Blow it up. Team is trash.

[Ogaju]

The Coach is the problem….this team is more talented and deeper than last year.

This guy, Ime, can’t get the most out of these players.

Team is not trash….Ime has them playing like trash.

The players literally forced out the GM and prior coach and signed off on this coach. It’s the players and always has been.

The problem is the organization gave them a coach that they want, not the one that they need. Players shouldn't have much say on the coaching staff. And there's no continuity from the previous ones as they were all booted out as well.

Sounds like what happened.

[Somebody]

The Coach is the problem….this team is more talented and deeper than last year.

This guy, Ime, can’t get the most out of these players.

Team is not trash….Ime has them playing like trash.

The players literally forced out the GM and prior coach and signed off on this coach. It’s the players and always has been.

Our prior coach got the sack because he was painfully mediocre, what well-run clubs don't do after such a decision is to hire a clueless coach with a terrible CV just because the players want him.

[GreenlyGreeny]

 We went from the brightest future in the league to no future in a new York minute.  Tank this year.  Sit Tatum. Sit Brown.  Field offers.

 Time to start over. This team literally has no hope.

Agree but we need to keep Tatum. Everyone else must go and surely he can recruit a buddy worthy of max money.

[RodyTur10]

The Celtics in theory accumulated a pretty deep roster. On paper, this didn't look too bad:

Guards: Schröder, Smart, Richardson (+ Pritchard)
Wings: Tatum, Brown, Hernangomez (+ Langford, Nesmith)
Bigs: Horford, Timelord, Kanter (+ G.Williams, Parker, Fernando)

However, some guys individually have disappointed so far like Pritchard, Nesmith, Hernangomez and Kanter.
And besides that it turns out that not unsurprisingly there's a lack of balance in playmaking and shooting.
In practice this teams seems years away from contending. And to be honest I think that's true.

So I come back to what I have been advertising for the last two years to focus on developing our drafted youngsters.
Get value if you can get it for Schröder, Smart, Richardson, Horford and Kanter. Let's play Pritchard, Langford, Nesmith and Grant Williams a lot of minutes, there's still untapped potential there and foremost we need to build up value by them as assets.

The big question is whether we should break up Tatum and Brown, but I don't think there's a reasonable deal to be made that would be worth it. I doubt very much we could obtain Young, Morant or LaMelo Ball for Brown.
I'd keep an eye on Cleveland about Garland or Sexton and likewise Sacramento about Fox and Haliburton, but I wouldn't give up Brown for any of them.

[DrJasper]

I know people will hate this, but I can't stop thinking about if we should actually trade for Ben Simmons..
He complements Tatum way more than Jaylen, eventhough I LOVE Brown.
His Playmaking and Defense would be so perfect next to Tatums scoring, dare I say he reminds me of Scottie Pippen, Draymond or even Lebron/Magic sometimes (when he's at his best). Just watch these highlights from the all star game, there seems to be more synergy than I have ever seen from the Jays..

https://youtu.be/KQk33-7dm9g

If he could just get his free throws to an okay number he'll be good

[knuckleballer]

I know people will hate this, but I can't stop thinking about if we should actually trade for Ben Simmons..
He complements Tatum way more than Jaylen, eventhough I LOVE Brown.
His Playmaking and Defense would be so perfect next to Tatums scoring, dare I say he reminds me of Scottie Pippen, Draymond or even Lebron/Magic sometimes (when he's at his best). Just watch these highlights from the all star game, there seems to be more synergy than I have ever seen from the Jays..

https://youtu.be/KQk33-7dm9g

If he could just get his free throws to an okay number he'll be good

Any chance we could move most of the roster and end up with Tatum, Simmons, and Beal as a big three?

[Birdman]

Team needs a center..could have gotten Whiteside, Dedmon, Drummond, etc..for cheap but didn’t..they not great but better what we got..

[Birdman]

Heck go get Isaiah Thomas..he could provide a spark off the bench & better what we got on the bench currently

[ozgod]

Heck go get Isaiah Thomas..he could provide a spark off the bench & better what we got on the bench currently

Here's IT's last 16 games in the NBA.



He averaged 10.6ppg in 19 mins of play, with 1.5 turnovers...the issue is with his efficiency, he shot 39% from the floor. And I'm sure he's gotten worse defensively. I would assume he would be worse than PP defensively with no upside as he is 31.

If we were getting 2017 IT it would be a no-brainer, but 2021 IT is a bit more run down unfortunately 

[Birdman]

Unfortunately that’s better than anyone currently on our bench

[Kuberski33]

Udoka buried Pritchard from the start of the season and in the few opportunities he's had, save for one game he's been terrible. It's hard when you don't get the minutes.

But Brad elected to pay Smart. Schroder and him are getting all the minutes and you've got Tatum who dominates the ball often acting as a de facto PG.

It's not a great situation - though when/if Brad decides this team is going nowhere he'll have to move Schroder to at least get something (and my guess is it won't be a ton) for him.

But you can't expect Pritchard to contribute if you don't play him. And if you're not going to play him, you might as well move him along with Schroder.

[feckless]

Daniel Theis even though he was undersized he was solid and smart.  Always made the right play and often overachieved.  He worked well with Tatum and Brown.  We miss him!

Pritchard and Nesmith need minutes to gain confidence and fit in.

Playing a short bench this early in the season leads to the number of injuries we have had.

Udoka burns out the starters by playing every game like it is a must-win.

[Moranis]

The Celtics in theory accumulated a pretty deep roster. On paper, this didn't look too bad:

Guards: Schröder, Smart, Richardson (+ Pritchard)
Wings: Tatum, Brown, Hernangomez (+ Langford, Nesmith)
Bigs: Horford, Timelord, Kanter (+ G.Williams, Parker, Fernando)

However, some guys individually have disappointed so far like Pritchard, Nesmith, Hernangomez and Kanter.
And besides that it turns out that not unsurprisingly there's a lack of balance in playmaking and shooting.
In practice this teams seems years away from contending. And to be honest I think that's true.

So I come back to what I have been advertising for the last two years to focus on developing our drafted youngsters.
Get value if you can get it for Schröder, Smart, Richardson, Horford and Kanter. Let's play Pritchard, Langford, Nesmith and Grant Williams a lot of minutes, there's still untapped potential there and foremost we need to build up value by them as assets.

The big question is whether we should break up Tatum and Brown, but I don't think there's a reasonable deal to be made that would be worth it. I doubt very much we could obtain Young, Morant or LaMelo Ball for Brown.
I'd keep an eye on Cleveland about Garland or Sexton and likewise Sacramento about Fox and Haliburton, but I wouldn't give up Brown for any of them.

That is no where near a deep roster on paper. 

[ozgod]

One thing the data shows, the performance of the 5 man unit Ime has been using to start the games with JB out has been trash. It has been outscored by nearly 20 pts per 100 possessions. Horford is a main culprit, as is Smartacus.

The Celtics have 14 five-man lineups that have played at least 20 minutes together. And some of the spookiest numbers have been put up by the starting group that has been deployed while Jaylen Brown is out with a hamstring injury.

In 97 minutes together, Jayson Tatum, Marcus Smart, Al Horford, Robert Williams, and Dennis Schröder have been outscored by 19.6 points per 100 possessions. This group’s most obvious and glaring weakness is its lack of offense — specifically, outside shooting.

The unit has a cringe-worthy 91.3 offensive rating. To put that figure in perspective, that’s nearly 10 points worse than the Oklahoma City Thunder’s offense, which ranks last in the NBA. While sharing the floor, this Celtics group has connected on just 25.4 percent of 3-pointers.

To be effective, the double-big lineup that includes Horford and Williams needs a reliable floor spacer. But Horford has made just 29 percent of his attempts from beyond the arc, including 2 of 13 over the last four games. And Williams does not shoot from there.

So without an extra outside shooter, or someone who can create his own shot, there will be long ruts.

It also does not help that Smart’s long-range shooting has regressed considerably. After rising for three consecutive years it has fallen for three consecutive years, down to 28 percent this season, his lowest mark since 2015-16. This clear lack of shooting and shot creating around Tatum makes it easier for defenses to swarm him like never before, too.

It gets better with JRich in there for Al, not only because JRich has shot better than Al, but also because he has been a better switch defender than Al who has been getting roasted by smaller players who are using him as a turnstile on their way to the rim.

Interestingly, when Josh Richardson simply replaces Horford, this same grouping has been dominant, outscoring opponents by 45.5 points per 100 possessions in the seven games they’ve played together. Richardson has shot a respectable 35.4 percent from beyond the arc and gives Boston another playmaker, but this group has truly thrived with its defensive versatility, holding opponents to 83.8 points per 100 possessions.

What about the young players? Nessie and PP, two CelticsStrong favorites? Apparently lineups with them in it rank near the bottom of the rankings. Case of the eye test not matching up with the actual data perhaps?

Each of the nine worst two-man pairings with at least 50 minutes played include Nesmith, Pritchard or Romeo Langford. Nesmith appears in seven of the bottom nine.

This season, Boston has been outscored by 13.1 points per 100 possessions with Nesmith on the court and 10.5 points per 100 possessions while Pritchard is playing. The apparent regression of these second-year players is also harmful because it will dent their potential trade value.

All the stats I quoted came from this Globe article https://www.bostonglobe.com/2021/12/11/sports/what-comes-next-celtics-after-disappointing-1-4-road-trip/

[greg683x]

I know people will hate this, but I can't stop thinking about if we should actually trade for Ben Simmons..
He complements Tatum way more than Jaylen, eventhough I LOVE Brown.
His Playmaking and Defense would be so perfect next to Tatums scoring, dare I say he reminds me of Scottie Pippen, Draymond or even Lebron/Magic sometimes (when he's at his best). Just watch these highlights from the all star game, there seems to be more synergy than I have ever seen from the Jays..

https://youtu.be/KQk33-7dm9g

If he could just get his free throws to an okay number he'll be good

theyve been saying that in Philadelphia for 4 years now