The Celts made a run at Hinrich?

[Fafnir]

Totally agree about Chicago.  This team has had major assets for several years and they sit there and watch other teams get KG, Pau, etc.  They probably could have Amare or Boozer now too.  They havn't really had a good offensive big man since Brand.  And they let Gordon go for nothing.  They draft well, but are horrible when it comes to pulling the trigger.

Letting Gordon walk was the smart move. The worst thing you can do is overpay a guy who'd be the third/fourth best player on a title team.

They could have included him in a package for the big man they are lacking.  Gordon was an asset, now he's gone.

How exactly could they have done that? He was an unrestricted FA and no one was making him an offer when he was one. Not to mention he had the right to veto any in season trade.

The Pistons have $50mil that says otherwise.

I meant no one made him an offer when he was a restricted FA.

Besides the Pistons who was going to do a sign and trade for him? A sign and trade for a quality big man?

They could have INCLUDED him in a package before his contract was up.  If you can get someone to take Jerome James or Eddie Curry, you can find someone to take Ben Gordon.

While technically, this is true (although it would have had to happen at least 2 years ago, since Gordon would have vetoed any trade last season), I think the real mistake the Bulls made was with Thomas.  First, they picked him over Aldridge, and then, they refused to trade him when he still had value (more than Gordon had actually).

Well, they also messed up with the whole Ben Wallace debacle.

Don't forget overpaying by giving a super-roleplayer (Deng) superstar money.  

Basically, this Bulls organization has made more bad decisions over the last 10 years than just about anyone.  

Agreed, but moiso's idea that Ben Gordan could have been traded for big is asinine.

Ben Gordon would have vetoed any trade last year, and no one was offering a high quality big for him before that.

[Fafnir]

I'm not a Ben Gordon fan, I don't think the Bulls miss him, but I'm sure they could have included his expiring contract with someone else and gotten something of value in return.  They just are afraid to pull the trigger.

He accepted the qualifying offer and had veto rights to any trade, he said he would exercise said rights.

They literally had no options at that point to trade him..

[moiso]

Yeah they waited too long with Thomas, who doesn't look so great anymore.  Didn't Chandler walk too?  They wait too long and waste their assets.

[Chris]

I don't buy it for a second.  Hinrich simply does not make fiscal sense for the C's.  I think this is one of those "made up" rumors Danny was talking about one WEEI last week.

fiscal sense? how so?  IMO his contract is the exact type of contract that we need to be looking at...players who are good but teams are trying to move so they can get in on the upcoming FA class.

Since there is no way for us to get in on this FA class and we are making a run at a Title this season, we need to be taking advantage of teams trying to unload players (salary) as the trade deadline approaches.

  Taking bad contracts, especially during a temporary run of bad play, is a panic move.

I don't think it's a temporary run of bad play that is the reason to make the move. I have thought from the beginning of the season that our midseason move would be just this kind of move....going after a good player that a team is dumping to get in on the 2010 FA class.

that has been our best chance to upgrade our bench from the beginning. we have the expirings, but not much talent to give back....

But Wyc does not have bottomless pockets.  This is not the 2004 Knicks.  

Righht now, the C's have a championship level bench.  Danny will have a hard time explaining to Wyc why they need to add $9 million ($18 with luxury tax) to next year's roster for a backup PG.

[winsomme]

I don't buy it for a second.  Hinrich simply does not make fiscal sense for the C's.  I think this is one of those "made up" rumors Danny was talking about one WEEI last week.

fiscal sense? how so?  IMO his contract is the exact type of contract that we need to be looking at...players who are good but teams are trying to move so they can get in on the upcoming FA class.

Since there is no way for us to get in on this FA class and we are making a run at a Title this season, we need to be taking advantage of teams trying to unload players (salary) as the trade deadline approaches.

  Taking bad contracts, especially during a temporary run of bad play, is a panic move.

Exactly, and Danny knows that.  I think there are two possible ways Danny goes this season.  Either he deems KG unfit to carry the team to a championship, and blows it up for some young assets to start the rebuilding process, or much more likely, he sits back and waits, looks at trades that save other teams cash, but don't put future money on the C's books, and ultimately reinforce the team with buyout guys.

part two of that strategy is how you end up adding the least attractive/helpful player of the bunch. That thinking is how we ended up with a Mikki Moore IMO.

If Danny wants to get an impact player, he is going to have to add a bad contract.

and if Danny thinks KG is done, we are more than two years from getting back at this thing. So Hinrich wouldn't actually be that much of a hinderance.

long story short IMO is that we need to add a bad contract to make a real good run at this thing this year.

[Chris]

Yeah they waited too long with Thomas, who doesn't look so great anymore.  Didn't Chandler walk too?  They wait too long and waste their assets.

They traded Chandler in order to sign Ben Wallace's corpse. 

[moiso]

Yeah they waited too long with Thomas, who doesn't look so great anymore.  Didn't Chandler walk too?  They wait too long and waste their assets.

They traded Chandler in order to sign Ben Wallace's corpse. 

All the potential assets they have had, and the best they do is Ben Wallace, Brad Miller, and John Salmons.  Pretty bad.

[winsomme]

I don't buy it for a second.  Hinrich simply does not make fiscal sense for the C's.  I think this is one of those "made up" rumors Danny was talking about one WEEI last week.

fiscal sense? how so?  IMO his contract is the exact type of contract that we need to be looking at...players who are good but teams are trying to move so they can get in on the upcoming FA class.

Since there is no way for us to get in on this FA class and we are making a run at a Title this season, we need to be taking advantage of teams trying to unload players (salary) as the trade deadline approaches.

  Taking bad contracts, especially during a temporary run of bad play, is a panic move.

I don't think it's a temporary run of bad play that is the reason to make the move. I have thought from the beginning of the season that our midseason move would be just this kind of move....going after a good player that a team is dumping to get in on the 2010 FA class.

that has been our best chance to upgrade our bench from the beginning. we have the expirings, but not much talent to give back....

But Wyc does not have bottomless pockets.  This is not the 2004 Knicks.  

Righht now, the C's have a championship level bench.  Danny will have a hard time explaining to Wyc why they need to add $9 million ($18 with luxury tax) to next year's roster for a backup PG.

I look at the impact of a player like Crawford to show how much players off the bench can mean to a team's success. and all I'm really trying to say (leaving Hinrich aside for a sec) is that I am encouraged to hear a report like this because adding a salary dump contract IMO is the best chance we have to add a good player.

I'm just glad to hear a report suggesting that Wyc is willing to go there money-wise if the right player becomes available....and Hinrich is fairly close to that kind of player.

[Chris]

If Danny wants to get an impact player, he is going to have to add a bad contract.

This is the problem.  I don't think Danny wants an impact player (at least in the backcourt).  I think Danny feels (rightfully so) that they have played their cards this season, and have the roster he wants.  Now he just needs to hope they get healthy.

and if Danny thinks KG is done, we are more than two years from getting back at this thing. So Hinrich wouldn't actually be that much of a hinderance.

You don't think Wyc will consider paying a backup PG $18 million a year (including luxury tax) on a team not competing for a championship is a hinderance?  Because I certainly do.  Wyc agreed to pay the luxury tax for championship basketball.  He has made it crystal clear, he is not willing to throw that kind of money at mediocrity.

long story short IMO is that we need to add a bad contract to make a real good run at this thing this year.

That's fine, you are entitled to your opinion, and I personally believe that Danny does not share that opinion with you.  We will just have to wait and see.

[winsomme]

and if Danny thinks KG is done, we are more than two years from getting back at this thing. So Hinrich wouldn't actually be that much of a hinderance.

You don't think Wyc will consider paying a backup PG $18 million a year (including luxury tax) on a team not competing for a championship is a hinderance?  Because I certainly do.  Wyc agreed to pay the luxury tax for championship basketball.  He has made it crystal clear, he is not willing to throw that kind of money at mediocrity.

Well if we went into rebuilding mode after this season (depressing thought, but...) Hinrich could actually become a starter for us for the following two seasons...and would actually be an expiring contract after next season.

I don't know...it'll be interesting to see how this all plays out. But like I said, I'm just encouraged to see that we may be looking to make a move like this. I was starting to believe that you were right and that Danny was perfectly fine with the roster we have...

[Chris]

and if Danny thinks KG is done, we are more than two years from getting back at this thing. So Hinrich wouldn't actually be that much of a hinderance.

You don't think Wyc will consider paying a backup PG $18 million a year (including luxury tax) on a team not competing for a championship is a hinderance?  Because I certainly do.  Wyc agreed to pay the luxury tax for championship basketball.  He has made it crystal clear, he is not willing to throw that kind of money at mediocrity.

Well if we went into rebuilding mode after this season (depressing thought, but...) Hinrich could actually become a starter for us for the following two seasons...and would actually be an expiring contract after next season.

This is my biggest concern with the desire for trading for Hinrich.  He is not a SG.  He cannot fill Ray Allen's role.  He is a PG who has the ability to defend SG's, and hit wide open 3's.  Huge difference. 

And Danny knows this.  He is not going to bring in a PG to be the starting SG next year. 

[snively]

and if Danny thinks KG is done, we are more than two years from getting back at this thing. So Hinrich wouldn't actually be that much of a hinderance.

You don't think Wyc will consider paying a backup PG $18 million a year (including luxury tax) on a team not competing for a championship is a hinderance?  Because I certainly do.  Wyc agreed to pay the luxury tax for championship basketball.  He has made it crystal clear, he is not willing to throw that kind of money at mediocrity.

Well if we went into rebuilding mode after this season (depressing thought, but...) Hinrich could actually become a starter for us for the following two seasons...and would actually be an expiring contract after next season.

This is my biggest concern with the desire for trading for Hinrich.  He is not a SG.  He cannot fill Ray Allen's role.  He is a PG who has the ability to defend SG's, and hit wide open 3's.  Huge difference. 

And Danny knows this.  He is not going to bring in a PG to be the starting SG next year. 

I think Hinrich is capable of defending 2s at a high level and stretching the floor.  I'm pretty sure that's enough to merit starting at that position.

[Fan from VT]

It would ahve been hard to trade Gordon last year, since any team trading for him wouldn't have had his bird rights, so they'd be trading for a few months rental, unless they had cap space coming, in which case they could sign him in the offseason without giving up assets.

[Cman]

Righht now, the C's have a championship level bench.  Danny will have a hard time explaining to Wyc why they need to add $9 million ($18 with luxury tax) to next year's roster for a backup PG.

The idea is that Hinrich would start at SG, and also be able to backup PG.

In any case, the Cs don't currently have a starting SG on the roster for next year.  If it is going to be Ray for that position, it will cost probably around $9M ($18M with luxury tax).  So it is either pay Ray or trade for and pay Hinrich.  Hinrich is younger, and more versatile (or so the thinking probably goes).

Note: I realize that the OP cites an article about "spare parts" for Hinrich -- Chicago can and will get more, though, so any conversation starts with Ray Allen in the mix.

[BballTim]

  He turned down an offer from Chicago that was probably about as big as what he got from Detroit. He clearly had a high asking price.

That doesn't mean he was worth it, or that there was a feasible scenario that the Bulls could have traded him for something valuable.

The Bulls were lucky he turned their offer down two years ago.

  I don't disagree with any of this. I'm just saying that the reason he never got an offer was because his asking price was more than $10M a year.