Chuck & Shaq Are Right: Jayson & Jaylen Do Not Play Together, They Take Turns

[tenn_smoothie]

I made this exact comment during the last Nets game thread  .......... and Brown wasn't even playing.

The Celts offense mostly consists of the perimeter guys tossing the ball back and forth around the 3-point line and taking turns going 1-on-1. Sometimes they will penetrate and twist themselves into a pretzel throwing a pass to another shooter, who tonite was often Marcus Smart, producing a 1-for-10 three-point gem.

[RockinRyA]

This team needs a facilitator. Something like Al Horford a few years ago. I also think with Hayward out we lost the last bit of defensive versatility we had the last few seasons.

Im thinking something along this

Starting 5- Williams(healthy), Switchable wing (Like Siakam perhaps?),Tatum, Brown, Smart
Bench-Romeo, Thompson, Fournier, Nesmith, Pritchard+maybe one more 3&D vet

No, i dont have an idea how we are going to construct that kind of roster as I havent checked our salary situations and we dont know who is available and for what price. Im just saying with this I think we have a more balanced team that would fit well together.

Also tenn sorry but our offense isnt like that. We run different plays, like the Horns set for example. What you see is when defense disrupts the offense and takes away the options due to several reasons- for example good defense, or wrong personnel. it is then when it turns into one on one.

[Celtics4ever]

How many times is Chuck right though?   Agreeing with Barkley is a crap shoot most of the time.

[gouki88]

How many times is Chuck right though?   Agreeing with Barkley is a crap shoot most of the time.

Shaq might be even worse. His sensitive ego gets in the way of him being worth taking seriously.

[td450]

Who does Tatum have chemistry with? No one. He plays off no one. He doesn't make it easier for anyone on the team to score consistently.

[td450]

Jaylen is never going to be a number one guy, and clearly Tatum is poised to be the next Durant. Whenever these two play together, they just take turns and do not exactly jive like MJ/Pippen or LeBron/Wade. We gotta make a change. Really think we gotta move Brown for another young all-star on their second contract (KAT), or a prospective all-star still on their rookie contract (maybe a top two pick this year if a team is interested in taking Brown instead of drafting a top guy).

Thoughts on whether Jayson and Jaylen play together, whether we should move one of the two and, if so, who we should move them for.

I am consistently shocked that fans still believe Jaylen couldn't be a #1 option, even though he had better numbers than Tatum and scored just under 25 ppg. I think he could easily average 30 ppg if he swapped roles with Tatum.

[Kiorrik]

Jaylen is never going to be a number one guy, and clearly Tatum is poised to be the next Durant. Whenever these two play together, they just take turns and do not exactly jive like MJ/Pippen or LeBron/Wade. We gotta make a change. Really think we gotta move Brown for another young all-star on their second contract (KAT), or a prospective all-star still on their rookie contract (maybe a top two pick this year if a team is interested in taking Brown instead of drafting a top guy).

Thoughts on whether Jayson and Jaylen play together, whether we should move one of the two and, if so, who we should move them for.

I am consistently shocked that fans still believe Jaylen couldn't be a #1 option, even though he had better numbers than Tatum and scored just under 25 ppg. I think he could easily average 30 ppg if he swapped roles with Tatum.

Agreed. He's smart enough to adjust his game to whatever his role is. And he's GOOD at that.

[Kuberski33]

This team misses Hayward in the worst way.  Tatum, Jaylen, Smart, Kemba - all are shoot first, pass 2nd. They need to do something to change that.  Tatum is developing into a better passer but he can't be the only one who gives the ball up.

[Kiorrik]

This team misses Hayward in the worst way.  Tatum, Jaylen, Smart, Kemba - all are shoot first, pass 2nd. They need to do something to change that.  Tatum is developing into a better passer but he can't be the only one who gives the ball up.

If I were any good at quickly finding them, I'd look into statistics as to how great players progressed, regarding assists and the like.

I'm super curious if this might be an experience thing.

.edit: because I agree, and think you're 100% right.

[Tr1boy]

Who does Tatum have chemistry with? No one. He plays off no one. He doesn't make it easier for anyone on the team to score consistently.

There was a stretch at the start of that 7 game winning streak, he was trying to do it

Make the conscious effort to create for others

But whenever he gets a good matchup/smaller player.  His mindset seems like "you cant stop me"

Brown has built this habit as well

And both are strong scorers. But without some other guys getting easy looks... it becomes much harder to win.

Pritchard is an example. Whats the point of Brad even putting him out there??

Yesterday Tatum didnt pass it to him ... not even once. Not sure if they dont like each other or... but Brad has to create plays out of timeout to specifically get him a shot.

A 41 percent 3 pt shooter, wasted. While Smart goes 1-10 etc.

Is that smart basketball? 

[Somebody]

I just don't see anything that backs this up. Or rather, anything that can't be remedied by a good offensive philosophy. I think it's much more a function of our offence that we often have one on one isolation with wings in the corner than it is those two not having chemistry.

I saw no chemistry whatsoever between the two in the first and potentially only season where they were the top two players by a wide margin. It just doesn’t feel like it’s working. The offense never moved like this in prior years, and the defense took a dive as guys seemed more focus on offensive stats. It feels like maybe Jaylen wants this to be his team, but it’s clearly Tatum’s and he’s being nice about it. It feels like Durant/Westbrook back in the day, frankly. We’d hum better with Tatum/Hayward as our top two than we did with Tatum/Brown. Really believe Tatum/Beal may be our way out of this mess.

The chemistry between them is non-existent

None

But at least they are chummy

I read somewhere that Brown gave feedback to Ainge to take Tatum in the draft. 

Both Jays are not natural passers. They are learning. But love to score ... they need learn how to make the extra passes vs take over balance.  Thats the next step

Both can learn the bounce pass through traffic. Touch passes.  Would also love to see Tatum incorporate C&S... rarely in ready position to do it.  For both Brown and Tatum... drive, upfake and draw fouls.  Pierce style. Dont be afraid of contact.

I would like to see more Jordan for Jaylen - I think he can really emulate Jordan's hybrid on/off-ball game.

Part of good passing (even for natural passers) is having teammates that cut at the right time.

And part of that is about hiring folks that know instinctively when to cut, coaching current folks to cut and, well, chemistry that can develop over time.

This is a huge part of why I wanna see this very cast return next season. I reckon with a year's worth of playing and practicing together, they'll do just fine!

Hopefully the lad who trains us next season will be one who can have our players practice playing like this

YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES

[LilRip]

I disagree with this take. I think Tatum and Brown can play with each other because great players tend to be able to play together.

However, I agree with the observation. It did seem like we ran a lot of your turn-my turn which makes me think the flaw is the system or that the coaching staff was unable to instill the game plan in the players.

[slamtheking]

I disagree with this take. I think Tatum and Brown can play with each other because great players tend to be able to play together.

However, I agree with the observation. It did seem like we ran a lot of your turn-my turn which makes me think the flaw is the system or that the coaching staff was unable to instill the game plan in the players.

this.

I think the issue is more with the offensive scheme the coaching staff is implementing than the players.

[boscel33]

There should be no issue here, their game plays off of each other as a natural inside/outside one.  Both are good driving and both are good outside.

[Goldstar88]

Jaylen is never going to be a number one guy, and clearly Tatum is poised to be the next Durant. Whenever these two play together, they just take turns and do not exactly jive like MJ/Pippen or LeBron/Wade. We gotta make a change. Really think we gotta move Brown for another young all-star on their second contract (KAT), or a prospective all-star still on their rookie contract (maybe a top two pick this year if a team is interested in taking Brown instead of drafting a top guy).

Thoughts on whether Jayson and Jaylen play together, whether we should move one of the two and, if so, who we should move them for.

They may take turns playing ISO ball, but perhaps it’s because the team doesn’t have a real point guard to run the offense and get guys open looks. If we had CP3 instead of Kemba this thread doesn’t exist.