Jrue Holiday to Bucks

[tazzmaniac]

Per Bobby Marks:
New Orleans receives
2020 1st (via IND)
2024 right to swap
2025 1st unprotected
2026 right to swap
2027 1st unprotected

Also the Bucks had to give Cleveland a 2nd round pick in order to get them to remove the protection on the 2022 1st the Bucks traded them. 

[Roy H.]

I feel like its worth saying again and again that the Bucks traded three first round picks and two pick swaps for Holliday.

The Pelicans have absolutely played their roster right over the last few years to extract the most possible value.

If those picks are all 30th in the draft, though, it’s great value.  Time will tell.

[tstorey_97]

You guys know more about these guys than I. I offer two broad observations.

Bucks make correct move to "keep" Giannis and prepare for title run.

Pels continue perpetual rebuild.

"Lots of draft picks" doesn't mean much....lots of "luck" means a lot.

[Tr1boy]

Per Bobby Marks:
New Orleans receives
2020 1st (via IND)
2024 right to swap
2025 1st unprotected
2026 right to swap
2027 1st unprotected

Also the Bucks had to give Cleveland a 2nd round pick in order to get them to remove the protection on the 2022 1st the Bucks traded them.

That is Danny Ainge type level robbery.  That is crazy. For a player that could walk as a FA after next season

[BitterJim]

Per Bobby Marks:
New Orleans receives
2020 1st (via IND)
2024 right to swap
2025 1st unprotected
2026 right to swap
2027 1st unprotected

Also the Bucks had to give Cleveland a 2nd round pick in order to get them to remove the protection on the 2022 1st the Bucks traded them.

The picks being that far out is scary. It's one thing to trade away picks for the next 5 years if you have Giannis signing a supermax extension, but that 2027 pick would be the year after said extension would end. There's a lot of risk here for the Bucks.

If it gets Giannis to sign an extension then I'll stand by it being the right move, but... it's Jrue Holiday, not James Harden. I know Bledsoe has been awful in the playoffs, but is Jrue really enough of an upgrade to take on all this risk?

[tazzmaniac]

Per Bobby Marks:
New Orleans receives
2020 1st (via IND)
2024 right to swap
2025 1st unprotected
2026 right to swap
2027 1st unprotected

Also the Bucks had to give Cleveland a 2nd round pick in order to get them to remove the protection on the 2022 1st the Bucks traded them.

That is Danny Ainge type level robbery.  That is crazy. For a player that could walk as a FA after next season

Not if it gets Giannis to sign his supermax.  Clips gave up a ton to get PG in order to sign Kawhi. 

[Jvalin]

Per Bobby Marks:
New Orleans receives
2020 1st (via IND)
2024 right to swap
2025 1st unprotected
2026 right to swap
2027 1st unprotected

Also the Bucks had to give Cleveland a 2nd round pick in order to get them to remove the protection on the 2022 1st the Bucks traded them.

That is Danny Ainge type level robbery.  That is crazy. For a player that could walk as a FA after next season

Not if it gets Giannis to sign his supermax.  Clips gave up a ton to get PG in order to sign Kawhi.

Apples and oranges here.

Kawhi would sign for the Clips only if they traded for George. Unless Giannis informed the Bucks he would stay only if they traded for Jrue (which seems unlikely), imo this is a panic move from the Bucks. They got fleeced big time.

[hwangjini_1]

Per Bobby Marks:
New Orleans receives
2020 1st (via IND)
2024 right to swap
2025 1st unprotected
2026 right to swap
2027 1st unprotected

Also the Bucks had to give Cleveland a 2nd round pick in order to get them to remove the protection on the 2022 1st the Bucks traded them.

That is Danny Ainge type level robbery.  That is crazy. For a player that could walk as a FA after next season

i am guessing that ainge must of offered a pretty impressive package for holiday if the bucks felt obligated to give up this many draft picks.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

Per Bobby Marks:
New Orleans receives
2020 1st (via IND)
2024 right to swap
2025 1st unprotected
2026 right to swap
2027 1st unprotected

Also the Bucks had to give Cleveland a 2nd round pick in order to get them to remove the protection on the 2022 1st the Bucks traded them.

That is Danny Ainge type level robbery.  That is crazy. For a player that could walk as a FA after next season

i am guessing that ainge must of offered a pretty impressive package for holiday if the bucks felt obligated to give up this many draft picks.

This is a really interesting unseen part of the job of GMs in the NBA. Ainge has already significantly hurt one of the Cs primary rivals in the East-the Sixers. If he made a bid to the Pelicans in order to give them leverage against the Bucks, that hurts them too long-term (maybe short-term too. They won't be a very deep team).

[Roy H.]

Per Bobby Marks:
New Orleans receives
2020 1st (via IND)
2024 right to swap
2025 1st unprotected
2026 right to swap
2027 1st unprotected

Also the Bucks had to give Cleveland a 2nd round pick in order to get them to remove the protection on the 2022 1st the Bucks traded them.

That is Danny Ainge type level robbery.  That is crazy. For a player that could walk as a FA after next season

Not if it gets Giannis to sign his supermax.  Clips gave up a ton to get PG in order to sign Kawhi.

Apples and oranges here.

Kawhi would sign for the Clips only if they traded for George. Unless Giannis informed the Bucks he would stay only if they traded for Jrue (which seems unlikely), imo this is a panic move from the Bucks. They got fleeced big time.

He met with the Bucks and told them he needed to upgrade the roster.  We have no idea what specifics were said, but the implication was that if the Bucks did not upgrade, he would keep his free agency options open.

[tazzmaniac]

Per Bobby Marks:
New Orleans receives
2020 1st (via IND)
2024 right to swap
2025 1st unprotected
2026 right to swap
2027 1st unprotected

Also the Bucks had to give Cleveland a 2nd round pick in order to get them to remove the protection on the 2022 1st the Bucks traded them.

That is Danny Ainge type level robbery.  That is crazy. For a player that could walk as a FA after next season

Not if it gets Giannis to sign his supermax.  Clips gave up a ton to get PG in order to sign Kawhi.

Apples and oranges here.

Kawhi would sign for the Clips only if they traded for George. Unless Giannis informed the Bucks he would stay only if they traded for Jrue (which seems unlikely), imo this is a panic move from the Bucks. They got fleeced big time.

He met with the Bucks and told them he needed to upgrade the roster.  We have no idea what specifics were said, but the implication was that if the Bucks did not upgrade, he would keep his free agency options open.

His quotes to a Swedish paper are certainly inline with the Bucks need to make some significant moves. 

Aftonbladet, a daily newspaper based in Stockholm, reported in this story that Giannis said: "There are a lot of rumors. Everyone has opinions. But at the end of the day, I will do what is best for my family. I do not see why I could not be in Milwaukee for several years. As long as Milwaukee and I are on the same page when it comes to being one of the best teams in the league and winning championships, that's fine. When it changes, it will not be good. It's easy, I want to be a winner. I do not care about the money. My family is fine and I can take care of my children and grandchildren so that's not the most important thing right now, it's winning. As long as we can win and create a winning culture, it will be good."

Aftonbladet then asked if his plan was to stay in Milwaukee and maybe sign an extension, and reported that Giannis said: “I do not know what the plan is. It depends on what decisions they make. If they make the right decision, I'll be there for many years. If they do not, we'll see. The NBA is business and we take it day by day. Hopefully we can succeed together."

https://madison.com/wsj/sports/basketball/professional/report-giannis-antetokounmpo-tells-swedish-paper-that-future-with-bucks-depends-on-what-decisions-they/article_f31c6ea5-3f3d-51da-8aae-8504802afabf.html

[Redz]

Pelicans will be stacked in 2030

[tazzmaniac]

Agree with others that I hate the Jrue deal for MIL on the surface - Bledsoe/Hill for Jrue is almost a wash for an expiring Jrue w/o the 1sts, but, yeah, so so worth it if it gets Giannis to re-sign. You literally do whatever it takes to keep Giannis.

The one that really hurts as a Cs fan is the Bogdan trade. DD is a decent player, but it MIL hit this one out of the park - even got him on a good deal, too. I suppose the fact that we as a FA made a difference here, but it really makes these deals even out a bit. The one good part is it likely means SAC holds on to Hield and doesn't trade him to PHI for Horford/pieces.

Holiday is significantly better than Bledsoe and Hill and Hill's shooting is easily replaced. 

So assuming they bring back their bench free agents from last year (or most of them anyway)

Starters - Holiday, Middleton, Bogdanovic, Giannis, Lopez
Bench - Justin James, Marvin Williams, Pat Connaughton, Sterling Brown, Kyle Korver, Frank Mason, Thanasis Antetokounmpo, Dragan Bender

Add a couple of ring chasing vets and their team rounds out pretty well.  Not as deep as last year, but a much better starting 5 replacing Bledsoe and Matthews with Holiday and Bogdanovic and they still have some solid bench guys in Williams, Connaughton, Brown, and Korver.

Calling those guys "solid bench guys" is really stretching it. Korver and Williams are on retirement's doorstep, and Connaughton and Brown shouldn't even be in the rotation of a good team. This team is it's starting 5, and nothing more. Even so, that may very well work because of how good that starting 5 is.

I had forgotten Williams retired. Seems odd, he is just 33 and played fairly well for the Bucks last year. 

Korver is one of the top 5 greatest shooters in history.  He is still that good as a shooter.  He played 16 mpg last year.  He can easily do that again, making him a very valuable bench player, especially situationally.  Connaughton is a very solid well rounded bench guard.  Doesn't do anything elite, but doesn't hurt you either.  Good for 20 mpg a game, where he might not win you a game, but he won't lose you a game either, and can fill in as a starter here and there.  Brown will be in his 4th year, has shown some flashes and has been a consistent rotation player for the Bucks.  Not great, but certainly in the vein of all kinds of bench players. 

Not a great bench, but guys that will be good enough if they can add 1 or 2 guys with the MLE that are a bit better.  A guy like Rondo would be great on their bench, for example.

Brown wasn't even in the rotation come playoff time, and relying on grandpa Korver to be a consistent bench player isn't very smart. Sorry, not buying that this bench is anything but bad at the moment.

Definitely a weak bench.  Per Bobby Marks, the Bogdanovic trade hard caps the Bucks so that will limit what they can do with their bench this season. 

[Rikibellevie]

Maybe Bogdanovic will be the 6th men and they could play Sterling Brown alonside Jrue to have a very athletic pair of guards. They still have to pick an experienced big who come for min to chase a ring and a wing. Next year East will be strongest than almost ever with Bucks and Nets who look elite now and us, Raptors, Heat and Philly beeing very serious team also...

I understand they go all in to covince Giannis to stay. But the last big deals top teams made with a lot of draft picks to overpay because you are in a win now mode turned very bad... I mean after one year the Westbrook deal to Houston looks catastrophic and our 2013 trade with Nets look also hoorible for them now. If Giannis leave this picks will look a massive overpay until next year. OKC and more NO have all the tools now to build a contender sooner (3-4years from now) or l ater.

[Moranis]

I will say again, there is no way Milwaukee does the Holiday trade with that draft capital without knowing that Giannis will sign the extension this year.  None at all.  You don't make that trade without 100% knowing Giannis is going to re-sign.