Why Brown must be traded at some point

[footey]

Brown took 36 shots last night. He was dominating the ball, yet he had zero assists and 3 turnovers! I'm gonna write this again cause it is straight up ridiculous: 36 shot attempts, zero assists! This is the issue, not that the Jays "occupy the same parts of the floor" like the OP suggests. What does that even mean? The vast majority of players in the modern NBA occupy space on the perimeter.

edit: just saw that celticsclay wrote practically the same thing

0 assists means nothing on a night when the whole team shoots like crap and that he did pass to teammates enough for 8 potential assists.   4-42 on three pointers by the team.  Jaylen's passes were likely almost all for 3's.  if the bricklayers made even half of those attempts, the C's win.  This wasn't on Jaylen -- other than his own horrible 3 point shooting.  he was the only one trying to get baskets by driving to the bucket.  everyone else was bombing away, badly.

Are you suggesting that Brown is actually a good passer, but his teammates cannot take advantage of his passing skills? If so, how come Horford delivered 8 assists last night with only 1 t/o? He was playing alongside the same teammates.

Did you watch the game?

No. Are you happy now? I've been watching his games the past 6 years. He's a scorer, not a shot creator. Feel free to believe he is a good passer and his teammates cannot take advantage of his passing skills.

He asked if you watched the game, my guess is, because that box score doesn't accurately describe how Brown played last night. He was very much trying to get his teammates involved.  The fact he had no assists was more attributable to the poor shooting by his teammates than a refusal to implement the game plan.   Brown was the only guy on the floor, along with Rob Williams, who showed heart last night.  Give him a break, dude.

[footey]

This post has nothing to do with last night. I have been saying this for years in various threads.  I just finally put it all in one place.  The simple reality is Boston doesn't need Brown to be successful, while conversely Boston needs Tatum. Tatum doesn't even need to play well, he just has to be on the floor.  We've seen this time and time again, year after year.  We are now getting close to the point of no return.  It is time.  Those 2 just don't work, why delay the inevitable.

What realistic two way trade of Brown will make our team clearly better?  And please don't contrive a complicated 3 team deal, those almost never materialize.

[CBS_Take a Report]

I’ve been saying Jaylen needs to go since we drafted him. He is a guy trying to prove his self worth rather than grow into a team oriented culture. Outside of basketball, he is all about his personal brand. Inside basketball, he is slow, mechanical, telegraphs his moves and still has terrible ball handling skills.

Since we drafted him?  He’s arguably the best player from his draft class, depending on how you feel about Simmons.  For a slow, mechanical guy he sure is productive.

What branding have you seen from him this season that has taken his focus off of basketball?

Are you kidding me? The guy who has been quoted as saying “I’m not a businessman, I’m a business, man,”?

His entire aura is enterprise and commerce driven.

- 7uice Launch
- While in China playing for Team USA, he was spending time with offshoring manufacturing for his design wear

So you’re saying his now developed businesses aren’t taking time for him to run?

He is a stats chaser… period. He will never be a part of a championship team.

[Moranis]

This post has nothing to do with last night. I have been saying this for years in various threads.  I just finally put it all in one place.  The simple reality is Boston doesn't need Brown to be successful, while conversely Boston needs Tatum. Tatum doesn't even need to play well, he just has to be on the floor.  We've seen this time and time again, year after year.  We are now getting close to the point of no return.  It is time.  Those 2 just don't work, why delay the inevitable.

What realistic two way trade of Brown will make our team clearly better?  And please don't contrive a complicated 3 team deal, those almost never materialize.

That is hard to say, but there are trade demands by stars that come along (we've seen Leonard and Harden, for example happen).

But if I was probing, I think you could potentially get a young player trade with the Warriors something centered on Wiseman and Kuminga, for example (Brown, Freedom for Wiseman, Kuminga, Moody, and Looney works financially as an example).

Simmons would be out there, but I think you need a 2nd trade in place to get a better 2nd scoring option as I wouldn't want Simmons needing to be a 2nd scorer.

I'd call up Denver and see if they'd part with Murray and Porter, Jr.  That might appeal to Denver as they could better utilize Jokic.  Obvious risk for the C's given Murray and MPJ are both injured, but that is a trade that could pay off big time down the line if Murray and MPJ got healthy.

I'd call the Cavs and see if I could Sexton + Allen + Okoro for Brown (the Cavs then go with Garland, Brown, Mobley as their core). 

I don't know if the Suns would move Ayton, but I'd certainly ask.

The Hawks could be interesting something like Collins, Huerter, Hunter or Reddish, pick for Brown

Of course I'd call the Pelicans and inquire about Zion, though I don't think they'd move him.

Siakam plus something else I might consider (depending on what the something else is). 

I wouldn't trade Brown for Beal, but that is probably a potential trade out there. 

I'm sure there are other trades that are potentially out there.  I wouldn't trade Brown just to trade him, but if the right trade comes along, I do think it is something that needs to be done and the C's should really be exploring what is out there.

[Vermont Green]

The key part of this is the "at some point" part.  Sure, at some point and for the right deal, I am OK trading Brown but right now is not the time and it is doubtful that we could end up better with what we would get back right now.

I don't not feel that Brown is the problem with the team right now or was ever.  Even if we were able to get say Beal or Lillard, I don't think we end up better.  And if we trade him for say Jeromi Grant?  Or just picks and prospects?

No, the strategy needs to continue to be building around Tatum and Brown.  We are not "at some point" yet.

[wdleehi]

The key part of this is the "at some point" part.  Sure, at some point and for the right deal, I am OK trading Brown but right now is not the time and it is doubtful that we could end up better with what we would get back right now.

I don't not feel that Brown is the problem with the team right now or was ever.  Even if we were able to get say Beal or Lillard, I don't think we end up better.  And if we trade him for say Jeromi Grant?  Or just picks and prospects?

No, the strategy needs to continue to be building around Tatum and Brown.  We are not "at some point" yet.

And  let's  be honest, nothing is happening in the NBA until teams are past the Covid outbreaks. 



But adding and shifting around Tatum and Brown is the first step.

[Bobshot]

Time to trade Jaylen for Simmons.

What a breath of fresh air it would be to have a guy who distributes the ball and doesn't shoot 3 pointers.

This is the one deal they could do...

[wdleehi]

Time to trade Jaylen for Simmons.

What a breath of fresh air it would be to have a guy who distributes the ball and doesn't shoot 3 pointers.

This is the one deal they could do...

A guy who may not care about basketball?   Who has never added anything to his game since coming to the NBA?


A guy who doesn't hit 3 (or take them) to a team struggling to hit outside shots?   

[Roy H.]

Time to trade Jaylen for Simmons.

What a breath of fresh air it would be to have a guy who distributes the ball and doesn't shoot 3 pointers.

This is the one deal they could do...

A guy who may not care about basketball?   Who has never added anything to his game since coming to the NBA?


A guy who doesn't hit 3 (or take them) to a team struggling to hit outside shots?

Yeah…. Taking one of our better outside shooters off this team wouldn’t necessarily make us better.

Brown + Smart for Simmons + Curry?  I’d at least consider it.

[Ogaju]

Brown took 36 shots last night. He was dominating the ball, yet he had zero assists and 3 turnovers! I'm gonna write this again cause it is straight up ridiculous: 36 shot attempts, zero assists! This is the issue, not that the Jays "occupy the same parts of the floor" like the OP suggests. What does that even mean? The vast majority of players in the modern NBA occupy space on the perimeter.

edit: just saw that celticsclay wrote practically the same thing

I bet Brown wishes he was married to Giselle at this point, so she can tell his team mates her husband cannot pass to them and shoot the ball for them too.

[Ogaju]

Too bad that this thread is a year and a half too late.  Better title would be, why Brown should have been traded when we had the chance to get a star.

But nooooooo, fans love their homegrown, young guy with potential.  Nine times of of ten you take the sure thing but it’s too late now.  It’s obvious he won’t be a real star and should be a third guy at best. 

It takes fans way to long to realize what they have and once they do, they somehow want to turn THAT guy into a better player.  Good luck with that.

Not related but I don't think the fans necessarily made their own bed as you seem to suggest heavily here...since it's not like we get to vote on whether to keep Brown/Tatum...

Some fans spoke up but were told by the ‘experts’ they didn’t know what they were talking about. The OPs breakdown is great, but it is evident from watching them that they do not fit well together. Tatum, at this point, is biding his time to get to Hollywood.

[Ogaju]

Just kind of playing devil's advocate. Al Horford got 8 assists, as someone mentioned. It is possible that a lot of those were to Jaylen though.

I think hitting people in rhythm is also important. I see both Tatum and Brown trying hard to move the ball, but they aren't natural passers and sometimes the play is just slightly off. This is just some BS eye test from the games I've watched - I have faith in their improvement.

What have they done to improve that aspect of their games? Bird and Walton took so much pride in their passing that it was rumored they had friendly wagers on who would have the best pass in games. These two young Celtics go on summer pilgrimages to one-on-one camps to perfect their ISO games. There is no passing in one-on-one drills. It’s tunnel vision, put your head down to beat your man to your spot. The very antithesis to full court vision that you need for passing the ball efficiently.

[Vermont Green]

This post has nothing to do with last night. I have been saying this for years in various threads.  I just finally put it all in one place.  The simple reality is Boston doesn't need Brown to be successful, while conversely Boston needs Tatum. Tatum doesn't even need to play well, he just has to be on the floor.  We've seen this time and time again, year after year.  We are now getting close to the point of no return.  It is time.  Those 2 just don't work, why delay the inevitable.

What realistic two way trade of Brown will make our team clearly better?  And please don't contrive a complicated 3 team deal, those almost never materialize.

That is hard to say, but there are trade demands by stars that come along (we've seen Leonard and Harden, for example happen).

But if I was probing, I think you could potentially get a young player trade with the Warriors something centered on Wiseman and Kuminga, for example (Brown, Freedom for Wiseman, Kuminga, Moody, and Looney works financially as an example).

Simmons would be out there, but I think you need a 2nd trade in place to get a better 2nd scoring option as I wouldn't want Simmons needing to be a 2nd scorer.

I'd call up Denver and see if they'd part with Murray and Porter, Jr.  That might appeal to Denver as they could better utilize Jokic.  Obvious risk for the C's given Murray and MPJ are both injured, but that is a trade that could pay off big time down the line if Murray and MPJ got healthy.

I'd call the Cavs and see if I could Sexton + Allen + Okoro for Brown (the Cavs then go with Garland, Brown, Mobley as their core). 

I don't know if the Suns would move Ayton, but I'd certainly ask.

The Hawks could be interesting something like Collins, Huerter, Hunter or Reddish, pick for Brown

Of course I'd call the Pelicans and inquire about Zion, though I don't think they'd move him.

Siakam plus something else I might consider (depending on what the something else is). 

I wouldn't trade Brown for Beal, but that is probably a potential trade out there. 

I'm sure there are other trades that are potentially out there.  I wouldn't trade Brown just to trade him, but if the right trade comes along, I do think it is something that needs to be done and the C's should really be exploring what is out there.

Plenty of ideas, most probably are not even on the table and those that may be, don't necessarily make us better.  Simmons is probably a possibility if you want to go there as some seem to.  I think Brown is an overpay for Simmons and I don't really see anyone else on the Sixers who could make a deal work.  Beal or Lillard are probably possibilities, we would likely need to give up more than just Brown in either case.  Beal or Lilliard may make us a little better in the short term, give us that proven 4th quarter big shot maker but would this really be smart for the long term?

Ayton, Siakam?  I like them with Brown and Tatum but are we better with Tatum and Siakam?  Doesn't seem that way to me.

And injured players like Porter?  Trade Brown for that?  No thanks.  Brown may have more upside or at worst comparable upside but the downside of Porter or Murray is stuck with big contracts for players who will never be the same.

[spikelovetheCelts]

Brown, Gwill and Horford a pick for  Fox, Bagley and Hield is my trade.

[dannyboy35]

You make good points.

I think the basic fact here is that Brown is not as good as Tatum. Couple that with the fact that Tatum and Brown do not make each other better.  This is different from saying that they can't play together.  They don't have a two man game.

Can you think of a single play that this team regularly runs that utilizes both of them? I can't.

   I can’t either. That’s coaching. These guys NEVER screen for eachother. Ime is always weak side. I get it but they’ve never been put in position to work together. At least no help from coaching. They go AWAY from that.