30 team CelticsBlog draft, year two

[JSD]

BTW I am buying a 3rd rounder offering a 4th, a 6th and some important tps.
if u have one under No. 20 call me
he best position gets the prize.

thanks

Edgar

and I mean SERIOUS TPs

Those TP's should come with an * 

[RebusRankin]

I'll give massive tps and a 5th rounder for another 3rd rounder. Plus I'll be your friend.

[Roy Hobbs]

Hmm...  perhaps it's time to implement last year's "10 TPs per transaction maximum" to keep things fair.

[crownsy]

i don't understand why lopsided trades are veto'd. i'm sure that if this trade occurred before the draft, and the trade went like a 1st round pick for two 3rd round picks and a 4th round pick, it would have been approved. one sided trades happen all the time in the real nba. if both parties agree, i don't see why it can be rejected. just this year we saw the gasol trade be one sided, as well as the camby trade. by rejecting the trade, you are not only breaking your vow of neutrality, but also favoring one team over another.

A few points, in wdleehi's defense:

1) Vetos have been a part of this year's draft since the beginning.   Everybody knew about this.

2) Lopsided trades in the NBA (Gasol, Camby) are motivated by money.  We don't have this here.

3) I don't see how this breaks neutrality; if there is a veto power at all, the Commish has to exercise it in the best interests of the league.  The role of a veto is to protect us from ourselves.

I personally would use the veto pretty sparingly, and I don't know if I'd have one  at all.  However, the fact is there *is* a veto, and wdleehi wielded it to protect the league as best he can.

my two cents on this, since every owner seems to be chiming in. WDL does this for free, we really did nothing but join his league, and he has every right to veto in my eyes, and i have no problem with it being exercised.

That said, i do tend find the veto a little suspect considering some of the trades that have gone through unquestioned .

thats my first and last stance on the issue

[crownsy]

Wasn't somebody putting all of the teams from this year into a simulation?

I will do my best to do this with draft day sports full court basketball. not sure how succesful it will be, really depends on the modding comminuty putting out a new roster set next month when FA is final.

[wdleehi]

Hmm...  perhaps it's time to implement last year's "10 TPs per transaction maximum" to keep things fair.

Also, I did say that TPs have no actual trade value. 

[zerophase]

Wasn't somebody putting all of the teams from this year into a simulation?

I will do my best to do this with draft day sports full court basketball. not sure how succesful it will be, really depends on the modding comminuty putting out a new roster set next month when FA is final.

why not just run it in 2k9?

[crownsy]

Wasn't somebody putting all of the teams from this year into a simulation?

I will do my best to do this with draft day sports full court basketball. not sure how succesful it will be, really depends on the modding comminuty putting out a new roster set next month when FA is final.

why not just run it in 2k9?

because DDS is a sim engine, made to sim out franchises based on text sims, and thus eliminates the arcadeness of nba2k, and takes into account a ton of ratings and stats. the NBA2k8 sims, while fantastic games, dont really finsh anywhere near reality in my experiance

(for instance, and i still remeber this because it was hillarious, here were the first 3 winners in my non-fantasy drafted clippers franchise i took to play rebuilding mode)

bobcats (lol), Jazz (acceptable) Knicks (?)

[LarBrd33]

I just want to apologize to everyone for how I acted.  I was disappointed that the commissioner was influencing the outcome of the game.  It essentially ruined the entire experience for me and made the entire exercise pointless.  It also meant I had just wasted the last few days playing along with you guys only to have the entire game broken in the process.   

I have taken everyone's advice and spoken to wdleehi privately about this.  He's finally (after several attempts) given me an explanation for why he blocked the trade between the Warriors and the Wizards

Recap:  Wizards tried to trade Chris Bosh for the 3rd round #3, 3rd round #24 and a 4th rounder.

The commish didn't approve the trade, because he felt the Wizards were making a mistake and could get much better value.

The trade would have worked out to Chris Bosh for Devin Harris (#3) and Josh Howard (#24), and a 4th.

The notable players picked after Harris:  Bogut, Artest, Odom, Prince, O'Neal, Dalembert, Richard Jefferson, Okur, Hinrich, Turkaglu, Ben Gordon

The notable players picked after Josh Howard:  Ak47, Marvin Williams, Peja, Maurice Williams, Zach Randolph, Grant Hill... etc

So the Wizards could have easily ended up with two allstar players in return for Bosh.    Anyone who had a draft board could see how that trade would have essentially been fair after the dust settled.

Earlier today I was able to trade for Chris Bosh (Gave up marion and the #26 who ended up being Kirilenko in order to get him).  I knew I was giving up too much, but I wanted to prove a point.    I then offered Bosh for the same package as above (two 3rd rounders and a 4th).  The Commish again rejected it saying I was giving up Bosh for too little (I didn't think Tayshaun Prince and Josh Howard was "too litte").   

I then got very frustrated with this experience and the commissioner preventing me from making trades.  I basically offered up Chris Bosh to the first person who would send me a trade.   I ended up trading Bosh for Rasheed Wallace.   The commissioner had no problem approving this. 

So a 33 year old big man malcontent who averages 12 points and 6 rebounds is more "fair" value for Chris Bosh than Tayshaun Prince and Josh Howard?   Ugh...

I asked the commish for his explanation and he FINALLY gave me his reasoning:

"I put value on players based on were they are being picked.  It is simple.  Everyone can see where a player is."

So because Rasheed went in the 2nd round... the commish felt he had more value than Josh Howard and Tayshaun Prince.  (It's interesting to note that I offered Rasheed straight up for AK47 after this whole thing, and the Wizards flatly refused.  Kinda gives you an idea the kind of perception Rasheed has.   I traded Marion and Ak47 for Sheed and couldn't even get give away Sheed for Ak47)

Later when I asked him if he seriously put more value on Rasheed Wallace than Josh Howard and Tayshaun Prince he responded with:

See, that the problem.  The Commish decisions are not going to be based on what you think. 

Well that settles that...

Again... I would like to sincerely apologize to EVERYONE for ruining your experience.  I know I stepped way out of line, got frustrated and dug myself into a hole.   The majority of the time I was just staying in character and trying to negotiate trades.  When I initially started "calling out" the commish I was doing it as a joke... as if I was Mark Cuban and he was David Stern.  But I know I rubbed the majority of you the wrong way and I'm definitely sorry for that.   I was very likely the most active person in this little mock draft (I have 600 messages in my PM inbox since this exercise started) and I hope everyone understands I was just trying to maximize my team's potential.  The reason I asked for the Bobcats and a mid 1st rounder to begin with was because I wanted a challenge and wanted to turn the Bobcats into a powerhouse despite everyone's expectations.

But I'll take Robb's lead and take everyone's suggestion and just step down at this point.   I ruined the experience for half of you and I felt like the experience was ruined for me.   Prior to the "vetos" my team was:

Deron Williams, Yao Ming, Shawn Marion, Derrick Rose, 4th round (#2), 5th round (#8), 12th (#7), 13th (#24), 14th (#7), 15th (#24)

After the vetos my team is:  Deron Williams, Yao Ming, Derrick Rose, Rasheed Wallace and the 4th round #8

I just wasted the last several days playing this game with you all.  And I wish the best of luck to whoever takes my place.  I had a plan to turn my team into a powerhouse, but the entire thing is bogus now.  I hope everyone accepts my apology and understands I was just doing my best to win the "competition".  And wdheeli... I said several times that you were doing a fantastic job.  But the second you started influencing the outcome with your "trade veto power", I felt obligated to rant about it.  I hope we can be pals after this.  It was just a game.  Ubuntu baby.  Go Celtics!  I'll see ya on the rest of the forum. 



   

[Celtic Fan Forever]

I just want to apologize to everyone for how I acted.  I was disappointed that the commissioner was influencing the outcome of the game.  It essentially ruined the entire experience for me and made the entire exercise pointless.  It also meant I had just wasted the last few days playing along with you guys only to have the entire game broken in the process.   

I have taken everyone's advice and spoken to wdleehi privately about this.  He's finally (after several attempts) given me an explanation for why he blocked the trade between the Warriors and the Wizards

Recap:  Wizards tried to trade Chris Bosh for the 3rd round #3, 3rd round #24 and a 4th rounder.

The commish didn't approve the trade, because he felt the Wizards were making a mistake and could get much better value.

The trade worked out to Chris Bosh for Devin Harris (#3) and Josh Howard (#24), and a 4th.

The notable players picked after Harris:  Bogut, Artest, Odom, Prince, O'Neal, Dalembert, Richard Jefferson, Okur, Hinrich, Turkaglu, Ben Gordon

The notable players picked after Josh Howard:  Ak47, Marvin Williams, Peja, Maurice Williams, Zach Randolph, Grant Hill... etc

So the Wizards could have easily ended up with two allstar players in return for Bosh.    Anyone who had a draft board could see how that trade would have essentially been fair after the dust settled.

Earlier today I was able to trade for Chris Bosh (Gave up marion and the #26 who ended up being Kirilenko in order to get him).  I knew I was giving up too much, but I wanted to prove a point.    I then offered Bosh for the same package as above (two 3rd rounders and a 4th).  The Commish again rejected it saying I was giving up Bosh for too little (I didn't think Tayshaun Prince and Josh Howard was "too litte").   

I then got very frustrated with this experience and the commissioner preventing me from making trades.  I basically offered up Chris Bosh to the first person who would send me a trade.   I ended up trading Bosh for Rasheed Wallace.   The commissioner had no problem approving this. 

So a 33 year old big man malcontent who averages 12 points and 6 rebounds is more "fair" value for Chris Bosh than Tayshaun Prince and Josh Howard?   Ugh...

I asked the commish for his explanation and he FINALLY gave me his reasoning:

"I put value on players based on were they are being picked.  It is simple.  Everyone can see where a player is."

So because Rasheed went in the 2nd round... the commish felt he had more value than Josh Howard and Tayshaun Prince.

Later when I asked him if he seriously put more value on Rasheed Wallace than Josh Howard and Tayshaun Prince he responded with:

See, that the problem.  The Commish decisions are not going to be based on what you think. 

Well that settles that...

Again... I would like to sincerely apologize to EVERYONE for ruining your experience.  I know I stepped way out of line, got frustrated and dug myself into a hole.   The majority of the time I was just staying in character and trying to negotiate trades.  When I initially started "calling out" the commish I was doing it as a joke... as if I was Mark Cuban and he was David Stern.  But I know I rubbed the majority of you the wrong way and I'm definitely sorry for that.   I was very likely the most active person in this little mock draft (I have 600 messages in my PM inbox since this exercise started) and I hope everyone understands I was just trying to maximize my team's potential.  The reason I asked for the Bobcats and a mid 1st rounder to begin with was because I wanted a challenge and wanted to turn the Bobcats into a powerhouse despite everyone's expectations.

But I'll take Robb's lead and take everyone's suggestion and just step down at this point.   I ruined the experience for half of you and I felt like the experience was ruined for me.   Prior to the "vetos" my team was:

Deron Williams, Yao Ming, Shawn Marion, Derrick Rose, 4th round (#2), 5th round (#8), 12th (#7), 13th (#24), 14th (#7), 15th (#24)

After the vetos my team is:  Deron Williams, Yao Ming, Derrick Rose, Rasheed Wallace and the 4th round #8

I just wasted the last several days playing this game with you all.  And I wish the best of luck to whoever takes my place.  I had a plan to turn my team into a powerhouse, but the entire thing is bogus now.  I hope everyone accepts my apology and understands I was just doing my best to win the "competition".  And wdheeli... I said several times that you were doing a fantastic job.  But the second you started influencing the outcome with your "trade veto power", I felt obligated to rant about it.  I hope we can be pals after this.  It was just a game.  Ubuntu baby.  Go Celtics!  I'll see ya on the rest of the forum. 



   

After reading through that entire thing, that was truly a great post. I know many have gotten annoyed with larbrd33, but this is one of the most sincere apologies I've seen in  a while. I forgive you, I don't know abou any of the other GM's though. I'm sorry you couldn't get the most out of this experience, and I really hope this doesn't change anyone's views on you as a poster on this blog.

[LarBrd33]

thanks CFF.   Best of luck in the competition.   Under normal circumstances there is no conceivably way I would ever had traded you Chris Bosh for Rasheed Wallace and a 4th rounder... but it was well within the "veto" rules and compliment you for your diligence and taking advantage of the opportunities given to you.  Well played, sir... well played. 

Side note.. Btw... if Roy Hobbs reads this I only have one thing to say to him:  You remember that extremely lopsided trade I pulled off (that was subsequently vetoed) where I traded the 3rd round #26 for a 4th #2 and 5th rounder?  We kept arguing back and forth that 6 spots didn't matter.   Look who was taken #26... Andre Kirelenko ... Do you think equal value will still be there with the 2nd pick in the 4th round?  Debatable.  And giving up a 5th rounder was probably worth the risk for the Wizards in that hypothetical trade that was vetoed...

K... I'm out.  See you guys around.  Gew Bawbkittehz, Iz mis u!

[celticmaestro]

was good to have you on board, shame about your departure and i hope to see you again next year.

[KCattheStripe]

In the first of two major announcements, Washington Wizard's GM KCatthestripe announced that he has offered the General managment position of the Wizards' D-League affiliate to Larbrd33. Now word yet on whether or not Larbrd33 has accepted the position.

In response to fan criticisms that the team had moved away from the youth and athletiscism movement that he had promised, GM Atthestripe said that though the team had moved away from the youth movement, they certainly had not strayed from the Athleticism. " We realized we may not be able to create the ideal contender with the picks we had, nor could we draft a team of young studs that would lead us victory six years from now.


So we decided that we owed it to the fans in Washington that if we may not win now, and we can't win later, then we might as well put the most entertaining team on the floor as possible. We're not just gonna run by people, we're going to jump through them, Shoot over them and basically make them look silly. All the while giving fans the most athletically exciting team that we can give them. Jay Bilas will love our team.


Coach Eddie Jordan was especially excited about the forward duo that the Wizard's aquirred, " Defense is what ignites a running attack, and having these two PREMIRE defenders on at the forward spots gives us to people who can both ignite the fast break and finish it. Also it gives us the flexibility to shut down an opposing teams two best players." When asked about his thoughts about 2nd year guard Rodney Stuckey, Jordan said simply " You all saw the Eastern conference finals, next question."

Atthestripe was then asked about a rumor that Wizards' had literally tried to steal Tayshaun Prince from the Warriors. "Just an innocent misunderstanding," said Atthestripe, " We sent the Warriors a fruit basket as an apology."

When asked about the apparent holes at Point Guard and Center Atthestripe said cryptically " Just wait, we think we have answers to both those positions that will continue the trend of superior athletes running and running and running some more."


PG.
SG. Rodney Stuckey
SF. Andrei Kirilenko
PF. Shawn Marion
C.

[Celtic Fan Forever]

thanks CFF.   Best of luck in the competition.   Under normal circumstances there is no conceivably way I would ever had traded you Chris Bosh for Rasheed Wallace and a 4th rounder... but it was well within the "veto" rules and compliment you for your diligence and taking advantage of the opportunities given to you.  Well played, sir... well played. 

I know, lol  

[LarBrd33]

was good to have you on board, shame about your departure and i hope to see you again next year.

I could handle having the team I constructed prior to the "veto" ordeal: Deron Williams, Yao Ming, Shawn Marion, Derrick Rose and Andre Kirilenko....

I could handle having the team I constructed after the trades that were eventually vetoed: Deron Williams, Yao Ming, Shawn Marion, Derrick Rose, 4th round (#2), 5th round (#8), 12th (#7), 13th (#24), 14th (#7), 15th (#24)

I could handle having the team I constructed before I felt the commish contradicted himself:  Deron Williams, Yao Ming, Derrick Rose, Chris Bosh

But it's not fun to just accept the team the commissioner saw fit to give me:  Deron Williams, Yao Ming, Derrick Rose, Rasheed Wallace and the 4th round (#8)...

If I'm invited to participate next year (doubtful after all the bridges I burned), i'll be happy to participate as long as the "veto" rule is applied the way it was intended (to prevent collusion)... and not as a means of controlling the flow of the game