Author Topic: NBA Season 2024-25  (Read 2677948 times)

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Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2325 on: March 31, 2025, 02:18:27 PM »

Offline bdm860

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They had a graphic at the bottom of game screen, one of those ticker things, saying Russell Westbrook has now passed Oscar Robertson for #8 All-Time for assists. 9,892 for Russ. 9,887 for Oscar.

First reaction: I was shocked Oscar was as low as 8th. Now 9th. I remember Magic breaking his record. Then Stockton breaking Magic's.

Next question was: Who are all these other guys ahead of Oscar?

I remember J-Kidd did it. Mark Jackson. Chris Paul is probably there by now. Maybe Nash made it which he did. The guy I missed was LeBron James. I forgot about him.

Quote
1.   John Stockton*    15806
2.   Chris Paul    12449
3.   Jason Kidd*    12091
4.   LeBron James    11542
5.   Steve Nash*    10335
6.   Mark Jackson    10334
7.   Magic Johnson*    10141
8.   Russell Westbrook    9892
9.   Oscar Robertson*    9887
10.   Isiah Thomas*    9061

Now I remember LeBron getting that 40k points 10k assists 10k rebounds mark. Now he is at 42k points 11.5k assists 11.5k rebounds.

Next group down

Quote
11.   Gary Payton*    8966
12.   Andre Miller    8524
13.   James Harden    8232
14.   Rod Strickland    7987
15.   Rajon Rondo    7584
16.   Maurice Cheeks*    7392
17.   Lenny Wilkens*    7211
18.   Terry Porter    7160
19.   Kyle Lowry    7096
20.   Tim Hardaway*    7095

21.   Tony Parker*    7036
22.   Bob Cousy*    6955

Added in #21 and #22 to get Tony Parker and Cousy in there.

Harden is rocking up that list. If he can play another 2 years, he could crack the top 10 All-Time. Harden turns 36 years old this summer.

Anyways, heck of an achievement by Westbrook. He wasn't even a passing PG his first couple of years in the league. His improvement as a playmaker over his career has been incredible sight. I would never have guessed it after watching him as a 1st-2nd year player. The improvement in seeing passes, being willing to take risks. He creates so much.

I've brought this up years ago, but looking at the assist list again reminds me of it. Hypothetically, in a world without John Stockton, Mark Jackson would have retired the all time assist leader in 2004 and would have held that title for 5+ years until surpassed by Kidd on 11/25/09, ~5 months before Hall of Fame announcements were made for guys who retired in '04.

So in a world without Stockton, does Mark Jackson make the Hall for holding the record for all time assists for 5 years? In a sports world focused on stats, assists is a pretty big deal, not as big as points obviously, but in the next tier with rebounds, and above steals and blocks.

All the top 10 total point leaders are in the HoF or are locks to be when eligible.
All the top 10 total rebound leaders are in the HoF.
9 of 10 total assist leaders are in the HoF (#6 Jackson being the exclusion).
8 of 10 total block leaders are in the HoF (missing #5 Eaton and #10 Rollins).
All the top 10 total steal leaders are in the HoF or are locks to be when eligible.

Steals is where it's interesting, because Mo Cheeks retired in '93 with the steal record and held it for 2 1/2 years until broken by Stockton, and he wasn't elected to the HoF until 2018, but also had a much better resume, but steals is also a lesser stat, IMO. I don't think there's any other guy (in the more modern eras at least) who retired as an all time leader in a significant stat that's not in the HoF. In other sports, is there a guy who would retire an all time leader in a significant stat, that's not in their respective Hall (other than guys like Rose who are banned)?

Even in this hypothetical world without Stockton, I don't think Jackson should be in, but it's tough to wrap my head around it, having a guy be an all time leader (in a major stat!) and not be in the HoF. Ha, way too much time spent thinking about this hypothetical.

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Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2326 on: March 31, 2025, 05:31:49 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Okla. -- The Oklahoma Sooners have hired former Sooners player and Atlanta Hawks star Trae Young as assistant general manager for men's basketball.

He also has pledged to donate $1 million to the program, the school announced Monday.

Young, a four-time NBA All-Star, was an All-American for Oklahoma in 2017-18, his only season with the Sooners. He became the first player in NCAA Division I history to lead the nation in points per game (27.4) and assists per game (8.7). He was drafted No. 5 overall.

The 26-year-old Norman North High School graduate for years has worn his love for the city on his sleeve.

"As someone who grew up in Norman and played at the University of Oklahoma, stepping into the role of assistant GM for OU Basketball is a huge honor," Young said in a statement. "This program has such a rich history, which I am fortunate to have been and continue to be a part of. In my new role, my focus is on helping contribute to OU's winning culture, working alongside the coaching staff and front office to bring in the right players to help us compete and succeed at the highest level."

Young will assist with the evaluation of high school and transfer portal prospects, help negotiate player contracts and guide players in building their brands.


This seems like a potential conflict to me.

Can Jayson Tatum please become an Assistant GM at Duke?


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Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2327 on: March 31, 2025, 07:13:09 PM »

Offline Who

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So in a world without Stockton, does Mark Jackson make the Hall for holding the record for all time assists for 5 years? In a sports world focused on stats, assists is a pretty big deal, not as big as points obviously, but in the next tier with rebounds, and above steals and blocks.
Even in this hypothetical world without Stockton, I don't think Jackson should be in, but it's tough to wrap my head around it, having a guy be an all time leader (in a major stat!) and not be in the HoF. Ha, way too much time spent thinking about this hypothetical.

I was thinking to myself, was there any season that Mark Jackson was a top 10 PG?

He was close a number of years. I'd have to check but I expect I would have him just outside the top 10 when he was at Indy and LAC. His peak years.

Maybe his 2nd year in NYC when he made the All-Star Game ... just 1 season out of a 17 year career?

It was so strange to see him go from that career year to having his playing time slashed over the next few years because the coaches all wanted defensive guards instead of a passer like Mark. He didn't get back to peak form until he left NYC for the Clippers. Man, that team was fun with him and Danny Manning. Ron Harper too.

Aww, it would be tough to put him in the HoF. And yet those career totals are persuasive. It would be hard to pass on a guy who was the All Time assist leader. I like it. Great hypothetical.

------------------------------------

If Mark Eaton was the All-Time Blocked Shots leader, I may have voted for him to be in the HoF. That would be tough to overlook. And like you said, assists is much more important category to most people than blocks are. Points, then assists & rebounds, then steals & blocks. Eaton does have some DPOYs though.

Maybe Manute Bol would be a better comparison for Mark Jackson. Would I vote for Manute Bol to be in the HoF if he was the All Time Leader in Blocks? Heck no!!!

--------------------------

It would be interesting to know if there are some people pushing for Mark Jackson for the HoF. I wouldn't be shocked if there was. Might be a small following. But those career numbers are compelling and a lot of people loved watching him play.

A lot of Knicks fans still love Mark Jackson are, to this day, angry that Riley traded him away. That believe they would have beaten the Bulls in 1993 if they had of kept Mark Jackson and X-Man instead of going with Doc & Charles Smith. And Knicks fans are .... there are a lot of Knicks fans. NYC is a big place.

Steals is where it's interesting, because Mo Cheeks retired in '93 with the steal record and held it for 2 1/2 years until broken by Stockton, and he wasn't elected to the HoF until 2018, but also had a much better resume, but steals is also a lesser stat, IMO.

Side note

Mo Cheeks was both #1 in steals and Top 5 in assists when he retired. I love that guy. One of my favourite players of the 80s. He is to my mind the prototypical PG. How you want your PG to play. Tough D. Set up the team. Keep everyone involved. Be a leader. Score a bit when you need to. Hit open shots. Get easy transition hoops.

Other folks see Stockton as the prototypical but I think he was too much of a freak. Of an outlier. For other guys to copy / imitate / replicate. Mo Cheeks is the model for me of what a PG should be. Of what young PGs should look to. With Mike Conley being this generation's Mo Cheeks.

I was happy when Mo Cheeks got to the HoF. Long overdue.

Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2328 on: March 31, 2025, 08:43:51 PM »

Offline trickybilly

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Just watching OKC on league pass.

They look scary. But we will only need to sneak one on their court if we make the Finals..
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Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2329 on: March 31, 2025, 08:46:05 PM »

Offline Phantom255x

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Just watching OKC on league pass.

They look scary. But we will only need to sneak one on their court if we make the Finals..

That would also be really tough lol. OKC has one of the best homecourt environments along with Utah (when they were in the playoffs with Mitchell/Gobert)



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Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2330 on: March 31, 2025, 09:33:02 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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That one ugly three might turn things for PP. 

Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2331 on: March 31, 2025, 09:53:27 PM »

Offline Phantom255x

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Grizzlies now just 0.5 up on the Warriors for the 5 seed, and both teams play each other tomorrow. I think there's a very real chance it's Warriors vs. Lakers first round. Butler/Curry/Draymond vs. Lebron/Doncic/Reaves
"Tough times never last, but tough people do." - Robert H. Schuller

Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2332 on: April 01, 2025, 12:24:52 AM »

Offline Phantom255x

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Not sure what Ime is doing tonight. His rotations and decisions have been bad. Why is Green benched late in this game??? Meanwhile FVV is selling big time too.
"Tough times never last, but tough people do." - Robert H. Schuller

Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2333 on: April 01, 2025, 07:53:51 AM »

Offline Birdman

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Grizzlies now just 0.5 up on the Warriors for the 5 seed, and both teams play each other tomorrow. I think there's a very real chance it's Warriors vs. Lakers first round. Butler/Curry/Draymond vs. Lebron/Doncic/Reaves
I hope! Warriors sweep
C/PF-Horford, Baynes, Noel, Theis, Morris,
SF/SG- Tatum, Brown, Hayward, Smart, Semi, Clark
PG- Irving, Rozier, Larkin

Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2334 on: April 01, 2025, 08:13:55 AM »

Offline Vermont Green

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Okla. -- The Oklahoma Sooners have hired former Sooners player and Atlanta Hawks star Trae Young as assistant general manager for men's basketball.

He also has pledged to donate $1 million to the program, the school announced Monday.

Young, a four-time NBA All-Star, was an All-American for Oklahoma in 2017-18, his only season with the Sooners. He became the first player in NCAA Division I history to lead the nation in points per game (27.4) and assists per game (8.7). He was drafted No. 5 overall.

The 26-year-old Norman North High School graduate for years has worn his love for the city on his sleeve.

"As someone who grew up in Norman and played at the University of Oklahoma, stepping into the role of assistant GM for OU Basketball is a huge honor," Young said in a statement. "This program has such a rich history, which I am fortunate to have been and continue to be a part of. In my new role, my focus is on helping contribute to OU's winning culture, working alongside the coaching staff and front office to bring in the right players to help us compete and succeed at the highest level."

Young will assist with the evaluation of high school and transfer portal prospects, help negotiate player contracts and guide players in building their brands.


This seems like a potential conflict to me.

Can Jayson Tatum please become an Assistant GM at Duke?

I agree that something doesn't feel right with this, but I think this is just a rich alum giving money to the college so they can bid higher on players.  Not sure this is any different than any other rich alum.  It will be interesting to see how this plays out.  Seems like this is just what comes with the territory in the new world of paid college athletes.

Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2335 on: April 01, 2025, 09:57:07 AM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

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Quote
Okla. -- The Oklahoma Sooners have hired former Sooners player and Atlanta Hawks star Trae Young as assistant general manager for men's basketball.

He also has pledged to donate $1 million to the program, the school announced Monday.

Young, a four-time NBA All-Star, was an All-American for Oklahoma in 2017-18, his only season with the Sooners. He became the first player in NCAA Division I history to lead the nation in points per game (27.4) and assists per game (8.7). He was drafted No. 5 overall.

The 26-year-old Norman North High School graduate for years has worn his love for the city on his sleeve.

"As someone who grew up in Norman and played at the University of Oklahoma, stepping into the role of assistant GM for OU Basketball is a huge honor," Young said in a statement. "This program has such a rich history, which I am fortunate to have been and continue to be a part of. In my new role, my focus is on helping contribute to OU's winning culture, working alongside the coaching staff and front office to bring in the right players to help us compete and succeed at the highest level."

Young will assist with the evaluation of high school and transfer portal prospects, help negotiate player contracts and guide players in building their brands.


This seems like a potential conflict to me.

Can Jayson Tatum please become an Assistant GM at Duke?

I agree that something doesn't feel right with this, but I think this is just a rich alum giving money to the college so they can bid higher on players.  Not sure this is any different than any other rich alum.  It will be interesting to see how this plays out.  Seems like this is just what comes with the territory in the new world of paid college athletes.

Steph Curry just did the same thing at Davidson. It's becoming more common with the NIL.

Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2336 on: April 01, 2025, 12:01:45 PM »

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Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2337 on: April 01, 2025, 08:39:55 PM »

Offline Phantom255x

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Warriors blitzing the Grizz and about to move into the 5th seed out West
"Tough times never last, but tough people do." - Robert H. Schuller

Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2338 on: April 01, 2025, 09:15:38 PM »

Offline SparzWizard

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Warriors blitzing the Grizz and about to move into the 5th seed out West

I know the Lakers has the better part of the LAL/GSW series, but I feel with the addition of Butler it won't be a cakewalk for them. Though unfortunately, I think the Lakers will clear out the Warriors in 6 or 7 due to sheer offensive talent alone aka their Big 3.

A lot better that the Warriors face Lakers than the dysfunctional Grizzlies.


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Re: NBA Season 2024-25
« Reply #2339 on: April 01, 2025, 09:38:30 PM »

Offline Phantom255x

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Warriors blitzing the Grizz and about to move into the 5th seed out West

I know the Lakers has the better part of the LAL/GSW series, but I feel with the addition of Butler it won't be a cakewalk for them. Though unfortunately, I think the Lakers will clear out the Warriors in 6 or 7 due to sheer offensive talent alone aka their Big 3.

A lot better that the Warriors face Lakers than the dysfunctional Grizzlies.

Warriors can at least give them a fight. Right now I don't think Memphis is doing any damage lol, and they just recently fired the coach (great timing).
"Tough times never last, but tough people do." - Robert H. Schuller