2011 CB draft: How does my team look?/division rankings

[indeedproceed]

and then after he sees playing time is then being trade for ____ ________, an underwhelming SF.

Binkie alert!

[RebusRankin]

What is wrong with San Antonio? Cousins? Boozer? Wright?

[action781]

What is wrong with San Antonio? Cousins? Boozer? Wright?

I think people here value defense.  What's up with that? 

 

Seriously though, I can't really picture those guys all fitting together well.  None of them are particularly known as team players.

One thing I will say though, Carlos Boozer always seems to play on a winning team.  He has always been the #2 option for a team with a really good point guard and a pretty so-so remaining cast and has been consistently leading those teams to very good regular season records.  And you've got that really good point guard.  I really don't like the way Boozer and Cousins fit together.  I think Boozers needs a vet next to him.  No particular offense or defense specialist, just a veteran.

[action781]

Atlantic:
1.  76ers*
2.  Celtics*
3.  Knicks*
4.  Nets*

Central:
1.  Pawnee*
2.  Chicago*
3.  El Salvador*
4.  Detroit

Southeast:
1.  Washington*
2.  Orlando
3.  Atlanta
4.  Miami

You guys were right, the East is pretty weak.

Southwest:
1.  Dallas*
2.  Memphis*
3.  San Antonio
4.  Cleveland

Northwest:
1.  OKC*
2.  Denver*
3.  Portland*
4.  Utah*

Pacific:
1.  Sacramento*
2.  Golden State*
3.  Phoenix
4.  LA Conspiracy

That Northwest division is very tough and are all separated by very little.  I initially had written "4 way tie", but that's lame so I just went with something.

[mgent]

In my opinion, Kyle Lowry is a better PG than Billups in every possible sense.

Experience?  Leadership?  Shooting?  Efficiency?  Getting to the line?  Playing off the ball?

Can't debate it: Experience, getting to the line, playing off the ball

Will debate it/not a clear winner: Shooting, efficiency, leadership

Leadership I almost put in the first catagoery, but I'm telling you Lowry made me a believer after the (diva volume scoring PG who wore an awesome draft suit) fiasco/trade. He almost single handedly hauled that Rockets team kicking and screaming into the playoffs.

EDIT: Actually nevermind. Billups is a better leader if only by virtue of his past accomplishments. I just don't think its a 'weakness' in Lowry. He's just not on Billups level there.

Shooting?  How can you argue shooting?  Lowry is a career 32% 3pt shooter.  Billups has averaged 2 a game for like the past 10 years while shooting 39% is probably second only to Nash as far as PGs go.

Billups is among the best shooters in the league both off the dribble and spotting up, from any distance.

[Edgar]

Atlantic:

1. Philly*
2. Nets*
3. Boston*
4. Knicks*

Central:

1. Pawnee*   
2. El Salvador*
3. Detroit
4. Chicago

Southeast:

1. Washington*
2. Orlando*
3. Miami
4. Atlanta

=================================================

Southwest:

1. Memphis*
2. Cleveland*
3. Dallas
4. San Antonio

Northwest:

1. Denver*
2.(tie) Portland*
2. (tie)OKC*
4. Utah

Pacific:

1. Sacramento*
2. Phoenix*
3. Golden State*
4. Los Angeles


My divisional rankings aren't all that different than Roy's except in the Atlantic which I see as a very close division from top to bottom.

I left the playoff teams the same as I really couldn't disagree with them but think that Dallas and San Antonio are right on the heals of the 7 and 8 spots in the West. In the east there are probably right now three playoff teams that wouldn't make the playoffs if they were out west.

I will say we are only through the first week and trades and drafting surprises and talented players dropping farther down the draft will happen and anything is still possible and teams could get a lot better and a lot worse. So take this as a very preliminary look.

At this time I think there are 7 clear title contenders, 2 in the East and 5 out West. But once again, that could all change.

I think there are two clear teams that have separated themselves for Team of the Future and one is clearly in the lead.

Again, this is just my opinion and not that of the Sacramento Kings as the Kings vote will be a collaborated combined vote so please do not associate these ranking as those belonging to the Kings. Rondo and I will confer and may have a very different view on things as a team.

I understand your logic and appreciatte but i am closest to first than most think
just watch for the bench to lock it


PS Still buying a 6th roudner with a 7th and a 9th
and a 11th and a beer and a hug, and 100 tps an....

[Roy H.]

In my opinion, Kyle Lowry is a better PG than Billups in every possible sense.

Experience?  Leadership?  Shooting?  Efficiency?  Getting to the line?  Playing off the ball?

Can't debate it: Experience, getting to the line, playing off the ball

Will debate it/not a clear winner: Shooting, efficiency, leadership

Leadership I almost put in the first catagoery, but I'm telling you Lowry made me a believer after the (diva volume scoring PG who wore an awesome draft suit) fiasco/trade. He almost single handedly hauled that Rockets team kicking and screaming into the playoffs.

EDIT: Actually nevermind. Billups is a better leader if only by virtue of his past accomplishments. I just don't think its a 'weakness' in Lowry. He's just not on Billups level there.

Shooting?  How can you argue shooting?  Lowry is a career 32% 3pt shooter.  Billups has averaged 2 a game for like the past 10 years while shooting 39% is probably second only to Nash as far as PGs go.

Billups is among the best shooters in the league both off the dribble and spotting up, from any distance.

I don't see how efficiency can be debated, either:

Chauncey: .519 eFG%, .617 TS%
Lowry: .506 eFG%, .550 TS%

[nickagneta]

You have a lot of good players, Edgar, but they are older and slower up front and against the Pawnee with younger, stronger, faster players and they  have more recently been successful as a unit(all three front court members have played together and been healthy and getting better for 3 years).

Deron is definitely one of the best point guards in the league but Parker is no slouch and you advantage their isn't huge. You will definitely have an advantage at the SG spot unless the Pawnee can pull off some great trade but Indiana is just better up front at every position and have chemistry and history.

Both teams are very good and separated from the rest of that division but I think the Pawnee are just better right now. Key words....right now. Everything and anything is still possible.

[Fafnir]

You know, you might be right.

Look at Hickson's shot location success:

http://www.hoopdata.com/player.aspx?name=J.J.%20Hickson

32% on all shots outside the rim area isn't probably the guy you want to pair next to Noah.

hicksons more productive when hes not the main guy look at his numbers with and without lebron.  hickson would not be taking alot of shots with a kobe/melo team and he can focus on rebounding which is a strength for him.

2009 fga  6.4 fg% 55%
2010 fga  11.9 fg% 45%

I agree that Hickson plays best when not a primary or even secondary option on offense.  Funny you guys don't like his rebounding.  When I think of Hickson, I picture somebody attacking the offensive glass.

His defensive rebounding was poor for a PF with his athleticism. Only when the Cavs moved him to C did he start getting many boards.

[Edgar]

You have a lot of good players, Edgar, but they are older and slower up front and against the Pawnee with younger, stronger, faster players and they  have more recently been successful as a unit(all three front court members have played together and been healthy and getting better for 3 years).

Deron is definitely one of the best point guards in the league but Parker is no slouch and you advantage their isn't huge. You will definitely have an advantage at the SG spot unless the Pawnee can pull off some great trade but Indiana is just better up front at every position and have chemistry and history.

Both teams are very good and separated from the rest of that division but I think the Pawnee are just better right now. Key words....right now. Everything and anything is still possible.

Everything is possible

p.s. I am trading for a 6th offering a 7th a 9th a beer a tamal a pupusa  a salvaorean b beer, panda hug, 100 tps, eternal gratitude, one cars sticker, a lesson to make ninja signs, one kolashampan, coffe, ..................

[nickagneta]

In my opinion, Kyle Lowry is a better PG than Billups in every possible sense.

Experience?  Leadership?  Shooting?  Efficiency?  Getting to the line?  Playing off the ball?

Can't debate it: Experience, getting to the line, playing off the ball

Will debate it/not a clear winner: Shooting, efficiency, leadership

Leadership I almost put in the first catagoery, but I'm telling you Lowry made me a believer after the (diva volume scoring PG who wore an awesome draft suit) fiasco/trade. He almost single handedly hauled that Rockets team kicking and screaming into the playoffs.

EDIT: Actually nevermind. Billups is a better leader if only by virtue of his past accomplishments. I just don't think its a 'weakness' in Lowry. He's just not on Billups level there.

Shooting?  How can you argue shooting?  Lowry is a career 32% 3pt shooter.  Billups has averaged 2 a game for like the past 10 years while shooting 39% is probably second only to Nash as far as PGs go.

Billups is among the best shooters in the league both off the dribble and spotting up, from any distance.

I don't see how efficiency can be debated, either:

Chauncey: .519 eFG%, .617 TS%
Lowry: .506 eFG%, .550 TS%

So what you gentlemen have basically shown is that in intangibles Lowry is a more efficient player and a better shooter. IP has already admitted that Chauncey already is a better leader, gets to the whole better and plays better off the ball.

I will add that Chauncey is a better post up option as a guard, a much more clutch performer(his nickname is "Mr. Big Shot) and a better distributor. IP says Lowry is but Chauncey's numbers were top 10-15 in the league in assists when he was with Detroit. His assist numbers dipped once he got paired with Melo because Melo is ball dominant and takes the ball out of Billups hands to create his own shots.

Lowry is better in transition and a better man defender. that's about it. I like Lowry. he had a heck of a year. But he needs to show me more than a great second half with a below average Houston team for me to believe he is for real or, at this point, anywhere near the player Chauncey Billups is.

[nickagneta]

You have a lot of good players, Edgar, but they are older and slower up front and against the Pawnee with younger, stronger, faster players and they  have more recently been successful as a unit(all three front court members have played together and been healthy and getting better for 3 years).

Deron is definitely one of the best point guards in the league but Parker is no slouch and you advantage their isn't huge. You will definitely have an advantage at the SG spot unless the Pawnee can pull off some great trade but Indiana is just better up front at every position and have chemistry and history.

Both teams are very good and separated from the rest of that division but I think the Pawnee are just better right now. Key words....right now. Everything and anything is still possible.

Everything is possible

p.s. I am trading for a 6th offering a 7th a 9th a beer a tamal a pupusa  a salvaorean b beer, panda hug, 100 tps, eternal gratitude, one cars sticker, a lesson to make ninja signs, one kolashampan, coffe, ..................

Those decisions now rest in the hands of Rondo but I do have to admit that if I was making the decision, I might have done itbecause of the beer, tamale and pupusa. My stomach makes my mind do funny things sometimes

[Edgar]

Not to mention originality allows to show or hide weakness

And i will put  a case in the supreme court against copying an existing team

 

[nickagneta]

Not to mention originality allows to show weakness

And i will put  a case in the supreme court against copying an existing team

 

Didn't you do that last year?

[Yoki_IsTheName]

Anyone wanna waste their time in a divisional breakdown?

It's not a "breakdown", but here's a very quick sketch of how I see the divisions breaking down.  This is done on incomplete information, though -- if team rosters weren't updated in the official thread, I went by memory.  In other words, if I massively underrated your team, it's your own fault.

Atlantic:

1. Boston*
2. Philly*
------------------ (gap)
3. Knicks*
4. Nets*

Central:

1. Pawnee*   
2. El Salvador*
----------------------- (gap)
3. Detroit
4. Chicago

Southeast:

1. Washington*
--------------------- (gap)
2. Orlando*
3. Miami
--------------------- (gap)
4. Atlanta

=================================================

Southwest:

1. Memphis*
2. Cleveland*
--------------- (gap)
3. San Antonio
4. Dallas

Northwest:

1. Denver*
2. Portland*
------------------ (gap)
3. OKC*
4. Utah

Pacific:

1. Sacramento*
2. Golden State*
----------------------- (gap)
3. Phoenix*
-----------------------
4. Los Angeles


I had a hard time finding eight playoff teams in the East, and I had trouble limiting myself to eight teams in the West.  I think the West is both deeper and has more contenders than the East.

Wow, a team with solid defense, a great passer, good rebounding (on both sides) rebounding, athletic and can score in the last place?

Atlanta has probably on of the best passers and penetration-guy in the game in Rondo.

Yes Caron will play outside to stretch the floor. He's a 37% 3 point shooter but he will play to shoot behind the rainbow. And this team have Jamal Crawford who, even at 36% percent is still a respected outside shooter to bring in if Caron is not hitting shots.

A PF who even though has maturity and laziness on defense issues is still a close double-double machine, with still enough potential to improve more, as he is improving every year.

A team who, it's starting 5 alone is averaging a career 8 offensive rebounds a game will create a lot of second chance opportunities.

A team with great defense (PF being the only liability but can be covered up by a tenacious SF and C), shot blockers/alterers and can create turnovers.

I understand not making the playoffs but last place? C'mon.