Author Topic: Fire Joe! ... or critique Joe ... or defend Joe... or worry about Joe's coaching  (Read 783592 times)

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Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1110 on: May 31, 2023, 07:31:41 AM »

Offline Surferdad

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https://twitter.com/john_zannis/status/1663571375292858370?s=46&t=lGU0TGXtwjkuVuoin6WTNw

Quote
WOW. Shams reporting that Joe Mazzulla has 3 years and $14 million coming to him on his extension. Hard to see Wyc eating that.

Surely Shams is wrong on this. No way we gave a new coach with that little experience this much money. If so, Brad and Wyc need to hit the road, too.

I imagine this is wrong.
Shams has to be off here. That would be over twice the minimum, right? 2 and a bit times the minimum for a totally unproven coach? Fully guaranteed??
Doubtful that it's all guaranteed.

Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1111 on: May 31, 2023, 08:00:57 AM »

Offline ozgod

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I was unimpressed with Joe's post game interview after the thrashing. I sympathize with any coach or player who has to front the media after a shattering loss that just ended a season, but Joe doesn't do himself any favors with his condescending attitude to the media. Bud had to front the media too after being eliminated, after his brother died no less, and he handled it with class. This comes with the job. His worst traits (stubborn, obstinate, unwilling to accept responsibility for mistakes) all came to the fore here. Saying the defense was good? Come on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vglmovWYAJA
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Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1112 on: May 31, 2023, 08:43:42 AM »

Online Roy H.

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I was unimpressed with Joe's post game interview after the thrashing. I sympathize with any coach or player who has to front the media after a shattering loss that just ended a season, but Joe doesn't do himself any favors with his condescending attitude to the media. Bud had to front the media too after being eliminated, after his brother died no less, and he handled it with class. This comes with the job. His worst traits (stubborn, obstinate, unwilling to accept responsibility for mistakes) all came to the fore here. Saying the defense was good? Come on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vglmovWYAJA

Yeah, it's interesting to me.  Joe, even before the elevation to head coach, was a rising star.  His personality makes you wonder how he made it through a job interview.  There's got to be a really sharp, insightful side of him that we just haven't seen. 



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Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1113 on: May 31, 2023, 09:01:08 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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One thing about Joe, he didn't throw the players under the bus.   He just repeated we need more threes, make more threes.

Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1114 on: May 31, 2023, 10:30:14 AM »

Offline jpotter33

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I was unimpressed with Joe's post game interview after the thrashing. I sympathize with any coach or player who has to front the media after a shattering loss that just ended a season, but Joe doesn't do himself any favors with his condescending attitude to the media. Bud had to front the media too after being eliminated, after his brother died no less, and he handled it with class. This comes with the job. His worst traits (stubborn, obstinate, unwilling to accept responsibility for mistakes) all came to the fore here. Saying the defense was good? Come on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vglmovWYAJA

Agreed. The problem is this is his norm. He’s literally always like this, and the media regularly takes notice.

It’d be easier to be more sympathetic and give him the benefit of the doubt given the situation he was thrown into, but his smug, arrogant attitude makes it easy to hate him.

Just a downright mess we hired this guy.
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Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1115 on: May 31, 2023, 10:31:12 AM »

Offline jpotter33

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https://twitter.com/john_zannis/status/1663571375292858370?s=46&t=lGU0TGXtwjkuVuoin6WTNw

Quote
WOW. Shams reporting that Joe Mazzulla has 3 years and $14 million coming to him on his extension. Hard to see Wyc eating that.

Surely Shams is wrong on this. No way we gave a new coach with that little experience this much money. If so, Brad and Wyc need to hit the road, too.

I imagine this is wrong.
Shams has to be off here. That would be over twice the minimum, right? 2 and a bit times the minimum for a totally unproven coach? Fully guaranteed??
Doubtful that it's all guaranteed.

https://nesn.com/2023/05/joe-mazzulla-contract-what-celtics-coach-reportedly-has-left-on-deal/

Appears to be fully guaranteed.

Shams isn’t perfect, but more often than not he’s right on this stuff. What a ridiculous situation if true.
Recovering Joe Skeptic, but inching towards a relapse.

Check out my Youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/@Yakin_Bassin/shorts

Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1116 on: May 31, 2023, 10:37:10 AM »

Offline Kernewek

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I’d be surprised if it wasn’t guaranteed.

I’m also routinely impressed by the fact that some people who take such pains to disparage the real media being upset when someone treats the sports media similarly.
"...unceasingly we are bombarded with pseudo-realities manufactured by very sophisticated people using very sophisticated electronic mechanisms. I do not distrust their motives; I distrust their power. They have a lot of it."

Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1117 on: May 31, 2023, 11:30:32 AM »

Online Roy H.

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https://twitter.com/john_zannis/status/1663571375292858370?s=46&t=lGU0TGXtwjkuVuoin6WTNw

Quote
WOW. Shams reporting that Joe Mazzulla has 3 years and $14 million coming to him on his extension. Hard to see Wyc eating that.

Surely Shams is wrong on this. No way we gave a new coach with that little experience this much money. If so, Brad and Wyc need to hit the road, too.

I imagine this is wrong.
Shams has to be off here. That would be over twice the minimum, right? 2 and a bit times the minimum for a totally unproven coach? Fully guaranteed??
Doubtful that it's all guaranteed.

https://nesn.com/2023/05/joe-mazzulla-contract-what-celtics-coach-reportedly-has-left-on-deal/

Appears to be fully guaranteed.

Shams isn’t perfect, but more often than not he’s right on this stuff. What a ridiculous situation if true.

I don't know if Shams is correct or incorrect, but you're right that his reporting is pretty explicit.  From the original article:

Quote
According to league sources, Mazzulla has $14 million guaranteed on his deal, which spans over the next three years.

There's not a lot of ambiguity there.  (Nitpicking here:  I guess it's ambiguous if "$14 million guaranteed on his deal" means "$14 million left guaranteed on his deal", i.e., did the $14 million include this past season or not.  But I presume it means that over the next three years, Joe is guaranteed $14 million.)


I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER——— AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!@ 34 minutes

Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1118 on: May 31, 2023, 11:44:48 AM »

Offline angryguy77

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Would it really shock anyone that the same FO who put a kid in charge of a contender would also given him a guaranteed contract?
Brad most likely thought he had a hidden gem in Joe and wanted to lock him up.

Brad and Joe are both disasters.
Back to wanting Joe fired.

Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1119 on: May 31, 2023, 11:48:44 AM »

Online Vermont Green

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I didn't hear the exact statements by Shams but it certainly sounds like he is signed for 3 more years at $14M, guaranteed.  I am not all that worried about the contract and I suspect the Celtics aren't either.  I don't think this will prevent them from making a coaching change.

To me, it is about whether Mazzulla can get the team to buy in.  There was reporting of owners and players shouting at each other and that the players "never got over" the firing of Udoka.  It is hard for the new coach to get buy in if the players are still wishing they had their old coach.  To me, this is the critical issue.

The players need to get over Udoka, he is not coming back.  But it may be easier for them to get over this if they have a more established coach, or maybe it won't.  It is going to be really tough on the team if every time there is a rough stretch, the players start thinking, Udoka was a better coach, why did they fire him.

In the end, I have some doubts about Mazzulla as a coach.  Not so much over Xs and Os (although I have some doubts with that) but more over buy in.  It may be no fault of his but the Udoka shadow may make it impossible for Mazzulla to succeed.

As to the schemes, I don't think the team's offensive schemes are sophisticated enough.  There needs to be more action off the ball.  More player movement off the ball.  More cutting, more off ball screens.  I acknowledge that it can take more than 1 season for that level of offensive scheme to start working but I just did not see it.  Not with this team and also not with Udoka either.

Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1120 on: May 31, 2023, 11:54:53 AM »

Offline BringToughnessBack

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Wow, 3 more years, 14M guaranteed. So essentially, we will waste the initial prime years of Brown(if resigned) and Tatum with an offense first philosophy with no defense or change in anything.

Wonderful. The GM of the Warriors is no longer employed. How about we redo everything from the top down and beginning with a new GM who doesn't dish out ridiculous coach contracts to an unproven guy. This is not Riley teaching Spoe here as well. If Bird was running our team, maybe Joe could be taught a bit more by a legit mentor but he is not.

Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1121 on: May 31, 2023, 12:29:27 PM »

Offline GreenBoomer

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If you're not replacing gm and coach, might as well trade them all and rebuild. Not winning anything like this. Give these players a chance  to win somewhere else.

Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1122 on: May 31, 2023, 12:36:11 PM »

Offline Ed Monix

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According to the Boston Globe, the Celtics are losing three assistants to Udoka.

Ben Sullivan, Aaron Miles & Mike Moser.
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Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1123 on: May 31, 2023, 12:45:58 PM »

Online Roy H.

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According to the Boston Globe, the Celtics are losing three assistants to Udoka.

Ben Sullivan, Aaron Miles & Mike Moser.

Interesting.  I guess those assistants know which coach has more of a long-term future.


I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER——— AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!@ 34 minutes

Re: Fire Joe!
« Reply #1124 on: May 31, 2023, 01:08:26 PM »

Offline GreenBoomer

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Maybe Ima takes Joe too