Celtics Dancing Lockerroom Video (NSFW)

[ManUp]

I am not questioning you, why are you questioning my opinions.

When I was growing up Segregation was the norm.  Segregation is wrong.  Just because "everyone" goes along with something does not make it right.  Just because "everyone" is exposed to something does not make it right.

Throwing the "N" word around is not right, no matter how many songs it is used on.  When kids are in MY house, they will not listen to that garbage.

I don't feel the need to post in this thread on this particular subject further.  If you want to know how I feel, simply reread my replies.

Pretty much agreed, TB.

My oldest son (just turned 12) reads CelticsBlog often, and when we both started watching the vid, I had to turn it off.

My son and I have talked about the N word and the history behind it, and we don't use it in our house, either.

Now as for the vid? Like I posted earlier - I think this is good fun for them. I wish that it hadn't made it to the blog for the world to see, but as long as it stays in the locker room and they don't do this stuff (a la Lebron and Cavs last year), then it's all good.

My son is well aware of KG's potty mouth, but still loves his fire and intensity. I've made it a point to let my son know that these players are not perfect, but they are still great and have many traits that he can use as he plays sports.

My son (or I) aren't kicking KG to the curb anytime soon.

Hope your aren't paying for Xbox live then... at least not for him.

[guava_wrench]

The important thing for parents to do, then, is to teach children what real role models look like, while reducing the idolization of many athletes, musicians, actors, and sadly, politicians.

Classic, authoritarian: Hobbs.

Why do you say "sadly, politicians"?  For at least 2000 years, politicians have been the first category that civilized people have identified as being potential scoundrels, morons, and boobs.  Well, except for "actors," of course.  ... And "musicians."  And "athletes."  See Petronius, Suetonius, Tacitus, Horace. 

Down with politician-worship!

Politicians are easy targets. I am skeptical that they are any worse than you or I, but they are forced to go on record and they have no choice but to try to be popular.

No doubt, some are power hungry and drawn to politics for that reason, but I think we tend to be appeased with the copout excuse that problems are due to the shortcomings of politicians when it is the complexity of the problems we face and the lack of consensus in our goals that is the main culprit.

[Eeyore III]

The important thing for parents to do, then, is to teach children what real role models look like, while reducing the idolization of many athletes, musicians, actors, and sadly, politicians.

Classic, authoritarian: Hobbs.

Why do you say "sadly, politicians"?  For at least 2000 years, politicians have been the first category that civilized people have identified as being potential scoundrels, morons, and boobs.  Well, except for "actors," of course.  ... And "musicians."  And "athletes."  See Petronius, Suetonius, Tacitus, Horace. 

Down with politician-worship!

Politicians are easy targets. I am skeptical that they are any worse than you or I, but they are forced to go on record and they have no choice but to try to be popular.

No doubt, some are power hungry and drawn to politics for that reason, but I think we tend to be appeased with the copout excuse that problems are due to the shortcomings of politicians when it is the complexity of the problems we face and the lack of consensus in our goals that is the main culprit.

I agree that politicians are easy targets, but the reason for that situation is that, in reality, politicians really, legitimately, ARE easy targets.

And far from suggesting that our problems are due to the shortcomings of politicians, I think that our problems are fundamentally due to the shortcomings in ourselves.  That does not mean, however, that politicians generally are not lying, thieving scoundrels.

But the fact that some people believe it actually lamentable that the "politician" should be deleted from the list of "Objects of Emulation", is for me ludicrous.  But that's just me.  ... and 2000 years of history.   

[indeedproceed]

The important thing for parents to do, then, is to teach children what real role models look like, while reducing the idolization of many athletes, musicians, actors, and sadly, politicians.

Classic, authoritarian: Hobbs.

Why do you say "sadly, politicians"?  For at least 2000 years, politicians have been the first category that civilized people have identified as being potential scoundrels, morons, and boobs.  Well, except for "actors," of course.  ... And "musicians."  And "athletes."  See Petronius, Suetonius, Tacitus, Horace. 

Down with politician-worship!

Politicians are easy targets. I am skeptical that they are any worse than you or I, but they are forced to go on record and they have no choice but to try to be popular.

No doubt, some are power hungry and drawn to politics for that reason, but I think we tend to be appeased with the copout excuse that problems are due to the shortcomings of politicians when it is the complexity of the problems we face and the lack of consensus in our goals that is the main culprit.

I agree that politicians are easy targets, but the reason for that situation is that, in reality, politicians really, legitimately, ARE easy targets.

And far from suggesting that our problems are due to the shortcomings of politicians, I think that our problems are fundamentally due to the shortcomings in ourselves.  That does not mean, however, that politicians generally are not lying, thieving scoundrels.

But the fact that some people believe it actually lamentable that the "politician" should be deleted from the list of "Objects of Emulation", is for me ludicrous.  But that's just me.  ... and 2000 years of history.   

Politicians are just people who have power over other people. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

If we were all allowed to act with impunity we'd all be sleazy scandalous scumbags too.

The trick is to pick the sleazy scandalous scumbag that is a little smarter and a little more restrained than the other sleazy scandalous scumbag.

[LarBrd33]

If you don't get why that video was pulled from Nate's twitter shortly after posting (probably at request of the Celtics or the NBA) than yall are extremely naive.

I personally don't care.  Don't have a problem with that music.  Don't have a problem with the dancing.  But I have common sense.  I thought it was a little uncomfortable to watch... I couldn't help but cringe mainly because I can tell how it will be received.

These people get paid millions of dollars to present themselves in professional way.   The NBA forced these guys to adhere to a dress code in 2005, because they were sick of some of them showing up in doo-rags, baggy shorts, crooked hats, bling-bling and fueling the perception that the NBA is full of a bunch of thuggish uneducated criminals.  Call it racist if you want, but after the 2004 brawl they needed to do something about their image.  The NBA and the various sponsors have a major incentive to keep the perception of their players as clean and wholesome as possible.

How do you think the NBA or the various companies that hold endorsement deals with the players feel when they see their spokespeople dancing around in clown masks to obscene music, grabbing their crotches and flipping off the camera?   It's not good.  Certainly not the worst thing, but it's a little embarrassing.  And no, it's not the same as Shaq dancing in a jabbawockee mask at all-star weekend.  Can you imagine the flap it would cause if the players came out at all-star weekend to this song, grabbing their crotches and flipping off the crowd?  It's a difference.

And honestly, I'm kinda surprised the players are too stupid to recognize the line they are walking.  I mean... I'm not hating on Nate Robinson's videos.  Some of them are entertaining, I guess.  I enjoyed seeing him jog in Shaq's shoes (which is all fun and games until the idiot sprains an ankle doing it),  some of his clearly fake and obviously staged Shaq pranks are mildly watchable merely for showing the positive team chemistry...  but I think I've had enough of this midget's shenanigans.   Trade him and the fat kid, lets get down to business and go win a title.

[Jon]

Going back to the original point of the OP's post, this group looks to be highly entertaining.  As of now, they remind of the 2004 Cowboy-Up-Why-Not-Us? Red Sox.  Lots of personality, lots of fun, and potentially lots of success. 

Should be a fun ride. 

[GreenEnvy]

Thanks Roy.  The thing that bothered me was the use of racial pergoritives in the dance sequence.  They should not be used by Anyone of Any race, IMO.

Now this I can agree with you on.  It is not like they were out on the town they were in the work place playing that music.

But I have to say if me and my co-workers played that song and starting dancing around in the workplace...HR would be the least of our worries.

P.S. I do have to add I play that song in my car all the time lol.

I don't know your work environment, but surely it cannot compare to a professional sports locker room. They don't have a defined workplace. But if they did, it would be the court. It's more like you and your coworkers dancing to that song in the parking lot.

There are things they can say/do that us normal employees cannot, and alternatively there are things they cannot say/do that we probably can.

[indeedproceed]

Thanks Roy.  The thing that bothered me was the use of racial pergoritives in the dance sequence.  They should not be used by Anyone of Any race, IMO.

Now this I can agree with you on.  It is not like they were out on the town they were in the work place playing that music.

But I have to say if me and my co-workers played that song and starting dancing around in the workplace...HR would be the least of our worries.

P.S. I do have to add I play that song in my car all the time lol.

I don't know your work environment, but surely it cannot compare to a professional sports locker room. They don't have a defined workplace. But if they did, it would be the court. It's more like you and your coworkers dancing to that song in the parking lot.

There are things they can say/do that us normal employees cannot, and alternatively there are things they cannot say/do that we probably can.

Yeah team locker rooms vs actual work environments is like comparing frat houses with hotels. You can't do luge shots in the lobby of a courtyard marriott.

[Mizzy21390]

If you don't get why that video was pulled from Nate's twitter shortly after posting (probably at request of the Celtics or the NBA) than yall are extremely naive.

I personally don't care.  Don't have a problem with that music.  Don't have a problem with the dancing.  But I have common sense.  I thought it was a little uncomfortable to watch... I couldn't help but cringe mainly because I can tell how it will be received.

These people get paid millions of dollars to present themselves in professional way.   The NBA forced these guys to adhere to a dress code in 2005, because they were sick of some of them showing up in doo-rags, baggy shorts, crooked hats, bling-bling and fueling the perception that the NBA is full of a bunch of thuggish uneducated criminals.  Call it racist if you want, but after the 2004 brawl they needed to do something about their image.  The NBA and the various sponsors have a major incentive to keep the perception of their players as clean and wholesome as possible.

How do you think the NBA or the various companies that hold endorsement deals with the players feel when they see their spokespeople dancing around in clown masks to obscene music, grabbing their crotches and flipping off the camera?   It's not good.  Certainly not the worst thing, but it's a little embarrassing.  And no, it's not the same as Shaq dancing in a jabbawockee mask at all-star weekend.  Can you imagine the flap it would cause if the players came out at all-star weekend to this song, grabbing their crotches and flipping off the crowd?  It's a difference.

And honestly, I'm kinda surprised the players are too stupid to recognize the line they are walking.  I mean... I'm not hating on Nate Robinson's videos.  Some of them are entertaining, I guess.  I enjoyed seeing him jog in Shaq's shoes (which is all fun and games until the idiot sprains an ankle doing it),  some of his clearly fake and obviously staged Shaq pranks are mildly watchable merely for showing the positive team chemistry...  but I think I've had enough of this midget's shenanigans.   Trade him and the fat kid, lets get down to business and go win a title.

Man, that was harsh. I actually like Nate, and his videos. I enjoy the fact that they give us an inside view of the team off court. I do agree that the NBA is trying to keep its image clean, and that the poor choice of hand motions and cuss words is why it was pulled down.

But I don't think there's anything wrong with Nate and his videos.. That's just his personality, and if he is able to be mature on the court, im fine with it

[Kiorrik]

You know what, this whole profanity thing just points at one thing;

Our way of communicating is flawed.

Let's say I want to tell someone I don't like something. I could say, for instance:

For Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline.s sake, this Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline.ing Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline. aint flying! I Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline.ing hate this Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline.!

Someone else might say:

For gods sake, this here thing will not happen! I really don't like this stuff!

Someone else again might say:

Hmmm. This will not go. I don't agree.

The point is, people MEAN the same thing, but the way they convey their emotions is different.

And what happens?

People look at what others SAY, not at what they might MEAN.

That, right there, is the flaw in communication. You can point at anything as a reason for this flaw; education, race, computer games, music, etc, but the basic flaw remains the fact that we're "doing it wrong".

[wiley]

You know what, this whole profanity thing just points at one thing;

Our way of communicating is flawed.

Let's say I want to tell someone I don't like something. I could say, for instance:

For ****s sake, this ****ing **** aint flying! I ****ing hate this ****!

Someone else might say:

For gods sake, this here thing will not happen! I really don't like this stuff!

Someone else again might say:

Hmmm. This will not go. I don't agree.

The point is, people MEAN the same thing, but the way they convey their emotions is different.

And what happens?

People look at what others SAY, not at what they might MEAN.

That, right there, is the flaw in communication. You can point at anything as a reason for this flaw; education, race, computer games, music, etc, but the basic flaw remains the fact that we're "doing it wrong".

Too many variables around the concept of meaning is what keeps things focused more on what's actually said (everyone taking their own meaning....just as they walk away from the latest art exhibit or movie with different reactions and interpretations).  That's why judgement comes into play--what to hang on the walls, what to allow in the theater, what to allow into the speech, etc..)

Good intentions have gone awry throughout history.  I think the minister (priest?) down in Florida probably just meant to make his own team feel really good.  I think he kind of forgot for a moment that the other team was out there.  (I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt...didn't follow the story closely).  I'm sure he didn't think someone on the other side of the world would die during a protest (not his fault...just talking about chain reactions of events), and I'll bet he regrets the episode.

Another varable is that people from the same group can be acting with different intentions.  Some of the minister's followers may have had more sinister intent than the minister himself.

Regarding the video, I thought it was top notch.  I give it an A+ for spontaneous imitation of a genre.  I don't mind if the players work out their own code of ethics and standard for language in the locker room.  The fact that it was filmed was also not problematic (the guys could get together and watch it at someone's house.)

Posting it on the web?  That decision gets an F-.

[wiley]

You know what, this whole profanity thing just points at one thing;

Our way of communicating is flawed.

Let's say I want to tell someone I don't like something. I could say, for instance:

For ****s sake, this ****ing **** aint flying! I ****ing hate this ****!

Someone else might say:

For gods sake, this here thing will not happen! I really don't like this stuff!

Someone else again might say:

Hmmm. This will not go. I don't agree.

The point is, people MEAN the same thing, but the way they convey their emotions is different.

And what happens?

People look at what others SAY, not at what they might MEAN.

That, right there, is the flaw in communication. You can point at anything as a reason for this flaw; education, race, computer games, music, etc, but the basic flaw remains the fact that we're "doing it wrong".

Too many variables around the concept of meaning is what keeps things focused more on what's actually said (everyone taking their own meaning....just as they walk away from the latest art exhibit or movie with different reactions and interpretations).  That's why judgement comes into play--what to hang on the walls, what to allow in the theater, what to allow into the speech, etc..)

Good intentions have gone awry throughout history.  I think the minister (priest?) down in Florida probably just meant to make his own team feel really good.  I think he kind of forgot for a moment that the other team was out there.  (I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt...didn't follow the story closely).  I'm sure he didn't think someone on the other side of the world would die during a protest (not his fault...just talking about chain reactions of events), and I'll bet he regrets the episode.

Another varable is that people from the same group can be acting with different intentions.  Some of the minister's followers may have had more sinister intent than the minister himself.

Regarding the video, I thought it was top notch.  I give it an A+ for spontaneous imitation of a genre.  I don't mind if the players work out their own code of ethics and standard for language in the locker room.  The fact that it was filmed was also not problematic (the guys could get together and watch it at someone's house.)

Posting it on the web?  That decision gets an F-.

In the above post I'm assuming they weren't really thinking about if it was for the web or not while they were doing the dance.  Just having fun.  If the whole thing was meant for the web from the beginning, then in that case I would have a problem with various aspects....language and gestures.

[Assassin70]

Thanks Roy.  The thing that bothered me was the use of racial pergoritives in the dance sequence.  They should not be used by Anyone of Any race, IMO.

Now this I can agree with you on.  It is not like they were out on the town they were in the work place playing that music.

But I have to say if me and my co-workers played that song and starting dancing around in the workplace...HR would be the least of our worries.

P.S. I do have to add I play that song in my car all the time lol.

I don't know your work environment, but surely it cannot compare to a professional sports locker room. They don't have a defined workplace. But if they did, it would be the court. It's more like you and your coworkers dancing to that song in the parking lot.

There are things they can say/do that us normal employees cannot, and alternatively there are things they cannot say/do that we probably can.

Yeah team locker rooms vs actual work environments is like comparing frat houses with hotels. You can't do luge shots in the lobby of a courtyard marriott.

Good point in principle and I will agree somewhat.

But what we are really talking about in this instance is what is tolerated.

I work in IT. I am in an enclosed secure area away from other employees not part of IT.  Things get said back here that would not fly anywhere else.  We could watch that video,  with the sound blasting, if you were in any other department you would not be able to (without serious Human Resources repercussion).  But with all that said...again if I stated pumping that song and dancing around, I would be in trouble.

There is a reason that video is being taken down almost as fast as it was put up.  Just like in my workplace they tolerate shenanigans and expect them, it is what it is.  However the general rule is what happens back here just like in that locker room generally stays here.  You do not want to paint your company in a negative light (obviously the Celtics don't want the potential bad press).

There is always a fine line between what is acceptable and what is not depending on who is involved.  What may be considered acceptable is some instances changes entirely depending on certain parameters.  That is all I am saying nothing more nothing less.

And for the 100X I have to say for me personally I loved the video!

[mmbaby]

World is changing, people. The culture changes that will be possible because of the information systems access young people have now is going to truly change the world. This is unlike anything the world has ever experienced...ever!

We cannot yet imagine the changes and personally I think information exchange is going to be incredibly helpful to those who are oppressed all around the world.

A word on cursing: I was taught by my parents by example to curse; I curse, I don't mind if my kids curse to a point. It's not always thought of as something 'bad', low-class, disrespectful, etc. I see it as an expression of feeling, and obviously our players do too. They were making a funny video and really, I don't see the big deal at all.

Language evolves over time and who knows....maybe new curse words will arise. My 11 yr old son and his friends say granite in place of [dang]it at school. Frankly I just can't imagine a happy world without being able to curse my heart out. 

[cornbreadsmart]

I think it's great they are having fun.