2008 CelticsBlog draft board.

[indeedproceed]

Well he was one of the best shot blockers in the league at the SF position.  And dont talk about him being overhyped.  When i picked him a response was, "Who?"  So either its a really bad hype machine or somebody(IP) is misinformed.

Joe Alexander was the biggest mover in terms of climbing the draft this season. He did so on fantastic individual workouts and a great orlando camp/athletic marker measurments.

He isn't smart defensively, and he can't shoot a 3 pt shot. You bet he'll be good. I bet he'll be bad to mediocre.

BTW 1.5 blocked shots over 36 games doesn't make you smart defensively, if thats your inference.

[Roy Hobbs]

Let's see how I stack up against the "Champions"

Yao vs Amare: Push (just look up their head to head #'s)
Okafor vs Horford: Edge: Pistons (Okafor kills him head to head)
Turkoglu vs Gay: Push (They averaged basically the same ppg while Turk was the 2nd/3rd option. Gay is more athletic)
Gordon vs Iguodala: Edge: Blazers  (ok, you got me here)
Watson vs Ford: Edge: Blazers (not by that much, especially b/c Ford won't be healthy when they play)

So you have me with starters, but not really by a lot. Let's move on to the bench (put the Blazers first this time) :

Haslem/Wright/Battie/Mourning vs Landry/Hibbert: Edge Blazers  Haslem is better than Landry, Hibbert is as good as the other three.

Webster/Mobley/Ross vs Terry/Stackhouse Edge: Pistons  Terry is too good to overlook

Blake vs Lowry: Edge Pistons: Lowry is better and younger.


Roy, I think you have the better starters, and I have the better bench. You will most likely win the title, but I feel like if I get past the Knicks/Nets I can challenge you for the next 3-5 years.

I do definitely like your team.  My comparisons:

Yao vs Amare: Push (Agreed.  They're *very* close head-to-head.)
Okafor vs Horford: Edge: Push (We must be looking at different head-to-head numbers.)
Turkoglu vs Gay: Push (Turk is a better passer, Gay is a better defender.)
Gordon vs Iguodala: Edge: Blazers  (Finally, a clear advantage!)
Watson vs Ford: Edge: Blazers (As you say, health depending)

On the bench, things get tricky.

Haslem vs. Landry: Edge: Blazers
Wright vs. Hibbert: Edge: Push (Wright was as good as Hibbert in college, and has a year of expereince.)
Battie/Mourning vs. N/A: Edge: Blazers (You need some size at the backup 5.)
Mobley vs. Terry: Edge: Pistons (You have the edge here.)
Webster vs. Stackhouse: Edge: Blazers (Stack's best days are behind him, and Webster is a great shooter.)
Ross vs. N/A: Edge: Blazers (I like having a defensive stopper to put on my opponent's best wing in crunch time.)
Blake vs. Lowry: Edge: Blazers (I agree with buckner's analysis above.)

So, by my "head-to-head" analysis, I have it 7-1-4, Blazers.  That means I'm going to crush you, right?  Doubtful.  I think we both have very good teams, and my advantages, where there are some, are relatively small.  I think this series would go at least six games.  I also agree that your team has a solid 3 or 4 year window of opportunity (with me hopefully having a few years beyond that).

My only major quibble with your analysis was the claim that Okafor "kills" Horford head-to-head.  In four career games, Horford has outscored Okafor twice, and has shot as good or better than Okafor in all four games.  In fact, Horford shot 61.1% against the Bobcats this year, which is a fairly impressive number.  I'd put them as even right now, but in the future, I expect Horford to become one of the elite power forwards in the NBA.  As you know, he's got a better-than-even shot of turning into Karl Malone.

[bucknersrevenge]

Let's see how I stack up against the "Champions"

Yao vs Amare: Push (just look up their head to head #'s)
Okafor vs Horford: Edge: Pistons (Okafor kills him head to head)
Turkoglu vs Gay: Push (They averaged basically the same ppg while Turk was the 2nd/3rd option. Gay is more athletic)
Gordon vs Iguodala: Edge: Blazers  (ok, you got me here)
Watson vs Ford: Edge: Blazers (not by that much, especially b/c Ford won't be healthy when they play)

So you have me with starters, but not really by a lot. Let's move on to the bench (put the Blazers first this time) :

Haslem/Wright/Battie/Mourning vs Landry/Hibbert: Edge Blazers  Haslem is better than Landry, Hibbert is as good as the other three.

Webster/Mobley/Ross vs Terry/Stackhouse Edge: Pistons  Terry is too good to overlook

Blake vs Lowry: Edge Pistons: Lowry is better and younger.


Roy, I think you have the better starters, and I have the better bench. You will most likely win the title, but I feel like if I get past the Knicks/Nets I can challenge you for the next 3-5 years.

I do definitely like your team.  My comparisons:

Yao vs Amare: Push (Agreed.  They're *very* close head-to-head.)
Okafor vs Horford: Edge: Push (We must be looking at different head-to-head numbers.)
Turkoglu vs Gay: Push (Turk is a better passer, Gay is a better defender.)
Gordon vs Iguodala: Edge: Blazers  (Finally, a clear advantage!)
Watson vs Ford: Edge: Blazers (As you say, health depending)

On the bench, things get tricky.

Haslem vs. Landry: Edge: Blazers
Wright vs. Hibbert: Edge: Push (Wright was as good as Hibbert in college, and has a year of expereince.)
Battie/Mourning vs. N/A: Edge: Blazers (You need some size at the backup 5.)
Mobley vs. Terry: Edge: Pistons (You have the edge here.)
Webster vs. Stackhouse: Edge: Blazers (Stack's best days are behind him, and Webster is a great shooter.)
Ross vs. N/A: Edge: Blazers (I like having a defensive stopper to put on my opponent's best wing in crunch time.)
Blake vs. Lowry: Edge: Blazers (I agree with buckner's analysis above.)

So, by my "head-to-head" analysis, I have it 7-1-4, Blazers.  That means I'm going to crush you, right?  Doubtful.  I think we both have very good teams, and my advantages, where there are some, are relatively small.  I think this series would go at least six games.  I also agree that your team has a solid 3 or 4 year window of opportunity (with me hopefully having a few years beyond that).

My only major quibble with your analysis was the claim that Okafor "kills" Horford head-to-head.  In four career games, Horford has outscored Okafor twice, and has shot as good or better than Okafor in all four games.  In fact, Horford shot 61.1% against the Bobcats this year, which is a fairly impressive number.  I'd put them as even right now, but in the future, I expect Horford to become one of the elite power forwards in the NBA.  As you know, he's got a better-than-even shot of turning into Karl Malone.

He can correct me if I'm wrong but I think he was thinking of Hibbert as his size for the backup 5. Obviously Roy was able to get a few more spots filled sooner so straight slot by slot comparisons are tough. But I had a Hibbert vs Battie/Mourning comparison as a Push due to the opinion that all 3 are in varying degrees unknown quantities for this season be it youth or injury history being the excuse.

In regard to Wright, I haven't had a chance to see him in the Summer League this year. I liked him a bunch in college and I used to live like 20 minutes from Chapel Hill while he was there so I saw a bunch of his games. Really put me off though when I saw how slight of fram he was. If Big Baby could just like give him a little both players would be happy. I wonder where he stands size-wise now. Despite his skills it's tough for me to buy into a player I think might get pushed around a lot by the bigger PFs in the NBA.

[Roy Hobbs]

He can correct me if I'm wrong but I think he was thinking of Hibbert as his size for the backup 5. Obviously Roy was able to get a few more spots filled sooner so straight slot by slot comparisons are tough. But I had a Hibbert vs Battie/Mourning comparison as a Push due to the opinion that all 3 are in varying degrees unknown quantities for this season be it youth or injury history being the excuse.

In regard to Wright, I haven't had a chance to see him in the Summer League this year. I liked him a bunch in college and I used to live like 20 minutes from Chapel Hill while he was there so I saw a bunch of his games. Really put me off though when I saw how slight of fram he was. If Big Baby could just like give him a little both players would be happy. I wonder where he stands size-wise now. Despite his skills it's tough for me to buy into a player I think might get pushed around a lot by the bigger PFs in the NBA.

Yeah, good call on that.  My thought is, if healthy, both Battie and Mourning would destroy Hibbert.  I just don't think he's going to be that good; he's a bit still and mechanical, and I think he's going to have a hard time against physical big men in the NBA.  Mourning vs. Hibbert, Hibbert gets completely shut down.  (That, of course, presumes that Mourning is healthy near the middle to latter part of the season.)

Wright has added about 10 pounds of muscle to his frame so far.  That's not enough yet, but I fully expect this kid to develop.  From my perspective, he was the one "home run" pick I made, in terms of gambling on a guy who wasn't proven.  At the start of the season, he'll probably be my 12th man (as Mourning recovers).  I'm not expecting a huge contribution this season, but in future years, I like his chances to be a key part of the team.  Should he be forced to take a bigger role this year, though, I think he's up to the task.  He shot 55% last year in limited minutes, which shows he can hold his own against NBA-caliber players.

[bucknersrevenge]

He can correct me if I'm wrong but I think he was thinking of Hibbert as his size for the backup 5. Obviously Roy was able to get a few more spots filled sooner so straight slot by slot comparisons are tough. But I had a Hibbert vs Battie/Mourning comparison as a Push due to the opinion that all 3 are in varying degrees unknown quantities for this season be it youth or injury history being the excuse.

In regard to Wright, I haven't had a chance to see him in the Summer League this year. I liked him a bunch in college and I used to live like 20 minutes from Chapel Hill while he was there so I saw a bunch of his games. Really put me off though when I saw how slight of fram he was. If Big Baby could just like give him a little both players would be happy. I wonder where he stands size-wise now. Despite his skills it's tough for me to buy into a player I think might get pushed around a lot by the bigger PFs in the NBA.

Yeah, good call on that.  My thought is, if healthy, both Battie and Mourning would destroy Hibbert.  I just don't think he's going to be that good; he's a bit still and mechanical, and I think he's going to have a hard time against physical big men in the NBA.  Mourning vs. Hibbert, Hibbert gets completely shut down.  (That, of course, presumes that Mourning is healthy near the middle to latter part of the season.)

Wright has added about 10 pounds of muscle to his frame so far.  That's not enough yet, but I fully expect this kid to develop.  From my perspective, he was the one "home run" pick I made, in terms of gambling on a guy who wasn't proven.  At the start of the season, he'll probably be my 12th man (as Mourning recovers).  I'm not expecting a huge contribution this season, but in future years, I like his chances to be a key part of the team.  Should he be forced to take a bigger role this year, though, I think he's up to the task.  He shot 55% last year in limited minutes, which shows he can hold his own against NBA-caliber players.

Well then I guess we shall see. But if he bombs...and if O'Bryant bombs we may have to point back to this day when it all fell apart:

http://www.youtube.com/v/lnghNWRX2cA&hl=en&fs=1

Please tell me we don't do this at the Garden...Note Wright and O'Bryant...they look like they'd rather be shot out there at midcourt.

[Roy Hobbs]

Management of the Rose Garden has hereby banned the playing of Soulja Boy at all Trailblazers events.

[bucknersrevenge]

Management of the Rose Garden has hereby banned the playing of Soulja Boy at all Trailblazers events.

LOL Good call. But yeah that's just disturbing to watch. Giddens strikes me as the type though who would enjoy that. I don't think anything bothers that kid anymore.

[Rondo2287]

Well he was one of the best shot blockers in the league at the SF position.  And dont talk about him being overhyped.  When i picked him a response was, "Who?"  So either its a really bad hype machine or somebody(IP) is misinformed.

Joe Alexander was the biggest mover in terms of climbing the draft this season. He did so on fantastic individual workouts and a great orlando camp/athletic marker measurments.

He isn't smart defensively, and he can't shoot a 3 pt shot. You bet he'll be good. I bet he'll be bad to mediocre.

BTW 1.5 blocked shots over 36 games doesn't make you smart defensively, if thats your inference.

That is false he moved up so far because of his second half of the season when he was one of the top 5 players in all of college basketball.  but being a top 5 player in the game doesnt make you good I guess....If you arent drafted by the celtics

[Evantime34]

Well he was one of the best shot blockers in the league at the SF position.  And dont talk about him being overhyped.  When i picked him a response was, "Who?"  So either its a really bad hype machine or somebody(IP) is misinformed.

Joe Alexander was the biggest mover in terms of climbing the draft this season. He did so on fantastic individual workouts and a great orlando camp/athletic marker measurments.

He isn't smart defensively, and he can't shoot a 3 pt shot. You bet he'll be good. I bet he'll be bad to mediocre.

BTW 1.5 blocked shots over 36 games doesn't make you smart defensively, if thats your inference.

That is false he moved up so far because of his second half of the season when he was one of the top 5 players in all of college basketball.  but being a top 5 player in the game doesnt make you good I guess....If you arent drafted by the celtics

I'm not sure people who think Alexander is going to fail have watched him play very much. In college basketball there was no one he couldn't score on. He has a deadly midrange jumper (I'm not sure what his numbers are but he had a hang in face every shot)  which with practice will translate to a very good three point shooter. He is strong, fast a good help defender (most of his blocks came on weak side help). He is going to be good, you'll see.

[Celtic Fan Forever]

Let's see how I stack up against the "Champions"

Yao vs Amare: Push (just look up their head to head #'s)
Okafor vs Horford: Edge: Pistons (Okafor kills him head to head)
Turkoglu vs Gay: Push (They averaged basically the same ppg while Turk was the 2nd/3rd option. Gay is more athletic)
Gordon vs Iguodala: Edge: Blazers  (ok, you got me here)
Watson vs Ford: Edge: Blazers (not by that much, especially b/c Ford won't be healthy when they play)

So you have me with starters, but not really by a lot. Let's move on to the bench (put the Blazers first this time) :

Haslem/Wright/Battie/Mourning vs Landry/Hibbert: Edge Blazers  Haslem is better than Landry, Hibbert is as good as the other three.

Webster/Mobley/Ross vs Terry/Stackhouse Edge: Pistons  Terry is too good to overlook

Blake vs Lowry: Edge Pistons: Lowry is better and younger.


Roy, I think you have the better starters, and I have the better bench. You will most likely win the title, but I feel like if I get past the Knicks/Nets I can challenge you for the next 3-5 years.

I do definitely like your team.  My comparisons:

Yao vs Amare: Push (Agreed.  They're *very* close head-to-head.)
Okafor vs Horford: Edge: Push (We must be looking at different head-to-head numbers.)
Turkoglu vs Gay: Push (Turk is a better passer, Gay is a better defender.)
Gordon vs Iguodala: Edge: Blazers  (Finally, a clear advantage!)
Watson vs Ford: Edge: Blazers (As you say, health depending)

On the bench, things get tricky.

Haslem vs. Landry: Edge: Blazers
Wright vs. Hibbert: Edge: Push (Wright was as good as Hibbert in college, and has a year of expereince.)
Battie/Mourning vs. N/A: Edge: Blazers (You need some size at the backup 5.)
Mobley vs. Terry: Edge: Pistons (You have the edge here.)
Webster vs. Stackhouse: Edge: Blazers (Stack's best days are behind him, and Webster is a great shooter.)
Ross vs. N/A: Edge: Blazers (I like having a defensive stopper to put on my opponent's best wing in crunch time.)
Blake vs. Lowry: Edge: Blazers (I agree with buckner's analysis above.)

So, by my "head-to-head" analysis, I have it 7-1-4, Blazers.  That means I'm going to crush you, right?  Doubtful.  I think we both have very good teams, and my advantages, where there are some, are relatively small.  I think this series would go at least six games.  I also agree that your team has a solid 3 or 4 year window of opportunity (with me hopefully having a few years beyond that).

My only major quibble with your analysis was the claim that Okafor "kills" Horford head-to-head.  In four career games, Horford has outscored Okafor twice, and has shot as good or better than Okafor in all four games.  In fact, Horford shot 61.1% against the Bobcats this year, which is a fairly impressive number.  I'd put them as even right now, but in the future, I expect Horford to become one of the elite power forwards in the NBA.  As you know, he's got a better-than-even shot of turning into Karl Malone.

Woops, I was tired when I wrote this so I might have overlooked the head-to-head #'s for Okafor and Horford. While Horford shot at a better %, Okafor led in points( 14.0 to 12.3 )  rebounds (14.5 to 10.5) and blocks (2.8 to 1.3 ) Plus Okafor has 0.8 turnovers to Horford's 3.0. While it's not exactly "murder" Okafor still is a better player head to head.

[LEAHYISGOD]

im pretty sure there have been a lot of top-5 players in college to not be good in the NBA... like i said before, the NBA is the next level and i dont think alexander is going to hack it.

[Roy Hobbs]

Let's see how I stack up against the "Champions"

Yao vs Amare: Push (just look up their head to head #'s)
Okafor vs Horford: Edge: Pistons (Okafor kills him head to head)
Turkoglu vs Gay: Push (They averaged basically the same ppg while Turk was the 2nd/3rd option. Gay is more athletic)
Gordon vs Iguodala: Edge: Blazers  (ok, you got me here)
Watson vs Ford: Edge: Blazers (not by that much, especially b/c Ford won't be healthy when they play)

So you have me with starters, but not really by a lot. Let's move on to the bench (put the Blazers first this time) :

Haslem/Wright/Battie/Mourning vs Landry/Hibbert: Edge Blazers  Haslem is better than Landry, Hibbert is as good as the other three.

Webster/Mobley/Ross vs Terry/Stackhouse Edge: Pistons  Terry is too good to overlook

Blake vs Lowry: Edge Pistons: Lowry is better and younger.


Roy, I think you have the better starters, and I have the better bench. You will most likely win the title, but I feel like if I get past the Knicks/Nets I can challenge you for the next 3-5 years.

I do definitely like your team.  My comparisons:

Yao vs Amare: Push (Agreed.  They're *very* close head-to-head.)
Okafor vs Horford: Edge: Push (We must be looking at different head-to-head numbers.)
Turkoglu vs Gay: Push (Turk is a better passer, Gay is a better defender.)
Gordon vs Iguodala: Edge: Blazers  (Finally, a clear advantage!)
Watson vs Ford: Edge: Blazers (As you say, health depending)

On the bench, things get tricky.

Haslem vs. Landry: Edge: Blazers
Wright vs. Hibbert: Edge: Push (Wright was as good as Hibbert in college, and has a year of expereince.)
Battie/Mourning vs. N/A: Edge: Blazers (You need some size at the backup 5.)
Mobley vs. Terry: Edge: Pistons (You have the edge here.)
Webster vs. Stackhouse: Edge: Blazers (Stack's best days are behind him, and Webster is a great shooter.)
Ross vs. N/A: Edge: Blazers (I like having a defensive stopper to put on my opponent's best wing in crunch time.)
Blake vs. Lowry: Edge: Blazers (I agree with buckner's analysis above.)

So, by my "head-to-head" analysis, I have it 7-1-4, Blazers.  That means I'm going to crush you, right?  Doubtful.  I think we both have very good teams, and my advantages, where there are some, are relatively small.  I think this series would go at least six games.  I also agree that your team has a solid 3 or 4 year window of opportunity (with me hopefully having a few years beyond that).

My only major quibble with your analysis was the claim that Okafor "kills" Horford head-to-head.  In four career games, Horford has outscored Okafor twice, and has shot as good or better than Okafor in all four games.  In fact, Horford shot 61.1% against the Bobcats this year, which is a fairly impressive number.  I'd put them as even right now, but in the future, I expect Horford to become one of the elite power forwards in the NBA.  As you know, he's got a better-than-even shot of turning into Karl Malone.

Woops, I was tired when I wrote this so I might have overlooked the head-to-head #'s for Okafor and Horford. While Horford shot at a better %, Okafor led in points( 14.0 to 12.3 )  rebounds (14.5 to 10.5) and blocks (2.8 to 1.3 ) Plus Okafor has 0.8 turnovers to Horford's 3.0. While it's not exactly "murder" Okafor still is a better player head to head.

I'd still call it even.  The point differential is nothing (7 points over four games).  The rebounding difference is a little more significant, but I think that's offset somewhat by Okafor playing more minutes, and Okafor shooting a significantly higher percentage.  The turnovers are a concern, but let's chock that up to rookie nerves.

The other thing I like about that matchup is that Okafor's development has stagnated; he literally hasn't gotten any better (statistically) in four seasons.  Horford, on the other hand, is a rookie who still has some growth potential, and showed positive progression through his season.

The gap isn't a huge one, but if you offered me Okafor for Horford straight up, I'd turn you down.

[Roy Hobbs]

There has been a trade:

Portland trades: 12(9)

Atlanta trades: 13(12), 14(19), and 15(12)

[Roy Hobbs]

The Hawks have made yet another trade:

Hawks trade: 12th rounder (1)

Spurs trade: 12th rounder (18) and 14th rounder (17)

[BigAlTheFuture]

What is that Lucky17 four 12th rounders, now?