When the team loses you hate doc but when they win you like him?

[Tr1boy]

here are some articles which backs up my opinion about doc

http://dimemag.com/2008/01/docs-no-genius/

I have yet to see an article that praises doc. With such record last year he should have won coach of the year easily, the question is then why didn't he?? (ainge, big three, thibs, posey??)

nickagneta here are some sources which backup my point that doc is not the defensive architech for our club

"Assistant Coach Tom Thibadeau transformed the Boston Celtics into a defensive force in just a year’s time. "

source: https://www.onlinetickets.com/info/sports_nba/boston_celtics/2008_preview.html

lastly

"Why not? The Celtics still have the best defense in the League until further notice, led by the best defensive player (Kevin Garnett) and the behind-the-scenes architect that is assistant coach Tom Thibadeau. "

source: http://dimemag.com/2008/10/boston-celtics-nba-season-preview/

And i will try to find an interview quote that doc specifically states he doesn't interfere with thibadeaus defense system.

Remember also during halftime and come third quarter the celtics defense system adjust well to what the other team has done in the beginning of the game. Doc is not the one who is the genius behind this adapdation just to let you know

Lastly thibadeau will definitely get a chance next year or maybe the year after. He just has to find a team that values discipline and strategy more than personality. Honestly i wouldn't be suprised if next year the wolves might steal him away from us.

Just to be clear, it is is not Thibodeau's system.  It is the same system that Doc was running (or I should say Tony Brown, since Doc also gave him the same responsibilities he gave to Thibodeau).  It is a system that is run by many coaches from the Pat Riley coaching tree.

That doesn't take away from the fact that Thibodeau does an excellent job implementing it, but if you are going to go with that as your basis, I think it shows much worse on Tony Brown than Doc Rivers.  If you are saying that Doc isn't responsible, because he relies on his assistant coaches, you have to use that accross the board, not just to make your argument.

Now you can say Doc did a terrible job of picking Brown to run his defense...but then he did a great job of picking Thibs.

chris even if you say it is docs defensive system being utlizied its not originally his. And remember main credit is to the guy who is making the defense click and that is thibs.

[fairweatherfan]

It's easy to judge Doc's performance and impact on our team, just follow these simple guidelines:

1. Something goes poorly for the C's:  Doc was directly in charge and control of whatever caused the negative event, and deserves every last bit of blame.

2. Something goes well for the C's:  Doc had nothing to do with it; the good event was entirely the doing of Thibs/Danny/KG/Pierce/Gino; Doc deserves no credit except for not screwing things up.

3. Something happens and it's too soon to tell if it's good or bad:  There are several strategies here.  The safest is to take a pessimistic stance and complain loudly about how Doc's incompetence is about to tear the team apart.  Then, if things do shake out well, talk about how Thibs/Danny/KG/Pierce/Gino/alternate universe C's Coach McHale singlehandedly saved the team from Doc's stupidity.

It's as easy as 1-2-3!

[Tr1boy]

For me its more like even if the team lost but the coach executed plays correctly than he can't be blamed. If you need the last bucket to win and you trust your main star to get you that, but he doesn't its not the coaches fault nor players. Because he executed the correct play at that point.

If you win games with a stacked team and properly utilize the bench then yeah the main thing the coach has to do is just not screw up. Only way really he will receive some significant praise is if such a team can string multiple championships ala phil jackson

From what i have seen the past few years is that doc has made the same dumbazz mistakes when having mostly young talent and also great talent on his roster thats why i dont have much confidence in his overall coaching abilities

[Tr1boy]

Here comes the haters out now. Why take out house and powe?? cuz doc is not adaptable and doesn't know how to manage his rotation even a high school coach knows how to

BudweiserCeltic and to all you others guys defending doc, tell me last night wasn't classic idiotic doc.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Here comes the haters out now. Why take out house and powe?? cuz doc is not adaptable and doesn't know how to manage his rotation even a high school coach knows how to

BudweiserCeltic and to all you others guys defending doc, tell me last night wasn't classic idiotic doc.

Go read the thread where all of this is being discussed. No need to rehash it here to amuse you.

[Tr1boy]

no offense but its good to see you get the point now

[CelticsWhat35]

Because one Doc-bashing thread clearly isn't enough.   

[Tr1boy]

Because one Doc-bashing thread clearly isn't enough.   

he needs to be put down for utter stupidity moves.

also last play give it to pierce, give it to allen for the last shots straight from inbound, i mean its so predictable(could can't draw up a more clever way to get them the ball??). Phil jackson is not like the amature 76rs coach

they didn't even have bynum, unless doc eats some brainfood or starts coaching properly against good teams like the lakers say goodbye to repeating this year

[EJPLAYA]

I continue to be a big Doc supporter, but that move to bring BBD in instead of Powe who was lighting the Lakers up last night was absolutely insane. BBD was awful and his 1-8 night and 3 rebounds in 22 minutes killed us. We needed Powe down on the block. Then maybe that inbound pass would have gone to someone who could do something with it instead of a fat man in a little coat getting the ball with 3 seconds past the three point line and nothing to do but try and hand it off...

[winsomme]

I continue to be a big Doc supporter, but that move to bring BBD in instead of Powe who was lighting the Lakers up last night was absolutely insane. BBD was awful and his 1-8 night and 3 rebounds in 22 minutes killed us. We needed Powe down on the block. Then maybe that inbound pass would have gone to someone who could do something with it instead of a fat man in a little coat getting the ball with 3 seconds past the three point line and nothing to do but try and hand it off...

huh? what exactly is Powe going to do with the ball at the top of the key?

[thedawg]

I dont like him as a coach...full stop!  The game vs. Lakers last night was just a good reminder for the whole organisation to think about what the final goal is.  "We are working on a dream" as Bruce Springsteen is singing about these days and Paul Pierce just said the correct words about this loss.  We need to strengthen our team as we clearly can see that Doc doesnt rate the team deeper than just 8 players are pretty much in the rotation.  That needs to be sorted out in order for us to get through the East!

[EJPLAYA]

I continue to be a big Doc supporter, but that move to bring BBD in instead of Powe who was lighting the Lakers up last night was absolutely insane. BBD was awful and his 1-8 night and 3 rebounds in 22 minutes killed us. We needed Powe down on the block. Then maybe that inbound pass would have gone to someone who could do something with it instead of a fat man in a little coat getting the ball with 3 seconds past the three point line and nothing to do but try and hand it off...

huh? what exactly is Powe going to do with the ball at the top of the key?

Did you miss that part about where Powe would be down on the block and another player would have been up there with Ray?!

[Chris]

here are some articles which backs up my opinion about doc

http://dimemag.com/2008/01/docs-no-genius/

I have yet to see an article that praises doc. With such record last year he should have won coach of the year easily, the question is then why didn't he?? (ainge, big three, thibs, posey??)

nickagneta here are some sources which backup my point that doc is not the defensive architech for our club

"Assistant Coach Tom Thibadeau transformed the Boston Celtics into a defensive force in just a year’s time. "

source: https://www.onlinetickets.com/info/sports_nba/boston_celtics/2008_preview.html

lastly

"Why not? The Celtics still have the best defense in the League until further notice, led by the best defensive player (Kevin Garnett) and the behind-the-scenes architect that is assistant coach Tom Thibadeau. "

source: http://dimemag.com/2008/10/boston-celtics-nba-season-preview/

And i will try to find an interview quote that doc specifically states he doesn't interfere with thibadeaus defense system.

Remember also during halftime and come third quarter the celtics defense system adjust well to what the other team has done in the beginning of the game. Doc is not the one who is the genius behind this adapdation just to let you know

Lastly thibadeau will definitely get a chance next year or maybe the year after. He just has to find a team that values discipline and strategy more than personality. Honestly i wouldn't be suprised if next year the wolves might steal him away from us.

Just to be clear, it is is not Thibodeau's system.  It is the same system that Doc was running (or I should say Tony Brown, since Doc also gave him the same responsibilities he gave to Thibodeau).  It is a system that is run by many coaches from the Pat Riley coaching tree.

That doesn't take away from the fact that Thibodeau does an excellent job implementing it, but if you are going to go with that as your basis, I think it shows much worse on Tony Brown than Doc Rivers.  If you are saying that Doc isn't responsible, because he relies on his assistant coaches, you have to use that accross the board, not just to make your argument.

Now you can say Doc did a terrible job of picking Brown to run his defense...but then he did a great job of picking Thibs.

chris even if you say it is docs defensive system being utlizied its not originally his. And remember main credit is to the guy who is making the defense click and that is thibs.

The point is that it is the same system the C's were running before Thibs got there.  So the difference was either that Thibs is MUCH better than Tony Brown (again, if you give Thibs credit now, you need to give the blame to Brown, since they were both given the same freedom in running the defense), or the players are simply executing better now.  Obviously I think it is a combination of the two.  But I also think you can't take the way they are playing now as any sort of evidence that Doc is a bad defensive coach, since he has been doing the exact same thing since he has been here...delegating responsibility.

[Chris]

I continue to be a big Doc supporter, but that move to bring BBD in instead of Powe who was lighting the Lakers up last night was absolutely insane. BBD was awful and his 1-8 night and 3 rebounds in 22 minutes killed us. We needed Powe down on the block. Then maybe that inbound pass would have gone to someone who could do something with it instead of a fat man in a little coat getting the ball with 3 seconds past the three point line and nothing to do but try and hand it off...

The reason Davis was up there handing the ball off was in order to set a pick, so that the defender would either have to go underneath it, giving Allen an open look, or have to fight over it, forcing him to handcheck Allen, to be able to stay with him.  He went over it, handchecked Allen, but the call wasn't made. 

Having Powe in there would have done nothing, since there is no way they were giving the ball to him, and the Lakers knew it...and there was not enough time on the clock for him to get an offensive rebound, which would really have been his only use at that point.

[winsomme]

I continue to be a big Doc supporter, but that move to bring BBD in instead of Powe who was lighting the Lakers up last night was absolutely insane. BBD was awful and his 1-8 night and 3 rebounds in 22 minutes killed us. We needed Powe down on the block. Then maybe that inbound pass would have gone to someone who could do something with it instead of a fat man in a little coat getting the ball with 3 seconds past the three point line and nothing to do but try and hand it off...

huh? what exactly is Powe going to do with the ball at the top of the key?

Did you miss that part about where Powe would be down on the block and another player would have been up there with Ray?!

and Powe on the block gets us?

there were 3 seconds left....if Powe was in there, he would have been out setting screens just like BBD...