Who Will the Red Sox Target for 08/09 FA? Who Will They Trade?

[Tr1boy]

Either Teix is one greedy son of a gun or boras that loser once again is up to his old tricks.

I really hope teix is high on his skills and can honor it with peak play for 8 years straight.

I think the redsox should retaliate and bring down the offer to 180 million for 8 years offer with the last step to withdrawal from the process. (honestly other than the redsox, angels, yankees, mets teams like texas,washington, baltimore will suffer economically in the long run, have to trade him to one of those big teams listed above and also have to eat a chunk of the contract). Texas last time i remember with the arod incident barely got anything back worthwhile

[nickagneta]

I think the state of the league is much different financially than when Texas first signed ARod. First off we aren't talking about $250 million and it's 8 years later. 10 teams in the league currently are paying at least one contract that was valued at over $100 million when it was signed. Another 5 clubs are paying at least one contract that was valued at over $80 million when it was signed. Teams like the Braves and Brewers and Orioles and Nationals who aren't counted amongst the above categories are now offer contracts to players in excess of $100 million. And new contracts aren't even in the stratosphere of that original ARod contract. Most top off at $70 million less than that original ARod deal.

A lot more clubs have the resources to offer deals that can compete with the Sox and Mets and Yankees of the world but just don't have a need for a first baseman. I guess what I am trying to say is don't rule out that Boras' claim of another team existing that has put an offer on the table that is higher than that of the Red Sox is unfounded. Lots more teams can afford a Texiera nowadays and won't be effected to the point of incapacitating the finances of the team where even if Texiera had monster production they would need to move him because they just can't afford to build around him.

[Chris]

Either Teix is one greedy son of a gun or boras that loser once again is up to his old tricks.

I really hope teix is high on his skills and can honor it with peak play for 8 years straight.

I think the redsox should retaliate and bring down the offer to 180 million for 8 years offer with the last step to withdrawal from the process. (honestly other than the redsox, angels, yankees, mets teams like texas,washington, baltimore will suffer economically in the long run, have to trade him to one of those big teams listed above and also have to eat a chunk of the contract). Texas last time i remember with the arod incident barely got anything back worthwhile

I don't know if it is about being greedy, I just think Tex is a union man through and through, and knows that if he takes significantly lower than the highest bid, it is not in the best interest of the union. 

[nickagneta]

Either Teix is one greedy son of a gun or boras that loser once again is up to his old tricks.

I really hope teix is high on his skills and can honor it with peak play for 8 years straight.

I think the redsox should retaliate and bring down the offer to 180 million for 8 years offer with the last step to withdrawal from the process. (honestly other than the redsox, angels, yankees, mets teams like texas,washington, baltimore will suffer economically in the long run, have to trade him to one of those big teams listed above and also have to eat a chunk of the contract). Texas last time i remember with the arod incident barely got anything back worthwhile

I don't know if it is about being greedy, I just think Tex is a union man through and through, and knows that if he takes significantly lower than the highest bid, it is not in the best interest of the union. 

Not only that but I never have a problem with an athlete who, when they are a free agent, try to maximize their contract. These guys only play so long and many don't have the skills or abilities to do anything else after they finish playing. If it was me I would want to get every dollar I could. You would too. Who wouldn't. Good for them. Call them greedy if you want, I call them human.

[Cman]

" Jason Varitek doesn't learn pitching staffs. He goes there and teaches them. I think that's what he does..........." - Scott Boras, while making a case for Varitek deserving a Posada-like 4yr/52 million $ deal.

The above quote is from the man telling John Henry & Co. that they'll need to up their ante for Teixeira. How have the Tek negotiations been going with the rest of the teams out there BTW? Because from what I've heard, NOBODY else wants this guy.

I think that not only are the Red Sox calling Boras's bluff, but that they've taken satisfaction in going on record that their offer had been allegedly dwarfed. They want Texeira & Boras to come back to them with egg on their face (unless of course, The Sox offer has been significantly topped, in which case good luck to that team. ).

Realistically, while Teixeira would be a nice addition to the line-up, we simply don't need him. Lowell and Ortiz figure to be healthy by '09, and Lars Anderson isn't too far off from being MLB ready. I have to say that I am far from being on pins and needles fretting about where this guy ends up. He's just one bat, like A-Rod, Bonds, and Ted Williams, who between them have combined for zero rings.

TP -- I like your sentiment here. 
I especially like the idea of Boras getting egg on his face.

[yall hate]

Not only that but I never have a problem with an athlete who, when they are a free agent, try to maximize their contract. These guys only play so long and many don't have the skills or abilities to do anything else after they finish playing. If it was me I would want to get every dollar I could. You would too. Who wouldn't. Good for them. Call them greedy if you want, I call them human.

Obviously a player is going to try and maximize their salary, but there is also something to be said for happiness.  A guy like CC made it very clear he wanted to play in the NL, he wanted to play out west, etc.  Now, maybe the value of those things was less then the difference between the yankee's and the brewers offer...or maybe CC was solely concerned with grabbing the most money possible.  Same with Tex.  is playing for a winner (Boston or LA) more valuable then being miserable playing for a loser (Baltimore of Washington) if the difference is only 10-20 million?  obviously that is a lot of money, but at the same time, it is likely less then 10% of the overall amount...

[nickagneta]

Not only that but I never have a problem with an athlete who, when they are a free agent, try to maximize their contract. These guys only play so long and many don't have the skills or abilities to do anything else after they finish playing. If it was me I would want to get every dollar I could. You would too. Who wouldn't. Good for them. Call them greedy if you want, I call them human.

Obviously a player is going to try and maximize their salary, but there is also something to be said for happiness.  A guy like CC made it very clear he wanted to play in the NL, he wanted to play out west, etc.  Now, maybe the value of those things was less then the difference between the yankee's and the brewers offer...or maybe CC was solely concerned with grabbing the most money possible.  Same with Tex.  is playing for a winner (Boston or LA) more valuable then being miserable playing for a loser (Baltimore of Washington) if the difference is only 10-20 million?  obviously that is a lot of money, but at the same time, it is likely less then 10% of the overall amount...

I don't think we as fans appreciate how these players view the baseball profession once the aura of being in the bigs wears off and the players realize, it is a job. We might thinkthat every athlete looks at things as playing for a winner as being an important factor but so many of these guys understand this is a business and in business, you have to go where the money is.

I can't even fathom the thought of making $10 million nevermind choosing between $160 and $180 million but for most who grew up not having everything they ever wanted, earning every dollar they can during that time so that they or their kids will never have to want for anything is important. Sometimes more important than winning a ring or living where they want during the season. For many, the security the money provides for their parents, themselves and their kids is much more important.

As in CC's case the extra $20-30 million that the Yankees offered was just lost mobey he would never see ever again. I don't know your specific situation but I know my wife wouldn't allow me to leave tens of millions on the table simply because I wanted to pitch in the National League or play in warm weather. It would be amazing how quick she would fall in love with the idea of living in NY when $20-$30 million is on the table.

[yall hate]

Not only that but I never have a problem with an athlete who, when they are a free agent, try to maximize their contract. These guys only play so long and many don't have the skills or abilities to do anything else after they finish playing. If it was me I would want to get every dollar I could. You would too. Who wouldn't. Good for them. Call them greedy if you want, I call them human.

Obviously a player is going to try and maximize their salary, but there is also something to be said for happiness.  A guy like CC made it very clear he wanted to play in the NL, he wanted to play out west, etc.  Now, maybe the value of those things was less then the difference between the yankee's and the brewers offer...or maybe CC was solely concerned with grabbing the most money possible.  Same with Tex.  is playing for a winner (Boston or LA) more valuable then being miserable playing for a loser (Baltimore of Washington) if the difference is only 10-20 million?  obviously that is a lot of money, but at the same time, it is likely less then 10% of the overall amount...

I don't think we as fans appreciate how these players view the baseball profession once the aura of being in the bigs wears off and the players realize, it is a job. We might thinkthat every athlete looks at things as playing for a winner as being an important factor but so many of these guys understand this is a business and in business, you have to go where the money is.

I can't even fathom the thought of making $10 million nevermind choosing between $160 and $180 million but for most who grew up not having everything they ever wanted, earning every dollar they can during that time so that they or their kids will never have to want for anything is important. Sometimes more important than winning a ring or living where they want during the season. For many, the security the money provides for their parents, themselves and their kids is much more important.

As in CC's case the extra $20-30 million that the Yankees offered was just lost mobey he would never see ever again. I don't know your specific situation but I know my wife wouldn't allow me to leave tens of millions on the table simply because I wanted to pitch in the National League or play in warm weather. It would be amazing how quick she would fall in love with the idea of living in NY when $20-$30 million is on the table.

Yea I know what you are saying, but when you are determining where you are going to be for X number of years, happiness 'should' weigh in.  and if the contracts we were discussing were 100k vs 200k then I could understand, but 160 vs 180 is less relevant (despite the fact it is for more money).  You would have to assume the player, his parents, kids, grandkids...could never spend 160 million, let allow 180. 

I know it is obviously easy for me to make comments when it isnt me parting with 20 million, but I would like to think that happiness does have some bearing.  oh well, obviously not.

[nickagneta]

The best thing about the CC deal is CC got the money and still is in an atmosphere where a championship will be fought for every year because of the players there and the money available. Same holds true in Boston for Texiera but the more I read about what's happening the more I think this is just Boras doing his usual power play crap to try and drain every last penny out of the team Texiera signs for. Sooner or later it's going to cost one of his clients tens of millions of dollars because teams are becoming much smarter in handling Boras and by going public with what he does.

[Chris]

Not only that but I never have a problem with an athlete who, when they are a free agent, try to maximize their contract. These guys only play so long and many don't have the skills or abilities to do anything else after they finish playing. If it was me I would want to get every dollar I could. You would too. Who wouldn't. Good for them. Call them greedy if you want, I call them human.

Obviously a player is going to try and maximize their salary, but there is also something to be said for happiness.  A guy like CC made it very clear he wanted to play in the NL, he wanted to play out west, etc.  Now, maybe the value of those things was less then the difference between the yankee's and the brewers offer...or maybe CC was solely concerned with grabbing the most money possible.  Same with Tex.  is playing for a winner (Boston or LA) more valuable then being miserable playing for a loser (Baltimore of Washington) if the difference is only 10-20 million?  obviously that is a lot of money, but at the same time, it is likely less then 10% of the overall amount...

The problem is, we don't know if money is the only factor.  If Tex takes more money to go to Washington or Baltimore, it may have just as much to do with the location as the money.  He is a family man, and his family is in Maryland.  So the comfort of being able to work so close to home might mean just as much to him as being on a winning team.  And I certainly can respect that.

With CC, of course it was about money, but if he left $60 million on the table...well, no one, and I mean NO ONE would do that.

[Chris]

Not only that but I never have a problem with an athlete who, when they are a free agent, try to maximize their contract. These guys only play so long and many don't have the skills or abilities to do anything else after they finish playing. If it was me I would want to get every dollar I could. You would too. Who wouldn't. Good for them. Call them greedy if you want, I call them human.

Obviously a player is going to try and maximize their salary, but there is also something to be said for happiness.  A guy like CC made it very clear he wanted to play in the NL, he wanted to play out west, etc.  Now, maybe the value of those things was less then the difference between the yankee's and the brewers offer...or maybe CC was solely concerned with grabbing the most money possible.  Same with Tex.  is playing for a winner (Boston or LA) more valuable then being miserable playing for a loser (Baltimore of Washington) if the difference is only 10-20 million?  obviously that is a lot of money, but at the same time, it is likely less then 10% of the overall amount...

I don't think we as fans appreciate how these players view the baseball profession once the aura of being in the bigs wears off and the players realize, it is a job. We might thinkthat every athlete looks at things as playing for a winner as being an important factor but so many of these guys understand this is a business and in business, you have to go where the money is.

I can't even fathom the thought of making $10 million nevermind choosing between $160 and $180 million but for most who grew up not having everything they ever wanted, earning every dollar they can during that time so that they or their kids will never have to want for anything is important. Sometimes more important than winning a ring or living where they want during the season. For many, the security the money provides for their parents, themselves and their kids is much more important.

As in CC's case the extra $20-30 million that the Yankees offered was just lost mobey he would never see ever again. I don't know your specific situation but I know my wife wouldn't allow me to leave tens of millions on the table simply because I wanted to pitch in the National League or play in warm weather. It would be amazing how quick she would fall in love with the idea of living in NY when $20-$30 million is on the table.

Yea I know what you are saying, but when you are determining where you are going to be for X number of years, happiness 'should' weigh in.  and if the contracts we were discussing were 100k vs 200k then I could understand, but 160 vs 180 is less relevant (despite the fact it is for more money).  You would have to assume the player, his parents, kids, grandkids...could never spend 160 million, let allow 180. 

I know it is obviously easy for me to make comments when it isnt me parting with 20 million, but I would like to think that happiness does have some bearing.  oh well, obviously not.

That is why he has the opt-out in 3 years.  If he really is unhappy in 3 years, he can leave.  But $60 million (or however much the difference was) is certainly motivation to give it a try. 

[Tr1boy]

What sort of bugs me the most is that teix is just one player but with such demands thinks he is the "team"

Not really his fault but during his tenure there, texas was a middle rated team (i mean skill is one thing, but infusing passion and leadership can take a team far) and this year he had a chance to help the angels beat the sox but didn't. Both cases the defense is that he is just one member and skillful one too. But he is not the whole team and already wants to get paid like one (i also have a theory that he has been always jealous of what arod got in texas)

I don't have a problem with guys like michael jordan getting paid 30 million per year because all he does is get you rings. And because he is such a significan player back then it didn't really matter who you had around him, you knew the team was going to be good. Same with guys like gretzky in his prime

teixera will make our offense even better but our main problem last year, was we were injured that prevented us from winning it all.

Don't want to be a debbie downer because i'd like him in our team, but i'm just worried about his ego after getting such a deal and how other players in the team will feel about it. (Pedroia loyal guy, not greedy but others who knows after this deal)

[Chris]

What sort of bugs me the most is that teix is just one player but with such demands thinks he is the "team"

Not really his fault but during his tenure there, texas was a middle rated team (i mean skill is one thing, but infusing passion and leadership can take a team far) and this year he had a chance to help the angels beat the sox but didn't. Both cases the defense is that he is just one member and skillful one too. But he is not the whole team and already wants to get paid like one (i also have a theory that he has been always jealous of what arod got in texas)

I don't have a problem with guys like michael jordan getting paid 30 million per year because all he does is get you rings. And because he is such a significan player back then it didn't really matter who you had around him, you knew the team was going to be good. Same with guys like gretzky in his prime

teixera will make our offense even better but our main problem last year, was we were injured that prevented us from winning it all.

Don't want to be a debbie downer because i'd like him in our team, but i'm just worried about his ego after getting such a deal and how other players in the team will feel about it. (Pedroia loyal guy, not greedy but others who knows after this deal)

I think you are blaming him for things that are not really in his control.  He is playing the market, the same way 99% of free agents do.  The problem is the system, not the players who use the system the way it was designed. 

And in Baseball, it is VERY tough for one player to make a significant difference (which is why it makes little sense for a team like the Nationals, who don't have a high payroll, to sink so much money into one player, not matter who it is).

The guy is going to make a ton of money, and in this market, he is worth it.  The Red Sox don't need him, he is a luxury, but he would still help the team immensely. 

This would not cause any problems with other players on the team, because they have can do the exact same thing Tex did, if they produce like him, and take the personal chance of playing out their contract/arbitration years to FA. 

The only thing that could cause problems and set bad precedents will be if the Sox put aside their rules, and give Tex clauses that they refuse to give others, like opt-outs and no-trades. 

And by the way, I absolutely think this could be the reason why Henry balked.  There was never any mention of money, and even Boras said there was not much discussion of money at their meeting.  My guess is Tex wants either an opt-out or no-trade, and the Sox are (rightfully so) drawing the line there.

[yall hate]

What sort of bugs me the most is that teix is just one player but with such demands thinks he is the "team"

Not really his fault but during his tenure there, texas was a middle rated team (i mean skill is one thing, but infusing passion and leadership can take a team far) and this year he had a chance to help the angels beat the sox but didn't. Both cases the defense is that he is just one member and skillful one too. But he is not the whole team and already wants to get paid like one (i also have a theory that he has been always jealous of what arod got in texas)

I don't have a problem with guys like michael jordan getting paid 30 million per year because all he does is get you rings. And because he is such a significan player back then it didn't really matter who you had around him, you knew the team was going to be good. Same with guys like gretzky in his prime

teixera will make our offense even better but our main problem last year, was we were injured that prevented us from winning it all.

Don't want to be a debbie downer because i'd like him in our team, but i'm just worried about his ego after getting such a deal and how other players in the team will feel about it. (Pedroia loyal guy, not greedy but others who knows after this deal)

Just remember, DeMarlo Hale was the third base coach at Texas when Tex was there.  He has had nothing but good things to say.  Professionalism, leadership, etc...  leaders are different and act differently.  Pierce isnt the vocal leader of the Celtics, but that doesnt mean he isnt 'a' leader, you know?  people lead in different ways.


Edit: I dont fault Tex for trying to get a lot of money because he is the best hitter on the market, and this contract is likely his last (maybe one more, but at 37ish, it will likely be a much smaller deal).  I have spoken out about some of the tactics used, and the crap between whether you take 8 year, 175 and hold out for 184 or whatever, but I dont fault him for looking for a big deal.

I do actually feel bad for Lowell.  He must be sitting there thinking, Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline., where am i playing next year, and do I want to play here as a backup option if Tex fails to sign...

[Toine43]

What sort of bugs me the most is that teix is just one player but with such demands thinks he is the "team"

Not really his fault but during his tenure there, texas was a middle rated team (i mean skill is one thing, but infusing passion and leadership can take a team far) and this year he had a chance to help the angels beat the sox but didn't. Both cases the defense is that he is just one member and skillful one too. But he is not the whole team and already wants to get paid like one (i also have a theory that he has been always jealous of what arod got in texas)

I don't have a problem with guys like michael jordan getting paid 30 million per year because all he does is get you rings. And because he is such a significan player back then it didn't really matter who you had around him, you knew the team was going to be good. Same with guys like gretzky in his prime

teixera will make our offense even better but our main problem last year, was we were injured that prevented us from winning it all.

Don't want to be a debbie downer because i'd like him in our team, but i'm just worried about his ego after getting such a deal and how other players in the team will feel about it. (Pedroia loyal guy, not greedy but others who knows after this deal)

I could rant for a while in response for this but I'll keep it short and sweet.

He's going to get paid a lot of money. A lot of baseball players make a lot of money.

1) His contract is what it is. It's not his fault that he's loaded.
2) You have no reason to say that he thinks he's the "whole team" just because he's going to get paid a lot. All reports say he's a good character guy...