Robert Williams (Merged Threads)

[DefenseWinsChamps]

I don't see anything racist.  He's showing legitimate warning signs of substance abuse (at worst) and extreme dysfunction and immaturity (at best).  The team should get him the help he needs before he flames out of the league or becomes Lenny Bias.

I honestly can't believe this sentiment. You have no idea what is going on, but you are making huge assumptions.

Missing a plan is not extreme dysfunction. Invoking the name of Lenny Bias is ridiculous. Flaming out of the league is pretty far away. There is no evidence of substance abuse.

Woah woah woah. As I think the original poster who said he should be tested I agree with all of this. I would point out half the reason for testing is to confirm the guy is NOT on drugs, and the other part is to get him help if he is.

I would think the Celtics, as his employer, would want to know, but not for the purpose of destroying his career before it has begun. Destroying his career is his choice, not ours.

The testing is meant far more as info gathering and a wake up call. Not some public execution

I get that your intention is not aggressive, but the act of making a guy take a drug test because he was late for a plane, especially if he is innocent, is extremely insulting. It may sour the rest of the working relationship.

[JHTruth]

Ainge:

“Old news, we’re moving on,” said the Celtics president, though when pressed on how the team intends to deal with a player who slid in the draft due to questions about his work ethic and maturity, he added, “We’re trying to provide structure. We’ll handle things about this internally.”

Asked about his discussion with Williams this morning, Ainge said, “I’m talking to everybody.”

Ainge was anxious to move on from the issue.

“It was an accurate story yesterday and we’re moving on – today’s a new day,” he said. “These things become huge stories and they’re just not.


“A lot of people out there need to grow up, and there are consequences for their actions.”

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/celtics/celtics_insider/2018/07/ainge_on_wayward_williams_were_trying_to_provide_structure_0

[PickNRoll]

I don't see anything racist.  He's showing legitimate warning signs of substance abuse (at worst) and extreme dysfunction and immaturity (at best).  The team should get him the help he needs before he flames out of the league or becomes Lenny Bias.

I honestly can't believe this sentiment. You have no idea what is going on, but you are making huge assumptions.

Missing a plan is not extreme dysfunction. Invoking the name of Lenny Bias is ridiculous. Flaming out of the league is pretty far away. There is no evidence of substance abuse.

Maybe you haven't been around substance abuse or family dysfunction as much as I have?  Maybe you think he's just a 20 year old who likes to sleep in and his family isn't good with alarm clocks?  Maybe he needed to fly back home for 16 hours because he forgot his gym bag?

Maybe he was suspended at A&M because his dog ate his homework.  Maybe his conditioning was poor in college and his coach limited his minutes because of... asthma?  Maybe he just wasn't good enough to start in 7 games -- maybe a matchup problem. 

I don't actually know.  How could I?  I'm just calling it like I see it.  He's shown a lot of warning signs.  He appears to be a smart kid with underdeveloped maturity who likes to party.  I was that kid, lol.  He's at risk.

I've been around disfunction, but I've also learned that you can't make assumptions about people just because they are similar to other people you know who have disfunctions.

I'm not saying he's an angel. I'm not really even defending him. I'm annoyed at the kid as a fan.

I'm just saying its pretty foolish to make the statements you're making when you only have a 35,000 foot view of the situation.

Is it foolish?  Is it better to keep quiet and not make assumptions when you see warning signs?  That's not how I'd treat family.  Is he off-limits because he's an athlete and not a personal friend?

I grew up dirt-poor, surrounded by meth, heroin, pill-poppers, junkies and degenerates.  I was lucky enough to escape it.  If you put a gun to my head, I'd guess Robert is popping his "aunt's Oxycontin" or he just likes the purple drank and some weed.  Of course I have only tiny circumstantial details and speculation from a 35,000 ft view.  No evidence.  I'm just drawing on a lifetime of experience and my intuition on these things is pretty fn good.  Nothing about this situation equates to "lazy" or "bad luck" in my mind.

[PickNRoll]

I don't see anything racist.  He's showing legitimate warning signs of substance abuse (at worst) and extreme dysfunction and immaturity (at best).  The team should get him the help he needs before he flames out of the league or becomes Lenny Bias.

I honestly can't believe this sentiment. You have no idea what is going on, but you are making huge assumptions.

Missing a plan is not extreme dysfunction. Invoking the name of Lenny Bias is ridiculous. Flaming out of the league is pretty far away. There is no evidence of substance abuse.

Woah woah woah. As I think the original poster who said he should be tested I agree with all of this. I would point out half the reason for testing is to confirm the guy is NOT on drugs, and the other part is to get him help if he is.

I would think the Celtics, as his employer, would want to know, but not for the purpose of destroying his career before it has begun. Destroying his career is his choice, not ours.

The testing is meant far more as info gathering and a wake up call. Not some public execution

I get that your intention is not aggressive, but the act of making a guy take a drug test because he was late for a plane, especially if he is innocent, is extremely insulting. It may sour the rest of the working relationship.

Drug tests are commonplace in a lot of professions, including pro sports.  I don't see how it's insulting, but I'm also not saying it's necessary.  Not enough information.

[SparzWizard]

Ainge:

“Old news, we’re moving on,” said the Celtics president, though when pressed on how the team intends to deal with a player who slid in the draft due to questions about his work ethic and maturity, he added, “We’re trying to provide structure. We’ll handle things about this internally.”

Asked about his discussion with Williams this morning, Ainge said, “I’m talking to everybody.”

Ainge was anxious to move on from the issue.

“It was an accurate story yesterday and we’re moving on – today’s a new day,” he said. “These things become huge stories and they’re just not.


“A lot of people out there need to grow up, and there are consequences for their actions.”

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/celtics/celtics_insider/2018/07/ainge_on_wayward_williams_were_trying_to_provide_structure_0

Is it time to cut him or trade him

[JHTruth]

Ainge:

“Old news, we’re moving on,” said the Celtics president, though when pressed on how the team intends to deal with a player who slid in the draft due to questions about his work ethic and maturity, he added, “We’re trying to provide structure. We’ll handle things about this internally.”

Asked about his discussion with Williams this morning, Ainge said, “I’m talking to everybody.”

Ainge was anxious to move on from the issue.

“It was an accurate story yesterday and we’re moving on – today’s a new day,” he said. “These things become huge stories and they’re just not.


“A lot of people out there need to grow up, and there are consequences for their actions.”

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/celtics/celtics_insider/2018/07/ainge_on_wayward_williams_were_trying_to_provide_structure_0

Is it time to cut him or trade him

Interesting response to Ainge's comments lol

[Eddie20]

I hate to say it, but there are a lot of racist sounding posts in this thread. I expect better from Celticsblog.

Point to one?

Below are all literally posts from this thread, and missing is the post that has since been deleted predicting that Williams' future will be as a minimum wage laborer sweeping floors.


"the thing I dislike the most is that he talks about working hard, ability to work hard....   time to get my sheet together"

"this guy should not be allowed to be alone. pair him up with a roommate moving forward.  And a guy who won't lie for him in case he wants to sneak out or something."

"Once he gets to Boston they can get him a babysitter."

"His agent needs to hire someone to get him through the summer."

"I'd test him for drugs the second he gets to the team and if it's positive I'd tell him to drive up to Maine where he will be remaining with the Red Claws till at least the All Star break. This cycle has to end immediately. If he doesn't test positive make him carry the bags and fetch everyone water during all summer league. In practice he wears a yellow jersey till he earns a green one."

"Well what is the good reason for missing the flight?  I mean how much are we going to baby this guy and shrug our shoulders? Were you late for work your first day? How about your 2nd day? There need to be immediate clear consequences. Personally I think he was gonna be on the flight but then he got high. Na na na na na na. I'd like to know why."

"Keep him away from our young guys.  I don’t want Williams to influence any of our young players. Heck, if it was me, I will not let him inside the facilities,  cut our losses now."


"I'm with eja117 in that I thought it was some kind of substance abuse when he missed the conference call and this episode reinforces my thoughts.  What else would cause the guy to not care about the responsibilities related to his new job?  It could also be the reason he hightailed it out of Boston and flew home for such a short time."


"I'm off the band wagon on this guy. Probably a bust. He doesn't have the commitment clearly to succeed. Sad case of a talented player who doesn't like basketball."

"This has substance abuse all over it. Hopefully he's getting the last bits of need out of his system."

That's just attributing a whole lot of mundane noises to the movements of ghosts.

These are not "ghosts." It is racial stereotyping, and it is dangerous.

I can't believe you're actually being serious.

It's called criticism, it has nothing to do with color. So if Williams was white and the EXACT things were said would you consider it racial? If not, then YOU may have an issue that you aren't even aware of.

[cltc5]

16 pages debating whether some kid is good or bad based on missed flight shows how much some people in this board need to get a life!

[Roy H.]

16 pages debating whether some kid is good or bad based on missed flight shows how much some people in this board need to get a life!

And yet you’re contributing to those 16 pages?

If you don’t enjoy discussion on CelticsBlog, you’ve got plenty of other options.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

16 pages debating whether some kid is good or bad based on missed flight shows how much some people in this board need to get a life!

Some of us aren't debating Williams' badness or goodness.

We are discussing the quality of conversation about Williams on these 16 pages based on the little we know about him.

[tenn_smoothie]

I hate to say it, but there are a lot of racist sounding posts in this thread. I expect better from Celticsblog.

Point to one?

Below are all literally posts from this thread, and missing is the post that has since been deleted predicting that Williams' future will be as a minimum wage laborer sweeping floors.


"the thing I dislike the most is that he talks about working hard, ability to work hard....   time to get my sheet together"

"this guy should not be allowed to be alone. pair him up with a roommate moving forward.  And a guy who won't lie for him in case he wants to sneak out or something."

"Once he gets to Boston they can get him a babysitter."

"His agent needs to hire someone to get him through the summer."

"I'd test him for drugs the second he gets to the team and if it's positive I'd tell him to drive up to Maine where he will be remaining with the Red Claws till at least the All Star break. This cycle has to end immediately. If he doesn't test positive make him carry the bags and fetch everyone water during all summer league. In practice he wears a yellow jersey till he earns a green one."

"Well what is the good reason for missing the flight?  I mean how much are we going to baby this guy and shrug our shoulders? Were you late for work your first day? How about your 2nd day? There need to be immediate clear consequences. Personally I think he was gonna be on the flight but then he got high. Na na na na na na. I'd like to know why."

"Keep him away from our young guys.  I don’t want Williams to influence any of our young players. Heck, if it was me, I will not let him inside the facilities,  cut our losses now."


"I'm with eja117 in that I thought it was some kind of substance abuse when he missed the conference call and this episode reinforces my thoughts.  What else would cause the guy to not care about the responsibilities related to his new job?  It could also be the reason he hightailed it out of Boston and flew home for such a short time."


"I'm off the band wagon on this guy. Probably a bust. He doesn't have the commitment clearly to succeed. Sad case of a talented player who doesn't like basketball."

"This has substance abuse all over it. Hopefully he's getting the last bits of need out of his system."

That's just attributing a whole lot of mundane noises to the movements of ghosts.

These are not "ghosts." It is racial stereotyping, and it is dangerous.

I can't believe you're actually being serious.

It's called criticism, it has nothing to do with color. So if Williams was white and the EXACT things were said would you consider it racial? If not, then YOU may have an issue that you aren't even aware of.

I was gonna mention how lazy and shiftless that Williams appears to be - but someone would probably take offense at such a remark.

[No Nickname]

I hate to say it, but there are a lot of racist sounding posts in this thread. I expect better from Celticsblog.

Point to one?

Below are all literally posts from this thread, and missing is the post that has since been deleted predicting that Williams' future will be as a minimum wage laborer sweeping floors.


"the thing I dislike the most is that he talks about working hard, ability to work hard....   time to get my sheet together"

"this guy should not be allowed to be alone. pair him up with a roommate moving forward.  And a guy who won't lie for him in case he wants to sneak out or something."

"Once he gets to Boston they can get him a babysitter."

"His agent needs to hire someone to get him through the summer."

"I'd test him for drugs the second he gets to the team and if it's positive I'd tell him to drive up to Maine where he will be remaining with the Red Claws till at least the All Star break. This cycle has to end immediately. If he doesn't test positive make him carry the bags and fetch everyone water during all summer league. In practice he wears a yellow jersey till he earns a green one."

"Well what is the good reason for missing the flight?  I mean how much are we going to baby this guy and shrug our shoulders? Were you late for work your first day? How about your 2nd day? There need to be immediate clear consequences. Personally I think he was gonna be on the flight but then he got high. Na na na na na na. I'd like to know why."

"Keep him away from our young guys.  I don’t want Williams to influence any of our young players. Heck, if it was me, I will not let him inside the facilities,  cut our losses now."


"I'm with eja117 in that I thought it was some kind of substance abuse when he missed the conference call and this episode reinforces my thoughts.  What else would cause the guy to not care about the responsibilities related to his new job?  It could also be the reason he hightailed it out of Boston and flew home for such a short time."


"I'm off the band wagon on this guy. Probably a bust. He doesn't have the commitment clearly to succeed. Sad case of a talented player who doesn't like basketball."

"This has substance abuse all over it. Hopefully he's getting the last bits of need out of his system."

That's just attributing a whole lot of mundane noises to the movements of ghosts.

These are not "ghosts." It is racial stereotyping, and it is dangerous.

Maybe it's you who is racial stereotyping. You seem to be the only one attributing these criticisms to being black.

Agreed, you could have seen the same exact (non-racist) comments about Chris Herren and how he handled his off the court stuff back in the day.

[Emmette Bryant]

video from when Williams arrived at practice

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QzPRpePDLj8&feature=youtu.be

[Emmette Bryant]

I was gonna mention how lazy and shiftless that Williams appears to be - but someone would probably take offense at such a remark.

Southern man
better keep your head
Don't forget
what your good book said

[Pucaccia]

video from when Williams arrived at practice

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QzPRpePDLj8&feature=youtu.be

Funny