Report: Carmelo to NY is finally official

[JSD]

On my mind:

- The Knicks now become major buyout buyers.

-They still get knocked out in the 1st round, b ut they'll do it in a more exciting fashion.

- The East Will be a better conference than the West very soon.

- It looks like the Knicks will have Amare and Melo plus enough cap room next off-season for a max guy.

How will they have max room next off-season? Melo/Amar'e combined make 40-mill. They'd have to literally renounce everybody and everything outside of Melo/Amar'e, and even then, I believe a max guy would have to take a pay cut.

They'll renounce everyone or package them in a S&T/absorb. Chris Paul will be a Knick within the next 18 months.

Even if they do, depending on where the cap is under the new CBA, Paul would still have to take a paycut. I don't see him willing to do that.

The players will more than likely have a rollback similar to the NHL. This would make everything relative.

Paul could cut half his salary and make it back in NY fairly easly.

[Cman]

BTW, anyone have insight as to why Minny had to get involved?  Anyone like the deal from Minny point of view?  i don't...

[Roy H.]

BTW, anyone have insight as to why Minny had to get involved?  Anyone like the deal from Minny point of view?  i don't...

Minnesota was going to let Brewer walk in the off-season.  They didn't really add anything to their payroll, between giving up Brewer, taking on Curry's and Randolph's remaining salaries, and gaining $3 million.  Whatever they did add, it was worth it to pick up a player of Randolph's talent, even if he doesn't have an immediate spot in Minnesota's starting lineup.

[Casperian]

You can´t overpay if you get clearly the best player in the deal.

New York definitely won this deal.

[KCattheStripe]

I dunno man, we may be using the term superstar a little loosely. Was Bernard King a superstar? Adrian Dantley? This is the level of player Melo is.

Was Pierce a superstar in 02-06? Because Carmelo is a marginally better version of Pierce from those seasons right now.

EDIT: I'm not saying Pierce was or wasn't a 'superstar'..I'm just saying...that's what NY is getting.

I just would never gut my franchise for that. The most underrated thing Danny Ainge has ever done is refuse to let Rondo or Perk be a part of the Ray and KG deals. He knew that if he couldn't put a team around them than the new players, even a top 5 PF of all time,  would mean diddly.The Knicks just gutted their roster of their 2nd, 3rd and 4th most talented players, I don't see how adding a superstar to that helps all that much.

Well, I'd contest that they gutted their team...or I guess more accurately, that what they gave up compares to in any way to what they're getting back.

They're a .500 team. Felton (whether because of the trade rumors or whatever) was not playing like he was in the beginning of the season. They were not going to keep Wilson Chandler if they resigned Melo in the off-season...so don't even think about Chandler in the situation long-term.

Really what they did was decide to trade Raymond Felton, Gallinari, a mid-round 1st, and a project center for one of the best scorers in the game, rather than keep Gallinari and hope that the Nuggets don't get Anthony to sign an extension with them or any other team before the end of the season.

They got the bird in hand..and really it came down to maybe losing Carmelo but keeping Gallinari, who Carmelo was replacing in the starting lineup, or just getting Carmelo, but this time for realsies.

Plus, much like Miami, this whole thing doesn't really shake out until next season, or the season after. Ironically, the biggest missing piece for both Miami and NY now is Kendrick Perkins.

I haven't seen Pierce's mean streak in the playoffs in Melo, but I admit I haven't watched the Nuggets that closely.


My problem is this, the Knicks literally traded their 2nd, 3rd and 4th most talented player for Melo. When Ainge got KG and Ray he traded his 3rd and a bunch of other stuff. I just think it's bad management.

[guava_wrench]

You can´t overpay if you get clearly the best player in the deal.

New York definitely won this deal.

Of course you can. If only the world were so simple.

With a salary cap, you need to get a lot of bang for your buck to be a top team. Melo could be the kind of player who commands top dollar and puts up his stats, but whose team's plateau at mediocrity.

Also, no one 'wins' deals. The question is whether teams benefited from moves. Denver clearly benefited greatly if Melo was going to move anyway.

Evaluating how NY fared should not based on who got more talent since they acquired a guy who could have come as a FA next season from a team with limited leverage.

[BballTim]

I dunno man, we may be using the term superstar a little loosely. Was Bernard King a superstar? Adrian Dantley? This is the level of player Melo is.

Was Pierce a superstar in 02-06? Because Carmelo is a marginally better version of Pierce from those seasons right now.

EDIT: I'm not saying Pierce was or wasn't a 'superstar'..I'm just saying...that's what NY is getting.

I just would never gut my franchise for that. The most underrated thing Danny Ainge has ever done is refuse to let Rondo or Perk be a part of the Ray and KG deals. He knew that if he couldn't put a team around them than the new players, even a top 5 PF of all time,  would mean diddly.The Knicks just gutted their roster of their 2nd, 3rd and 4th most talented players, I don't see how adding a superstar to that helps all that much.

Well, I'd contest that they gutted their team...or I guess more accurately, that what they gave up compares to in any way to what they're getting back.

They're a .500 team. Felton (whether because of the trade rumors or whatever) was not playing like he was in the beginning of the season. They were not going to keep Wilson Chandler if they resigned Melo in the off-season...so don't even think about Chandler in the situation long-term.

Really what they did was decide to trade Raymond Felton, Gallinari, a mid-round 1st, and a project center for one of the best scorers in the game, rather than keep Gallinari and hope that the Nuggets don't get Anthony to sign an extension with them or any other team before the end of the season.

They got the bird in hand..and really it came down to maybe losing Carmelo but keeping Gallinari, who Carmelo was replacing in the starting lineup, or just getting Carmelo, but this time for realsies.

Plus, much like Miami, this whole thing doesn't really shake out until next season, or the season after. Ironically, the biggest missing piece for both Miami and NY now is Kendrick Perkins.

I haven't seen Pierce's mean streak in the playoffs in Melo, but I admit I haven't watched the Nuggets that closely.


My problem is this, the Knicks literally traded their 2nd, 3rd and 4th most talented player for Melo. When Ainge got KG and Ray he traded his 3rd and a bunch of other stuff. I just think it's bad management.

  Ray was older and coming off of surgery. Danny didn't trade any of his top 3 players to get Ray.

[KCattheStripe]

I dunno man, we may be using the term superstar a little loosely. Was Bernard King a superstar? Adrian Dantley? This is the level of player Melo is.

Was Pierce a superstar in 02-06? Because Carmelo is a marginally better version of Pierce from those seasons right now.

EDIT: I'm not saying Pierce was or wasn't a 'superstar'..I'm just saying...that's what NY is getting.

I just would never gut my franchise for that. The most underrated thing Danny Ainge has ever done is refuse to let Rondo or Perk be a part of the Ray and KG deals. He knew that if he couldn't put a team around them than the new players, even a top 5 PF of all time,  would mean diddly.The Knicks just gutted their roster of their 2nd, 3rd and 4th most talented players, I don't see how adding a superstar to that helps all that much.

Well, I'd contest that they gutted their team...or I guess more accurately, that what they gave up compares to in any way to what they're getting back.

They're a .500 team. Felton (whether because of the trade rumors or whatever) was not playing like he was in the beginning of the season. They were not going to keep Wilson Chandler if they resigned Melo in the off-season...so don't even think about Chandler in the situation long-term.

Really what they did was decide to trade Raymond Felton, Gallinari, a mid-round 1st, and a project center for one of the best scorers in the game, rather than keep Gallinari and hope that the Nuggets don't get Anthony to sign an extension with them or any other team before the end of the season.

They got the bird in hand..and really it came down to maybe losing Carmelo but keeping Gallinari, who Carmelo was replacing in the starting lineup, or just getting Carmelo, but this time for realsies.

Plus, much like Miami, this whole thing doesn't really shake out until next season, or the season after. Ironically, the biggest missing piece for both Miami and NY now is Kendrick Perkins.

I haven't seen Pierce's mean streak in the playoffs in Melo, but I admit I haven't watched the Nuggets that closely.


My problem is this, the Knicks literally traded their 2nd, 3rd and 4th most talented player for Melo. When Ainge got KG and Ray he traded his 3rd and a bunch of other stuff. I just think it's bad management.

  Ray was older and coming off of surgery. Danny didn't trade any of his top 3 players to get Ray.

He traded one of his top 4 to get KG. If this deal had been Felton, Mozgov, Shawne Williams, Toney Douglass and the picks with Ty Lawson coming instead of Chauncey then it would have been more akin to the KG trade.

[Casperian]

You can´t overpay if you get clearly the best player in the deal.

New York definitely won this deal.

Of course you can. If only the world were so simple.

With a salary cap, you need to get a lot of bang for your buck to be a top team. Melo could be the kind of player who commands top dollar and puts up his stats, but whose team's plateau at mediocrity.

Also, no one 'wins' deals. The question is whether teams benefited from moves. Denver clearly benefited greatly if Melo was going to move anyway.

Evaluating how NY fared should not based on who got more talent since they acquired a guy who could have come as a FA next season from a team with limited leverage.

I would agree if we talk about some lower-level talent, but not when discussing someone of Carmelo´s talent. Yes, I simplyfied, but I didn´t think my statement would need a long-winded explanation.

Carmelo is instantly the best player on the Knicks. Considering how hard it is to get players of Carmelo´s calibre, NY clearly won this trade, imo. A team of twelve Galinarí´s won´t win a championship. It´s easier to put role-players around stars than the other way around.

Considering that the Knicks also have players like Amare and Billups to support him, the pieces seem to be already in place.

And it is completely pointless to discuss the "ifs" of Carmelo leaving anyways or joining the Knicks next summer, imo, since we don´t know any details about the negotiations and offers Denver or Carmelo had. The fact that Carmelo is now a Knick is a good thing for the Knicks, regardless of what they paid for him.

All the players New York gave up are replacable, Carmelo isn´t.

[Surferdad]

...Also, no one 'wins' deals. The question is whether teams benefited from moves. Denver clearly benefited greatly if Melo was going to move anyway.

Definitely agree, in fact, most successful deals are those where both teams benefit and that's pretty much the case here.  The best trading partners are those that have differerent goals in mind and are at different stages of re-building or going for the Ring.  Again, that's the case here.

If you want a "loser" then it must be Minny.  I don't see what they get out of this.

[BballTim]

I dunno man, we may be using the term superstar a little loosely. Was Bernard King a superstar? Adrian Dantley? This is the level of player Melo is.

Was Pierce a superstar in 02-06? Because Carmelo is a marginally better version of Pierce from those seasons right now.

EDIT: I'm not saying Pierce was or wasn't a 'superstar'..I'm just saying...that's what NY is getting.

I just would never gut my franchise for that. The most underrated thing Danny Ainge has ever done is refuse to let Rondo or Perk be a part of the Ray and KG deals. He knew that if he couldn't put a team around them than the new players, even a top 5 PF of all time,  would mean diddly.The Knicks just gutted their roster of their 2nd, 3rd and 4th most talented players, I don't see how adding a superstar to that helps all that much.

Well, I'd contest that they gutted their team...or I guess more accurately, that what they gave up compares to in any way to what they're getting back.

They're a .500 team. Felton (whether because of the trade rumors or whatever) was not playing like he was in the beginning of the season. They were not going to keep Wilson Chandler if they resigned Melo in the off-season...so don't even think about Chandler in the situation long-term.

Really what they did was decide to trade Raymond Felton, Gallinari, a mid-round 1st, and a project center for one of the best scorers in the game, rather than keep Gallinari and hope that the Nuggets don't get Anthony to sign an extension with them or any other team before the end of the season.

They got the bird in hand..and really it came down to maybe losing Carmelo but keeping Gallinari, who Carmelo was replacing in the starting lineup, or just getting Carmelo, but this time for realsies.

Plus, much like Miami, this whole thing doesn't really shake out until next season, or the season after. Ironically, the biggest missing piece for both Miami and NY now is Kendrick Perkins.

I haven't seen Pierce's mean streak in the playoffs in Melo, but I admit I haven't watched the Nuggets that closely.


My problem is this, the Knicks literally traded their 2nd, 3rd and 4th most talented player for Melo. When Ainge got KG and Ray he traded his 3rd and a bunch of other stuff. I just think it's bad management.

  Ray was older and coming off of surgery. Danny didn't trade any of his top 3 players to get Ray.

He traded one of his top 4 to get KG. If this deal had been Felton, Mozgov, Shawne Williams, Toney Douglass and the picks with Ty Lawson coming instead of Chauncey then it would have been more akin to the KG trade.

  None of those players are as desirable as Big Al was at the time.

[Fafnir]

  None of those players are as desirable as Big Al was at the time.

Big Al had similar value to Derek Favors at the time. He was a young big man who looked to have 20 10 talent. (and he did for the first two years in Minny)

[Chris]

  None of those players are as desirable as Big Al was at the time.

Big Al had similar value to Derek Favors at the time. He was a young big man who looked to have 20 10 talent. (and he did for the first two years in Minny)

Agreed.  Although the summer before, Big Al's value was probably lower than Gallo's is.  He looked like a guy who peaked in his rookie year, could not stay healthy, and was not a 2-way player.  Its funny how the value of these guys fluctuates. 

[RebusRankin]

On the one hand I hate this idea of stars demanding where they want to play. Its selfish and you know what you should be happy to make millions when you don't have to do a real job. On the other hand, I'm curious now to watch the new Knicks so I see how it helps the NBA overall.

[Finkelskyhook]

Billups has never shown an a public attitude before....But made it clear he didn't want to go anywhere.  I wonder if he'll play in New York.  He seems like the antithesis of a D'Antoni player.

NY's 2 best players play no defense and are average rebounders playing with a gutted roster and a PG who doesn't fit the system.  Playing for Paul Westhead Jr....

Sounds like pretty much the same result this season and maybe a 4-5 seed next season if they get Paul.

Should be fun to watch until playoff time.