Sean Deveny- Cs intent on pursuing Barnes

[saltlover]

Unlike Green, Barnes can actually shoot, defend, and compete for boards. He's much more similar to Marvin Williams.

And so can Crowder.

I've never quite understood the fascination with Barnes on this board. He's a nice piece without a doubt and I think he's a good player for anyone to have. But the Cs already have a guy who has very similar production, same role, is just as good defensively (if not better), a locker room leader and is only two years older for a LOT cheaper than Barnes would cost.

How many more wins would Barnes bring to the Celtics?

This is where I am.  I like him and I think he's a better player than Crowder but not so much so that I would be willing to give him a max contract. 

The only way I could see Danny making a move like this is would be if he plans on using Crowder as a trading chip in some type of monster deal.

In a world in which the Celtics signed Harrison Barnes, I've always assumed that he would play next to Crowder, not instead of Crowder.  I think Brad wishes he had three Jae Crowders.

[PhoSita]

Unlike Green, Barnes can actually shoot, defend, and compete for boards. He's much more similar to Marvin Williams.

And so can Crowder.

I've never quite understood the fascination with Barnes on this board. He's a nice piece without a doubt and I think he's a good player for anyone to have. But the Cs already have a guy who has very similar production, same role, is just as good defensively (if not better), a locker room leader and is only two years older for a LOT cheaper than Barnes would cost.

How many more wins would Barnes bring to the Celtics?

This is where I am.  I like him and I think he's a better player than Crowder but not so much so that I would be willing to give him a max contract. 

The only way I could see Danny making a move like this is would be if he plans on using Crowder as a trading chip in some type of monster deal.

In a world in which the Celtics signed Harrison Barnes, I've always assumed that he would play next to Crowder, not instead of Crowder.  I think Brad wishes he had three Jae Crowders.

This is exactly the point.  It's not an either/or.  The Celts need as many versatile combo wings as they can get.

[greece66]

In a world in which the Celtics signed Harrison Barnes, I've always assumed that he would play next to Crowder, not instead of Crowder.  I think Brad wishes he had three Jae Crowders.

Stevens has said a 'versatile wing player' should be the team's top priority (that was when we were looking for a player to fill the extra roster spot); Barnes fits the description perfectly. I'm not sure Ainge would agree with the price tag though.

Speaking of which, earlier this year there were rumours Utah was considering trading Hayward. anyone has news from that front?

[danglertx]

I've never been super high on Barnes but during the 4th game of the finals there was a point where I guess Barnes got mad and decided he was going to get every rebound for a couple of minutes.  That Barnes might be worth it.

[jambr380]

I don't know Barnes' personality well enough to say whether or not he would make Harden-type leap or if he would naturally take a backseat like Jeff Green. This is not to say that I don't think Jeff Green is an effective player - I always liked him - but Ainge clearly expected more out of him after making the trade. The heart surgery may have made him embrace life rather than obsess with bball.

I do know that Barnes has done an extremely good job settling into his role on a championship team. If he were constantly looking for his own, he would be on the bench a lot more often.

If we ended up signing him, I could definitely get behind it. Signing Horford or trading for Love seem like worse moves than getting a young, efficient, versatile Barnes for 'free'.

[BadNewsBarnes]

Unlike Green, Barnes can actually shoot, defend, and compete for boards. He's much more similar to Marvin Williams.

And so can Crowder.

I've never quite understood the fascination with Barnes on this board. He's a nice piece without a doubt and I think he's a good player for anyone to have. But the Cs already have a guy who has very similar production, same role, is just as good defensively (if not better), a locker room leader and is only two years older for a LOT cheaper than Barnes would cost.

How many more wins would Barnes bring to the Celtics?

This is where I am.  I like him and I think he's a better player than Crowder but not so much so that I would be willing to give him a max contract. 

The only way I could see Danny making a move like this is would be if he plans on using Crowder as a trading chip in some type of monster deal.

In a world in which the Celtics signed Harrison Barnes, I've always assumed that he would play next to Crowder, not instead of Crowder.  I think Brad wishes he had three Jae Crowders.

This is exactly the point.  It's not an either/or.  The Celts need as many versatile combo wings as they can get.

I suppose that's possible even though they both play the three.  The NBA is changing and having a versatile roster is critical.  Still, I'm in agreement with others who have posted here against a max contract for Barnes.

[Beat LA]

Teams are intent on flushing Barnes pockets with money, because they believe he could step up into the 2nd/3rd role, but I'm not too sure about that. I think Barnes will have an impressive steady career, but I think ultimately, he's going to be relegated to the small ball 4, and his inconsistencies at offense/defense won't be such a red flag at the 3.

I saw that Barnes has been a consistent contributor in the Finals, and the playoffs. But another concerning thing that I've witnessed personally from the eye test, is Barnes inability to pass out of tough double teams, and making the right play at the right time. I think its also steadfast become another issue is Barnes weak ball handling, passing, and overall basketball IQ. He's so athletic, and so young, you just have to give him a lengthy and wealthy contract in hopes of aspirations of his ceiling reached, but its a very tough and vague road that you're going to be taking, if desperate teams even offer anywhere near 20-23 million.

While I'm not sure that I agree in terms of his intelligence on the court, I definitely concur with your assessment of his Bradley-like skills regarding ball handling and passing.  What I do like about him is his post game.  During that OKC series, he was being guarded by Waiters for significant stretches, yet they never got him the ball.  Honestly, it's like at times they simply forget about him out there, but when they get it to him with someone like Dellavedova or Kyrie guarding him because Lebron and Shumpert/Smith or whoever are trying to stop Curry and Thompson, that's when they become nearly unbeatable, because it really is pick your poison out there at that point.

All that said, I do like the guy, but I wouldn't even make him an offer, and not for the reason of Crowder being better than him.  That's ridiculous, imo.  Crowder has nowhere near the offensive ability of Barnes, nor Jimmy Butler, especially because both of those guys can post up.  All Serena Williams can do is spot up and straight line drives, and he never gets to the line, either, which is why it's truly laughable when someone like Sean Grande says that Butler wouldn't be too much of an upgrade over Serena.  Really? Has he never seen both of them play before, lol?

While I agree with most of your assessment, the free throw part is very false.

Free Throw rates last year:

Jimmy Butler:  45.9%
Harrison Barnes:  21.2%
Jae Crowder:  29.4% 

Crowder over his career has gotten to the line around the same rate as Barnes, and last year actually significantly higher.

Butler is, of course, on a whole other level.  Anyone who claims Butler isn't much of an upgrade over Crowder probably also is one of those people who still believes the world is flat.  Totally irrational.

Yeah, in terms of free throws I was only comparing Crowder to Butler, there.  Sorry about that.

[IDreamCeltics]

It would be super interesting to see what Barnes would do with a greater role on a different team.  His shooting percentages are solid.  I get the Jeff Green comps... but on the optimistic side you'd expect him to have a James Harden-esque surge with a greater role.

I feel like you're ignoring the fact that James Harden showed repeatedly on OKC that he was capable of filing a bigger role for a team while Harrison Barnes has done the opposite.

I'd go so far as to say every time Harrison Barnes has been forced to take on a bigger role he's shown why he's not that type of player.

[Fafnir]

It would be super interesting to see what Barnes would do with a greater role on a different team.  His shooting percentages are solid.  I get the Jeff Green comps... but on the optimistic side you'd expect him to have a James Harden-esque surge with a greater role.

I feel like you're ignoring the fact that James Harden showed repeatedly on OKC that he was capable of filing a bigger role for a team while Harrison Barnes has done the opposite.

I'd go so far as to say every time Harrison Barnes has been forced to take on a bigger role he's shown why he's not that type of player.

On the bright side he looks great in garbage time!     

[Fafnir]

Odds of this story coming from Barnes agent? 5 : 1?

[Kaz]

Ummm, so yeah about that.... 

If the Celtics are going to try to get a wing, I'd much rather they slightly overpay Crabbe than drastically burn money on Barnes.

[meangreenmachine]

Marginal costs of adding Barnes far exceeds the marginal benefits. He is not much of an upgrade over Crowder, who has one of the best contracts in the league.

[BornReady]

I wouldn't read into this that much

As posters before noted, crowder is a better defender and on a bargain contract
Barnes is going to probably be offered max while crowder is only $7 mil

[Stig]

Has he just gone 2/14 in the last game? I used to like Barnes, but now he looks strikingly like Jeff Green, or Marvin Williams, not sure I want them for $20m.

[RockinRyA]

Has he just gone 2/14 in the last game? I used to like Barnes, but now he looks strikingly like Jeff Green, or Marvin Williams, not sure I want them for $20m.

he was averaging around 11 ppg shooting 57 percent prior to last game this series.