Author Topic: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week  (Read 42982 times)

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Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #75 on: September 12, 2008, 08:39:30 AM »

Offline bucknersrevenge

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Not trying to be incendiary, or maybe I am, but how do all of you "In Danny We Trust" guys feel about this positive move? I mean, you have to admit, Cassell has more talent than any other player that Danny has brought aboard this off season. You have to be loving this, right? Or are you going to start being negative?

I figure it would be prudent to revisit nick's post here considering Danny has no confirmed that Sam for once was not actually just running his mouth. All I can say is it's a shame. If I'm Eddie House right now I have be incensed by this move. Eddie turned down better offers from other team to stay here because he liked it here and figured he proved himself in the Finals when they went back to him and they won. Now he's gonna get his job stolen from him again. And what's worse is because Sam looks to shoot first, second and third when he's on the court I wonder how well the new guys are really gonna get incorporated into the offense when he's on the floor. First move Danny's made this offseason that I disagree with.
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Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #76 on: September 12, 2008, 09:20:58 AM »

Offline nickagneta

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Not trying to be incendiary, or maybe I am, but how do all of you "In Danny We Trust" guys feel about this positive move? I mean, you have to admit, Cassell has more talent than any other player that Danny has brought aboard this off season. You have to be loving this, right? Or are you going to start being negative?

I figure it would be prudent to revisit nick's post here considering Danny has no confirmed that Sam for once was not actually just running his mouth. All I can say is it's a shame. If I'm Eddie House right now I have be incensed by this move. Eddie turned down better offers from other team to stay here because he liked it here and figured he proved himself in the Finals when they went back to him and they won. Now he's gonna get his job stolen from him again. And what's worse is because Sam looks to shoot first, second and third when he's on the court I wonder how well the new guys are really gonna get incorporated into the offense when he's on the floor. First move Danny's made this offseason that I disagree with.

I don't get the move either. Eddie proved that he is the back up PG. Unless Danny somehow thinks that Sam is going to come in and be the Sam of years back that could not only shoot first but also dish the ball well, I don't get the move.

Of course, this could all be an insurance plan against injury where Sam would be the 15th man, never dress, but be the defacto mentor to Rondo and Pruitt and Giddens and help on the court during practice. I could see Sam dressed in a suit on the sidelines just constantly talking in the young players ears about what they should watch for, think about and do. Then in practice, do the things that he finds gives the young guys trouble so they could work on it.

Yeah, I know, I'm just trying to look at this from the positive side but I just don't get it. Sam's shot left him when his shot always seemed to be there in the past, in the playoffs. I think his time to play should be over.

I wonder if in the contract if it says that if he doesn't make the team they will immediately morph the contract into that of a coach upon cutting him as a player? Can that even be done under the rules of the CBA?

Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #77 on: September 12, 2008, 09:24:45 AM »

Offline Greenback

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Whatever happened to the low risk/high reward thinking?   Sam’s skills have declined but he won’t be prone to rookie mistakes.  But I don’t think he will see that many minutes.  He is probably an insurance policy and mentor.

He is not as old as Reggie Miller.  KG likes him.  He’s a safer bet than Pruitt or Giddens as a 3rd string PG.

Sam scored 35 and 32 points in games last year.  Also, he scored over 20 pts in 12 games.  The same cannot be said for Rondo or Eddie.  Sam is an 86% career free throw shooter and knows how to draw fouls.  His mid range jumper is still pretty good. 

It’s not a bad thing having a little more scoring off the bench.  No one complains about Eddie being one dimensional.

His services will probably fit into the Celtics budget.  He can teach  Rondo.

Let’s see if he gets the contract.


we dont complain about eddie being one dimensional because he hits his shots, unlike ET, and takes them in the flow of the offense rather than sitting there for 10 seconds backing a guy down to shoot over him. he also passes well, hustles his heart out, and plays better team defense than sam could ever hope to archive.



I like Eddie.   However, he is steaky as his career shooting is 40.8%.  Last year in the playoffs it was 30.4%.  He is an undersized steaky shooting guard.
 
Also, he is a bit chubby and not a great ball handler or playmaker , as his 1.7 career assist per game shows. 

He doesn’t get to the line much.   He does have a quick release, (so it doesn’t get blocked) and he is a good 3 point shooter but that’s about it.  But when his shot is on, it’s a very good one dimensional weapon.

It would be a good thing if the Celtics get another veteran point guard.  Sam posting up is something we seldom see from other PGs on the team.   


Because we don't need our PGs to post up. We have plenty of post up options. But tell us more about how Rondo is bringing the team down again.  ::)

And our post players are, who again? 

Even a casual observer can see that the Celtics are a jump shooting team.
 
Just because Rondo cannot or will not post up, doesn’t mean we can’t use someone who can.

 

Well that's the first thing you've said I 100% agree with. There is no doubt this team had a jumpshooting, non-attacking feel to it last year. And while Paul and KG are both solid post up options as well as Perk, I felt the bench group led by 2 more jumpshooters created a problem. You are without a doubt right about that.

That's actually one of the reasons I'm okay with Posey not being on this team. I loved what Posey brought last year to help us win but 60% of all his shots were 3's. I'd much rather Eddie be the one main long range threat off the bench and the rest of the bench guys be more athletic and whose skills are more suited to attacking the rim.

While many of the guys we're bringing off the bench are inexperienced without question but I believe that inexperience to be counter-balanced and in the end outweighed by the infusion of talent, skill, and athleticism that both Doc and Danny believed were sorely lacking. While maybe only O'Bryant among them is a pure back-to-the-basket option these guys are all about taking the ball to the hole and that makes creating offense off the bench easier.

In Sam's case I just don't believe his 1 or 2 postups are gonna be enough of a weapon. Count me in as someone that does not believe a full training camp is gonna make a leopard change his stripes. At this point you gotta call a spade a spade. In the end, I just feel what the combination of Pruitt and Eddie at point will give us more than Sam and their weaknesses aren't as glaring as Sam's are at this point. 5 years ago I couldn't say this but now I can.

EDIT: Hey I'm one away from my first star!!

KG is not much of a post player.  He can but doesn’t often.  He’s a jump shooter.  Pierce may be our best post up player.  Perk is very slow and methodical.  Powe and Baby are mostly offensive rebounders.

Because the C’s are a jump shooting team, people that go to the rim and post up add other dimensions to the offense. 

Ainge drafted Giddens and Walker because they can get to the rim and hopefully finish.  Maybe Pruitt can.  Unfortunately again, Rondo doesn’t finish well and doesn’t shoot FTs well. 

Ray Allen drives occasionally.  Tony Allen can get to the rim but doesn’t finish consistently either.

Posey occasionally took it to the hoop.  Big Game James made his FTs and wasn’t afraid to take the big shot.   

Eddie is valuable because Rondo has no 3 point shot.  But Eddie will run down the court and stand in the corner waiting for the ball.  Eddie does not drive or post up and can’t handle defensive pressure.  Eddie was in the 4th quarter a lot last year because Rondo is still learning how to close games. 

Sam is not afraid to take the big shot, is a very good free throw shooter, and knows how to get fouls.  He should help us close games in the 4th quarter.
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Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #78 on: September 12, 2008, 10:57:09 AM »

Offline JSD

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Well I was wrong. Ainge has spoken:

"Sam Cassell is expected to sign with the Celtics for the 2008-09 season, general manager Danny Ainge said yesterday. Cassell joined the team last season as a reserve point guard. Cassell, 38, plans to play one more season, then become an assistant coach, according to the Baltimore Sun." (Boston Globe)

Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #79 on: September 12, 2008, 11:19:19 AM »

Offline BringToughnessBack

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Wow, so much for my hibernation. I am a bit shocked and surprised by the Celtics bringing back Cassell..I don't like it on many levels. Does this mean House will be looking over his shoulder again come playoff time? Who is out the door? hey if he is going to replace Scali then maybe I can get on board with this but as of right now, I would have preferred a big fat NO.

I will hold final opinions until I see what Danny has up his sleeve. I am sure it will not be long before we will see what he has planned with another tinkering of our roster.

On another note, I cannot wait for the season to get here...I am having major Celtics withdrawals

Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #80 on: September 12, 2008, 11:23:11 AM »

Offline Redz

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Is it at all beyond the realm of possibility that going through a training camp and playing a full season with the team might actually make Sam more beneficial to the team than what we saw last year when he was thrown into the fire?
Yup

Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #81 on: September 12, 2008, 11:25:26 AM »

Offline JSD

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A little more...

"Sam made a comment that he would like to coach someday, and I already knew that," Ainge said. "But we are working on a deal to bring Sam back as a player. There is nothing done yet, but we could get it done soon. "We always bring four point guards to training camp. We love where Gabe [Pruitt] is and we also have Eddie House. Rajon [Rondo] is our starter and they are fighting for the backup spot." Boston Globe

Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #82 on: September 12, 2008, 11:28:06 AM »

Offline BballTim

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Penciling Pruitt in for minutes makes as much sense as those who portend to know exactly what Giddens and Walker will contribute.

Fact is, no one knows. And championship teams don't win titles with benches full of "no one knows."

Nothing wrong with signing Sam. We're going to have to bring back PJ, too, because the bench big situation is a disaster. Nothing wrong with either one.

  The only people who seem to portend to know exactly what Giddens and Walker will contribute are those who claim that we have a big hole at backup sf.

  If Pruitt can't average 5 minutes a game in his second season I don't see much of a reason to have him on the roster.

Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #83 on: September 12, 2008, 11:45:32 AM »

Offline bucknersrevenge

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Whatever happened to the low risk/high reward thinking?   Sam’s skills have declined but he won’t be prone to rookie mistakes.  But I don’t think he will see that many minutes.  He is probably an insurance policy and mentor.

He is not as old as Reggie Miller.  KG likes him.  He’s a safer bet than Pruitt or Giddens as a 3rd string PG.

Sam scored 35 and 32 points in games last year.  Also, he scored over 20 pts in 12 games.  The same cannot be said for Rondo or Eddie.  Sam is an 86% career free throw shooter and knows how to draw fouls.  His mid range jumper is still pretty good. 

It’s not a bad thing having a little more scoring off the bench.  No one complains about Eddie being one dimensional.

His services will probably fit into the Celtics budget.  He can teach  Rondo.

Let’s see if he gets the contract.


we dont complain about eddie being one dimensional because he hits his shots, unlike ET, and takes them in the flow of the offense rather than sitting there for 10 seconds backing a guy down to shoot over him. he also passes well, hustles his heart out, and plays better team defense than sam could ever hope to archive.



I like Eddie.   However, he is steaky as his career shooting is 40.8%.  Last year in the playoffs it was 30.4%.  He is an undersized steaky shooting guard.
 
Also, he is a bit chubby and not a great ball handler or playmaker , as his 1.7 career assist per game shows. 

He doesn’t get to the line much.   He does have a quick release, (so it doesn’t get blocked) and he is a good 3 point shooter but that’s about it.  But when his shot is on, it’s a very good one dimensional weapon.

It would be a good thing if the Celtics get another veteran point guard.  Sam posting up is something we seldom see from other PGs on the team.   


Because we don't need our PGs to post up. We have plenty of post up options. But tell us more about how Rondo is bringing the team down again.  ::)

And our post players are, who again? 

Even a casual observer can see that the Celtics are a jump shooting team.
 
Just because Rondo cannot or will not post up, doesn’t mean we can’t use someone who can.

 

Well that's the first thing you've said I 100% agree with. There is no doubt this team had a jumpshooting, non-attacking feel to it last year. And while Paul and KG are both solid post up options as well as Perk, I felt the bench group led by 2 more jumpshooters created a problem. You are without a doubt right about that.

That's actually one of the reasons I'm okay with Posey not being on this team. I loved what Posey brought last year to help us win but 60% of all his shots were 3's. I'd much rather Eddie be the one main long range threat off the bench and the rest of the bench guys be more athletic and whose skills are more suited to attacking the rim.

While many of the guys we're bringing off the bench are inexperienced without question but I believe that inexperience to be counter-balanced and in the end outweighed by the infusion of talent, skill, and athleticism that both Doc and Danny believed were sorely lacking. While maybe only O'Bryant among them is a pure back-to-the-basket option these guys are all about taking the ball to the hole and that makes creating offense off the bench easier.

In Sam's case I just don't believe his 1 or 2 postups are gonna be enough of a weapon. Count me in as someone that does not believe a full training camp is gonna make a leopard change his stripes. At this point you gotta call a spade a spade. In the end, I just feel what the combination of Pruitt and Eddie at point will give us more than Sam and their weaknesses aren't as glaring as Sam's are at this point. 5 years ago I couldn't say this but now I can.

EDIT: Hey I'm one away from my first star!!

KG is not much of a post player.  He can but doesn’t often.  He’s a jump shooter.  Pierce may be our best post up player.  Perk is very slow and methodical.  Powe and Baby are mostly offensive rebounders.

Because the C’s are a jump shooting team, people that go to the rim and post up add other dimensions to the offense. 

Ainge drafted Giddens and Walker because they can get to the rim and hopefully finish.  Maybe Pruitt can.  Unfortunately again, Rondo doesn’t finish well and doesn’t shoot FTs well. 

Ray Allen drives occasionally.  Tony Allen can get to the rim but doesn’t finish consistently either.

Posey occasionally took it to the hoop.  Big Game James made his FTs and wasn’t afraid to take the big shot.   

Eddie is valuable because Rondo has no 3 point shot.  But Eddie will run down the court and stand in the corner waiting for the ball.  Eddie does not drive or post up and can’t handle defensive pressure.  Eddie was in the 4th quarter a lot last year because Rondo is still learning how to close games. 

Sam is not afraid to take the big shot, is a very good free throw shooter, and knows how to get fouls.  He should help us close games in the 4th quarter.


I agree about tony last year though I think some of it still had to do with his mental approach coming back from the injury. He could be a more solid finisher around the hoop this time around with a full camp and more minutes.

Rondo I think is a decent finisher he just doesn't look at the rim nearly enough. It was also his rookie season for all intents last year. Greenback I think you forget that about Rondo. And I do too when I'm watching games and I see him pass up an easy look I get frustrated. But in the end we're still talking about a 22 year old kid. You have to know that. A 22 year old kid that helped lead his team to a championship 1 year removed from being on an 18 win team. The kid's a player whether you wanna like it or not. He may not yet possess the jumpshot you're looking for but this kid impacts the game at both ends and whether you choose to believe it or not there are very few of his kind in the game right now...and hes gonna get better. As for the 4th quarter it's gonna be Rondo who will be finishing games not Sam Cassell.
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Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #84 on: September 12, 2008, 01:19:44 PM »

Offline P2

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What can this mean other than Miles getting waived and Giddens, Walker and Tony Allen filling in for Pierce as the backup SF?

Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #85 on: September 12, 2008, 02:10:03 PM »

Offline BballTim

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And our post players are, who again? 

Even a casual observer can see that the Celtics are a jump shooting team.
 
Just because Rondo cannot or will not post up, doesn’t mean we can’t use someone who can.


  We're not a jump shooting team. We're middle of the pack in percentage of inside shots.

  http://www.82games.com/FGTEAM11.HTM

Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #86 on: September 12, 2008, 02:44:48 PM »

Offline cordobes

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Penciling Pruitt in for minutes makes as much sense as those who portend to know exactly what Giddens and Walker will contribute.

Fact is, no one knows. And championship teams don't win titles with benches full of "no one knows."

Nothing wrong with signing Sam. We're going to have to bring back PJ, too, because the bench big situation is a disaster. Nothing wrong with either one.

TP. Concise and correct.

This move shows Ainge wants to achieve a better balance on our bench in terms of proven/unproven.

What can this mean other than Miles getting waived and Giddens, Walker and Tony Allen filling in for Pierce as the backup SF?

If Sam accepts the offer, who knows what will happen? I tend to think you are right, but maybe Pruitt is waived, maybe there's a 2 for 1 trade, maybe Walker is waived... I guess we'll have to wait till after the training camp, then Ainge and Doc will decided on who is more ready to contribute and who is a sure bet to contribute in the future.

Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #87 on: September 12, 2008, 02:50:34 PM »

Offline cordobes

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Quote
Ainge drafted Giddens and Walker because they can get to the rim and hopefully finish.

A little off-topic here: I don't know how much has Walker improved his game after finishing his season, but last year he was terrible attacking the rim, unless he was already close to it or playing on the open court. But penetrating from the perimeter? Nah, he had no idea on how to do it. Too out of control, bad ballhandling, therefore virtually no court vision...

Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #88 on: September 12, 2008, 03:06:57 PM »

Offline D Dub

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Well, I think 2 players will have to go.

One to make room for Sam now, and another has to go later in the season to make room for PJ. 








Re: Cassell Says He Will Sign Contract With Celtics Next Week
« Reply #89 on: September 12, 2008, 03:46:59 PM »

Offline Cman

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Eddie turned down better offers from other team to stay here

Really?  He got a pretty lucrative offer from the Cs.  He shouldn't be too upset, the Cs and fans clearly value him.  Is it that bad that he has a little competition at the backup spot?
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