Wise to Keep Bill Walker?

[EJPLAYA]

I like Bill Walker a lot, particularly his aggressiveness but I can't say at this point I agree with everyone saying 'he's a good defender.' I'm sure its a lot to do with rookie nerves but he seems to be caught in the air or out of place a decent amount of times.

I havent really seen this out of him. I mean, he gets caught/beat sometimes, but alot of that is garabge time minutes. That goes both ways of course, when he looks good, we must also remeber the other team isn't exactly into it down 20.

Only way we'll know is if he gets meanigful minutes, which i don't think he's earning from doc anytime soon.

How does someone not get held accountable for the way they play only because they are garbage minutes Crownsy?! I would say the reverse should be the case actually. He is playing in those minutes against inferior talent. If he can't play good fundamental defense against these guys, then what chance does he have against very good NBA players. This is where the guy has to earn his time. Shutting down a so-so 2nd or 3rd string guy by playing fundamental defense vs. gambling because it is garbage time would seem to be a requirement! (I am not necessarily saying that is what Walker is doing, just the premise that it is okay for someone to play like that because of the timing)

[crownsy]

I like Bill Walker a lot, particularly his aggressiveness but I can't say at this point I agree with everyone saying 'he's a good defender.' I'm sure its a lot to do with rookie nerves but he seems to be caught in the air or out of place a decent amount of times.

I havent really seen this out of him. I mean, he gets caught/beat sometimes, but alot of that is garabge time minutes. That goes both ways of course, when he looks good, we must also remeber the other team isn't exactly into it down 20.

Only way we'll know is if he gets meanigful minutes, which i don't think he's earning from doc anytime soon.

How does someone not get held accountable for the way they play only because they are garbage minutes Crownsy?! I would say the reverse should be the case actually. He is playing in those minutes against inferior talent. If he can't play good fundamental defense against these guys, then what chance does he have against very good NBA players. This is where the guy has to earn his time. Shutting down a so-so 2nd or 3rd string guy by playing fundamental defense vs. gambling because it is garbage time would seem to be a requirement! (I am not necessarily saying that is what Walker is doing, just the premise that it is okay for someone to play like that because of the timing)

well, for one, i said i didn't really see him out of position, and his defense has been excelent. But we've pointed to all this in this thread EJ, and it was dismissed as "playing against scrubs" and not useful to showing he's ready for non-garbage minutes. So this would seem to indicate that only the bad matters with regardess to walker (of which thier has been little to none so far)


also,this doesn't  really seem a good stance for  you to be taking EJ, since in the other thread your dismissing POB's awful garbage time stats (6.34 TO's/48, 10.3 PF/per 48, being out rebounded currently) because they are in garbage time. If your logic here, that walker should dominate all comers in garbage time if he's any good holds true, why doesn't it hold to POB?

Whats POB's excuse for his bad shooting percentage, awful turnover rate, and massive foul rate in garbage time?

Note: i've actaully seen some defintie improvment in the last two blowouts, effort wise from pob, he seems to be getting a bit of a fire under his butt the last few weeks. just pointing out, you can't have this both ways, and you've been pretty dismissive of bad stats for pob (worst is his TO rate and PF rate) because its garbage time. You can't now try to take a shot at walker using the "he should dominate if he's any good!" move after dismissing the bad things POB does out of hand.

garbage time is garbage time. Its useful for getting eyes on players and getting a rough estimate of them. But its not useful to determine actual NBA level skill.

IMO neither walker or POB are rotation ready, but both have shown that they are getting there. Walker seems a bit ahead pose wise, but POB has picked it up his last two runs.
 

[EJPLAYA]

I like Bill Walker a lot, particularly his aggressiveness but I can't say at this point I agree with everyone saying 'he's a good defender.' I'm sure its a lot to do with rookie nerves but he seems to be caught in the air or out of place a decent amount of times.

I havent really seen this out of him. I mean, he gets caught/beat sometimes, but alot of that is garabge time minutes. That goes both ways of course, when he looks good, we must also remeber the other team isn't exactly into it down 20.

Only way we'll know is if he gets meanigful minutes, which i don't think he's earning from doc anytime soon.

How does someone not get held accountable for the way they play only because they are garbage minutes Crownsy?! I would say the reverse should be the case actually. He is playing in those minutes against inferior talent. If he can't play good fundamental defense against these guys, then what chance does he have against very good NBA players. This is where the guy has to earn his time. Shutting down a so-so 2nd or 3rd string guy by playing fundamental defense vs. gambling because it is garbage time would seem to be a requirement! (I am not necessarily saying that is what Walker is doing, just the premise that it is okay for someone to play like that because of the timing)

well, for one, i said i didn't really see him out of position, and his defense has been excelent. But we've pointed to all this in this thread EJ, and it was dismissed as "playing against scrubs" and not useful to showing he's ready for non-garbage minutes. So this would seem to indicate that only the bad matters with regardess to walker (of which thier has been little to none so far)


also,this doesn't  really seem a good stance for  you to be taking EJ, since in the other thread your dismissing POB's awful garbage time stats (6.34 TO's/48, 10.3 PF/per 48, being out rebounded currently) because they are in garbage time. If your logic here, that walker should dominate all comers in garbage time if he's any good holds true, why doesn't it hold to POB?

Whats POB's excuse for his bad shooting percentage, awful turnover rate, and massive foul rate in garbage time?

Note: i've actaully seen some defintie improvment in the last two blowouts, effort wise from pob, he seems to be getting a bit of a fire under his butt the last few weeks. just pointing out, you can't have this both ways, and you've been pretty dismissive of bad stats for pob (worst is his TO rate and PF rate) because its garbage time. You can't now try to take a shot at walker using the "he should dominate if he's any good!" move after dismissing the bad things POB does out of hand.

garbage time is garbage time. Its useful for getting eyes on players and getting a rough estimate of them. But its not useful to determine actual NBA level skill.

IMO neither walker or POB are rotation ready, but both have shown that they are getting there. Walker seems a bit ahead pose wise, but POB has picked it up his last two runs.
 

That's not what I have been saying at ALL about POB. I have maintained that the guy has put up very good numbers offensively, shot blocking, rebounding and shooting percentage. Those arguing the other side have been the ones saying that the numbers don't matter because he does it against scrubs.

Yes his slow rotations concern me and would be a bigger issue with better players and maintain his foul problems. I have always said that he brings enough to the table with the other positives and his length to make up for that since the guy in front of him has so many flaws himself.

[zerophase]

Doc doesn't feel comfortable playing rookies... even though this has nothing to do with their playing ability. I haven't seen walker make any devastating mistakes besides bring energy the 2nd unit is missing. POB may seen lazy, but Walker definitely has the drive.

[Jon]

Right now I'm wary of Bill Walker.  We've all been excited by young players before who disappointed.  Names like Ron Mercer, Jerome Moiso, Kedrick Brown, Joe Forte, Brandon Hunter, J.R. Bremer, Marcus Banks, and Gerald Green all leap to mind.  All of them actually played in meaningful NBA games as well, something Bill Walker has yet to do. 

Still, I would like to see Doc put him in for some meaningful minutes at some point.  We can never know what he'll do in meaningful minutes until we actually see. 

[Roy Hobbs]

Right now I'm wary of Bill Walker.  We've all been excited by young players before who disappointed.  Names like Ron Mercer, Jerome Moiso, Kedrick Brown, Joe Forte, Brandon Hunter, J.R. Bremer, Marcus Banks, and Gerald Green all leap to mind. 

Poor Ron Mercer.  Don't lump him into that pu pu platter of disappointment.  Mercer could actually play, at least on the offensive end.  The others guys, to a man, couldn't.

[xmuscularghandix]

Right now I'm wary of Bill Walker.  We've all been excited by young players before who disappointed.  Names like Ron Mercer, Jerome Moiso, Kedrick Brown, Joe Forte, Brandon Hunter, J.R. Bremer, Marcus Banks, and Gerald Green all leap to mind.  All of them actually played in meaningful NBA games as well, something Bill Walker has yet to do. 

Still, I would like to see Doc put him in for some meaningful minutes at some point.  We can never know what he'll do in meaningful minutes until we actually see. 

you know what all those names have in common? they played for bad celtics teams, teams that had no chance at winning a championship. If they were rookies coming into a team with hall of famers to help them, and show them the ropes, they could be smarter players...but instead they were thrown into the game before they were ready and would prove to be failures.

[Goldstar88]

Right now I'm wary of Bill Walker.  We've all been excited by young players before who disappointed.  Names like Ron Mercer, Jerome Moiso, Kedrick Brown, Joe Forte, Brandon Hunter, J.R. Bremer, Marcus Banks, and Gerald Green all leap to mind.  All of them actually played in meaningful NBA games as well, something Bill Walker has yet to do. 

Still, I would like to see Doc put him in for some meaningful minutes at some point.  We can never know what he'll do in meaningful minutes until we actually see. 

Bill Walker has alot more potential then alot of those listed. Before he reached the NBA he was a better prospect overall. He was ranked 2nd in the country at the SF spot comming out of highschool, 7th overall. Players ranked before him include Beasley,Rose, Bayless,Mayo,Love... Most of the listed players were not big prospects. Gerald Green was a great prospect with absolutely zero Basketball IQ. the majority of players shown should not be compared to Bill Walker.

[twinbree]

I really like Walker's game. He's looked good getting to the hoop. In terms of potential he could be the best 3 option on our current bench. I'd like to see Doc give him more playing time in garbage time. Up 30+ at home and he only played a few minutes. Hope Doc isn't given him the POB treatment.

[xmuscularghandix]

Right now I'm wary of Bill Walker.  We've all been excited by young players before who disappointed.  Names like Ron Mercer, Jerome Moiso, Kedrick Brown, Joe Forte, Brandon Hunter, J.R. Bremer, Marcus Banks, and Gerald Green all leap to mind.  All of them actually played in meaningful NBA games as well, something Bill Walker has yet to do. 

Still, I would like to see Doc put him in for some meaningful minutes at some point.  We can never know what he'll do in meaningful minutes until we actually see. 

Bill Walker has alot more potential then alot of those listed. Before he reached the NBA he was a better prospect overall. He was ranked 2nd in the country at the SF spot comming out of highschool, 7th overall. Players ranked before him include Beasley,Rose, Bayless,Mayo,Love... Most of the listed players were not big prospects. Gerald Green was a great prospect with absolutely zero Basketball IQ. the majority of players shown should not be compared to Bill Walker.

good point, theres a video online somewhere with Love, Beasley, Rose and a couple of other talking about "Billy" Walker and how hard of a guard he is. This is coming out of high school. I see Bill as the type of role player that could go out and have 30 point nights out of nowhere, i dont see this coming that soon, but i see it happening.

[xmuscularghandix]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-18n8XP351w

heres him mayo and oden playing together.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuhRDjuDJlU
and this is my favorite, look at how easy it is for him to get by his man down low, its like he's in slow motion.

[CoachBo]

Right now I'm wary of Bill Walker.  We've all been excited by young players before who disappointed.  Names like Ron Mercer, Jerome Moiso, Kedrick Brown, Joe Forte, Brandon Hunter, J.R. Bremer, Marcus Banks, and Gerald Green all leap to mind. 

Poor Ron Mercer.  Don't lump him into that pu pu platter of disappointment.  Mercer could actually play, at least on the offensive end.  The others guys, to a man, couldn't.

Yeah, Mercer doesn't belong in that landfill roll call.

I like Walker's game, although he's burdened greatly now by a boatload of immaturity that's going to take time to overcome. He will not contribute significantly to this team, nor should he be expected to. He needs to grow up, personally and professionally.

But, he's got intriguing possibilities on both ends of the floor - if he gets the time he needs to mature. He's the ONLY move Danny made this summer that I really like.

[spazmonkey]

Poor Ron Mercer.  Don't lump him into that pu pu platter of disappointment.

Tommy point for that one.  That cracked me up.

I think Bill's being brought along the way it should be.  I want to continue to see him out there, but he only deserves garbage time at this point.  He's gotta earn any add'l minutes.

[indeedproceed]

Walker isn't the 1st, 2nd, 3rd or even 4th guy off the bench, but I think he's the most talented, just not the best player...yet. I really hope he sticks around. Bill Walker Hype Club, yo!

[pearljammer10]

Very wise. From the limited garbage minutes he has seen so far he has made the most of it. He's exciting, talented, can shoot, drive, play d, is fearless, and the best of all he has some major confidence... I really hope that he takes over for Tony Allen and becomes the new 2/3 off the bench.