Would Josh Smith AND Big Al Be Enough?

[PhoSita]

Josh Smith.  Al Jefferson.  These are two popular names around here these days.  People are proposing trade / free agent scenarios with both of these guys, who are entering unrestricted free agency this summer.

I'm of the opinion that getting either one of these guys alone would not be enough to push our current squad over the top, even if you could somehow get them without giving up Pierce or KG.  I'm also of the opinion that building a team around one of these two and Rondo would not be enough to be any better than the Hawks or the Nets.

However, setting aside whether or not such a scenario is realistic, imagine that Danny Ainge could find a way to sign and trade for Josh Smith AND Al Jefferson this summer, trading away or waiving Pierce and KG in the process.

Imagine that the team then moves forward with a core group of Rondo, Green, Smith, and Jefferson.  That's the core we're locked into for the next 4-5 years.

Is that enough for you?  Would you be excited to watch that team?  Or would you rather see the team forget the "reload" option and just start over with young faces, or try to build around Rondo some other way?  Would you rather just "run it back" with essentially the same group?



Personally, I'm not sure that team would ever be more than a 50-55 win 2nd round exit.  But I think there's an outside chance Rondo could have one of his Playoffs-MVP type runs and lead the team deep.  That could be fun.

[gpap]

Hmm, good question. I'd like to have either Al or Josh ALONG with KG.

I'd hate to lose KG because he provides the experience/intensity of the team and I think his presence would only help either Smith or Al.

[AB_Celtic]

Is that enough for you?  Would you be excited to watch that team?

Yes, absolutely. I think Smith's defense and Jefferson's offense would complement each other very nicely. If we can somehow use the MLE on a solid backup PG (Jose Calderon anyone?) then I'd be very content with that team.

[badshar]

The day Pierce leaves, the team's performance will severely deteriorate. When Perkins left, the team went downhill for the next couple of games purely because of emotions and the fact that Perkins was such an integral part of the team. Compare that to Pierce, who has been a Celtic for life, been the captain for much of his tenure and has been the face of the franchise since he joined the Celtics, the day he leaves, the overflow of emotions will take over the team, way more than it did when Perkins left.

Not just that, the day Pierce leaves, KG will retire, Doc will second guess whether he wants to come back and Rondo well completely lose interest.

The culture of this franchise will be tuned.

At that point, no matter who you get (Big Sl or J-Smoove), we aren't getting anywhere.

[Fred Roberts]

Possibly .. . it would be a very interesting team. Long, athletic, highly skilled, and all in the 27-28 type age group (which generally means in their prime).

I think the obvious issue with that core is the lack of quality shooting. Al Jeff would be a revelation as a paint scorer. Rondo and Josh are working on their shooting, but let's be honest, they're below avg shooters and succeed in the slash and drive situations. Jeff Green is the only above avg outside shooter (in addition to many other skill sets) of the group, so my thought is we'd have to load up on outside shooters.

I'd keep Terrence Williams around for his overall skill set, but he's not a good outside shooter either. Avery Bradley can be a decent outside shooter, though he hasn't shown it lately. We'd need to the Posey / House types to come in a BOMB threes in order to keep teams honest. I guess the JET could do that for a couple years. Kyle Korver would be a good addition.

Overall, the fast break potential with Rondo, Avery, Green, Josh and T-Will would be amazing.

[LooseCannon]

I am not enthusiastic about Al Jefferson and I want a big who is a better jump shooter than Josh Smith.

[kozlodoev]

I don't understand the fascination with Al Jefferson. As an overall basketball player he's just not that good -- he's never been good enough of a defensive presence at the center position, and that ACL injury has reduced him from "potentiall special" to "very good" offensive player.

[gpap]

The day Pierce leaves, the team's performance will severely deteriorate. When Perkins left, the team went downhill for the next couple of games purely because of emotions and the fact that Perkins was such an integral part of the team. Compare that to Pierce, who has been a Celtic for life, been the captain for much of his tenure and has been the face of the franchise since he joined the Celtics, the day he leaves, the overflow of emotions will take over the team, way more than it did when Perkins left.

Not just that, the day Pierce leaves, KG will retire, Doc will second guess whether he wants to come back and Rondo well completely lose interest.

The culture of this franchise will be tuned.

At that point, no matter who you get (Big Sl or J-Smoove), we aren't getting anywhere.

Disagree. When Perk was dealt, he was still very much in his prime and was uniquely talented with his tough defense.

On the flip side, Pierce has been declining badly the last couple years. I think it would be silly to keep a roster spot occupied purely for nostalgic reasons.

If Pierce would accept a bench role, that would be one thing. But if you can deal him and get something of use, I say go for it.

To be honest, I would rather deal Rondo for either a Gasol, Jefferson, Millsap or Cousins and keep Paul, have him come off the bench.

But I would also understand if Danny felt the need to deal him.

[badshar]

The day Pierce leaves, the team's performance will severely deteriorate. When Perkins left, the team went downhill for the next couple of games purely because of emotions and the fact that Perkins was such an integral part of the team. Compare that to Pierce, who has been a Celtic for life, been the captain for much of his tenure and has been the face of the franchise since he joined the Celtics, the day he leaves, the overflow of emotions will take over the team, way more than it did when Perkins left.

Not just that, the day Pierce leaves, KG will retire, Doc will second guess whether he wants to come back and Rondo well completely lose interest.

The culture of this franchise will be tuned.

At that point, no matter who you get (Big Sl or J-Smoove), we aren't getting anywhere.

Disagree. When Perk was dealt, he was still very much in his prime and was uniquely talented with his tough defense.

On the flip side, Pierce has been declining badly the last couple years. I think it would be silly to keep a roster spot occupied purely for nostalgic reasons.

If Pierce would accept a bench role, that would be one thing. But if you can deal him and get something of use, I say go for it.

To be honest, I would rather deal Rondo for either a Gasol, Jefferson, Millsap or Cousins and keep Paul, have him come off the bench.

But I would also understand if Danny felt the need to deal him.

Except, people here want to trade him, not to improve the team, but because they just want to trade him.

Plus, you can't just base opinions according to what people say here. If Rondo has one bad game, these people make 100 threads saying how useless he is and the day he has a good game, people start comparing him to legends.

Sure Pierce has been declining, as has every player in the NBA at his age, but that doesn't mean you just trade him. You guys only look at stats. NBA life doesn't start and end on the stat sheet.

If KG sets the most important screen to get Pierce wide open for the game winning shot (which he makes), the stat sheet will show that Pierce made the game winning shot. No one will mention that it was KG who created and gave Pierce a wide open shot instead of forcing him to shoot right in his opponent's face.

Pierce brings far too much to this team to just trade him for the heck of it.

No, Josh Smith will not do for this team what Paul Pierce does, even at this age.

At end game situations, I would take Pierce over Smith at every opportunity.
Taking those midrange jumpers that Smith loves, I would take Pierce over Smith at every opportunity.
Playing and making decisions based on Basketball IQ, I would Pierce over Smith at every opportunity.
For leadership, I would take Pierce over Smith at every opportunity.
For pure offense, I would take Pierce over Smith at every opportunity.

Everyone complains and uses Pierce's game 6 shooting as an excuse to why we should trade him, but they completely ignore the fact that:

1. Rondo wasn't playing, forcing PP to run the team and the entire offense, which he has not done much since 2009.
2. PP wasn't fully healthy, he was dealing with many injuries too.
3. PP was severely overplayed. KG had a limit on his minutes throughout the season which allowed him to go all out in the playoffs. PP didn't. Pierce had no minute restriction and not much of a rest in the regular season. He consistently played 30-48 minute range in the regular season which tired him out. Now you want him to play 40+ minutes per game and run the offense?

The truth is Pierce brings far more value to this team than anyone you trade him for will bring to this team.

[KGs Knee]

Putting aside whether or not such a move would be beneficial or not, I just don't think it's possible to get both through a S&T.

I don't think either Atlanta or Utah have any interest in Pierce.  Utah isn't likely to be a desirable location in Pierce's eyes, so he'd likely demand a buyout.  Pierce might be ok with going to Atlanta, but they pretty much already have shown they're not interested in Pierce.  Remember, the rumored trade deadline three-way deal with Atlanta had Pierce going to Dallas.

The problem is, including Pierce in a trade with a team that would likely want to buy him out, eliminates the possibility of the trade bringing back a player through a sign-and-trade.  Free agents can not be signed until after Pierce would need to be waived.  Therefore, we really can only trade Pierce (prior to the buyout date) to a team that has a player already under contract to send us in return.

The only way I could see this working is if we managed to pull off two separate three-way trades, and, both of the 'third teams' involved had players/assets Utah and Atlanta were actually interested in.

[SHAQATTACK]

All I know is don't want Al Jefferson , unless he replaces Bass and maybe that is wrong too.... .   Al Jefferson is no where the player we need.   Rather have Milsap if you just have to have a Utah player...geeess pete....what is it with BIG AL fan club. 


Like J. Smith...if he would play for HALF of what he wants  and be fined by DA everytime he takes a jumper futher than 15-17 feet out, so we could get a 7 foot ish player to play defense when KG is gone or sitting.


Utah wouldn't wants to DUMP AL JEFFERSON.....if n he was worth a plug nickel , then they would n't want him gone.

PLEASE AL Jefferson only CHEAP , SUPER CHEAP last resort.    If he begs DA to hire him.


I'm not for just DUMPING Pierce to have a NEW TOY ,   dumping him for Crap contract for Smith or a loser like Jefferson is a bad idea.......doing nothing seems more prudent.

[SHAQATTACK]

I am not enthusiastic about Al Jefferson and I want a big who is a better jump shooter than Josh Smith.

I didn't see you post until now, but this is my exact thinking as well

[syfy9]

I don't understand the fascination with Al Jefferson. As an overall basketball player he's just not that good -- he's never been good enough of a defensive presence at the center position, and that ACL injury has reduced him from "potentiall special" to "very good" offensive player.

Al is the most skilled post player in the NBA. He has the most moves and I am just astonished at how he seemingly is able to get guys in the air and score so fluidly. Having an elite low post option would help any team's offense.

He's not a horrible defender anymore - somewhere around average. He's not entirely beneficial on defense, but he isn't a liability.

All I know is don't want Al Jefferson , unless he replaces Bass and maybe that is wrong too.... .   Al Jefferson is no where the player we need.   Rather have Milsap if you just have to have a Utah player...geeess pete....what is it with BIG AL fan club. 

Why do you believe that the Celtics don't need a capable post player that they can revolve their offense around? Al is the sort of player that the Celtics desperately need. Another scoring option that they can go to to take away the load from KG and Pierce.



And if the Jazz really wanted to trade Al, they would've done so before the trade deadline earlier this year. Instead, they kept him - why do you think they did that?

[Evantime34]

Josh Smith.  Al Jefferson.  These are two popular names around here these days.  People are proposing trade / free agent scenarios with both of these guys, who are entering unrestricted free agency this summer.

I'm of the opinion that getting either one of these guys alone would not be enough to push our current squad over the top, even if you could somehow get them without giving up Pierce or KG.  I'm also of the opinion that building a team around one of these two and Rondo would not be enough to be any better than the Hawks or the Nets.

However, setting aside whether or not such a scenario is realistic, imagine that Danny Ainge could find a way to sign and trade for Josh Smith AND Al Jefferson this summer, trading away or waiving Pierce and KG in the process.

Imagine that the team then moves forward with a core group of Rondo, Green, Smith, and Jefferson.  That's the core we're locked into for the next 4-5 years.

Is that enough for you?  Would you be excited to watch that team?  Or would you rather see the team forget the "reload" option and just start over with young faces, or try to build around Rondo some other way?  Would you rather just "run it back" with essentially the same group?



Personally, I'm not sure that team would ever be more than a 50-55 win 2nd round exit.  But I think there's an outside chance Rondo could have one of his Playoffs-MVP type runs and lead the team deep.  That could be fun.

I would be very happy with this team. Is it an NBA title winner? Not likely. It is an athletic team that will force a lot of turnovers and run outs? Absolutely. It will be entertaining as hell. Josh Smith and Rondo's performance are so variable but if both are on at the same team not many teams will beat us. I love Jefferson as a post scorer, because as of now we don't have a half court offense.

The team might lack shooting but Terry, Bass, Crawford and Sullinger can all hit jumpers off the bench. I would still want to bring in a shooter like Korver for some floor spacing. But I think this team would be great to watch.

[Evantime34]

All I know is don't want Al Jefferson , unless he replaces Bass and maybe that is wrong too.... .   Al Jefferson is no where the player we need.   Rather have Milsap if you just have to have a Utah player...geeess pete....what is it with BIG AL fan club. 


Like J. Smith...if he would play for HALF of what he wants  and be fined by DA everytime he takes a jumper futher than 15-17 feet out, so we could get a 7 foot ish player to play defense when KG is gone or sitting.


Utah wouldn't wants to DUMP AL JEFFERSON.....if n he was worth a plug nickel , then they would n't want him gone.

PLEASE AL Jefferson only CHEAP , SUPER CHEAP last resort.    If he begs DA to hire him.


I'm not for just DUMPING Pierce to have a NEW TOY ,   dumping him for Crap contract for Smith or a loser like Jefferson is a bad idea.......doing nothing seems more prudent.

The only reason Utah is thinking about letting Jefferson walk is because they already have Kanter and Favors under contract. If we had those two we wouldn't need Jefferson either.

What do you not like about Jefferson? He can create his own high percentage shot when he gets the ball in the post. He is a good rebounder and can block some shots.

Our biggest problem is offense in the half court and he could help us greatly in that.