Rumor (now reported by Spears) - Rondo to Memphis?

[nickagneta]

Is this a joke?

Yeah, I think it was!!

[hwangjini_1]

Here is some stats.  

Conley is 21 2 years younger than Rondo.  

February numbers 14.5 PPG, 6.2 APG, 4.8 RPG
March numbers 13.9 PPG, 5.1 APG, 3.5 RPG
April numbers 15.6 PPG, 5.8 APG, 3.7 RPG

Gay age 22

Numbers were pretty consistent all year.  18.9 PPG, 5.5 RPG, 1.7 APG

After looking at the numbers especially Conley I feel a little better if this trade were true.  

good stats, thanks.
i doubt this trade comes to pass, but if it does it is not a lop-sided trade as some posters strongly think.

i watched conley at OSU. he is a very good pg. i dont think he is good as rondo on defense; but, he is a good passer and a more consistent scorer than rondo.

conley is a better shooter than rondo, but then, lots of folks are.

conley = 40.6% 3pter     81.7% ft
rondo = 31.3% 3 pter     64.2% ft

conley averaged about 4 assist less than rondo. but if conley joins the celtics and the big three, his assist numbers will most certainly go up.

gay is an excellent forward and would give celtics starters the rest they so desperately needed in the playoffs.

giving up rondo would be a loss for sure. but conley is not light years worse the rondo. and gay is light years better than giddens and scal.

actually, if this trade were reversed and it were the celtics who offered conley and gay for a guard who cant shoot and 2 bench warmers, i think the fans here would have hissy fits galore. 

[Jon]

Here is some stats.  

Conley is 21 2 years younger than Rondo.  

February numbers 14.5 PPG, 6.2 APG, 4.8 RPG
March numbers 13.9 PPG, 5.1 APG, 3.5 RPG
April numbers 15.6 PPG, 5.8 APG, 3.7 RPG

Gay age 22

Numbers were pretty consistent all year.  18.9 PPG, 5.5 RPG, 1.7 APG

After looking at the numbers especially Conley I feel a little better if this trade were true.  

good stats, thanks.
i doubt this trade comes to pass, but if it does it is not a lop-sided trade as some posters strongly think.

i watched conley at OSU. he is a very good pg. i dont think he is good as rondo on defense; but, he is a good passer and a more consistent scorer than rondo.

conley is a better shooter than rondo, but then, lots of folks are.

conley = 40.6% 3pter     81.7% ft
rondo = 31.3% 3 pter     64.2% ft

conley averaged about 4 assist less than rondo. but if conley joins the celtics and the big three, his assist numbers will most certainly go up.

gay is an excellent forward and would give celtics starters the rest they so desperately needed in the playoffs.

giving up rondo would be a loss for sure. but conley is not light years worse the rondo. and gay is light years better than giddens and scal.

actually, if this trade were reversed and it were the celtics who offered conley and gay for a guard who cant shoot and 2 bench warmers, i think the fans here would have hissy fits galore. 

Perhaps.  But with Gay coming up for a contract soon, will he really try to conform?  Or is he going to try to score 25 a game to get a bigger deal.  The thing with Rondo is that he can increase his value with steals, assists, and rebounds.  When you're talking about a wing, a lot of their value comes from ppg. 

And that's what it comes down to.  Maybe this deal is fair on paper, but championships aren't won on paper.  Maybe this deal would make us better, but if we're already good enough to win the title, is it really worth rolling the dice to maybe get marginally better?  I don't think so.

[Rondo2287]

Haha google, "Rondo to Memphis"  there are now like 5 blogs that are reporting this based on the REALGM rumor. 

[winsomme]

Here is some stats.  

Conley is 21 2 years younger than Rondo.  

February numbers 14.5 PPG, 6.2 APG, 4.8 RPG
March numbers 13.9 PPG, 5.1 APG, 3.5 RPG
April numbers 15.6 PPG, 5.8 APG, 3.7 RPG

Gay age 22

Numbers were pretty consistent all year.  18.9 PPG, 5.5 RPG, 1.7 APG

After looking at the numbers especially Conley I feel a little better if this trade were true.  

good stats, thanks.
i doubt this trade comes to pass, but if it does it is not a lop-sided trade as some posters strongly think.

i watched conley at OSU. he is a very good pg. i dont think he is good as rondo on defense; but, he is a good passer and a more consistent scorer than rondo.

conley is a better shooter than rondo, but then, lots of folks are.

conley = 40.6% 3pter     81.7% ft
rondo = 31.3% 3 pter     64.2% ft

conley averaged about 4 assist less than rondo. but if conley joins the celtics and the big three, his assist numbers will most certainly go up.

gay is an excellent forward and would give celtics starters the rest they so desperately needed in the playoffs.

giving up rondo would be a loss for sure. but conley is not light years worse the rondo. and gay is light years better than giddens and scal.

actually, if this trade were reversed and it were the celtics who offered conley and gay for a guard who cant shoot and 2 bench warmers, i think the fans here would have hissy fits galore. 

I don't think you can do a one to one analysis on Assts like that.

the fact is that Conley simply does not run a team well. it's the reason MEM isn't sold on him and the reason he hasn't even been able to nail down the PG position on a pretty terrible team.

plus, I don't want him jacking up threes. we need a PG who runs the offense, and that is the weakest part of Conley's game.

[rondohondo]

I posted this on the forums about a month ago, but here is an in depth look at Rondo VS Conley


I'm starting to think a deal for the # 2 pick could make some sense for the C's , but this would have to be the trade.

Bos sends: Rajon Rondo + Giddens
Mem sends: Mike Conley + #2 Pick


Rajon Rondo       Mike Conley


    Age 20            Age 20

     78 G              53 G
     25 GS             46 GS
   23.5 MPG            26 MPG
    6.4 PPG        9.4 PPG
    3.8 APG        4.2 APG
    1.8 TOPG      1.6 TOPG
 1.6 STL         1 STL
   3.7 RPG     2.6 RPG
    41  FG%         43 FG%
    20  3P%          33 3P%
    64  FT%          73 FT%


      Age 21             Age 21

      78   G             82   G                       
      77   GS            61   GS
      23.5 MPG         30.6 MPG
      10.6 PPG      10.9 PPG
   5.1 APG     4.3 APG
      1.9 TOPG       1.7 TOPG
   1.7 STL           1.1 STL
   4.2 RPG           3.4 RPG
   49  FG%           44 FG%
       26  3P%         40.6 3P%
       61  FT%         81 FT%


      Age 22                Age 22
 
       80 G                                     
       80 GS
       33 MPG
       12 PPG
      8.2 APG
      2.6 TOPG
      1.9 STL
      5.2 RPG
     50.5  FG%
       31  3P%
       64  FT%


While Mike Conley's overall stats in 2008-09 weren't anything speacial, he really picked his play up after the all-star break. I found an interesting article on his progress last year here.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/152468-examining-down-the-stretch-mike-conley

Quote
Again, 10.8 ppg, 3.4 rpg, and 4.2 apg are not what you expect from a cornerstone point guard.  But at 15.0 points, 5.7 assists, 3.8 rebounds, 1.5 steals, and 1.7 three-pointers since the break, Conley has elevated himself into the top-10 point guard debate.

 We’re no longer looking at Conley and wondering whether or not he can be successful without Oden.  In fact we’re looking at Mr. Oden and wondering whether or not he’ll be able to shine without his point guard by his side.   


Physical Features

-both players are about the same size 6'1 175LBS.
-Rondo has a slight speed advantage as Mike Conley is also very quick
-Rondo has better leaping ability

Winner- Rondo Slightly


Rebounding-

Rondo
It's no surprise to any of us Celtics fan that Rondo is a better rebounder. He is probably the best Rebounding PG in the league.

Conley
Although Conley is not in Rondo league as a rebounding PG ,he was right near the top 10 in RPG for PG's with 3.5 RPG in the 2008-09 season.

Winner: Rondo


Defense

Rajon Rondo

Rondo is one of the better defensive PG's in the league with his long arms he is able to get a lot of steals ranking 5th in the leauge in Steals per game, but he also gambles a lot and sometimes it hurts the Celtics badly. He kind of reminds me of a young Allen Iverson in the way he takes chances for steals on D, although I think he is a much better defender then Iverson ever was. He was names to the 2nd Team All Defensive team this year.

Mike Conley

While Conley isn't an all defensive player like Rondo at this point in his career he has the ability to play defense . He has quick feet which allows him to contain penetration into the paint. He might not get the amount of steals Rondo does but he might actually be better at preventing opposing PG's from getting into the lane because he doesn't gamble as much for steals. Conley avg'd 1 SPG in 2008-09

Winner: Rondo


Ball Handling and court vision

Rajon Rondo
This is a hard one to determine for me because so many thing factor into the amount of assists a PG averages. It appears Rondo has better court vision with the growth in the of APG by the years from 4APG TO 5APG to 8APG in his first three seasons.

Mike Conley
Mike Conley hasn't seen any big explosion in assists per year averaging basically the same 4.2 + 4.3 APG in his first 2 season's in the NBA,but you can also argue that if Mike Conley had PP , Ray Allen, Eddie House and KG to pass to, his assists would be around the 6-8 APG area. Rondo's assists didn't jump much until his 3 year in the NBA, which Mike Conley is about to enter . Conley also turned the ball over 1 less time than Rondo per game in the 2008-09 season with basically the same amount of MPG .

Winner: Rondo Slight edge


Shooting

Rajon Rondo
 We all know this is Rondo's biggest weakness . Rondo is very good at finishing at finishing at the rim, but his inability to at least semi consistently knock down a long 2 or 3 really hurts the Celtics half court offense . He has shown no real imporvement with his jump shot on long 2pt FG attempts or 3 pt attempts.

1st NBA Season- 21%
2nd NBA Season- 26%
3rd NBA Season- 31%

Rondo's free throw shooting hasn't really improved much over his first 3 seasons either. He is a career 63& FT shooter which is pretty bad for a PG. It has to be a cause for concern that he hasn't improved at the free throw line because if you can't improve your shot when no one is guarding you then it makes me wonder if he will ever be able to shoot at least semi consistently .

1st NBA Season- 65% FT
2nd NBA Season- 61% FT
3rd NBA Season- 64% FT

Mike Conley

This is an area Mike Conley has really showed improvement since entering the NBA. Conley has improved his 3pt shooting since his 1st and only season at Ohio state

OSU Freshmen Year- 30% 3P FG'S
   1st NBA season- 33% 3P FG'S
   2nd NBA season- 40% 3P FG'S

His free throw shooting has also showed a marked improvement since his only season at Ohio State

OSU Freshmen Year- 69% FT
   1st NBA Season- 73% FT
   2nd NBA Season- 82% FT

Winner- Conley by a lot

Intangibles

Rondo

Rondo has won an NBA championship as a starting PG and that has to count for something. He has performed at a high level on the biggest stage of the playoffs  and has come through about 75% of the time in the playoffs.

Conley
While Conley hasn't had nearly as much success in the NBA he did lead Ohio State to the NCAA Finals in his freshmen year along with Greg Oden and played really good in the championship. While it doesn't count for anything in the NBA ,I think the experience of playing in big pressure packed games does count for something.

Winner: Rondo Slightly


Contracts

Rondo

Rondo's contract will have to be extended by next off season. The have the ability to use a qualifying offer after next season. Rondo is likely to demand around 8-10 MIL per season for his next contract. If he could develop any kind of consistency with his jump shot, but it really worries me that he hasn't even improved his free throw shooting through his 1st 3 seasons. He is not always going to have Ray, PP and KG next to him and if he doesn't get a jump shot soon teams are just going to keep playing off him and make life harder for the C'S in the half court offense.

Conley
Conley is owed
3.8 Mil for the 2009-10 season,
has a team option of 4.9 MIL in 2010-11,
and has a qaulifying offer of 7.5 MIL in 2011-12

So we would have another few years to let Mike Conley keep developing before we make a longterm decision on him.


The #2 Pick
Here is the other piece of the trade. There are so many things the Celtics could do with this pick.

1)Trading Ray's expiring contract with the #2 pick may be able to land the Celtics a superstar.

2) Trading BBD with the # 2 Pick may land us a david Lee and   
  Chandler type of package from NY  or Something with Portland

3) Take the best player with most Potential. If Danny thinks someone is a superstar he will be able to get him here.

4) If there are no superstars danny can trade the pick along with other expiring contracts like Scal, Tony and House and probably get some very solid role players like say a jason terry to be a 6th man off the bench


Free Agents

The Celtics would obviously have to sign a Vet PG as insurance for Conley. I would actually have Conley be the PG for the 2nd unit and sign Kidd, Miller or Marbury to be the starter.


2009-10 Celtics Roster
PG: Kidd, Miller or Marubry / Conley
SG: Ray / # 2 pick(Harden)
SF: PP  / Vet FA(MLE)
PF: KG  / BBD / Scal/ Powe(IR)
 C: Perk/ VET FA



So while I think Rondo is the better PG now, I think it is a lot closer than one would have thought before looking at the development of each player.

So what do you guys think, would this trade make the Celtics better?

[Fafnir]

Here is some stats.  

Conley is 21 2 years younger than Rondo.  

February numbers 14.5 PPG, 6.2 APG, 4.8 RPG
March numbers 13.9 PPG, 5.1 APG, 3.5 RPG
April numbers 15.6 PPG, 5.8 APG, 3.7 RPG

Gay age 22

Numbers were pretty consistent all year.  18.9 PPG, 5.5 RPG, 1.7 APG

After looking at the numbers especially Conley I feel a little better if this trade were true.  

good stats, thanks.
i doubt this trade comes to pass, but if it does it is not a lop-sided trade as some posters strongly think.

i watched conley at OSU. he is a very good pg. i dont think he is good as rondo on defense; but, he is a good passer and a more consistent scorer than rondo.

conley is a better shooter than rondo, but then, lots of folks are.

conley = 40.6% 3pter     81.7% ft
rondo = 31.3% 3 pter     64.2% ft

conley averaged about 4 assist less than rondo. but if conley joins the celtics and the big three, his assist numbers will most certainly go up.

gay is an excellent forward and would give celtics starters the rest they so desperately needed in the playoffs.

giving up rondo would be a loss for sure. but conley is not light years worse the rondo. and gay is light years better than giddens and scal.

actually, if this trade were reversed and it were the celtics who offered conley and gay for a guard who cant shoot and 2 bench warmers, i think the fans here would have hissy fits galore. 

plus, I don't want him jacking up threes. we need a PG who runs the offense, and that is the weakest part of Conley's game.

I agree with you about Conley not running a team well. But having a PG who can hit the open 3 would be huge for our team. Just by spacing the floor for the big 3, the effect would be far beyond the 3 or so shots he'd take a game.

[Cman]

Also, don't forget that fabulous talent that is better than most players in this year's draft, JR Giddens, is included. How could Wallace pass up on getting a hold of JR Giddens?

TP
 

I would do Gay and #2 for Rondo.  Or Gasol and 2 for Rondo.  Draft Rubio.  

I would think hard about Conley + #2 for Rondo, so long as there were some other deals in the pipeline.

[Cman]

Rondohondo, TP for the in depth analysis (even if it is recycled  ).

Look, Conley doesn't look bad, but I wouldn't trade Rondo+filler for Conley+Gay.  Boston basically trades proven talent for prospects.  Yes, I consider Conley+Gay both still prospects.  Why? Because they have only played for a crap team.  They put up good numbers on a crap team, but that's it.  Rondo has proven that he can help a championship team win important ball games.  Neither of those memphis guys has.  Now, if the #2 were included, then the trade is lopsided in the Cs favor and I jump on it.  But... this is all make-believe anyway...

[winsomme]

Here is some stats.  

Conley is 21 2 years younger than Rondo.  

February numbers 14.5 PPG, 6.2 APG, 4.8 RPG
March numbers 13.9 PPG, 5.1 APG, 3.5 RPG
April numbers 15.6 PPG, 5.8 APG, 3.7 RPG

Gay age 22

Numbers were pretty consistent all year.  18.9 PPG, 5.5 RPG, 1.7 APG

After looking at the numbers especially Conley I feel a little better if this trade were true.  

good stats, thanks.
i doubt this trade comes to pass, but if it does it is not a lop-sided trade as some posters strongly think.

i watched conley at OSU. he is a very good pg. i dont think he is good as rondo on defense; but, he is a good passer and a more consistent scorer than rondo.

conley is a better shooter than rondo, but then, lots of folks are.

conley = 40.6% 3pter     81.7% ft
rondo = 31.3% 3 pter     64.2% ft

conley averaged about 4 assist less than rondo. but if conley joins the celtics and the big three, his assist numbers will most certainly go up.

gay is an excellent forward and would give celtics starters the rest they so desperately needed in the playoffs.

giving up rondo would be a loss for sure. but conley is not light years worse the rondo. and gay is light years better than giddens and scal.

actually, if this trade were reversed and it were the celtics who offered conley and gay for a guard who cant shoot and 2 bench warmers, i think the fans here would have hissy fits galore. 

plus, I don't want him jacking up threes. we need a PG who runs the offense, and that is the weakest part of Conley's game.

I agree with you about Conley not running a team well. But having a PG who can hit the open 3 would be huge for our team. Just by spacing the floor for the big 3, the effect would be far beyond the 3 or so shots he'd take a game.

but we can get that with Eddie. It's much more important to me to get the offense moving.

plus, the thing that makes Rondo so good is his intensity. that is something i just don't get from Conley.

[KG Living Legend]

Here is some stats.  

Conley is 21 2 years younger than Rondo.  

February numbers 14.5 PPG, 6.2 APG, 4.8 RPG
March numbers 13.9 PPG, 5.1 APG, 3.5 RPG
April numbers 15.6 PPG, 5.8 APG, 3.7 RPG

Gay age 22
 TP JB thanks for bringing something different to the table.
Numbers were pretty consistent all year.  18.9 PPG, 5.5 RPG, 1.7 APG

After looking at the numbers especially Conley I feel a little better if this trade were true.  

[Gomesfan]

Did this die ?

[PosImpos]

Did this die ?

At this point I think it's pretty clear it's not going to happen.

[snively]

I am surprised that Gay is getting so much love.  He's shot-happy and turnover-prone. 

[PosImpos]

I am surprised that Gay is getting so much love.  He's shot-happy and turnover-prone. 

I think it's more surprising we're seriously discussing trading Rondo....