Rumor: Execs belive Cs will rekindle talks w/ Bulls about Butler

[apc]

No for trading Bradley.
He is the face of the franchise.

[vjcsmoke]

No for trading Bradley.
He is the face of the franchise.

What?  IT is the franchise.

Bradley is good, but if Butler is coming back I could live with that trade.

[Moranis]

I think a solid realistic haul for Butler is this:

Bulls receive:
G Avery Bradley
F Jaylen Brown
C Tyler Zeller
Memphis 1st

Celtics receive:
G/F Jimmy Butler


PG: IT, Rozier
SG: Butler, Smart
SF: Crowder, Green
PF: Jerebko, Olynyk
C: Horford, Johnson

I think that's a trade that gives the bulls a ton of young talent, role players, cap relief, and pick. We keep a majority of our core and also keep our depth into the bench. We could probably bring in a veteran off of waivers that could strengthen our frontcourt

that is neither solid nor realistic

How? We keep our main core of IT, Horford, Crowder, Smart, and both our Brooklyn Picks plus the Clippers pick. We also keep some sort of depth into our bench.

You look at all the trades that fetched stars or blockbusters recently.

Ryan Gomes, Gerald Green, Al Jefferson, Theo Ratliff, Sebastian Telfair, and 2 first rounders for KG
All those players besides Jefferson are role players

Kevin Martin, Jeremy Lamb, and 2 1sts, and a 2nd for Harden

Wilson Chandler, Danilo Gallinari, and Mozgov for Carmelo and Billups

All those players are role players besides Gallinari who is a solid starter.

So considering that all these trade are for players that are of a much higher caliber of player then the trade that consists of a solid starter in Bradley, a top young prospect in Jaylen Brown, essentially an expiring deal in Zeller, and pick that could possibly be a lottery pick in a couple of years. So in all I think that's a solid haul comparatively

Oh it is a great trade for Boston, but it is a terrible trade for Chicago, which is why it is neither solid nor realistic.  Kevin Love fetched the #1 pick in the draft, a recent #1 pick, and a future 1st.  That is more in line with what Butler will require, i.e. the 2017 Brooklyn pick and either Brown or the 2018 Brooklyn pick and some other asset plus whatever salary is required.  Now if you start adding in real players instead of salary filler, you can probably eliminate the Brown/2018 BKN portion of the trade, but Chicago is not trading Butler without Boston's best trade asset.

But aren't the circumstances far different here?

With the Cavs, they 1) had to win immediately to hold onto LeBron and b) more or less viewed Love as the Final piece to make a run at a title.

With the Celtics, they really have no timetable on when they have to win a title. If Danny isn't happy with the price, he can stick with building with the draft and free agency. Moreover, can Butler be viewed as more or less the final piece to be a contender? I'm not so sure.

 And if he's not, the C's really can't afford to give up much more than the aforementioned package.

I don't want to acquire Butler.  I'd much rather go after Anthony who will cost a lot less to acquire.  But the Bulls don't have to trade Butler either.  He hasn't asked for a trade and he is signed long term on a reasonable contract.  The Bulls won't trade Butler to Boston without Boston's best trade asset because they have no incentive to do so.  Love was going to leave Minnesota after the following summer, they needed to trade him.  Cleveland needed to acquire him, as well, but it wasn't just the Cavs that felt pressure, Minnesota did as well because if they didn't trade him they were going to lose him. 

[Darío SpanishFan]

I wouldn't trade a possible Top-3 pick in 2018 for a player who doesn't put us into GSW or Cavs level.

We must have the goal of winning a title, not getting close to it. And it implies a beast in the paint. So the Nets picks are only traded for Cousins, A-Davis, Towns or Embiid (maybe I'm forgetting anyone else). Not for Butler, Melo or Paul George.

My best offer for Butler may be Rozier, Bradley, Young, Yabu's rights, our first in 2018, Clippers 1st, Minnesota's 2017 second and fillers.

[TrueFan]

My two Cs fears

1.   That the Cs unload assets for Butler when they could have Hayward as a FA. I trust that DA and BS will have a solid enough grasp on the situation to not make this mistake.

2.  They unload assets for Butler only to create the perennial second best team in the east for the next 3 seasons. The alternative is to compete as the currently are as the 2nd-4th best in the east while gearing up for the end of James reign. The the most competitively inspirational idea but the clearest path to their next championship.

What about Jaylen Brown? I think he could give us 15 ppg 2 years from now. Do we really want to give him more obstacles by bringing in Heyward?

[apc]

No for trading Bradley.
He is the face of the franchise.

What?  IT is the franchise.

Bradley is good, but if Butler is coming back I could live with that trade.

Its not about who is better.

[Ilikesports17]

No for trading Bradley.
He is the face of the franchise.

What?  IT is the franchise.

Bradley is good, but if Butler is coming back I could live with that trade.

Its not about who is better.

You could argue Bradley is more important to the identity of the Celtics in the locker room and on the court, but Isaiah Thomas is the face of this franchise and its not even remotely close.

[Smartacus]

My two Cs fears

1.   That the Cs unload assets for Butler when they could have Hayward as a FA. I trust that DA and BS will have a solid enough grasp on the situation to not make this mistake.

2.  They unload assets for Butler only to create the perennial second best team in the east for the next 3 seasons. The alternative is to compete as the currently are as the 2nd-4th best in the east while gearing up for the end of James reign. The the most competitively inspirational idea but the clearest path to their next championship.

What about Jaylen Brown? I think he could give us 15 ppg 2 years from now. Do we really want to give him more obstacles by bringing in Heyward?

Why couldn't Jaylen and Hayward play together? Don't think the skill overlap would be too bad.

An athletic, above the rim, slasher filling the lanes and spotting up for transition 3's could be the ideal running mate for Hayward.

Isaiah
Hayward
Brown
Crowder(Josh Jackson? Millsap? Melo?)
Horford

That's one of the biggest small ball lineups you could hope for.

[TrueFan]

My two Cs fears

1.   That the Cs unload assets for Butler when they could have Hayward as a FA. I trust that DA and BS will have a solid enough grasp on the situation to not make this mistake.

2.  They unload assets for Butler only to create the perennial second best team in the east for the next 3 seasons. The alternative is to compete as the currently are as the 2nd-4th best in the east while gearing up for the end of James reign. The the most competitively inspirational idea but the clearest path to their next championship.

What about Jaylen Brown? I think he could give us 15 ppg 2 years from now. Do we really want to give him more obstacles by bringing in Heyward?

Why couldn't Jaylen and Hayward play together? Don't think the skill overlap would be too bad.

An athletic, above the rim, slasher filling the lanes and spotting up for transition 3's could be the ideal running mate for Hayward.

Isaiah
Hayward
Brown
Crowder(Josh Jackson? Millsap? Melo?)
Horford

That's one of the biggest small ball lineups you could hope for.

Its a nice problem to have or is it not?

If it happens Brad Stevens will need a contract adjustment to get paid enough to figure out that puzzle.

[jpotter33]

I know everyone is excited about the Nets pick this year, but Butler is a guarantee, where the draft pick has a chance to be good.

I'd give them Bradley, Smart and the Nets pick for Butler. Jae seems like the vocal leader of this team and with Butler having problems leading in Chicago, I'd like to keep Jae so that Butler can just fit in instead of needing to lead. It also doesn't hurt that Butler played with Crowder in college.

If by some miracle we could give them the '18 Nets pick instead of the '17 one I'd be ecstatic, but I just don't see that being realistic.

At this point, I think you have to include Brown in there, because there's no way he's going to develop properly behind both Crowder AND Butler at the swing position.

Here's what I'd offer them:

Chicago: Bradley, Zeller, Brown, Rozier, and the 2017 Brooklyn pick

Boston: Butler, Canaan

That's a fair offer that gives them an upgrade in prospects at the 1, 2, and 3, along with the best chances at the number one pick in this draft.

I'd then turn around and get serious about trading for Noel, offering up something like Jackson, the Memphis pick, AND the Clips pick for him, even the rights to someone like Yab if need be. With there being no other trade market for him at the moment and the fact that the 76ers simply aren't going to match the near-max offers he's going to get in free agency from the likes of Dallas, Brooklyn, etc., I think this should suffice for him.

That'd then leave us with a championship-level lineup of:

PG: IT, Smart
SG: Butler, Young/Canaan
SF: Crowder, Green
PF: Horford, KO/JJ
C: Noel, Amir

[Evantime34]

I know everyone is excited about the Nets pick this year, but Butler is a guarantee, where the draft pick has a chance to be good.

I'd give them Bradley, Smart and the Nets pick for Butler. Jae seems like the vocal leader of this team and with Butler having problems leading in Chicago, I'd like to keep Jae so that Butler can just fit in instead of needing to lead. It also doesn't hurt that Butler played with Crowder in college.

If by some miracle we could give them the '18 Nets pick instead of the '17 one I'd be ecstatic, but I just don't see that being realistic.

At this point, I think you have to include Brown in there, because there's no way he's going to develop properly behind both Crowder AND Butler at the swing position.

Here's what I'd offer them:

Chicago: Bradley, Zeller, Brown, Rozier, and the 2017 Brooklyn pick

Boston: Butler, Canaan

That's a fair offer that gives them an upgrade in prospects at the 1, 2, and 3, along with the best chances at the number one pick in this draft.

I'd then turn around and get serious about trading for Noel, offering up something like Jackson, the Memphis pick, AND the Clips pick for him, even the rights to someone like Yab if need be. With there being no other trade market for him at the moment and the fact that the 76ers simply aren't going to match the near-max offers he's going to get in free agency from the likes of Dallas, Brooklyn, etc., I think this should suffice for him.

That'd then leave us with a championship-level lineup of:

PG: IT, Smart
SG: Butler, Young/Canaan
SF: Crowder, Green
PF: Horford, KO/JJ
C: Noel, Amir

I would be happy with the deal. Especially because we could keep the '18 Brooklyn pick so that we could still draft a high prospect to bring along slowly.

I'd prefer keeping Brown to Smart though. Since we close most games with Crowder at the 4, I think there would still be plenty of time for Jaylen to develop. Eventually if he deserved to be a starter we could either start Jaylen along Crowder and Jimmy at the 2-4 or just move Crowder to the bench.

If we do a Jimmy deal, I don't want it to be a move that locks us into a roster that has little room for growth. Brown could be a piece that improves the team's ceiling if he develops.

[TrueFan]

I know everyone is excited about the Nets pick this year, but Butler is a guarantee, where the draft pick has a chance to be good.

I'd give them Bradley, Smart and the Nets pick for Butler. Jae seems like the vocal leader of this team and with Butler having problems leading in Chicago, I'd like to keep Jae so that Butler can just fit in instead of needing to lead. It also doesn't hurt that Butler played with Crowder in college.

If by some miracle we could give them the '18 Nets pick instead of the '17 one I'd be ecstatic, but I just don't see that being realistic.

At this point, I think you have to include Brown in there, because there's no way he's going to develop properly behind both Crowder AND Butler at the swing position.

Here's what I'd offer them:

Chicago: Bradley, Zeller, Brown, Rozier, and the 2017 Brooklyn pick

Boston: Butler, Canaan

That's a fair offer that gives them an upgrade in prospects at the 1, 2, and 3, along with the best chances at the number one pick in this draft.

I'd then turn around and get serious about trading for Noel, offering up something like Jackson, the Memphis pick, AND the Clips pick for him, even the rights to someone like Yab if need be. With there being no other trade market for him at the moment and the fact that the 76ers simply aren't going to match the near-max offers he's going to get in free agency from the likes of Dallas, Brooklyn, etc., I think this should suffice for him.

That'd then leave us with a championship-level lineup of:

PG: IT, Smart
SG: Butler, Young/Canaan
SF: Crowder, Green
PF: Horford, KO/JJ
C: Noel, Amir

Fun team but I'm not sure I like going all in for this lineup.

[CFAN38]

I know everyone is excited about the Nets pick this year, but Butler is a guarantee, where the draft pick has a chance to be good.

I'd give them Bradley, Smart and the Nets pick for Butler. Jae seems like the vocal leader of this team and with Butler having problems leading in Chicago, I'd like to keep Jae so that Butler can just fit in instead of needing to lead. It also doesn't hurt that Butler played with Crowder in college.

If by some miracle we could give them the '18 Nets pick instead of the '17 one I'd be ecstatic, but I just don't see that being realistic.

At this point, I think you have to include Brown in there, because there's no way he's going to develop properly behind both Crowder AND Butler at the swing position.

Here's what I'd offer them:

Chicago: Bradley, Zeller, Brown, Rozier, and the 2017 Brooklyn pick

Boston: Butler, Canaan

That's a fair offer that gives them an upgrade in prospects at the 1, 2, and 3, along with the best chances at the number one pick in this draft.

I'd then turn around and get serious about trading for Noel, offering up something like Jackson, the Memphis pick, AND the Clips pick for him, even the rights to someone like Yab if need be. With there being no other trade market for him at the moment and the fact that the 76ers simply aren't going to match the near-max offers he's going to get in free agency from the likes of Dallas, Brooklyn, etc., I think this should suffice for him.

That'd then leave us with a championship-level lineup of:

PG: IT, Smart
SG: Butler, Young/Canaan
SF: Crowder, Green
PF: Horford, KO/JJ
C: Noel, Amir

Fun team but I'm not sure I like going all in for this lineup.

retaining Smart and Crowder while trading for Butler at least makes things interesting vs the Cavs

Small ball

IT           vs Irving
Smart     vs Smith
Butler     vs Korver/Liggins/Shumpert
Crowder vs Lebron
Horford   vs Love

tough to over come Lebron but this team could at least make things tough on him.

[Evantime34]

I know everyone is excited about the Nets pick this year, but Butler is a guarantee, where the draft pick has a chance to be good.

I'd give them Bradley, Smart and the Nets pick for Butler. Jae seems like the vocal leader of this team and with Butler having problems leading in Chicago, I'd like to keep Jae so that Butler can just fit in instead of needing to lead. It also doesn't hurt that Butler played with Crowder in college.

If by some miracle we could give them the '18 Nets pick instead of the '17 one I'd be ecstatic, but I just don't see that being realistic.

At this point, I think you have to include Brown in there, because there's no way he's going to develop properly behind both Crowder AND Butler at the swing position.

Here's what I'd offer them:

Chicago: Bradley, Zeller, Brown, Rozier, and the 2017 Brooklyn pick

Boston: Butler, Canaan

That's a fair offer that gives them an upgrade in prospects at the 1, 2, and 3, along with the best chances at the number one pick in this draft.

I'd then turn around and get serious about trading for Noel, offering up something like Jackson, the Memphis pick, AND the Clips pick for him, even the rights to someone like Yab if need be. With there being no other trade market for him at the moment and the fact that the 76ers simply aren't going to match the near-max offers he's going to get in free agency from the likes of Dallas, Brooklyn, etc., I think this should suffice for him.

That'd then leave us with a championship-level lineup of:

PG: IT, Smart
SG: Butler, Young/Canaan
SF: Crowder, Green
PF: Horford, KO/JJ
C: Noel, Amir

Fun team but I'm not sure I like going all in for this lineup.

retaining Smart and Crowder while trading for Butler at least makes things interesting vs the Cavs

Small ball

IT           vs Irving
Smart     vs Smith
Butler     vs Korver/Liggins/Shumpert
Crowder vs Lebron
Horford   vs Love

tough to over come Lebron but this team could at least make things tough on him.

I'm not sure this would be us going all in either, since we would still have one Nets pick left.

[Vox_Populi]

Butler has been undoubtedly one of the ten or eleven best players in the NBA this season.

Do it. Do it.