his brief stint in Boston.

If Jokic is the main focus of opposition defenses, how come he isn't even in the top 20 players who face double teams? 
https://nbacourtoptix.nba.com/en/metrics/double-teams

Lol, are you serious? That is the be-all and end-all?

Here's a hint: Jokic is the best passer in the entire NBA, and one of the best passers ever. Double teaming him would be a death sentence immediately

This is where I am at as well. I raised this point earlier. People are certainly better off double teaming a player like jaylen brown that has a higher chance of committing a turnover (especially if Tatum is not in). Another factor is who the teammates are. The lakers had such awful shooters the first part of the season so they still double teamed Lebron a decent amount even though he is a good passer. You want to let a wide open Westbrook shoot? Go ahead.  The stat is pretty irrelevant as to whether he is their number one option (and as someone that watches the nuggets in person a lot he is definitely the main focus of opposing defenses). Murray has not returned to the player he once was so far, Gordon is very limited offensively and Porter is a good shooter and can create some but isn’t a star.

Unfortunately Perk on ESPN has turned the Jokic v Embiid debate into a racial issue.

https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status/1631029611638259717?s=20

Dirk was 5th in overall points and =10th in PPG. Perk is a moron.

[Roy H.]

Wow, Jokic with 40pts on a ridiculous 14-21 FGA and 12-15 FTA along with 17 rebounds and 10 assists. That is insane production and efficiency.

3 steals for good measure as well.

To me this is the most wild stat about Jokic's season:

Per ESPN: Jokic ties the record for most consecutive games shooting at least 50%, joining Robert Williams at 48 straight games.

It's impressive enough for Rob to have part of that record, but he's scoring mostly on lobs, layups and put-backs.  Jokic has an all-around offensive game, and he's barely missing.

That's incredible. It doesn't even make sense that he has been able to do that with all the long shots, midrange shots and difficult shots he takes. And with that volume of shots too.

Yeah, Jokic nearly triples the amount of PPG of RWIII and is the main (sometimes only) focus of opposition defences.

Shaq only shot better from the field than Jokic has this season once, and it was his brief stint in Boston.

If Jokic is the main focus of opposition defenses, how come he isn't even in the top 20 players who face double teams? 
https://nbacourtoptix.nba.com/en/metrics/double-teams

Lol, are you serious? That is the be-all and end-all?

Here's a hint: Jokic is the best passer in the entire NBA, and one of the best passers ever. Double teaming him would be a death sentence immediately

This is where I am at as well. I raised this point earlier. People are certainly better off double teaming a player like jaylen brown that has a higher chance of committing a turnover (especially if Tatum is not in). Another factor is who the teammates are. The lakers had such awful shooters the first part of the season so they still double teamed Lebron a decent amount even though he is a good passer. You want to let a wide open Westbrook shoot? Go ahead.  The stat is pretty irrelevant as to whether he is their number one option (and as someone that watches the nuggets in person a lot he is definitely the main focus of opposing defenses). Murray has not returned to the player he once was so far, Gordon is very limited offensively and Porter is a good shooter and can create some but isn’t a star.

Unfortunately Perk on ESPN has turned the Jokic v Embiid debate into a racial issue.

https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status/1631029611638259717?s=20

Dirk was 5th in overall points and =10th in PPG. Perk is a moron.

And the other two were elite passers who had a transformative effect on their teams.

Jokic is leading a top-3 team, with a ridiculous on-court / off-court differential, while averaging a triple-double on insane efficiency.  I'm a big Giannis guy and would vote him MVP just about any season, but this year it belongs to Jokic.

[Moranis]

Wow, Jokic with 40pts on a ridiculous 14-21 FGA and 12-15 FTA along with 17 rebounds and 10 assists. That is insane production and efficiency.

3 steals for good measure as well.

To me this is the most wild stat about Jokic's season:

Per ESPN: Jokic ties the record for most consecutive games shooting at least 50%, joining Robert Williams at 48 straight games.

It's impressive enough for Rob to have part of that record, but he's scoring mostly on lobs, layups and put-backs.  Jokic has an all-around offensive game, and he's barely missing.

That's incredible. It doesn't even make sense that he has been able to do that with all the long shots, midrange shots and difficult shots he takes. And with that volume of shots too.

Yeah, Jokic nearly triples the amount of PPG of RWIII and is the main (sometimes only) focus of opposition defences.

Shaq only shot better from the field than Jokic has this season once, and it was his brief stint in Boston.

If Jokic is the main focus of opposition defenses, how come he isn't even in the top 20 players who face double teams? 
https://nbacourtoptix.nba.com/en/metrics/double-teams

Lol, are you serious? That is the be-all and end-all?

Here's a hint: Jokic is the best passer in the entire NBA, and one of the best passers ever. Double teaming him would be a death sentence immediately

This is where I am at as well. I raised this point earlier. People are certainly better off double teaming a player like jaylen brown that has a higher chance of committing a turnover (especially if Tatum is not in). Another factor is who the teammates are. The lakers had such awful shooters the first part of the season so they still double teamed Lebron a decent amount even though he is a good passer. You want to let a wide open Westbrook shoot? Go ahead.  The stat is pretty irrelevant as to whether he is their number one option (and as someone that watches the nuggets in person a lot he is definitely the main focus of opposing defenses). Murray has not returned to the player he once was so far, Gordon is very limited offensively and Porter is a good shooter and can create some but isn’t a star.

Unfortunately Perk on ESPN has turned the Jokic v Embiid debate into a racial issue.

https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status/1631029611638259717?s=20

Dirk was 5th in overall points and =10th in PPG. Perk is a moron.

edit. Misread. Yes Perk is a moron.