Okafor back on philly after saying bye to teammates?

[celticsclay]

Nurkic didn't play his last game in Denver.  Was it because a trade was close, quite possibly, who knows they didn't say why he didn't play, but Faried was out as was Gallinari, and Nurkic doesn't play leaving O'Bryant to log 11 minutes (before that game O'Bryant had played a total of 18 minutes all season).  Seems odd, doesn't it?

Good grief man. This is bad, even for you.

Did the nuggets go make a public statement saying nurkic wouldn't play?
Was it publicly announced that nurkic was not getting on the teams next flight because a trade was close?
Did laphonso Ellis tweet out thanking Nurkic for his contributions to the nuggets?
Did Nurkic say good by to the team staff on the bench during a game?
Then after all of this happened did Nurkic rejoin the team?

Look I obviously disagree with you on a lot of points and know you can be very stubborn, but throwing out intentionally dissimilar situations to derail a thread is something worse than that. 3 posters have already pointed out why this applies to oranges and it is pretty straight forward.

Moranis, this is some Kellyanne Conway level of deflection hahahaha.

lol seriously. Tp

[Moranis]

Nurkic didn't play his last game in Denver.  Was it because a trade was close, quite possibly, who knows they didn't say why he didn't play, but Faried was out as was Gallinari, and Nurkic doesn't play leaving O'Bryant to log 11 minutes (before that game O'Bryant had played a total of 18 minutes all season).  Seems odd, doesn't it?

Good grief man. This is bad, even for you.

Did the nuggets go make a public statement saying nurkic wouldn't play?
Was it publicly announced that nurkic was not getting on the teams next flight because a trade was close?
Did laphonso Ellis tweet out thanking Nurkic for his contributions to the nuggets?
Did Nurkic say good by to the team staff on the bench during a game?
Then after all of this happened did Nurkic rejoin the team?

Look I obviously disagree with you on a lot of points and know you can be very stubborn, but throwing out intentionally dissimilar situations to derail a thread is something worse than that. 3 posters have already pointed out why this applies to oranges and it is pretty straight forward.

Nurkic was heavily involved in trade rumors.  The Nuggets are down two players, but instead of playing Nurkic, played a guy that had played 18 minutes all season, and then the Nuggets trade Nurkic before another game is played.  Who knows what Nurkic did behind the scenes, but there are plenty of reasons why a team wouldn't just say we are going to sit this guy because he is close to being traded.  That is the part that is odd for the Sixers, not that they sat a guy who might get traded. 

[saltlover]

Getting away from Moranis' inability to concede even the smallest of points, can someone please explain to me why you want Okafor on the Celtics?

Consider the following:

- For his career, he's shooting 40% on 2-point attempts beyond 3 feet.
- His rebounding percentages this season are very similar to Amir Johnson (7.8 to 9.2 ORB%, 15.1 to 16.7 DRB%.)  They were also a bit lower than Amir last year too, so it's not due to inconsistent playing time.
- He's not shown himself to be a great passer.
- His defensive reputation is mediocre at best.

I'm not saying the kid has no future.  He might.  But I fail to see how he'd make the team at all better this year, considering his inability to offer floor spacing or improved defense, and that he doesn't offer any improvement to our major weakness of poor defensive rebounding from our frontcourt.  Our team is not one that needs to take on the effort of developing Okafor.  We have bigger short-term goals, and enough other long-term options that there is limited benefit in pursuing this one.

This seems like a better player for another team, regardless of whatever "bargain" it may appear that they're getting.

[Moranis]

Getting away from Moranis' inability to concede even the smallest of points, can someone please explain to me why you want Okafor on the Celtics?

Consider the following:

- For his career, he's shooting 40% on 2-point attempts beyond 3 feet.
- His rebounding percentages this season are very similar to Amir Johnson (7.8 to 9.2 ORB%, 15.1 to 16.7 DRB%.)  They were also a bit lower than Amir last year too, so it's not due to inconsistent playing time.
- He's not shown himself to be a great passer.
- His defensive reputation is mediocre at best.

I'm not saying the kid has no future.  He might.  But I fail to see how he'd make the team at all better this year, considering his inability to offer floor spacing or improved defense, and that he doesn't offer any improvement to our major weakness of poor defensive rebounding from our frontcourt.  Our team is not one that needs to take on the effort of developing Okafor.  We have bigger short-term goals, and enough other long-term options that there is limited benefit in pursuing this one.

This seems like a better player for another team, regardless of whatever "bargain" it may appear that they're getting.

He makes sense on certain teams, but yeah I'm not sure he would work well here with the current team, though if you could get him for something like Rozier and the 18 1st, I think he would be worth the gamble.  I do think he would do well next to Davis in New Orleans or as the guy down low in Chicago.  I think he would have the freedom he needs to grow.  A clear playoff team like Boston, he makes much less sense.

[Evantime34]

Getting away from Moranis' inability to concede even the smallest of points, can someone please explain to me why you want Okafor on the Celtics?

Consider the following:

- For his career, he's shooting 40% on 2-point attempts beyond 3 feet.
- His rebounding percentages this season are very similar to Amir Johnson (7.8 to 9.2 ORB%, 15.1 to 16.7 DRB%.)  They were also a bit lower than Amir last year too, so it's not due to inconsistent playing time.
- He's not shown himself to be a great passer.
- His defensive reputation is mediocre at best.

I'm not saying the kid has no future.  He might.  But I fail to see how he'd make the team at all better this year, considering his inability to offer floor spacing or improved defense, and that he doesn't offer any improvement to our major weakness of poor defensive rebounding from our frontcourt.  Our team is not one that needs to take on the effort of developing Okafor.  We have bigger short-term goals, and enough other long-term options that there is limited benefit in pursuing this one.

This seems like a better player for another team, regardless of whatever "bargain" it may appear that they're getting.

From what has been reported as the offers for Okafor, I think he will be worth more than the assets it takes to get him. Essentially he would improve our asset base because I believe we could develop him to be better than the Sixers currently are (due to the veterans around him and the lack of top center prospects next to him).

As to how he would help us right now, I think he would be an improvement on what Zeller gives us right now against bigger centers, but I wouldn't want him playing a whole lot more than that. He's absolutely not the answer to any of our issues, but could be helpful in the future.

[saltlover]

Getting away from Moranis' inability to concede even the smallest of points, can someone please explain to me why you want Okafor on the Celtics?

Consider the following:

- For his career, he's shooting 40% on 2-point attempts beyond 3 feet.
- His rebounding percentages this season are very similar to Amir Johnson (7.8 to 9.2 ORB%, 15.1 to 16.7 DRB%.)  They were also a bit lower than Amir last year too, so it's not due to inconsistent playing time.
- He's not shown himself to be a great passer.
- His defensive reputation is mediocre at best.

I'm not saying the kid has no future.  He might.  But I fail to see how he'd make the team at all better this year, considering his inability to offer floor spacing or improved defense, and that he doesn't offer any improvement to our major weakness of poor defensive rebounding from our frontcourt.  Our team is not one that needs to take on the effort of developing Okafor.  We have bigger short-term goals, and enough other long-term options that there is limited benefit in pursuing this one.

This seems like a better player for another team, regardless of whatever "bargain" it may appear that they're getting.

From what has been reported as the offers for Okafor, I think he will be worth more than the assets it takes to get him. Essentially he would improve our asset base because I believe we could develop him to be better than the Sixers currently are (due to the veterans around him and the lack of top center prospects next to him).

As to how he would help us right now, I think he would be an improvement on what Zeller gives us right now against bigger centers, but I wouldn't want him playing a whole lot more than that.

It is certainly not a given that he'd be worth more on draft night than he is now, and if you think he's only going to play Zeller's spot minutes, it's even more difficult to see his value rise.  Being a day-trader for basketball players doesn't seem like the direction this team needs to head.

[Evantime34]

Getting away from Moranis' inability to concede even the smallest of points, can someone please explain to me why you want Okafor on the Celtics?

Consider the following:

- For his career, he's shooting 40% on 2-point attempts beyond 3 feet.
- His rebounding percentages this season are very similar to Amir Johnson (7.8 to 9.2 ORB%, 15.1 to 16.7 DRB%.)  They were also a bit lower than Amir last year too, so it's not due to inconsistent playing time.
- He's not shown himself to be a great passer.
- His defensive reputation is mediocre at best.

I'm not saying the kid has no future.  He might.  But I fail to see how he'd make the team at all better this year, considering his inability to offer floor spacing or improved defense, and that he doesn't offer any improvement to our major weakness of poor defensive rebounding from our frontcourt.  Our team is not one that needs to take on the effort of developing Okafor.  We have bigger short-term goals, and enough other long-term options that there is limited benefit in pursuing this one.

This seems like a better player for another team, regardless of whatever "bargain" it may appear that they're getting.

From what has been reported as the offers for Okafor, I think he will be worth more than the assets it takes to get him. Essentially he would improve our asset base because I believe we could develop him to be better than the Sixers currently are (due to the veterans around him and the lack of top center prospects next to him).

As to how he would help us right now, I think he would be an improvement on what Zeller gives us right now against bigger centers, but I wouldn't want him playing a whole lot more than that.

It is certainly not a given that he'd be worth more on draft night than he is now, and if you think he's only going to play Zeller's spot minutes, it's even more difficult to see his value rise.  Being a day-trader for basketball players doesn't seem like the direction this team needs to head.

I'm not saying he would be worth more on draft night than he is now. I'm saying that he would be worth more over the life of his contract than the pick(s) we would give up for him. So not day trading so much as selling your current position to buy a stock you expect to have long term.

So he wouldn't improve his value this year, given Zeller's minutes but improve his value next year and the year after.

[danglertx]

If he can make himself available when IT drives, catch the ball well, and finish either quickly or strongly than he can make the team better.  That is what we need.  It is why Zeller actually looks decent a lot of the time.  He knows how to make himself available for passes, he catches the ball (see years of Bass for how not to catch passes), and he finishes quickly (KO is starting to do this.)  That is what we need on offense from a big man.  Can Okafor do this?  I have no idea, I haven't watched enough of him.

One thing I do know about Okafor is that he can score on the post and we usually put four other guys out there who stretch the floor to give him room to work.  Can he pass out of double teams?  I have no idea, I haven't watched him enough.  But if he can, he might fit in nicely with this year's C's.

[bdm860]

- For his career, he's shooting 40% on 2-point attempts beyond 3 feet.

I'm pretty "meh" on Okafor overall.  I don't want the C's to get him, but I'd suddenly become optimistic on him if they did.  That being said, isn't 40% outside of 3 feet pretty normal for a big?

Not sure where to exactly find that stat, but spot checking a few bigs over on bball-reference:

Kevin Love is  .398, .353, and   .402 for his career from from 3-10,10-16, and 16<3.
The God Embiid is .370,.365, and .486
Anthony Davis is .436, .437, .392
Cousins is .367, .335, .384
Horford is .447, .309, .371

So Okafor being .445, .356, .275 isn't a huge concern for me 90 games into his career.  The man can score.  Of course an obvious difference is all those players I mentioned can also hit the 3 and are also better from 16<3, I understand spreading the floor is important.

I have nothing to add on your other points, the man clearly has his flaws, but I think I could become optimistic based on his scoring ability and potential (whether real or imagined) to improve and add range.

[saltlover]

- For his career, he's shooting 40% on 2-point attempts beyond 3 feet.

I'm pretty "meh" on Okafor overall.  I don't want the C's to get him, but I'd suddenly become optimistic on him if they did.  That being said, isn't 40% outside of 3 feet pretty normal for a big?

Not sure where to exactly find that stat, but spot checking a few bigs over on bball-reference:

Kevin Love is  .398, .353, and   .402 for his career from from 3-10,10-16, and 16<3.
The God Embiid is .370,.365, and .486
Anthony Davis is .436, .437, .392
Cousins is .367, .335, .384
Horford is .447, .309, .371

So Okafor being .445, .356, .275 isn't a huge concern for me 90 games into his career.  The man can score.  Of course an obvious difference is all those players I mentioned can also hit the 3 and are also better from 16<3, I understand spreading the floor is important.

I have nothing to add on your other points, the man clearly has his flaws, but I think I could become optimistic based on his scoring ability and potential (whether real or imagined) to improve and add range.

All of those other bigs can also hit the three, however.  There's a reason that mid-range jump shots are being phased out of the game, especially from bigs, and that's because most players aren't good enough at them to warrant attempting them. My point is that Okafor has not displayed any kind of ability to score away from the basket, which means his role in the offense would be limited.  If he's going to have to play that near the basket all the time, it'd be good if he had demonstrated good passing ability (he hasn't) or offensive rebounding (again, not his speciality).  All of the other players listed there have also shown plus passing or offensive rebounding skills, in addition to 3-point range.

Okafor is good at shots near the rim, but not a whole lot else at this point.  That's what I was getting at.

[celticsclay]

Okafor himself describing the situation as difficult

""I'm just trying to focus on playing basketball," Okafor said Wednesday following the team's shootaround. "It's really difficult with all the rumors, not knowing if I'll be here tomorrow. But I know I'm playing tonight and that's what I'm focusing on."

Okafor did thank the organization for being open with him about this, so his message was a little mixed.

Brown also commented on the unusual nature of what has been happening

"This isn't uncommon as it relates to the topic," Brown said Wednesday. "It is uncommon as it relates to the length of time."


Note this is a front page ESPN story for a backup center averaging 10 points a game so obviously the thing has become a bit of a circus. I hate Okafor's game, but I do really feel bad for him as a person and how he has been treated the last week. This has gone on long enough. This failed bluff by BC is embarassing

http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2017/02/15/okafors-benching-ploy-stir-interest/

Most people seem to feel the same way

http://www.libertyballers.com/2017/2/14/14607730/nba-trade-rumors-jahlil-okafor-chicago-bulls-new-orleans-pelicans-brett-brown-bryan-colangelo

[The Oracle]

The fact that Okafor is playing tonight is very telling as to what the market is for him.  They might as well keep him and hope he has some amazing epiphany.

[Cman]

Here is an interesting theory:

Kevin O'Connor ‏@KevinOConnorNBA
 Jahlil Okafor was shelved a ploy to stir interest and induce better offers, sources speculate. No one fell for it.

Here's the full story via theringer.com

A Jahlil Okafor trade appeared imminent this weekend: The Sixers left Okafor in Philadelphia when they traveled to Charlotte, and head coach Brett Brown admitted they did it because the former Duke star was involved in trade conversations. HoopsHype’s Alex Kennedy reported those talks were with the Pelicans, Bulls, Blazers, and Nuggets. “Jahlil Okafor’s situation is transparent,” Brown said Monday. “He’s in the middle of being discussed in trade scenarios.”

Except it’s not so transparent. It’s not even trade scenarios. It’s a trade scenario that involves the Pelicans. Nothing has really changed since nine days ago when The Vertical’s Adrian Wojnarowski reported the Pelicans were “engaged on several fronts to land a center,” including Okafor. Woj reported the Pelicans want to include a large salary (likely Alexis Ajinca), but the Sixers don’t want to take that on, which a source confirmed to me. Those negotiations are stuck in gridlock. The shelving of Okafor was likely meant to flush out the best offers around the league, sources speculate. It’s not uncommon for teams to use leaks to stir interest. The Nuggets and Blazers weren’t pursuing Okafor. The Bulls likely aren’t either. No one is buying what Bryan Colangelo is selling: a one-dimensional center who can’t defend, rebound, or pass on a roster loaded with big men.

https://theringer.com/pressing-eastern-conference-questions-36897397d17#.y32w53fz1

My guess is that Okafor was the fall back option for Toronto, if they couldn't get Ibaka (though for a different package). Once Toronto was able to trade for Ibaka, Toronto called Philly and said no thanks. The timing fits.

[Moranis]

Okafor himself describing the situation as difficult

""I'm just trying to focus on playing basketball," Okafor said Wednesday following the team's shootaround. "It's really difficult with all the rumors, not knowing if I'll be here tomorrow. But I know I'm playing tonight and that's what I'm focusing on."

Okafor did thank the organization for being open with him about this, so his message was a little mixed.

Brown also commented on the unusual nature of what has been happening

"This isn't uncommon as it relates to the topic," Brown said Wednesday. "It is uncommon as it relates to the length of time."


Note this is a front page ESPN story for a backup center averaging 10 points a game so obviously the thing has become a bit of a circus. I hate Okafor's game, but I do really feel bad for him as a person and how he has been treated the last week. This has gone on long enough. This failed bluff by BC is embarassing

http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2017/02/15/okafors-benching-ploy-stir-interest/

Most people seem to feel the same way

http://www.libertyballers.com/2017/2/14/14607730/nba-trade-rumors-jahlil-okafor-chicago-bulls-new-orleans-pelicans-brett-brown-bryan-colangelo

So the coach of the Sixers said he has held players out before because of trade discussions and goes so far as to say it isn't uncommon just the length of time here being uncommon and somehow I was the crazy one for saying it happens a fair amount. 

[nickagneta]

Any problems that Philly has, they have earned for the sickening way they decided to act as a franchuse over the last four years.

Having trouble with a roster crunch....thats what you get for drafting 3 centers in consecutive years with top 6 picks.

Having trouble integrating Okafor....thats what you get for drafting such an obviously flawed player whose strengths are better suited for the NBA in the 1970s.

Having trouble trading Okafor....thats what you get for doing everything possible to drive down his already low value across the league.

The Sixers deserve every bad thing that happens to them. I hope Embiid has serious injury problems and can never become anything.  I hope they get next to nothing for Noel and Okafor. I hope Simmons never develops. I hope their draft picks this year come out as the absolute worst case scenario. IMO, they deserve it for that embarrassing display of basketball they foisted upon the league and their fans. As far as I am concerned, you lose on purpose for years at a time, you get what you got coming to you.