FREE POB!

[KCattheStripe]

When someone refuses to admit they aren't always correct, then they lose all credibility.

Credibility? On a message board? Yo no sabe.     TP brotha.

[Roy Hobbs]

I will agree that tonight wasn't the best of the showings out there by him in his limited minutes this year, however what did he do that was so awful?! He didn't take a shot, but had a block shot, an assist, and a steal. Yes he had a couple turnovers and a foul, and once again I repeat tonight wasn't a great one for him, but you act like the guy was 0-10 from the floor, committed 5 turnovers and 5 fouls. He was a non-factor. As you all like to say though, it was in garbage time. If the positives don't count in your book in garbage time, then the negatives shouldn't either. Unless of course you have an agenda...

The thing about garbage time is that it should be *easier* for a player to put up good numbers.  Guys are playing against scrubs, nobody is playing intense defense, etc.  That's why people discount garbage time scoring; the intensity is reduced.

However, reduced intensity is not an excuse for sloppy play in the form of idiotic turnovers (like getting stripped under the basket).  If POB wants to earn time on the court, he needs to have his head in the game at all times.  If he's looking slow and lethargic, and making stupid mental mistakes with a 20+ point lead, how could this team ever trust him in high leverage minutes?

In limited minutes, POB is averaging more turnovers (6.5 per 36 minutes) than steals + blocks + assists combined (6.1/36).  Additionally, he's averaging 10.6 personal fouls per 36 minutes.  Both stats are by far the worst on the team.

It's pretty clear that POB isn't making the most of the playing time that he does get, so I'm baffled to see why people want to give him more.

[KungPoweChicken]

You people who keep insisting on thinking that giving Patrick O'Bryant minutes is going to make him a better player just do not get it. Have any of you ever coached any type of team on any level that was competitively based? Have you coached a team where the main goal was winning and not teaching the kids to have fun and making sure everyone gets to play a minimum of minutes or innings?

Because if you have then you should know that coaches make players better in practice and that the players earn the right to get to play by getting better in practice. You just don't give players time on the floor to see what they can do. If they can't get the job done against their own team mates who they are extremely familiar with, know all their moves and tendencies, know the plays they are running and how to best defend them and who they get to guard more than any other players in the league, what makes you think that player is going to get the job done against players they are unfamiliar with, who's moves they haven't seen a thousand times, who's plays they don't already know. The concept is ridiculous.

Doc, Coach T, and Coach Ray know what POB can do and do not need to gift wrap valuable minutes in a game where every minute needs to be a productively positive minute in order to suddenly unlock some skill that POB has been hiding from them. If he's not doing it in practice, and apparently from KG's one on one tutorial with POB today he obviously isn't getting it done in practice, then he's only going to hurt this team when he gets on the floor.

This is not Little League or Pop Warner or Youth League BB. It is the NBA and coaches get paid to win and get fired for losing. Doc isn't going to put his trust in a player to produce wins for him if that player just isn't performing, learning and executing in practice. The notion is just plain silly.

POB, Giddens, Walker and Pruitt will play when they have earned the right to play by earning Doc's trust in the quality and consistency of their game. Until then don't expect those players to get minutes simply because the players in front of them aren't wildly successful. Because chances are those players you are calling for might have made the bench players in front of them look like All Stars in comparison had they been put into the same exact circumstances.

I'm not in favor of playing O'Bryant in any minutes other than garbage time. But why don't you explain the case of Tom Brady? To say that athletes aren't worthy of game time because they haven't proved enough in practice is short sighted.

     Tom Brady was getting benched on the Patriots for an inferior quarterback. And according to your logic, if Bledsoe never got hurt, Tom Brady never should have touched the field. Because apparently Tom Brady never showed enough in practice. This is evidenced by the fact that he only attempted three passes during the entire 2000 season.

Tom Brady didn't gain his super human skills with a year of practice and no game time. He was always a great player, but no one ever realized it when he was in practice. Sometimes you never know who you have on your bench until you play them. If the Patriots have taught us anything, it's that you may just have the greatest player ever, rotting away on your bench.

[CoachBo]

Apples, meet oranges.

Anxiously awaiting the POB=Lou Gehrig v/ Wally Pipp comparison.

 

Waive POB!

[footey]

Wow, Patrick O'Bryant got stripped, after making a nifty steal, and he is once again remanded to the doghouse of celtic blog nation. Forget the shot blocks, forget the dive to the floor after almost forcing a turnover. Forget the beautiful, Bill Walton like bounce pass off the high post to a cutting team-mate. 

Am not sure what drives the vitriol against this kid, but what other available FA 7 footer should we have signed instead last season? 

Alot of people on this board are understandably frustrated that POB is not contributing major minutes to this team. However, I am pretty sure that Ainge has him more in mind for the future.  Stay tuned.

[Bankshot]

I like what I see from POB on the offensive end...the hustle was nice to see too.  It's the defensive end that has him in the dog house.  Yes, he can block shots, but he gives little to no resistance when his man tries to back him down in the paint.  He can be scored on at will in the paint by other centers.  He needs to get much tougher and stronger.

Hopefully, the Celtics will have many more blowouts so POB can play.

[xmuscularghandix]

its his mental mistakes on the defensive end, if he wasn't so dumb he'd be a monster, he averages a block every time he's out there, and he only plays for like 4 minutes a game.

[Andy Jick]

some of you guys must be related to POB or represent him...the lengths you'll go to defend this guy are hilarious...

[crownsy]

some of you guys must be related to POB or represent him...the lengths you'll go to defend this guy are hilarious...

to be fair, as a noted patty criticzer myself, his last two games he's shown me some fire and effort, which is what i need to see. I mean, he's taleneted, thats not in question, his drive is.

Not saying im suddenly "omg super center!!" on him, but the last two games, he's really been pretty good and hustling his butt off. More of that please pat.

[Chris]

some of you guys must be related to POB or represent him...the lengths you'll go to defend this guy are hilarious...

to be fair, as a noted patty criticzer myself, his last two games he's shown me some fire and effort, which is what i need to see. I mean, he's taleneted, thats not in question, his drive is.

Not saying im suddenly "omg super center!!" on him, but the last two games, he's really been pretty good and hustling his butt off. More of that please pat.

My problem is not with his "fire", it is with his head.  He seems to have Tony Allen/Marcus Banks syndrome.  The one where he has tremendous skills, makes some great plays...but he just seems to be missing either the fundamentals, or concentration level to put them all together.

Now, he is still tremendously young, so this can certainly change.  It may just be a simple case of needing to get stronger and more confident, but at the moment, he just is not an NBA player.  Not because he doesn't have NBA skills, but because he has not learned to put them together yet.

[cordobes]

People should stop talking about POB like he's some 17 years old who just left high school. He's a 3 years NBA veteran with 2 seasons of college. He's just 1 year younger than Perkins, 6 months younger than Dwight Howard or Gerald Green but 1 year older than Bynum, for example. He's 2/3 years older than guys like Lopez, Love or Oden. This "he'll be better next season, with a Summer of weight lifting" sounds a lot like the "Clifford Ray's coaching/the presence of the Big 3/a better system/etc. will make him a player" conversation of a couple of months ago.

He shows no signs of basketballability so far. Guys like Pruitt or Walker show they can belong on a NBA court during garbage time. Not POB. He still has chances to do it in the future, but time is running out for him. When was the last time in the history of the league that a player who produced so little in his first 3 seasons was still in the league after the 4th? Has it ever happened?

[Chris]

People should stop talking about POB like he's some 17 years old who just left high school. He's a 3 years NBA veteran with 2 seasons of college. He's just 1 year younger than Perkins, 6 months younger than Dwight Howard or Gerald Green but 1 year older than Bynum, for example. He's 2/3 years older than guys like Lopez, Love or Oden. This "he'll be better next season, with a Summer of weight lifting" sounds a lot like the "Clifford Ray's coaching/the presence of the Big 3/a better system/etc. will make him a player" conversation of a couple of months ago.

He shows no signs of basketballability so far. Guys like Pruitt or Walker show they can belong on a NBA court during garbage time. Not POB. He still has chances to do it in the future, but time is running out for him. When was the last time in the history of the league that a player who produced so little in his first 3 seasons was still in the league after the 4th? Has it ever happened?

Well, there are plenty of big men who weren't given the chances that POB was given early in their career, but then developed as a player later.  Actually, the best example may be Mark Blount, who had to earn his way into the league with hard work, moulding himself from a player with great size and athleticism into a good NBA player.  Of course there was also the downfall following that...but the rise is whats important here.

Now, perhaps POB will use up his chances early, and get written off before he really gets the chance to grow into his body...but stranger things have happened.

[EJPLAYA]

People should stop talking about POB like he's some 17 years old who just left high school. He's a 3 years NBA veteran with 2 seasons of college. He's just 1 year younger than Perkins, 6 months younger than Dwight Howard or Gerald Green but 1 year older than Bynum, for example. He's 2/3 years older than guys like Lopez, Love or Oden. This "he'll be better next season, with a Summer of weight lifting" sounds a lot like the "Clifford Ray's coaching/the presence of the Big 3/a better system/etc. will make him a player" conversation of a couple of months ago.

He shows no signs of basketballability so far. Guys like Pruitt or Walker show they can belong on a NBA court during garbage time. Not POB. He still has chances to do it in the future, but time is running out for him. When was the last time in the history of the league that a player who produced so little in his first 3 seasons was still in the league after the 4th? Has it ever happened?

You had me until you said "He shows no signs of basketballability". You see if you'd just make your argument pointing out some specifics without going to the extreme that isn't close to true, then you might alter some mindsets. When you make a comment like that, which no everyone knows is ridiculous, you lose all credibility.

POB has shown many signs of "basketballability" and you know it. He has a very nice offensive game. He has a smooth shot. Can finish strong at the rim. (58% shooting) He has an instinct to block shots. His length allows him to deter shots he can't get to. He can pull down rebounds due to this length. He DOES struggle picking up bad fouls due to slower rotations. That is accurate and needs to improve. To say that he has no ability at all is just plain nonsense and you know it.

[cordobes]

People should stop talking about POB like he's some 17 years old who just left high school. He's a 3 years NBA veteran with 2 seasons of college. He's just 1 year younger than Perkins, 6 months younger than Dwight Howard or Gerald Green but 1 year older than Bynum, for example. He's 2/3 years older than guys like Lopez, Love or Oden. This "he'll be better next season, with a Summer of weight lifting" sounds a lot like the "Clifford Ray's coaching/the presence of the Big 3/a better system/etc. will make him a player" conversation of a couple of months ago.

He shows no signs of basketballability so far. Guys like Pruitt or Walker show they can belong on a NBA court during garbage time. Not POB. He still has chances to do it in the future, but time is running out for him. When was the last time in the history of the league that a player who produced so little in his first 3 seasons was still in the league after the 4th? Has it ever happened?

Well, there are plenty of big men who weren't given the chances that POB was given early in their career, but then developed as a player later.  Actually, the best example may be Mark Blount, who had to earn his way into the league with hard work, moulding himself from a player with great size and athleticism into a good NBA player.  Of course there was also the downfall following that...but the rise is whats important here.

Now, perhaps POB will use up his chances early, and get written off before he really gets the chance to grow into his body...but stranger things have happened.

Oh, I know lots of guys with similar paths to the one Blount traced - from Bruce Bowen to Anthony Parker. A player like Haislip, who was a very similar player to POB (8th pick of the draft if I'm not mistaken, reported bad work ethic, very raw), has developed into a fine basketball player, easily a rotational player in every NBA team, including the C's.

I'm always of the opinion that a basketball career is a marathon, not a sprint. However, those guys didn't have chances or didn't keep getting them ad aeternum. I don't think POB will have any kind of preferential treatment.

[crownsy]

People should stop talking about POB like he's some 17 years old who just left high school. He's a 3 years NBA veteran with 2 seasons of college. He's just 1 year younger than Perkins, 6 months younger than Dwight Howard or Gerald Green but 1 year older than Bynum, for example. He's 2/3 years older than guys like Lopez, Love or Oden. This "he'll be better next season, with a Summer of weight lifting" sounds a lot like the "Clifford Ray's coaching/the presence of the Big 3/a better system/etc. will make him a player" conversation of a couple of months ago.

He shows no signs of basketballability so far. Guys like Pruitt or Walker show they can belong on a NBA court during garbage time. Not POB. He still has chances to do it in the future, but time is running out for him. When was the last time in the history of the league that a player who produced so little in his first 3 seasons was still in the league after the 4th? Has it ever happened?

You had me until you said "He shows no signs of basketballability". You see if you'd just make your argument pointing out some specifics without going to the extreme that isn't close to true, then you might alter some mindsets. When you make a comment like that, which no everyone knows is ridiculous, you lose all credibility.

POB has shown many signs of "basketballability" and you know it. He has a very nice offensive game. He has a smooth shot. Can finish strong at the rim. (58% shooting) He has an instinct to block shots. His length allows him to deter shots he can't get to. He can pull down rebounds due to this length. He DOES struggle picking up bad fouls due to slower rotations. That is accurate and needs to improve. To say that he has no ability at all is just plain nonsense and you know it.

add "play tougher in the low post and do much better at protecting the rock" to the second half and you've pretty much got my view of him.

As i said, he's been much better latley. I think its clear the only way to settle this is to blow out a ton more teams and see if that higher effort level keeps up