Sherrod Blakely- C's to put a package deal for Aldridge and Matthews

[Gainesville Celtic]

Does anyone know if we could potentially get 3 'max' level players via trade and free agency?

ie:

-get L Aldridge ($16 million) via trade (send out Wallace $10 million+ Bradley $8 million +Sullinger+picks)

-sign D Jordan as free agent ($20.1 million)

-sign and trade with Milwaukee to bring Khris Middleton here so his salary doesn't take us into the luxury tax? (send IT $7 million+Turner $3.3 million+ resigned Bass at $5 million)

Does something like the above have a *possibility* of working even if highly unlikely?

Saltlover?

Sure, it can work if we allow that all the teams and players would do it, as long as you drop Bass from the equation.  He messes it all up.  But you don't need him, so let's remove him from the deal.  But a couple of minor points:

The max salary for Jordan and Aldridge should be right around $19 million.  They're both getting the max, so we should account for it properly.

agree that it can work, but i think you're still off a little on Jordan and LMA's max $$.

As 7-9 yr experience FAs their max is 30% of the salary cap.

The last estimate i saw was that the cap will jump this year to $67.1M, 30% of that is $20.13M.


I think these then work (leaving aside that I dont' think POR or MIL cooperates....):

1. Sign DJ with space as you've outlined
2. LMA for Bradley, Sullinger, Wallace and Pressey + picks
3. Middleton for THomas, Turner, Young + picks

[Evantime34]

Its not out of the question that 16 +TE gets you Gibson and 28 + Wallace + ET gets you Hibbert

Then you could package Sully AB and KO to get Stanley Johnson in the draft.

If that's all it takes to get Hibbert do that ASAP. Not huge on Hibbert but for the price I'd jump.

Also S. Johnson shouldn't go until 7-9 so I think Sully/KO + 16 for that pick and  bad contract would be even.

Smart, IT4
AB, Young,
Johnson, Crowder
KO, (2nd rounder)
Hibbert, Zeller.

Not a title contender but that roster sits at under 40 mil assuming Hibbert doesn't get any more than 10 mil a year.

Which he absolutely will.

That package doesn't even get us close to a conversation about Hibbert.

I think it could get you close, since the Pacers publicly stated that he will be having a reduced deal in effort to convince him not to pick up his option. If he does pick up his option, then he is clearly gone next year and Indy takes what they can get for him now.

[number_n9ne]

Clearly we need to sign Aldridge and trade for Cousins so we can rock that Marcus, LeMarcus, and DeMarcus core. Championships for dayz.

[Evantime34]

It clearly is unlikely, but we have discussed considerably less likely things on this forum before.

However, in the unlikely event that Aldridge talked with the C's and informed them he would sign here if we gave Matthews the ~16MM max deal he wants then I would do it in a heart beat.  I don't really see a better outcome to this summer than adding two players who immediately become our two best players, without giving up a single asset besides cap space.

Argumentum ad passiones and red herring. I rest my case.

Ok I looked that up so I could disagree lol.

I'm not sure how I am appealing to emotion and what the red herring was. We were discussing if it would make sense to do such a deal, not if it was likely (since I already stated it was unlikely and that we discuss unlikely things all the time). I didn't use emotion or try to mislead, I simply stated that signing LMA and Matthews would be a great move.

[saltlover]

Does anyone know if we could potentially get 3 'max' level players via trade and free agency?

ie:

-get L Aldridge ($16 million) via trade (send out Wallace $10 million+ Bradley $8 million +Sullinger+picks)

-sign D Jordan as free agent ($20.1 million)

-sign and trade with Milwaukee to bring Khris Middleton here so his salary doesn't take us into the luxury tax? (send IT $7 million+Turner $3.3 million+ resigned Bass at $5 million)

Does something like the above have a *possibility* of working even if highly unlikely?

Saltlover?

Sure, it can work if we allow that all the teams and players would do it, as long as you drop Bass from the equation.  He messes it all up.  But you don't need him, so let's remove him from the deal.  But a couple of minor points:

The max salary for Jordan and Aldridge should be right around $19 million.  They're both getting the max, so we should account for it properly.

agree that it can work, but i think you're still off a little on Jordan and LMA's max $$.

As 7-9 yr experience FAs their max is 30% of the salary cap.

The last estimate i saw was that the cap will jump this year to $67.1M, 30% of that is $20.13M.


I think these then work (leaving aside that I dont' think POR or MIL cooperates....):

1. Sign DJ with space as you've outlined
2. LMA for Bradley, Sullinger, Wallace and Pressey + picks
3. Middleton for THomas, Turner, Young + picks

For archaic reasons, the "cap" for calculating max salaries is lower than the actual cap.  The 30% rule applies to a lower cap, which is derived from 42.14% of BRI, instead of 44.74%.  That $19 million approximation comes from me deriving how much BRI is projected if there's a cap of $67 million, and then working backwards to find the "Max-salary" cap.

Don't ask me why it's done this way.  Just trust me that it is.

P.S.  To be entirely precise, my estimates come out at $18.9 mil for Jordan and Aldridge, and $15.75 million for Middleton, at a $67.1 mil cap.  There's rounding that gets done in the calculations, however, so I went with $19 mil and $16 mil to be conservative.

[D Dub]

I believe Blakely in that this package deal is the type of added layer DA and others will be willing to use to land a star.

Looking past the fact that this is a long shot in order to get some enjoyment out of the speculations here is how I could see this happen.

DRAFT: If the Cs are committed to clearing cap space and moving Sully and/or KO to improve the talent on the roster then try to trade Wallace, #16 and #28 to a team in the #20-#25 range for their pick and a salary dump. The only team that may fit this is Toronto.
EX. Wallace, #16, #28 to Raptors for #20 and a future 2nd, draft Harrell at #20, D Wright or Andrew Harrison at #33, draft and stash at #45

FA:

Sign Crowder's qualifying offer

Signing Matthews to a risky 3-4 year deal @ 9-10 mill per to facilitate LMA coming to Boston (dont make official till LMA trade).

Do a S&T with Portland. Sully + Turner for LMA. This way LMA gets his max money.

Look into signing R Jefferson, C Copeland, W Johnson, C Budinger, K Singler, J Richardson or start the Paul Pierce retirement tour as Matthews insurance.

Match any offer under 8mill that Crowder receives. If he goes over look into Aminu, Mbah a Moute or D Williams

Resign Jerebko (cheaper and more versitale then Bass

Sign Withey, Joel Anthony, Udoh, C Aldrich, O'Quinn, or another journey man center' , give the Cs a cheap big body at the end of the bench

Sign Babb, give 3-D guy



2015-2016 roster

PG   Smart
SG   AB
SF   Matthews
PF   LMA
C    Zeller
6th IT4
7th Crowder
8th KO
9th R Jefferson
10th Jerebko
11th Withey
12th J Young
13th Harrell
14th Babb
15th Wright/Harrison

This roster would give LMA great spacing on offense as every player with the exception of the backup center can shoot from at least mid-range. On defense while they still lack elite rim protection in the top of the rotation LMA gives great size at the 4 and Withey and Harrell are both long and athletic off the bench. 4 of the top 8 players in the rotation (Smart, AB, Matthew and Crowder) are all-nba level defenders so the rim protection need is some what minimized. While I would plan on Zeller starting I view this as a 20-25mpg starting center not the typical 30+mpg with LMA getting half of his minutes at the center position.

TP for the well thought out post, especially detail about unheralded FA types that would fit nicely in our system.

[GzUP617]

 This isn't really news,  all Blakely said was Ainge should try to recruit Aldridge by signing Matthews.

Doesn't sound like he's connected at all.

[SHAQATTACK]

Fireworks. 

[Gainesville Celtic]

Does anyone know if we could potentially get 3 'max' level players via trade and free agency?

ie:

-get L Aldridge ($16 million) via trade (send out Wallace $10 million+ Bradley $8 million +Sullinger+picks)

-sign D Jordan as free agent ($20.1 million)

-sign and trade with Milwaukee to bring Khris Middleton here so his salary doesn't take us into the luxury tax? (send IT $7 million+Turner $3.3 million+ resigned Bass at $5 million)

Does something like the above have a *possibility* of working even if highly unlikely?

Saltlover?

Sure, it can work if we allow that all the teams and players would do it, as long as you drop Bass from the equation.  He messes it all up.  But you don't need him, so let's remove him from the deal.  But a couple of minor points:

The max salary for Jordan and Aldridge should be right around $19 million.  They're both getting the max, so we should account for it properly.

agree that it can work, but i think you're still off a little on Jordan and LMA's max $$.

As 7-9 yr experience FAs their max is 30% of the salary cap.

The last estimate i saw was that the cap will jump this year to $67.1M, 30% of that is $20.13M.


I think these then work (leaving aside that I dont' think POR or MIL cooperates....):

1. Sign DJ with space as you've outlined
2. LMA for Bradley, Sullinger, Wallace and Pressey + picks
3. Middleton for THomas, Turner, Young + picks

For archaic reasons, the "cap" for calculating max salaries is lower than the actual cap.  The 30% rule applies to a lower cap, which is derived from 42.14% of BRI, instead of 44.74%.  That $19 million approximation comes from me deriving how much BRI is projected if there's a cap of $67 million, and then working backwards to find the "Max-salary" cap.

Don't ask me why it's done this way.  Just trust me that it is.

P.S.  To be entirely precise, my estimates come out at $18.9 mil for Jordan and Aldridge, and $15.75 million for Middleton, at a $67.1 mil cap.  There's rounding that gets done in the calculations, however, so I went with $19 mil and $16 mil to be conservative.

Interesting... i did not know that... thanks for the knowledge. TP!

[Eddie20]

This isn't really news,  all Blakely said was Ainge should try to recruit Aldridge by signing Matthews.

Doesn't sound like he's connected at all.

This was the exact quote, which doesn't sound like he's saying "Ainge should try" as you suggested.

"My understanding is the Celtics are going to be open to putting together some type of package deal where they would not only bring in LaMarcus Aldridge, they'd bring in one of his good friends by the name of Wes Matthews," says Blakely. "Now, if you're the Celtics and you can put together a deal to get those two guys in town, you've gotta do it."

[GzUP617]

This isn't really news,  all Blakely said was Ainge should try to recruit Aldridge by signing Matthews.

Doesn't sound like he's connected at all.

This was the exact quote, which doesn't sound like he's saying "Ainge should try" as you suggested.

"My understanding is the Celtics are going to be open to putting together some type of package deal where they would not only bring in LaMarcus Aldridge, they'd bring in one of his good friends by the name of Wes Matthews," says Blakely. "Now, if you're the Celtics and you can put together a deal to get those two guys in town, you've gotta do it."

Both are UFA's, both are long-shot acquisitions,  only reason to even create said called "package deal" is for us to shed some salary.

I don't take "open to putting together some type of package deal" as some sort of real intel.

It's pretty obvious and common sense he will try to obtain prime free agents. I don't see any news in this.

[Eddie20]

This isn't really news,  all Blakely said was Ainge should try to recruit Aldridge by signing Matthews.

Doesn't sound like he's connected at all.

This was the exact quote, which doesn't sound like he's saying "Ainge should try" as you suggested.

"My understanding is the Celtics are going to be open to putting together some type of package deal where they would not only bring in LaMarcus Aldridge, they'd bring in one of his good friends by the name of Wes Matthews," says Blakely. "Now, if you're the Celtics and you can put together a deal to get those two guys in town, you've gotta do it."

Both are UFA's, both are long-shot acquisitions,  only reason to even create said called "package deal" is for us to shed some salary.

I don't take "open to putting together some type of package deal" as some sort of real intel.

It's pretty obvious and common sense he will try to obtain prime free agents. I don't see any news in this.

The key part is in bold.

Also, I took the "packaged deal" as them being signed together that's why he made the comment of them being close friends. It has nothing to do with trading for them since, like you said, they're both UFA's. However, I do disagree with you suggesting Matthews is a longshot.

[greece66]

It clearly is unlikely, but we have discussed considerably less likely things on this forum before.

However, in the unlikely event that Aldridge talked with the C's and informed them he would sign here if we gave Matthews the ~16MM max deal he wants then I would do it in a heart beat.  I don't really see a better outcome to this summer than adding two players who immediately become our two best players, without giving up a single asset besides cap space.

Argumentum ad passiones and red herring. I rest my case.

Ok I looked that up so I could disagree lol.

I'm not sure how I am appealing to emotion and what the red herring was. We were discussing if it would make sense to do such a deal, not if it was likely (since I already stated it was unlikely and that we discuss unlikely things all the time). I didn't use emotion or try to mislead, I simply stated that signing LMA and Matthews would be a great move.

Argumentum ad antiquitatem!
I'm nitpicking 

Appeal to emotion: where are your facts, Sir? All I see here is excitement and dedication to your team, but this can easily lead to wishful thinking.

Red herring: 'adding two players who immediately become our best players' introduces a new element to the conversation that is not relevant to whether these are the two best players to sign or more generally speaking this would be our best possible move for the summer.

But again we are arguing backwards, we are going from what would be best for the team to what is likely to happen. Even if this were the best of all possible moves for this summer, this makes it only marginally more likely to happen since it can influence decision making only on the Celtics side. Aldridge et al could care less about what is best for us.

Personally, I think the conversation is more fruitful if we discuss better substantiated rumours (eg from journalists who are likely to have inside information) and the options of the player. It does look like Aldridge is considering leaving Portland what other likely destinations are out there?
There are a lot of articles on Aldridge moving to Dallas and SAS. Then some journalists mention LAL and Knicks. The C's could be a dark horse in this race and it is too early to dismiss entirely the possibility of him coming to Boston, but for the time being we are just an outsider and nothing more than that.

[SHAQATTACK]

Sparkler 


 

[YeezusChrist]

Why are people trying to do sign and trades??

Don't players get better deals if they sign right out of free agency to a new team???

we would trade wallace away with a 1st rounder

And if thats the case I would expect Danny to trade both 1st's this year, 2016 cavs/nets/timberwolves, 2017 right to swap with nets, KO and Young and a trade exception for Demarcus hopefully that would finally be enough for the kings
Then work on a trade to move Isaiah and maybe 3 second rounders for Ty Lawson
Then convince both matthews and Aldridge to sign and form a contending team.

trade bradley for 12
trade sully and 12 to move up and grab porzingis if possible

Which would leave us
Pg: Lawson(12.4),turner(3.4)
Sg: Smart(3.4), Crowder/ turner
SF:Matthews(10), Crowder(6.2), Turner
PF: ALdridge(18), Porzingis(4.2)
C:Demarcus(14), Zeller (2.6)

Plus we would have our 2016 and 2017 and 2018 pick along with the 2016 mavs, and 2018 Nets

That would put us over the cap at around the mid 70's  but the cap rises again in 2016

This is possible but.... very optimistic haha