Cavs future?

[winsomme]

LeBron - $15M (25% cap)
Bosh - $15M (25% cap)
MoWill - $9.3 M
Varejao - $7 M
DWest - $0.3 M
Gibson - traded
Hickson - $1.5 M
Jackson - renounced
2009 first rounder - $1 M
2010 first rounder - $ traded with Gibson

Total: $49.1M and a $60 millions cap. Allocate the remaining $11 millions as you wish.

what's this 25% cap rule?

That's nonsensical. By that reasoning, no free-agent will sign with Cleveland without LeBron signing first, so they're basically screwed.  They'll negotiate the contracts, like any other team has to do.

Well, the Clipps signed Baron and the Brand bolted. There are no certainties out there. If LeBron is worried about being in CLE with supporting casts that he can't win Titles with, then doesn't it seem like he is going to want to know who his team in CLE is going to be before committing to 6 years?

[cordobes]

LeBron - $15M (25% cap)
Bosh - $15M (25% cap)
MoWill - $9.3 M
Varejao - $7 M
DWest - $0.3 M
Gibson - traded
Hickson - $1.5 M
Jackson - renounced
2009 first rounder - $1 M
2010 first rounder - $ traded with Gibson

Total: $49.1M and a $60 millions cap. Allocate the remaining $11 millions as you wish.

what's this 25% cap rule?

Maximum contract allowed, 25% of the cap. Or is it 30% for Bosh and LeBron? In any case, they have enough room.

That's nonsensical. By that reasoning, no free-agent will sign with Cleveland without LeBron signing first, so they're basically screwed.  They'll negotiate the contracts, like any other team has to do.

Well, the Clipps signed Baron and the Brand bolted. There are no certainties out there. If LeBron is worried about being in CLE with supporting casts that he can't win Titles with, then doesn't it seem like he is going to want to know who his team in CLE is going to be before committing to 6 years?[/quote]

He'll know. They'll sign the contracts simultaneously. Frankly, is Cleveland the only team affected by the fact that there are no certainties out there? And you want him to go to the Knicks, that are in a worse situation, salary and roster wise, than the Cavs? The Knicks still have 2 bad contracts in 2010 (Curry+Jeffries) and no assets left to move them. The Cavs have Gibson, but it's a much smaller one and way easier to move. The Knicks also don't have a single sure NBA starter under contract. And you somehow think that they're in a better situation than the Cavs? Nonsense.

Anyway, once again, it's beyond the point. The discussion was about Cavs chances of signing 2 max. free-agents in 2010, including LeBron. Convinced already?

[winsomme]

Maximum contract allowed, 25% of the cap. Or is it 30% for Bosh and LeBron? In any case, they have enough room.

well 18 and 15 are pretty different figures and I'm not sure you are going to get Bron to sign before the other max deal.

also not certain about Var for 7 mil or being able to dump Gibson or willingness to just dump DWest...

but at least it's on record.

[cordobes]

Maximum contract allowed, 25% of the cap. Or is it 30% for Bosh and LeBron? In any case, they have enough room.

well 18 and 15 are pretty different figures and I'm not sure you are going to get Bron to sign before the other max deal.

What does this mean? Are you saying LeBron won't opt out?

also not certain about Var for 7 mil or being able to dump Gibson or willingness to just dump DWest...

Now you're just changing the initial assumptions. Of course, they can keep Gibson and West and in that case they won't sign Bosh.

That just reinforces my point though: unless they screw it on purpose, they'll have enough room to sign 2 FA in 2010.

I'm not sure you are going to get Bron to sign before the other max deal.

How are the Knicks going to do it?

[winsomme]

Maximum contract allowed, 25% of the cap. Or is it 30% for Bosh and LeBron? In any case, they have enough room.

well 18 and 15 are pretty different figures and I'm not sure you are going to get Bron to sign before the other max deal.

What does this mean? Are you saying LeBron won't opt out?

30% of 60 is 18 million....

[cordobes]

Maximum contract allowed, 25% of the cap. Or is it 30% for Bosh and LeBron? In any case, they have enough room.

well 18 and 15 are pretty different figures and I'm not sure you are going to get Bron to sign before the other max deal.

What does this mean? Are you saying LeBron won't opt out?

30% of 60 is 18 million....

Yeah, if it's 30% they still have the cap room to sign them both, sign Varejão, keep Mo Williams, keep Hickson, sign a draft pick and spend $5 millions or so in other players (like DWest, for example).

[BballTim]

Maximum contract allowed, 25% of the cap. Or is it 30% for Bosh and LeBron? In any case, they have enough room.

well 18 and 15 are pretty different figures and I'm not sure you are going to get Bron to sign before the other max deal.

What does this mean? Are you saying LeBron won't opt out?

30% of 60 is 18 million....

Yeah, if it's 30% they still have the cap room to sign them both, sign Varejão, keep Mo Williams, keep Hickson, sign a draft pick and spend $5 millions or so in other players (like DWest, for example).

  Wouldn't James get more than Bosh? Can't you sign your own players to a bigger contract than other tean's players? They'd only be the same if they did a sign and trade for Bosh like the Magic did for Lewis.

[winsomme]

Maximum contract allowed, 25% of the cap. Or is it 30% for Bosh and LeBron? In any case, they have enough room.

well 18 and 15 are pretty different figures and I'm not sure you are going to get Bron to sign before the other max deal.

What does this mean? Are you saying LeBron won't opt out?

30% of 60 is 18 million....

Yeah, if it's 30% they still have the cap room to sign them both, sign Varejão, keep Mo Williams, keep Hickson, sign a draft pick and spend $5 millions or so in other players (like DWest, for example).

if they are able to dump both Gibson and DWest (something they would have to do before Bron reups) and are able to sign Var for 7 mil per (he's opting out on close to 7 by the way)....

personally, i think the only way they have money for two max contracts is if they don't re-sign Var....

[Fafnir]

Maximum contract allowed, 25% of the cap. Or is it 30% for Bosh and LeBron? In any case, they have enough room.

well 18 and 15 are pretty different figures and I'm not sure you are going to get Bron to sign before the other max deal.

What does this mean? Are you saying LeBron won't opt out?

30% of 60 is 18 million....

Yeah, if it's 30% they still have the cap room to sign them both, sign Varejão, keep Mo Williams, keep Hickson, sign a draft pick and spend $5 millions or so in other players (like DWest, for example).

if they are able to dump both Gibson and DWest (something they would have to do before Bron reups) and are able to sign Var for 7 mil per (he's opting out on close to 7 by the way)....

personally, i think the only way they have money for two max contracts is if they don't re-sign Var....

I'm not sure why you think that when the mathematics have been laid out for you. As long as they don't give AV more than 8 they only have to dump West.

AV opted out to get a long term deal. I highly doubt he'll ask for or command more than eight million per year. Plus they can always front load his deal some.

[winsomme]

Maximum contract allowed, 25% of the cap. Or is it 30% for Bosh and LeBron? In any case, they have enough room.

well 18 and 15 are pretty different figures and I'm not sure you are going to get Bron to sign before the other max deal.

What does this mean? Are you saying LeBron won't opt out?

30% of 60 is 18 million....

Yeah, if it's 30% they still have the cap room to sign them both, sign Varejão, keep Mo Williams, keep Hickson, sign a draft pick and spend $5 millions or so in other players (like DWest, for example).

if they are able to dump both Gibson and DWest (something they would have to do before Bron reups) and are able to sign Var for 7 mil per (he's opting out on close to 7 by the way)....

personally, i think the only way they have money for two max contracts is if they don't re-sign Var....

I'm not sure why you think that when the mathematics have been laid out for you. As long as they don't give AV more than 8 they only have to dump West.

AV opted out to get a long term deal. I highly doubt he'll ask for or command more than eight million per year. Plus they can always front load his deal some.

for one, we don't know what the cap is going to be. plus, Var was looking for 10 mil last off season. and they would have to dump these players before Bron signed.

if they are able to sign Var for 7 mill, what is their willingness going to be to go into the 2010 off season with a team of

Mo Williams
Varejao
Hickson

not knowing if Bron might not even want to come back at that point.

Let's see how it shakes down. maybe you guys are right.

[greenwise]

Cavs future? 32-50 record in 2010-2011 season;D

[Fafnir]

Maximum contract allowed, 25% of the cap. Or is it 30% for Bosh and LeBron? In any case, they have enough room.

well 18 and 15 are pretty different figures and I'm not sure you are going to get Bron to sign before the other max deal.

What does this mean? Are you saying LeBron won't opt out?

30% of 60 is 18 million....

Yeah, if it's 30% they still have the cap room to sign them both, sign Varejão, keep Mo Williams, keep Hickson, sign a draft pick and spend $5 millions or so in other players (like DWest, for example).

if they are able to dump both Gibson and DWest (something they would have to do before Bron reups) and are able to sign Var for 7 mil per (he's opting out on close to 7 by the way)....

personally, i think the only way they have money for two max contracts is if they don't re-sign Var....

I'm not sure why you think that when the mathematics have been laid out for you. As long as they don't give AV more than 8 they only have to dump West.

AV opted out to get a long term deal. I highly doubt he'll ask for or command more than eight million per year. Plus they can always front load his deal some.

for one, we don't know what the cap is going to be. plus, Var was looking for 10 mil last off season. and they would have to dump these players before Bron signed.

if they are able to sign Var for 7 mill, what is their willingness going to be to go into the 2010 off season with a team of

Mo Williams
Varejao
Hickson

not knowing if Bron might not even want to come back at that point.

Let's see how it shakes down. maybe you guys are right.

If LeBron leaves it doesn't matter you have to rebuild anyways. So you set up so at least you can sign him and another elite player. If that doesn't happen you'll be clear of bad contracts and can rebuild quickly.

[winsomme]

Maximum contract allowed, 25% of the cap. Or is it 30% for Bosh and LeBron? In any case, they have enough room.

well 18 and 15 are pretty different figures and I'm not sure you are going to get Bron to sign before the other max deal.

What does this mean? Are you saying LeBron won't opt out?

30% of 60 is 18 million....

Yeah, if it's 30% they still have the cap room to sign them both, sign Varejão, keep Mo Williams, keep Hickson, sign a draft pick and spend $5 millions or so in other players (like DWest, for example).

if they are able to dump both Gibson and DWest (something they would have to do before Bron reups) and are able to sign Var for 7 mil per (he's opting out on close to 7 by the way)....

personally, i think the only way they have money for two max contracts is if they don't re-sign Var....

I'm not sure why you think that when the mathematics have been laid out for you. As long as they don't give AV more than 8 they only have to dump West.

AV opted out to get a long term deal. I highly doubt he'll ask for or command more than eight million per year. Plus they can always front load his deal some.

for one, we don't know what the cap is going to be. plus, Var was looking for 10 mil last off season. and they would have to dump these players before Bron signed.

if they are able to sign Var for 7 mill, what is their willingness going to be to go into the 2010 off season with a team of

Mo Williams
Varejao
Hickson

not knowing if Bron might not even want to come back at that point.

Let's see how it shakes down. maybe you guys are right.

If LeBron leaves it doesn't matter you have to rebuild anyways. So you set up so at least you can sign him and another elite player. If that doesn't happen you'll be clear of bad contracts and can rebuild quickly.

well depending on how much and how long you have to sign Varejao for....that could end up being a bad contract if you lose out on LeBron.

I just don't think it is clear cut at all for CLE adding two max contracts -  especially along with re-signing Var.

As you have pointed out, it's within realm of possibility, but I think it would be more possible without re-signing Var. and that comes with its own risks....number one being the upcoming season.

As for the Knicks, they've been bad for so long they're not really risking much by trimming all contracts after 2010. and if they can unload Curry, they are going to have the most money to spend regardless of the cap number.

[Fafnir]

Maximum contract allowed, 25% of the cap. Or is it 30% for Bosh and LeBron? In any case, they have enough room.

well 18 and 15 are pretty different figures and I'm not sure you are going to get Bron to sign before the other max deal.

What does this mean? Are you saying LeBron won't opt out?

30% of 60 is 18 million....

Yeah, if it's 30% they still have the cap room to sign them both, sign Varejão, keep Mo Williams, keep Hickson, sign a draft pick and spend $5 millions or so in other players (like DWest, for example).

if they are able to dump both Gibson and DWest (something they would have to do before Bron reups) and are able to sign Var for 7 mil per (he's opting out on close to 7 by the way)....

personally, i think the only way they have money for two max contracts is if they don't re-sign Var....

I'm not sure why you think that when the mathematics have been laid out for you. As long as they don't give AV more than 8 they only have to dump West.

AV opted out to get a long term deal. I highly doubt he'll ask for or command more than eight million per year. Plus they can always front load his deal some.

for one, we don't know what the cap is going to be. plus, Var was looking for 10 mil last off season. and they would have to dump these players before Bron signed.

if they are able to sign Var for 7 mill, what is their willingness going to be to go into the 2010 off season with a team of

Mo Williams
Varejao
Hickson

not knowing if Bron might not even want to come back at that point.

Let's see how it shakes down. maybe you guys are right.

If LeBron leaves it doesn't matter you have to rebuild anyways. So you set up so at least you can sign him and another elite player. If that doesn't happen you'll be clear of bad contracts and can rebuild quickly.

well depending on how much and how long you have to sign Varejao for....that could end up being a bad contract if you lose out on LeBron.

I just don't think it is clear cut at all for CLE adding two max contracts -  especially along with re-signing Var.

As you have pointed out, it's within realm of possibility, but I think it would be more possible without re-signing Var. and that comes with its own risks....number one being the upcoming season.

As for the Knicks, they've been bad for so long they're not really risking much by trimming all contracts after 2010. and if they can unload Curry, they are going to have the most money to spend regardless of the cap number.

What risks? What free agents are they missing out on? They only will be passing on MLE free agents this offseason who want long term deals, and they don't even have to that if they're willing to dump Dwest/Boobie. Losing out two undersized two guards isn't a terrible price.

If they lose LeBron, they need to rebuild anyways and they'll have the room to do that. If they don't they'll have only AV/Mo with long deals. Which isn't bad at all.

As for AV's potential new deal being a risk, sure it is. But no more than any other player they could sign.

[cordobes]

Wouldn't James get more than Bosh?

As far as I know, no, not in the first year, although I may be wrong.

Can't you sign your own players to a bigger contract than other tean's players?

Yes, you can give them contracts with 10.5% increases, instead of 8%, and going to 6 years, not merely 5.

if they are able to dump both Gibson and DWest (something they would have to do before Bron reups)

It's not difficult to dump West. His contract is only guaranteed in 10%, $400k or something - they can merely release him. They have space to keep Gibson if they wish so, but do you really think they'll have any trouble to dump him?

are able to sign Var for 7 mil per (he's opting out on close to 7 by the way)....

As Fanfir said, he's going to opt out to get a long-term deal. They can offer him a $46 millions contract and he would be making $6.5 millions in the second year.

personally, i think the only way they have money for two max contracts is if they don't re-sign Var....

There's no reason to think that.

That said, I believe their priority will be to acquire the talent via trade and keep on operating above the cap.