Nets, Tsai upset about Cryrie's promotion of antisemitic book, film

[BringToughnessBack]

Anyone know the NBA’s view on the racism that is sanctioned by Chinese government? I am happy Lebron spoke out  about Kyrie but curious about Silver and Lebron’s views on the Uyghurs too.

Kyrie will not be in this league at age 35. Hell, I am not sure he will be playing at 32.

What Kyrie did is truly disgusting though. What  the Chinese government actions vs another race are disgusting as well. Different levels of disgusting , and should be condemned and stopped.

There is zero chance Kyrie’s foot does not end up in his mouth again this season. Only one leader has ever kept Kyrie in check and that was ironically Lebron.

[Kernewek]

I think the NBA mostly sticks with 'shut up and dribble' when it comes to China, which is sad but isn't particularly relevant to antisemitism. For what its worth, though, I agree with you.




However, from our boy Jaylen Brown, who is certainly allowed to think what he wants but is fast shaping up to be my personal facepalm trigger of the season:

"I don’t believe Kyrie Irving is antisemitic. I don’t think people in our governing bodies think he’s antisemitic. He made a mistake."

"I'm expecting the NBPA to appeal the suspension from Brooklyn. The terms, etc., that went into his return. The terms for his return, they seem like a lot, and a lot of the players expressed discomfort with the terms."

https://www.bostonglobe.com/2022/11/07/sports/jaylen-brown-kyrie-irving/

Presuming that the terms the union is held up on is the 500k donation and the general 'Elder Scrolls Sidequest' nature of the path to reinstatement but guys, c'mon.

[cman88]

Anyone know the NBA’s view on the racism that is sanctioned by Chinese government? I am happy Lebron spoke out  about Kyrie but curious about Silver and Lebron’s views on the Uyghurs too.

Kyrie will not be in this league at age 35. Hell, I am not sure he will be playing at 32.

What Kyrie did is truly disgusting though. What  the Chinese government actions vs another race are disgusting as well. Different levels of disgusting , and should be condemned and stopped.

There is zero chance Kyrie’s foot does not end up in his mouth again this season. Only one leader has ever kept Kyrie in check and that was ironically Lebron.

If I recall, when they asked LeBron about Hong Kong when the CCP was cracking down on protests and democracy he said he doesn't worry about other countries...

That was when the whole morey controversy went around. The NBA is very selective here..

[Roy H.]

Jaylen is quickly approaching the “fake intellectual “ label himself.  As I noted over the summer, when somebody surrounds himself with Kanye and Kyrie, it’s at least a yellow flag.

He’s a great basketball player, and seemingly a good guy.  He may want to check his sphere of influence though.

[ozgod]

More on what Jaylen said:

“There is an interesting distinction between what somebody says verbally and what somebody posts as a link on a platform with no description behind it,” Brown said. “Some people will argue there’s no difference and some people will argue there is a difference. There’s no language in our CBA. There’s no rules against it. This is uncharted territory for everybody, and everybody is trying to figure out the difference between the two.”

“He made a mistake. He posted something,” Brown said. “There was no distinction. Maybe we can move forward, but the terms in which he has to fulfill to return, I think not just speaking for me, speaking as a vice president from a lot of our players, we didn’t agree with the terms that was required for him to come back and we’re waiting for this Tuesday meeting to happen to see what comes of it. But we’ll go from there. That’s all I’ll say.”

https://www.bostonglobe.com/2022/11/07/sports/jaylen-brown-kyrie-irving/

I guess he's trying to use the "retweets are not endorsements" philosophy that a lot of public figures use when it comes to Twitter, and saying that the punishment is excessive if Cryrie wasn't endorsing those views, just tweeting them.

I think Cryrie, Jaylen and the PA need to figure out if this is a hill they want to die on. I get that it's a brotherhood, and they stick up for their own, that's the purpose of the PA after all. But some things are just wrong, and sometimes it's easier to just accept when someone did something wrong and do their penance, instead of trying to find technicalities and splitting hairs.

[nickagneta]

Jaylen is quickly approaching the “fake intellectual “ label himself.  As I noted over the summer, when somebody surrounds himself with Kanye and Kyrie, it’s at least a yellow flag.

He’s a great basketball player, and seemingly a good guy.  He may want to check his sphere of influence though.

I don't know why he is suddenly a "fake intellectual" other than because he is defending Kyrie, the player and was associated with Ye.

As a VP in the PA, it's kind of his job to stick up for players and the type of demands being made upon Kyrie are definitely unique and not addressed in any way in the CBA or the standard player's contract. So wanting to stop some strange precedent from being established makes sense, if look at from the perspective of being a VP representing players in matters dealing with differences with owners of the league.

That said, I wish Jaylen would have let some other VP come to Kyrie's defense, as I don't like Kyrie, don't like anti-semetism or anti-semites and don't like Brooklyn Nets players.

[Roy H.]

More on what Jaylen said:

“There is an interesting distinction between what somebody says verbally and what somebody posts as a link on a platform with no description behind it,” Brown said. “Some people will argue there’s no difference and some people will argue there is a difference. There’s no language in our CBA. There’s no rules against it. This is uncharted territory for everybody, and everybody is trying to figure out the difference between the two.”

“He made a mistake. He posted something,” Brown said. “There was no distinction. Maybe we can move forward, but the terms in which he has to fulfill to return, I think not just speaking for me, speaking as a vice president from a lot of our players, we didn’t agree with the terms that was required for him to come back and we’re waiting for this Tuesday meeting to happen to see what comes of it. But we’ll go from there. That’s all I’ll say.”

https://www.bostonglobe.com/2022/11/07/sports/jaylen-brown-kyrie-irving/

I guess he's trying to use the "retweets are not endorsements" philosophy that a lot of public figures use when it comes to Twitter, and saying that the punishment is excessive if Cryrie wasn't endorsing those views, just tweeting them.

I think Cryrie, Jaylen and the PA need to figure out if this is a hill they want to die on. I get that it's a brotherhood, and they stick up for their own, that's the purpose of the PA after all. But some things are just wrong, and sometimes it's easier to just accept when someone did something wrong and do their penance, instead of trying to find technicalities and splitting hairs.

I wonder what would happen if Daniel Theis posted a Hitler propaganda film (without comment) that talked about blacks being an inferior race.  I'm sure Jaylen and the NBAPA would be making distinctions between verbal speech and a written endorsement.

[Roy H.]

Jaylen is quickly approaching the “fake intellectual “ label himself.  As I noted over the summer, when somebody surrounds himself with Kanye and Kyrie, it’s at least a yellow flag.

He’s a great basketball player, and seemingly a good guy.  He may want to check his sphere of influence though.

I don't know why he is suddenly a "fake intellectual" other than because he is defending Kyrie, the player and was associated with Ye.

As a VP in the PA, it's kind of his job to stick up for players and the type of demands being made upon Kyrie are definitely unique and not addressed in any way in the CBA or the standard player's contract. So wanting to stop some strange precedent from being established makes sense, if look at from the perspective of being a VP representing players in matters dealing with differences with owners of the league.

That said, I wish Jaylen would have let some other VP come to Kyrie's defense, as I don't like Kyrie, don't like anti-semetism or anti-semites and don't like Brooklyn Nets players.

First, anybody who says the following gibberish is coming close to the fake intellectual line:

We understand from an outside perspective how important sensitivity is to not condone hate speech and not condone anything of that nature. It’s sensitivity to the dialect around that.

“We don’t want to stand up for somebody in order to not condemn hate speech, but I don’t believe Kyrie Irving is antisemitic. And hopefully the NBA feels the same way

That's barely coherent.

Second, it's not his job to say "I don’t believe Kyrie Irving is antisemitic", just like it wasn't his job to initially stick with Kanye the anti-semite.  Screw Jaylen for enabling hate speech and the racists who spout it.

Somehow, fellow VPs Malcolm Brogdon and Grant Williams haven't spoken on Kyrie's behalf.  That's probably because they're not friends with two of the biggest anti-Semites in pop culture.

[nickagneta]

Jaylen is quickly approaching the “fake intellectual “ label himself.  As I noted over the summer, when somebody surrounds himself with Kanye and Kyrie, it’s at least a yellow flag.

He’s a great basketball player, and seemingly a good guy.  He may want to check his sphere of influence though.

I don't know why he is suddenly a "fake intellectual" other than because he is defending Kyrie, the player and was associated with Ye.

As a VP in the PA, it's kind of his job to stick up for players and the type of demands being made upon Kyrie are definitely unique and not addressed in any way in the CBA or the standard player's contract. So wanting to stop some strange precedent from being established makes sense, if look at from the perspective of being a VP representing players in matters dealing with differences with owners of the league.

That said, I wish Jaylen would have let some other VP come to Kyrie's defense, as I don't like Kyrie, don't like anti-semetism or anti-semites and don't like Brooklyn Nets players.

First, anybody who says the following gibberish is coming close to the fake intellectual line:

We understand from an outside perspective how important sensitivity is to not condone hate speech and not condone anything of that nature. It’s sensitivity to the dialect around that.

“We don’t want to stand up for somebody in order to not condemn hate speech, but I don’t believe Kyrie Irving is antisemitic. And hopefully the NBA feels the same way

That's barely coherent.

Second, it's not his job to say "I don’t believe Kyrie Irving is antisemitic", just like it wasn't his job to initially stick with Kanye the anti-semite.  Screw Jaylen for enabling hate speech and the racists who spout it.

Somehow, fellow VPs Malcolm Brogdon and Grant Williams haven't spoken on Kyrie's behalf.  That's probably because they're not friends with two of the biggest anti-Semites in pop culture.

It's not gibberish. My lord.

[Roy H.]

Jaylen is quickly approaching the “fake intellectual “ label himself.  As I noted over the summer, when somebody surrounds himself with Kanye and Kyrie, it’s at least a yellow flag.

He’s a great basketball player, and seemingly a good guy.  He may want to check his sphere of influence though.

I don't know why he is suddenly a "fake intellectual" other than because he is defending Kyrie, the player and was associated with Ye.

As a VP in the PA, it's kind of his job to stick up for players and the type of demands being made upon Kyrie are definitely unique and not addressed in any way in the CBA or the standard player's contract. So wanting to stop some strange precedent from being established makes sense, if look at from the perspective of being a VP representing players in matters dealing with differences with owners of the league.

That said, I wish Jaylen would have let some other VP come to Kyrie's defense, as I don't like Kyrie, don't like anti-semetism or anti-semites and don't like Brooklyn Nets players.

First, anybody who says the following gibberish is coming close to the fake intellectual line:

We understand from an outside perspective how important sensitivity is to not condone hate speech and not condone anything of that nature. It’s sensitivity to the dialect around that.

“We don’t want to stand up for somebody in order to not condemn hate speech, but I don’t believe Kyrie Irving is antisemitic. And hopefully the NBA feels the same way

That's barely coherent.

Second, it's not his job to say "I don’t believe Kyrie Irving is antisemitic", just like it wasn't his job to initially stick with Kanye the anti-semite.  Screw Jaylen for enabling hate speech and the racists who spout it.

Somehow, fellow VPs Malcolm Brogdon and Grant Williams haven't spoken on Kyrie's behalf.  That's probably because they're not friends with two of the biggest anti-Semites in pop culture.

It's not gibberish. My lord.

That statement reads like English is his second language.  Sensitivity to the dialect?

[td450]

Jaylen is quickly approaching the “fake intellectual “ label himself.  As I noted over the summer, when somebody surrounds himself with Kanye and Kyrie, it’s at least a yellow flag.

He’s a great basketball player, and seemingly a good guy.  He may want to check his sphere of influence though.

I don't know why he is suddenly a "fake intellectual" other than because he is defending Kyrie, the player and was associated with Ye.

As a VP in the PA, it's kind of his job to stick up for players and the type of demands being made upon Kyrie are definitely unique and not addressed in any way in the CBA or the standard player's contract. So wanting to stop some strange precedent from being established makes sense, if look at from the perspective of being a VP representing players in matters dealing with differences with owners of the league.

That said, I wish Jaylen would have let some other VP come to Kyrie's defense, as I don't like Kyrie, don't like anti-semetism or anti-semites and don't like Brooklyn Nets players.

First, anybody who says the following gibberish is coming close to the fake intellectual line:

We understand from an outside perspective how important sensitivity is to not condone hate speech and not condone anything of that nature. It’s sensitivity to the dialect around that.

“We don’t want to stand up for somebody in order to not condemn hate speech, but I don’t believe Kyrie Irving is antisemitic. And hopefully the NBA feels the same way

That's barely coherent.

Second, it's not his job to say "I don’t believe Kyrie Irving is antisemitic", just like it wasn't his job to initially stick with Kanye the anti-semite.  Screw Jaylen for enabling hate speech and the racists who spout it.

Somehow, fellow VPs Malcolm Brogdon and Grant Williams haven't spoken on Kyrie's behalf.  That's probably because they're not friends with two of the biggest anti-Semites in pop culture.

It's not gibberish. My lord.

That statement reads like English is his second language.  Sensitivity to the dialect?

Or maybe he just intended to write "dialog", and it just reads like a social media post a young guy dictated into his phone and didn't check carefully enough.

Are we all losing our minds here?

[Roy H.]

Jaylen is quickly approaching the “fake intellectual “ label himself.  As I noted over the summer, when somebody surrounds himself with Kanye and Kyrie, it’s at least a yellow flag.

He’s a great basketball player, and seemingly a good guy.  He may want to check his sphere of influence though.

I don't know why he is suddenly a "fake intellectual" other than because he is defending Kyrie, the player and was associated with Ye.

As a VP in the PA, it's kind of his job to stick up for players and the type of demands being made upon Kyrie are definitely unique and not addressed in any way in the CBA or the standard player's contract. So wanting to stop some strange precedent from being established makes sense, if look at from the perspective of being a VP representing players in matters dealing with differences with owners of the league.

That said, I wish Jaylen would have let some other VP come to Kyrie's defense, as I don't like Kyrie, don't like anti-semetism or anti-semites and don't like Brooklyn Nets players.

First, anybody who says the following gibberish is coming close to the fake intellectual line:

We understand from an outside perspective how important sensitivity is to not condone hate speech and not condone anything of that nature. It’s sensitivity to the dialect around that.

“We don’t want to stand up for somebody in order to not condemn hate speech, but I don’t believe Kyrie Irving is antisemitic. And hopefully the NBA feels the same way

That's barely coherent.

Second, it's not his job to say "I don’t believe Kyrie Irving is antisemitic", just like it wasn't his job to initially stick with Kanye the anti-semite.  Screw Jaylen for enabling hate speech and the racists who spout it.

Somehow, fellow VPs Malcolm Brogdon and Grant Williams haven't spoken on Kyrie's behalf.  That's probably because they're not friends with two of the biggest anti-Semites in pop culture.

It's not gibberish. My lord.

That statement reads like English is his second language.  Sensitivity to the dialect?

Or maybe he just intended to write "dialog", and it just reads like a social media post a young guy dictated into his phone and didn't check carefully enough.

Are we all losing our minds here?

The entire statement is barely coherent.  If somebody is making a statement as a VP in the NBAPA, don't you think they should check to ensure their statement doesn't read like a drunk freshman?

[Vermont Green]

I don't think Jaylen is defending what Kyrie did or what he posted.  He was pretty clear about that.  What he went on to say though is that actions the team or the league can take against Kyrie must be consistent with the specific language in the CBA.  I would think the Lawyers on here would agree with that.  Nothing controversial here.  No matter how much you disagree with what Kyrie did, the team/league must work within the terms of the CBA, right?

Jaylen went on to say that even though he disagrees with the Tweet or whatever that Kyrie liked or whatever, as a person, he does not believe Kyrie is racist (edit: I guess his exact word was anti-Semitic).  I have said several times in other discussions that I hate it when someone labels someone else as racist.  Debating whether the person is or isn't racist based on someone else's measuring stick for what is racist, generally does not help resolve the issue or policy or whatever.  The issue here is what Kyrie did and what the league/team can do per the CBA in response.  It doesn't matter if Roy or Jaylen think Kyrie is racist (anti-Semitic) or not.  Everyone is going to have a different opinion on that.  It is subjective.

Some people will label you as racist if you are against affirmative action. Or against reparations  Others think the Charlottesville protesters were just good Americans exercising their first amendment rights.   But as soon as the "racist" labels start being thrown around, that is generally the end of the productive debate on how to deal with problems.

There is a point where simply believing that black people were once Jewish or came from the same place that white Jews came from, is not anti-Semitic.  When you start getting into the part where White Jews hate black people and have stolen from them and are evil and so on, that is much different.  I don't know where Kyrie is in his head.  The documentary was very clear and unambiguous.  Kyrie said he agreed with some parts, disagreed with other parts.  Leaves it that you can take it anyway you want.  But it doesn't matter.  The league/team can only do what the CBA allows them to do.

[Kernewek]

We understand from an outside perspective how important sensitivity is to not condone hate speech and not condone anything of that nature. It’s sensitivity to the dialect around that.

“We don’t want to stand up for somebody in order to not condemn hate speech, but I don’t believe Kyrie Irving is antisemitic. And hopefully the NBA feels the same way

Two things can be true at the same time. Jaylen can defend (and absolutely is defending) Kyrie's behaviour and he can be correct that punishments meted out to players by the league have to be governed by the CBA.

What some of us are critiquing is the first thing, not the second. If the only reason the NBAPA is not condoning hate speech is because of the 'outsider perspective' and 'the dialect around that', this is a bad thing.

Like I said in the Bruins thread - people push back when they think the punishment for the behaviour is out of line with their evaluation of the punishable behaviour. Does anyone think that Kyrie's punishment is particularly egregious? Because apparently the NBA's players do.

[nickagneta]

Jaylen is quickly approaching the “fake intellectual “ label himself.  As I noted over the summer, when somebody surrounds himself with Kanye and Kyrie, it’s at least a yellow flag.

He’s a great basketball player, and seemingly a good guy.  He may want to check his sphere of influence though.

I don't know why he is suddenly a "fake intellectual" other than because he is defending Kyrie, the player and was associated with Ye.

As a VP in the PA, it's kind of his job to stick up for players and the type of demands being made upon Kyrie are definitely unique and not addressed in any way in the CBA or the standard player's contract. So wanting to stop some strange precedent from being established makes sense, if look at from the perspective of being a VP representing players in matters dealing with differences with owners of the league.

That said, I wish Jaylen would have let some other VP come to Kyrie's defense, as I don't like Kyrie, don't like anti-semetism or anti-semites and don't like Brooklyn Nets players.

First, anybody who says the following gibberish is coming close to the fake intellectual line:

We understand from an outside perspective how important sensitivity is to not condone hate speech and not condone anything of that nature. It’s sensitivity to the dialect around that.

“We don’t want to stand up for somebody in order to not condemn hate speech, but I don’t believe Kyrie Irving is antisemitic. And hopefully the NBA feels the same way

That's barely coherent.

Second, it's not his job to say "I don’t believe Kyrie Irving is antisemitic", just like it wasn't his job to initially stick with Kanye the anti-semite.  Screw Jaylen for enabling hate speech and the racists who spout it.

Somehow, fellow VPs Malcolm Brogdon and Grant Williams haven't spoken on Kyrie's behalf.  That's probably because they're not friends with two of the biggest anti-Semites in pop culture.

It's not gibberish. My lord.

That statement reads like English is his second language.  Sensitivity to the dialect?

Or maybe he just intended to write "dialog", and it just reads like a social media post a young guy dictated into his phone and didn't check carefully enough.

Are we all losing our minds here?

The entire statement is barely coherent.  If somebody is making a statement as a VP in the NBAPA, don't you think they should check to ensure their statement doesn't read like a drunk freshman?

Watch out CelticsStrongers! Have perfect grammar and use words in perfect context or you're going to be labeled as incoherent, fake intellectual and have your intelligence questioned.