Hoopsworld: Rondo for Gasol?

[Kane3387]

OK, here is my new, completely fantasy scenario:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6m8vvqg

Lakers get: Rondo and JO
Clippers get: Ray
Suns get: Foye, Cook, Bledsoe, and cash (because they love cash)
C's get: Gasol, and Nash

C's lineup:
Nash, Dooling
Pietrus, Bradley, Moore
Pierce, Sasha, Daniels
KG, Bass, Johnson
Gasol, Wilcox, Stiemsma

Sign another wing or backup PG with the last roster spot.  Even if they don't win a championship, that would be a FUN team to watch.

Love the trade.

Hate to lose Ray, but like it says above it's a fantasy trade. More realistic would be bringing Cleveland in as a third team and moving Dooling and a pick to Cleveland for Sessions.

[csfansince60s]

OK, here is my new, completely fantasy scenario:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6m8vvqg

Lakers get: Rondo and JO
Clippers get: Ray
Suns get: Foye, Cook, Bledsoe, and cash (because they love cash)
C's get: Gasol, and Nash

C's lineup:
Nash, Dooling
Pietrus, Bradley, Moore
Pierce, Sasha, Daniels
KG, Bass, Johnson
Gasol, Wilcox, Stiemsma

Sign another wing or backup PG with the last roster spot.  Even if they don't win a championship, that would be a FUN team to watch.

Love the trade.

Sign me up....this trade should make all parties happy, and with a 4 team trade, that is difficult to do...

Lakers get their young pg

Suns get point guard for the future in Bledsoe for Nash who will walk at years end anyway plus the cash for Sarver

Clips get the piece at the 2 that makes them dangerous this year  and next in Ray by trading a redundant piece in Bledsoe

Cs get a scoring pg who is a huge expiring equivalent to Ray/JO as well as a huge force in the middle for the next 2 1/2 years and instant contenders

Only question is why don't Lakers and Clips cut out the middlemen Cs/Suns and trade Gasol for some combination of Bledsoe/Jordan/Mo Wms/Cook/Foye?

[33_Larry Legend_33]

OK, here is my new, completely fantasy scenario:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6m8vvqg

Lakers get: Rondo and JO
Clippers get: Ray
Suns get: Foye, Cook, Bledsoe, and cash (because they love cash)
C's get: Gasol, and Nash

C's lineup:
Nash, Dooling
Pietrus, Bradley, Moore
Pierce, Sasha, Daniels
KG, Bass, Johnson
Gasol, Wilcox, Stiemsma

Sign another wing or backup PG with the last roster spot.  Even if they don't win a championship, that would be a FUN team to watch.

I LOVE the trade and would do this in a heartbeat...

And to top it off, I would sign this guy out of the D-League for depth:

Gerald Green...

Yeah, that guy.  He's playing very good basketball down there, and is rated as one of the top 5 shooting guards at that level.

I was a strong critic of his years ago, but that's well behind him.  He deserves another shot, and why not bring him "home" to play?

[tfwhiteiii]

I haven't really read through this thread, but I'm going to post my thoughts on a 'Rondo-for-Gasol' swap, which I feel has legs.

First off, Danny has always had a high opinion of Gasol.  Back, I believe, in 2007, when Pierce was injured - there were serious rumors that we were going to trade Paul for a then 26 year old Pau.

Now, this deal on paper is tempting.  We are still a very underrated team here, and I believe we are 'in the mix' to an extent.  However, as currently constituted we are not a real contender because we don't close well at the end of games and execute when it matters (partially due to Rondo), and more importantly we are a below average rebounding team.  To quote a Hall of Fame Lakers head coach - "No rebounds, no rings" (that was Pat Riley if you don't want to look it up.)  Having Gasol would solve that almost immediately.  Gasol is still a great rebounder.  In terms of executing at the end of games, we'd have four plus passers at their position, including two of the five best passing bigs in the league with KG and Gasol.  The whole league is wide open, and this year is really going to come down to who stays healthy.  Never has an NBA season been more a crapshoot.  I still, in my heart of hearts believe the Miami-Chicago ECF will decide the title.  But as we have seen, some big names this year have been dropping like flies so a Rose injury (who's already had minor injuries himself) changes the whole complextion of the conference, much like what happened when we lost Garnett for the year in 2009 - as that Celtics team was well on their way to meeting the Lakers in the Finals again.  A good, but not great Orlando team represented the conference that year, and that very well could happen again this year.  I know Danny and Doc believe that too.  And that's what it'd even interest me to take a run at it with 4 HOFrs in your starting lineup, with two of them still in their primes (Pierce and Gasol), and one still playing at a high level (Allen).

However, after consideration - I just don't feel Rondo for Gasol is the play.  I'd be more interested in Gasol if I firmly believed we were a player away from being no-question-about-it top three contenders.  That *could* be the case, but it's a coinflip at best.  If it doesn't work, and all it gets us is a second round exit - this team is all of a sudden barren of any talent on the right side of 30.  Rondo is overrated by some Celtics fans, and I believe he should be dealt in the right deal.  He has some flaws that I just don't feel like you can win with him being your second best player, and absolutely not your first.  This team doesn't execute well at the end of games because of him.  They play one style of basketball for 42 minutes, and then have to play another style for the last 6 because he can't shoot, he can't make his FTs, and the defense tightens up so his knack for the fancy pass comes with second thoughts because you can't be that careless with the basketball at crucial times.  Back in 2008, Rondo was not even on the floor at the end of the games of, BY FAR, the two most important wins of those playoffs - Game 7 ECSF v. Clev (House, Ray, Pierce, Brown, Garnett)  and Game 4 Finals @ LA (House, Ray, Pierce, Posey, Garnett.)  Oddly enough, those were the two best games in which we closed the deal.  I think there's some of us that overrate Rondo, and some of us that are frustrated with him like me.  After the 2009 and ESPECIALLY the 2010 Playoffs, we all felt Rondo was the next generation Celtic that would be the bridge to another championship Celtic team - just as how Havlicek was the bridge guy from the Russell teams to the Cowens teams.  But Rondo just isn't that guy.  Too many flaws, and he has to be on the perfect team, where he's the third best player (like a Kobe-Bynum Lakers team, more in that in a moment.)

Rondo should be dealt in the right deal.  He should either be dealt to a team that overvalues him for younger pieces so this team can acquire multiple assets during its rebuild - OR, you wait for another Chris Paul type star to come on the market, and hope that said team values some of our other assets and takes them in a Rondo package for Superstar X (like New Orleans was going to do until they worked out that original deal with the Lakers and Rockets at the last moment.)

Also, Rondo on LA I believe would be perfect for them, AND perfect for Rondo.  They already have one of the great closers of all time (hint: his initials are KB), and already have a franchise center in place.  Bynum has developed into one of the dominant bigs in the game.  I see him being like this for at least six years.  Rondo would have a perfect big man running mate in Bynum to run the floor with.  Even after Bryant fades away, the Lakers finding another dynamite wing (doesn't have to be an all-timer like Kobe - just an athletic wing, like a Rudy Gay) would have them back as one of the elite teams immediately.

Also, for those of you who think the Lakers are dealing Dwight for Bynum - I don't see it happening.  The Lakers owner, Jim Buss, loves Bynum and is even hesitating trading him for Dwight straight up much less Bynum AND Gasol for Dwight (which it is rumored that Kupchak actually wants to deal both.)  Dwight is going to be a Net.  Since the Magic aren't getting back both Gasol and Bynum, they are waiting until the conclusion of the All Star Game (being played in Orlando, and they don't want Dwight coming back in another uniform) - and they will most likely send him to New Jersey.  The Nets can take back for more bad contracts than the Lakers can (who only have that TPE), as they have large expirings (Okur, Humphries), and can throw in more top notch draft picks (their own, and I believe they own a Rockets first rounder which I think is only top 10 protected.)  Also, Dwight's #1 choice is New Jersey (Brooklyn.)

But then, if you're LA.  If you're able to swing Gasol for Rondo - that is probably better.  What would you rather have, Kobe+Dwight and a roster full of overpaid, and mostly below average role players, or Rondo-Kobe-Bynum? Kobe+Dwight plus all their other junk (Fisher, Artest, Walton) leaves them with a roster much like this Knicks roster.  They'd be locked into a five seed for the forseeable future and won't be able to do anything until guys like Artest's contract expires.  Or do you take a run with Rondo (not being paid the max), Kobe and Bynum?

So all in all, this isn't the right deal for Rondo - trading him for a win-now player in Gasol when it's just a coinflip at best if it'd make us a legit contender this year (despite the fact we VERY WELL could be one, the odds just aren't worth it).  And to top it off, we'd very well help our hated rivals who are just one championship behind us.

One word:

No

[GreenEnvy]

Unless we were fleecing the Lakers, I certainly wouldn't do any trade with them that was remotely close. I certainly wouldn't give them the better, younger player.

[birdbrady]

Unless we were fleecing the Lakers, I certainly wouldn't do any trade with them that was remotely close. I certainly wouldn't give them the better, younger player.

Younger player, yes.  Better player, no.  Gasol is better this year, next and probably the year after than Rondo ever will be.

Still wouldn't do the trade though.  But let's not kid ourselves and call Rondo a better player than a Hall of Fame bigman, Pau Gasol.

[BballTim]

Unless we were fleecing the Lakers, I certainly wouldn't do any trade with them that was remotely close. I certainly wouldn't give them the better, younger player.

Younger player, yes.  Better player, no.  Gasol is better this year, next and probably the year after than Rondo ever will be.

Still wouldn't do the trade though.  But let's not kid ourselves and call Rondo a better player than a Hall of Fame bigman, Pau Gasol.

  Gasol made it into the HOF? That's impressive at his age.

[birdbrady]

Unless we were fleecing the Lakers, I certainly wouldn't do any trade with them that was remotely close. I certainly wouldn't give them the better, younger player.

Younger player, yes.  Better player, no.  Gasol is better this year, next and probably the year after than Rondo ever will be.

Still wouldn't do the trade though.  But let's not kid ourselves and call Rondo a better player than a Hall of Fame bigman, Pau Gasol.

  Gasol made it into the HOF? That's impressive at his age.

He's a Hall of Famer, the same way people on the Patriots forum on this board call Tom Brady a "Hall of Famer."

Meaning, if they retired five seconds from now - they would make it as soon as they are eligible.

Don't know what the point of your post was.  Besides to act cute.

[BballTim]

Unless we were fleecing the Lakers, I certainly wouldn't do any trade with them that was remotely close. I certainly wouldn't give them the better, younger player.

Younger player, yes.  Better player, no.  Gasol is better this year, next and probably the year after than Rondo ever will be.

Still wouldn't do the trade though.  But let's not kid ourselves and call Rondo a better player than a Hall of Fame bigman, Pau Gasol.

  Gasol made it into the HOF? That's impressive at his age.

He's a Hall of Famer, the same way people on the Patriots forum on this board call Tom Brady a "Hall of Famer."

Meaning, if they retired five seconds from now - they would make it as soon as they are eligible.

Don't know what the point of your post was.  Besides to act cute.

  He's in his 11th year and he's been an all-star 4 times, he's never been 1st team all-nba and he's never been even remotely a part of any MVP race. If you see that as on par with Tom Brady, I guess we disagree.

[birdbrady]

Unless we were fleecing the Lakers, I certainly wouldn't do any trade with them that was remotely close. I certainly wouldn't give them the better, younger player.

Younger player, yes.  Better player, no.  Gasol is better this year, next and probably the year after than Rondo ever will be.

Still wouldn't do the trade though.  But let's not kid ourselves and call Rondo a better player than a Hall of Fame bigman, Pau Gasol.

  Gasol made it into the HOF? That's impressive at his age.

He's a Hall of Famer, the same way people on the Patriots forum on this board call Tom Brady a "Hall of Famer."

Meaning, if they retired five seconds from now - they would make it as soon as they are eligible.

Don't know what the point of your post was.  Besides to act cute.

  He's in his 11th year and he's been an all-star 4 times, he's never been 1st team all-nba and he's never been even remotely a part of any MVP race. If you see that as on par with Tom Brady, I guess we disagree.

Didn't say he was 'on par with Tom Brady' - was just making that point using Brady as an example.  We can call players Hall of Famers before they retire because there are some who have accomplished enough where they can retire immediately and make the Hall as soon, or just a little after, they are eligible.  It was you the one who brought this up by inserting fairly useless joke to the conversation.

Anyways, Pierce hasn't come near a first team All NBA either, and I think was just all-NBA second team once.  And you know what, he's Hall of Fame if he retired right now too.

Gasol from 08-11 was the second best big man in the league, and he's had a 20+ PER every single year for the last ten years.  If he retired right now, he's  in.

[BballTim]

Unless we were fleecing the Lakers, I certainly wouldn't do any trade with them that was remotely close. I certainly wouldn't give them the better, younger player.

Younger player, yes.  Better player, no.  Gasol is better this year, next and probably the year after than Rondo ever will be.

Still wouldn't do the trade though.  But let's not kid ourselves and call Rondo a better player than a Hall of Fame bigman, Pau Gasol.

  Gasol made it into the HOF? That's impressive at his age.

He's a Hall of Famer, the same way people on the Patriots forum on this board call Tom Brady a "Hall of Famer."

Meaning, if they retired five seconds from now - they would make it as soon as they are eligible.

Don't know what the point of your post was.  Besides to act cute.

  He's in his 11th year and he's been an all-star 4 times, he's never been 1st team all-nba and he's never been even remotely a part of any MVP race. If you see that as on par with Tom Brady, I guess we disagree.

Didn't say he was 'on par with Tom Brady' - was just making that point using Brady as an example.  We can call players Hall of Famers before they retire because there are some who have accomplished enough where they can retire immediately and make the Hall as soon, or just a little after, they are eligible.  It was you the one who brought this up by inserting fairly useless joke to the conversation.

Anyways, Pierce hasn't come near a first team All NBA either, and I think was just all-NBA second team once.  And you know what, he's Hall of Fame if he retired right now too.

Gasol from 08-11 was the second best big man in the league, and he's had a 20+ PER every single year for the last ten years.  If he retired right now, he's  in.

  Paul's a 9 time all-star that's at least gotten smallish consideration in 5 MVP races, so he's 5 ahead of Pau in both categories. He also has a finals MVP. You might be able to make a case that Pau's arguably been the second best big overall over the last 4 years, but I don't know that he's in that category in any particular year. Howard's clearly better, Dirk probably as well, and Amare and KG (at least in his healthy years) would have arguments as well. I just don't know that 4 all-star games, being the second best player on a couple of title teams and a couple if 2nd-3rd team all-nba teams is good enough that you're a shoo-in to make the Hall in your first year of eligibility.

  By the way, sorry for trying to be somewhat humorous in my reply. You seem to have taken quite a bit of exception to that.

[Tai]

SherrodbCSN A. Sherrod Blakely
RT @twistedrico: @SherrodbCSN Please tell me that there is no truth to these Rondo to The Lakers for Gasol rumors!-> Nothing to it.
4 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

I think it's worth pointing out that Eric Pincus is from LA. Therefore, wouldn't it be logical to think that Pincus' sources wouldn't be the same as Sherrod's?

[BballTim]

SherrodbCSN A. Sherrod Blakely
RT @twistedrico: @SherrodbCSN Please tell me that there is no truth to these Rondo to The Lakers for Gasol rumors!-> Nothing to it.
4 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

I think it's worth pointing out that Eric Pincus is from LA. Therefore, wouldn't it be logical to think that Pincus' sources wouldn't be the same as Sherrod's?

  The channel 5 sports guy (I think it was Mike Lynch) last night said that there was absolutely nothing to the rumor. I don't consider him to be an expert on the Celts, but I don't think he'd say that with little idea if it was true or not.

[Chris]

SherrodbCSN A. Sherrod Blakely
RT @twistedrico: @SherrodbCSN Please tell me that there is no truth to these Rondo to The Lakers for Gasol rumors!-> Nothing to it.
4 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

I think it's worth pointing out that Eric Pincus is from LA. Therefore, wouldn't it be logical to think that Pincus' sources wouldn't be the same as Sherrod's?

  The channel 5 sports guy (I think it was Mike Lynch) last night said that there was absolutely nothing to the rumor. I don't consider him to be an expert on the Celts, but I don't think he'd say that with little idea if it was true or not.

Again, he can get that just by reading Pincus' article. 

All Pincus reported was that the C's would be interested in Gasol for Rondo (and that was weak at best, and could have been the personal opinion of anyone in the C's organization for all we know), and the rest was pure speculation based on an a random comment by Kupchak. 

It is headline grabbing by a blogger looking for more readers. 

[Tradetime]

Unless we were fleecing the Lakers, I certainly wouldn't do any trade with them that was remotely close. I certainly wouldn't give them the better, younger player.

Younger player, yes.  Better player, no.  Gasol is better this year, next and probably the year after than Rondo ever will be.

Still wouldn't do the trade though.  But let's not kid ourselves and call Rondo a better player than a Hall of Fame bigman, Pau Gasol.

Gasol would make us contenders this year. The Lakers, if they want to continue to look relevant, need to make a deal. Gasol has certainly proved he is still capable of getting it done on a nightly basis, but I'd think he'd be getting tired of being Kobe's sidekick in LA, where Bynum wants to be the second option on offense.