Like it or not, Ainge in driver's seat for Love

[Lucky17]

I mean, we're theoretically talking about trading two future borderline allstars, right?

A bird in the hand is . . . you know.

[D.o.s.]

At this point, there is no indication that Rondo (or Love, if acquired) will forgo free agency to sign a long-term contract with us.

  There's plenty to indicate that Rondo would sign a long term contract with the team.

Please enlighten me, then...

  He's pretty much said so.

He's also said that he wants to explore free agency too, hasn't he? Something like, 'I'm looking forward to it, I've never been in that situation before'?

There's no real proof either way. I don't think Rondo has any idea right now, and is looking towards this season as a measuring stick for whether he'll stay or not.

[MBunge]

If you give up Sully and three 1st rounders for KL and he bolts for another team after one year, you've been taken to the cleaners and ownership would be furious, to say nothing of the fans' reactions.  You'd still have 6 firsts over 4 years, but no Sully either.  With Olynyk, Green and RR, you wouldn't have much of a base to build around, and why then would Rondo reup with the Celts?  He might, but if he didn't want to continue to play for a big loser, he'd be gone with no compensation.  No way DA, or ownership, will assume such risks.

1.  If Ainge gets Love, it is almost certain more moves will come.  Even if he just gets Asik, Boston's line up next season is...

Rondo/Pressey
Bradley/Bayless
Green/Wallace
Love/Olynyk
Asik/Faverani

... with Bass, another perimeter player and probably Iverson filling out the team.

That's clearly a playoff team, especially in the East, and we'd still have multiple 1sts in at least two future drafts, including potential lottery picks from Brooklyn.  Given that we could offer Love more money and with that present and future, there wouldn't be more than 2 or 3 teams in the league that could come close to luring Love away.

And even if Love and then Rondo leave, Boston is left with cap space and lottery picks to tank and sign free agents.

2.  1st round picks are what Boston has to offer.  As of right now, we've got better picks or more picks than any one else.  We could give up 3 picks for Love and still be able to offer 2 or mor picks for Melo or another superstar.  Assets are useless until you do something with them.

3.  A team with Sully and 3 first round picks might be better than one with Love, except they won't be good enough fast enough to work with Rondo.  And if Rondo leaves because Boston sucks, we could have 30 first rounders and not come up with two players as good as Rondo and Love.

There are reasons not to get Love, but the difference between 2 and 3 draft picks cannot be a deal breaker.

Mike

[bucknersrevenge]

At this point, there is no indication that Rondo (or Love, if acquired) will forgo free agency to sign a long-term contract with us.

No, but there is an indication that Rondo will sign a long-term contract with us once reaching free agency.  Don't confuse wanting to reach free agency to sign a contract with being unwilling to stay in Boston.

Will Love stay in Boston if he's traded here?  I don't think anyone knows, including Love.  He might like it here, he might not.  But I would certainly bet on Love staying if the trade were made.  We can offer him more years, more money per year, and an environment where championships are the goal, and not merely making the post-season.  There's certainly a risk, and that should lower the price paid, but the risk is less than some posters would have you believe.  All we know is he's from California and he's tired of losing.  If we win with him, especially with a roster that's built for sustained success, I think the winning will trump California pretty quickly.  Besides, it's not like the Lakers are making the playoffs next year,  and if they do, they probably won't have room for Love in 2015.

TP.

For some reason people keep conveniently leaving this point out of their argument about "no certainty he will sign an extension". Not sure if it's convenience or ignorance. The same reason Love won't sign an extension right away is the same reason why Rondo won't sign an extension right away. It doesn't make sense financially for them to do so ahead of Free Agency where they have the chance to maybe earn more. It doesn't make sense for even Danny to offer one anyway and ruin his cap flexibility before he even has to which is why he'd be fine with making the RIGHT trade to bring Love in even without an extension.

You have completely missed my point, and based on that misinterpretation, rather insultingly made the highlighted comment.  Of course RR and KL are interested in seeing what the free agent market might offer - they'd be fools not to.  My point, however, is that giving up a big package of assets for KL might not result in his ultimately signing a long-term deal with the Celts.  If you surrender Sully and three 1sts, as mooted here, and then KL bolts, you've blown the entire rebuild and set the franchise back 3-4 years.

No.

I did not miss your point. I get it. There is inherent risk in making a trade for a player that by rule does have the option of leaving you high and dry when he becomes a free agent. I understand that point completely. I just happen to think(and many others do as well) that depending on exactly what it would cost that Love is worth the risk. The upside in having him on our team is a calculated risk. And if Love is truly serious about simply wanting to win, he'd be a bonafide idiot not to see the absolute chasm that is the Eastern Conference. Him coming to Boston along with a couple of other shrewd moves could easily make us a Finals contender in the East where there is Miami and then everyone else. Even Indiana could fall back to the pack next year.

The point is, Given what we have to offer: stable ownership committed to winning(vs the nightmarish turnstile of GMs and coaches he has in Minny), an All-Star PG that can get him the ball, a young but competent coach already earning praise in coaching circles, a fan base that remains ravenous about the team even in a down year, a GM with a plan to make the team winners who has already done it before starting from a worse position last time, and a fraqnchise in a Conference with a ton of parity, I'd say Danny has a better shot to keep him here than other teams have to steal him away after he gets here.

I will say one thing about the "setting the franchise back 3-4 years" point. Obviously it's not our goal to do that. And the good thing here I think is that Danny probably already knows what he's willing to give up for Love. The only reason this deal doesn't go through is if Danny decides that Flip Saunders is asking for too much. If Danny walks away from the deal and decides to just make his 6 and 17 picks at the Draft I would be absolutely fine with that. I won't speak for anyone else but I certainly don't think it's Love or bust. It's Love for the right deal and in that matter I trust Danny's judgment.

'Not sure if it's convenience or ignorance' you wrote.  Yeah, you missed my point.  And phrased it as an insult, to boot. 

If nothing else, I admire your versatility...!

Really dude? THAT'S what you took away from my last post.  My God, I'll get you a Band-Aid. I just explained that I understand your concerns about trading for Love and that it's a calculated risk. But it's one that is worth taking to get a player of Love's caliber.  And I trust that Danny will make the best deal or not at all.  What's hard to understand?  If you would quit crying when I didn't even call you out by name, you'd see that I got your point.  I just disagree with it.   How about we put on our big boy pants for a second?

[goCeltics]

Glen Taylor is a billionaire who just made a cash offer for full 100% ownership of the Minneapolis Star-Tribune.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/10997942/minnesota-timberwolves-owner-glen-taylor-signs-star-tribune-purchase-deal

I'm sure he'd have no problem taking on Boozer's expiring deal in a Love trade. That's peanuts to him. If he really needed to, I bet he could buy out Boozer for 75 or 80 cents on the dollar.

Boozer, rights to Mirotic, and two 2014 picks in the teens is a competitive offer for Love.

you have to pay mirotic around 25-30mil/y4 yeas i'm guessing to bring him over, plus $17mil for boozer, that's around 45-50mill all together

using bass+bogans+olynyk+06 pick your paying $7mil for bass, around $6mill/3 years for kelly or sully plus around $13mill/4years for the 06 pick, that's around 25mill.

so tell me would you rather pay $45mill and get mirotic or 25mill and get kelly and the 06 pick, it's not even close

[D.o.s.]

so tell me would you rather pay $45mill and get mirotic or 25mill and get kelly and the 06 pick, it's not even close

So you'd go with Mirotic every time, too?

[goCeltics]

so tell me would you rather pay $45mill and get mirotic or 25mill and get kelly and the 06 pick, it's not even close

So you'd go with Mirotic every time, too?

nope

[Sixth Man]

At this point, there is no indication that Rondo (or Love, if acquired) will forgo free agency to sign a long-term contract with us.

No, but there is an indication that Rondo will sign a long-term contract with us once reaching free agency.  Don't confuse wanting to reach free agency to sign a contract with being unwilling to stay in Boston.

Will Love stay in Boston if he's traded here?  I don't think anyone knows, including Love.  He might like it here, he might not.  But I would certainly bet on Love staying if the trade were made.  We can offer him more years, more money per year, and an environment where championships are the goal, and not merely making the post-season.  There's certainly a risk, and that should lower the price paid, but the risk is less than some posters would have you believe.  All we know is he's from California and he's tired of losing.  If we win with him, especially with a roster that's built for sustained success, I think the winning will trump California pretty quickly.  Besides, it's not like the Lakers are making the playoffs next year,  and if they do, they probably won't have room for Love in 2015.

TP.

For some reason people keep conveniently leaving this point out of their argument about "no certainty he will sign an extension". Not sure if it's convenience or ignorance. The same reason Love won't sign an extension right away is the same reason why Rondo won't sign an extension right away. It doesn't make sense financially for them to do so ahead of Free Agency where they have the chance to maybe earn more. It doesn't make sense for even Danny to offer one anyway and ruin his cap flexibility before he even has to which is why he'd be fine with making the RIGHT trade to bring Love in even without an extension.

You have completely missed my point, and based on that misinterpretation, rather insultingly made the highlighted comment.  Of course RR and KL are interested in seeing what the free agent market might offer - they'd be fools not to.  My point, however, is that giving up a big package of assets for KL might not result in his ultimately signing a long-term deal with the Celts.  If you surrender Sully and three 1sts, as mooted here, and then KL bolts, you've blown the entire rebuild and set the franchise back 3-4 years.

No.

I did not miss your point. I get it. There is inherent risk in making a trade for a player that by rule does have the option of leaving you high and dry when he becomes a free agent. I understand that point completely. I just happen to think(and many others do as well) that depending on exactly what it would cost that Love is worth the risk. The upside in having him on our team is a calculated risk. And if Love is truly serious about simply wanting to win, he'd be a bonafide idiot not to see the absolute chasm that is the Eastern Conference. Him coming to Boston along with a couple of other shrewd moves could easily make us a Finals contender in the East where there is Miami and then everyone else. Even Indiana could fall back to the pack next year.

The point is, Given what we have to offer: stable ownership committed to winning(vs the nightmarish turnstile of GMs and coaches he has in Minny), an All-Star PG that can get him the ball, a young but competent coach already earning praise in coaching circles, a fan base that remains ravenous about the team even in a down year, a GM with a plan to make the team winners who has already done it before starting from a worse position last time, and a fraqnchise in a Conference with a ton of parity, I'd say Danny has a better shot to keep him here than other teams have to steal him away after he gets here.

I will say one thing about the "setting the franchise back 3-4 years" point. Obviously it's not our goal to do that. And the good thing here I think is that Danny probably already knows what he's willing to give up for Love. The only reason this deal doesn't go through is if Danny decides that Flip Saunders is asking for too much. If Danny walks away from the deal and decides to just make his 6 and 17 picks at the Draft I would be absolutely fine with that. I won't speak for anyone else but I certainly don't think it's Love or bust. It's Love for the right deal and in that matter I trust Danny's judgment.

'Not sure if it's convenience or ignorance' you wrote.  Yeah, you missed my point.  And phrased it as an insult, to boot. 

If nothing else, I admire your versatility...!

Really dude? THAT'S what you took away from my last post.  My God, I'll get you a Band-Aid. I just explained that I understand your concerns about trading for Love and that it's a calculated risk. But it's one that is worth taking to get a player of Love's caliber.  And I trust that Danny will make the best deal or not at all.  What's hard to understand?  If you would quit crying when I didn't even call you out by name, you'd see that I got your point.  I just disagree with it.   How about we put on our big boy pants for a second?

You're a boor, and a not particularly clever one at that...

[Celtics4ever]

player of Love's caliber.

What caliber is that.  This has him at top five.   Some here act as if he is top three.   I think he is at least top ten but top five I am not so sure.

http://www.complex.com/sports/2014/02/25-best-players-in-the-nba-right-now/kevin-love

[bucknersrevenge]

At this point, there is no indication that Rondo (or Love, if acquired) will forgo free agency to sign a long-term contract with us.

No, but there is an indication that Rondo will sign a long-term contract with us once reaching free agency.  Don't confuse wanting to reach free agency to sign a contract with being unwilling to stay in Boston.

Will Love stay in Boston if he's traded here?  I don't think anyone knows, including Love.  He might like it here, he might not.  But I would certainly bet on Love staying if the trade were made.  We can offer him more years, more money per year, and an environment where championships are the goal, and not merely making the post-season.  There's certainly a risk, and that should lower the price paid, but the risk is less than some posters would have you believe.  All we know is he's from California and he's tired of losing.  If we win with him, especially with a roster that's built for sustained success, I think the winning will trump California pretty quickly.  Besides, it's not like the Lakers are making the playoffs next year,  and if they do, they probably won't have room for Love in 2015.

TP.

For some reason people keep conveniently leaving this point out of their argument about "no certainty he will sign an extension". Not sure if it's convenience or ignorance. The same reason Love won't sign an extension right away is the same reason why Rondo won't sign an extension right away. It doesn't make sense financially for them to do so ahead of Free Agency where they have the chance to maybe earn more. It doesn't make sense for even Danny to offer one anyway and ruin his cap flexibility before he even has to which is why he'd be fine with making the RIGHT trade to bring Love in even without an extension.

You have completely missed my point, and based on that misinterpretation, rather insultingly made the highlighted comment.  Of course RR and KL are interested in seeing what the free agent market might offer - they'd be fools not to.  My point, however, is that giving up a big package of assets for KL might not result in his ultimately signing a long-term deal with the Celts.  If you surrender Sully and three 1sts, as mooted here, and then KL bolts, you've blown the entire rebuild and set the franchise back 3-4 years.

No.

I did not miss your point. I get it. There is inherent risk in making a trade for a player that by rule does have the option of leaving you high and dry when he becomes a free agent. I understand that point completely. I just happen to think(and many others do as well) that depending on exactly what it would cost that Love is worth the risk. The upside in having him on our team is a calculated risk. And if Love is truly serious about simply wanting to win, he'd be a bonafide idiot not to see the absolute chasm that is the Eastern Conference. Him coming to Boston along with a couple of other shrewd moves could easily make us a Finals contender in the East where there is Miami and then everyone else. Even Indiana could fall back to the pack next year.

The point is, Given what we have to offer: stable ownership committed to winning(vs the nightmarish turnstile of GMs and coaches he has in Minny), an All-Star PG that can get him the ball, a young but competent coach already earning praise in coaching circles, a fan base that remains ravenous about the team even in a down year, a GM with a plan to make the team winners who has already done it before starting from a worse position last time, and a fraqnchise in a Conference with a ton of parity, I'd say Danny has a better shot to keep him here than other teams have to steal him away after he gets here.

I will say one thing about the "setting the franchise back 3-4 years" point. Obviously it's not our goal to do that. And the good thing here I think is that Danny probably already knows what he's willing to give up for Love. The only reason this deal doesn't go through is if Danny decides that Flip Saunders is asking for too much. If Danny walks away from the deal and decides to just make his 6 and 17 picks at the Draft I would be absolutely fine with that. I won't speak for anyone else but I certainly don't think it's Love or bust. It's Love for the right deal and in that matter I trust Danny's judgment.

'Not sure if it's convenience or ignorance' you wrote.  Yeah, you missed my point.  And phrased it as an insult, to boot. 

If nothing else, I admire your versatility...!

Really dude? THAT'S what you took away from my last post.  My God, I'll get you a Band-Aid. I just explained that I understand your concerns about trading for Love and that it's a calculated risk. But it's one that is worth taking to get a player of Love's caliber.  And I trust that Danny will make the best deal or not at all.  What's hard to understand?  If you would quit crying when I didn't even call you out by name, you'd see that I got your point.  I just disagree with it.   How about we put on our big boy pants for a second?

You're a boor, and a not particularly clever one at that...

I know you are but what am I?

[Irish Stew]

I completely agree with celtsfanforlife's analysis of what other Love contenders can offer. We can blow all other offers away. Where I would disagree with him is not adding the 4th draft pick if you have too. Getting Love is too important to let this opportunity get away. Once we have two all-stars, we can add a veteran rim defender, reup Bradley and we already have Green. That makes us at least the 3 or 4 seed in the East. Over the next year or two, we will probably be able to add the third all-star that you need to compete for a title because we are now an attractive destination for good players trapped in bad situations just like Kevin Love.

[SHAQATTACK]

I completely agree with celtsfanforlife's analysis of what other Love contenders can offer. We can blow all other offers away. Where I would disagree with him is not adding the 4th draft pick if you have too. Getting Love is too important to let this opportunity get away. Once we have two all-stars, we can add a veteran rim defender, reup Bradley and we already have Green. That makes us at least the 3 or 4 seed in the East. Over the next year or two, we will probably be able to add the third all-star that you need to compete for a title because we are now an attractive destination for good players trapped in bad situations just like Kevin Love.

Yup.....wouldn't Drummond be a a nice Center to pair with Love and Rondo.

[knuckleballer]

In Chris Forsberg's mailbag, he suggests Sully, the#6 pick, and a protected Brooklyn pick for Love.  I'd do that deal in a heartbeat.

[SHAQATTACK]

Sure there are risks about trading for Love without an extension.

On the other hand,

Standing around and doing NOTHiNG is also a terrible risk , and BAD business ,  the Celtics can not afford to sit idle for another 25 years waiting for a lottery LeBron James to fall from the sky.

Not landing Love is a lot worse to me than bringing him in for only a year guareentee deal

Sully is a good building block,  but with Love .....the serious players or elites might NOW give Boston a look as a serious team once again.  Or even a young all star prospect unhappy on a bad team , may want to sign on.

It takes stars to attract other stars who care about titles or winning as much as the money.

[BballTim]

At this point, there is no indication that Rondo (or Love, if acquired) will forgo free agency to sign a long-term contract with us.

  There's plenty to indicate that Rondo would sign a long term contract with the team.

Please enlighten me, then...

  He's pretty much said so.

Which means that you've pretty much said that he's pretty much said so.  Thanks for the clarification and also for not burdening me with an actual quote from Rondo...

  Sorry, when you said "there is no indication that Rondo would sign a contract with us" I didn't realize that you meant "I have no idea whether or not there's any indication that Rondo would sign a long term contract with us". Start with this, but I'm sure you'd be able to find more "indications" if you look hard enough.

http://espn.go.com/boston/nba/story/_/id/9796290/rajon-rondo-not-looking-leave-boston-celtics-rebuilding-period