Woj Bomb: Kemba, 1st Rounder, & '25 2nd Rounder to OKC for Horford, Brown, 2nd

[RodyTur10]

I'm a bit torn on this trade. On one hand I've been advocating for trading Walker for a year.
He was a bad fit with the Jays. He was a target on defense, in particular during the playoffs.
Overpaid. And unfortunately injury prone. So trading Walker and correcting one of Ainges biggest mistakes was definitely an objective.

However, under normal circumstances this team isn't ready to contend unless you bring in someone better than Walker (All Star type). Therefore I wasn't in favor of giving up assets to dump Walker (as we did). And I also didn't want any big non-expiring contract back (Horford's is partially guaranteed next season). Hypothetically: if you could just dump Horford for nothing and not take back any salary, you would do it and clear 27M of your payroll.

Despite Walker not living up to expectations, while having durability and knee problems, he wasn't terrible during the regular season. When he got back in rhytm, Walker averaged 20/4/5 with 2.7 AS/TO and 58 TS% in his last 25 games. That ain't too bad at all actually.

I believe with a bit more patience we could have let Walker go without giving up that midfirst. While Horford is still a good player, his contract is still bad. Not sure what we're going to do with him anyway. Improvement over Thompson as a back-up center? Seems like Thompson has to go as well and with this first move you apply pressure on yourself to find a good deal for that.

Moses Brown was impressive against us with his 20/20 game. Another stat: Moses Brown had the worst +/- of all NBA players this season. That might be telling something about his actual game impact. I wouldn't be counting on him as a rotation player.

Although Moses Brown is a very good rebounder, it's clear that Timelord is in a very different league. It's like comparing Langford with Jaylen Brown, while ignoring their offensive abilities.

My conclusion is that this was a bad trade valuewise, but I like the idea of starting with a clean sheet.

[Celtics2021]

would love TT to just opt out.

Given the lack of good free agents he just might.

I didn’t think Thompson had an option.

[Ed Monix]

Unless this is part of a bigger overall move, I'm not sold on this trade.

We gave up Kemba, a very flawed injury prone 31 y/o who still averaged 19.3, 4.0, 4.9, 1.1 AND the 16th pick for Al Horford a very flawed injury prone 35 y/o who averaged 14.2, 6.7, 3.3, 0.9 on a Thunder team that was horrible, actively trying to lose and Al only played 28 games of the season...for cap relief and Moses Brown?

We will have to pay Robert Williams soon thus making Moses Brown redundant and I question can Time Lord and Horford co-exist in the same starting line-up? That 16th pick has yet to be defined in value, given lottery talent drops in the draft every year (#16 pick: Rozier, Nurkic, Vucevic, Turkoglu, Artest) why move it now?

Everyone was obsessed about the callousness of Ainge and how it affected the Celtics as a free agent destination, yet Stevens first move as GM is to dump Kemba to Oklahoma after he chose Boston over his home team in New York.

Yes we do need defence (not sure if Horford is still a + defender) and veteran leadership, but we also drastically needed playmaking and more scoring, we now have lost more scoring and need a new point guard.

[CelticsWhat35]

Everyone was obsessed about the callousness of Ainge and how it affected the Celtics as a free agent destination, yet Stevens first move as GM is to dump Kemba to Oklahoma after he chose Boston over his home team in New York.

When did the Knicks offer Kemba a max contract?  Kemba didn’t choose the Celtics.  They were the only team that I recall offering him a max contract.  He chose the $$

[Ed Monix]

Everyone was obsessed about the callousness of Ainge and how it affected the Celtics as a free agent destination, yet Stevens first move as GM is to dump Kemba to Oklahoma after he chose Boston over his home team in New York.

When did the Knicks offer Kemba a max contract?  Kemba didn’t choose the Celtics.  They were the only team that I recall offering him a max contract.  He chose the $$

Kemba Walker, the four-time All-Star point guard who joined the Boston Celtics in 2019 after eight years with the Charlotte Hornets, said the Knicks were "very serious" contenders for his services:

"To be honest, yes. Yes, very serious. Very," Walker said on The Ringer's R2C2 podcast with Ryan Ruocco and CC Sabathia. "... Before Boston actually came along, the Knicks was one of my top priorities.

[Celtics4ever]

Unless this is part of a bigger overall move, I'm not sold on this trade.

We gave up Kemba, a very flawed injury prone 31 y/o who still averaged 19.3, 4.0, 4.9, 1.1 AND the 16th pick for Al Horford a very flawed injury prone 35 y/o who averaged 14.2, 6.7, 3.3, 0.9 on a Thunder team that was horrible, actively trying to lose and Al only played 28 games of the season...for cap relief and Moses Brown?

I think a lot will depend on what we do with Thompson.   I don't Al is as injury prone as Kemba.   You do realize that the Thunder was tanking and that is why Al did not play.   They told home to stay home.

Please Read

OKLAHOMA CITY (AP) — The Thunder said Saturday that veteran center Al Horford will remain inactive for the rest of the season as the team’s young talent develops.

Horford, 34, averaged 14.2 points and 6.7 rebounds this season. The five-time All-Star will remain with the team and train, but he will not travel.

“When I arrived, I understood the direction of the team, we had a great individual plan in place for me, and I feel like as a result I’ve played really good basketball for the Thunder,” Horford said in a statement. “At the same time, I know what it’s like to be a young, aspiring player, and at this point in the season I understand how important playing meaningful minutes is for their careers and their development.”

Moses Brown, a 7-foot-1 two-way player who played 14 games in the G League this season, has shown promise with the Thunder. The second-year player from UCLA has averaged 11.4 points, 11.0 rebounds and 1.8 blocks the past eight games for Oklahoma City while shooting 58% from the field.

https://www.nba.com/news/report-thunder-to-sit-al-horford-turn-to-younger-players

So he was not injured this year.  Al not playing was not due to injury but rather design.

We will have to pay Robert Williams soon thus making Moses Brown redundant and I question can Time Lord and Horford co-exist in the same starting line-up? That 16th pick has yet to be defined in value, given lottery talent drops in the draft every year (#16 pick: Rozier, Nurkic, Vucevic, Turkoglu, Artest) why move it now?

The other side of that coin is that Mo Brown is insurance if Rob leaves.  For every Terry Rozier and good player there are plenty of duds. So let's take a look at pick 16 chances of being a good player.   The mid first round is  a crap shoot with as many busts as stars.

Star                 5%    
Sollid             25%    
Role Player    30%    
Deep bench   25%    
Bust               15%

https://www.82games.com/nbadraftpicks.htm

Everyone was obsessed about the callousness of Ainge and how it affected the Celtics as a free agent destination, yet Stevens first move as GM is to dump Kemba to Oklahoma after he chose Boston over his home team in New York.

Didn't Kemba want out, he got what he wanted.   What a nice guy Brad is.....

Yes we do need defence (not sure if Horford is still a + defender) and veteran leadership, but we also drastically needed playmaking and more scoring, we now have lost more scoring and need a new point guard.

Horford is a superb passer,  Ed.   I agree we need another guard and a distributor would be best.  Al is a way better leader than Mr. Smiles. who was a great team mate but not the most vocal leader.   We are going into the full on era of the J's

Doesn't this move give us more flexibility after next year?  If we get the proverbial third star as a result of this flexibility and there is no guarantee that we will, don't you like that?

[Who]

Stating the obvious:

‘The Celtics had real concerns with Kemba Walker’s left knee’ – Adrian Wojnarowski | NBA Countdown

I hope for Kemba's sake this is not an IT situation where the injury is far worse than we knew at the time.

[td450]

Unless this is part of a bigger overall move, I'm not sold on this trade.

We gave up Kemba, a very flawed injury prone 31 y/o who still averaged 19.3, 4.0, 4.9, 1.1 AND the 16th pick for Al Horford a very flawed injury prone 35 y/o who averaged 14.2, 6.7, 3.3, 0.9 on a Thunder team that was horrible, actively trying to lose and Al only played 28 games of the season...for cap relief and Moses Brown?

We will have to pay Robert Williams soon thus making Moses Brown redundant and I question can Time Lord and Horford co-exist in the same starting line-up? That 16th pick has yet to be defined in value, given lottery talent drops in the draft every year (#16 pick: Rozier, Nurkic, Vucevic, Turkoglu, Artest) why move it now?

Everyone was obsessed about the callousness of Ainge and how it affected the Celtics as a free agent destination, yet Stevens first move as GM is to dump Kemba to Oklahoma after he chose Boston over his home team in New York.

Yes we do need defence (not sure if Horford is still a + defender) and veteran leadership, but we also drastically needed playmaking and more scoring, we now have lost more scoring and need a new point guard.

I think this improves playmaking because Kemba wasn't any better a passer than whoever we play there instead, and Horford is definitely a plus playmaker. It also probably won't reduce scoring because Kemba's salary situation was a problem with retaining another scorer. We can now keep Fournier, or do something else even better.

[BringToughnessBack]

I am actually pretty happy Big Al is coming back. It is now Tatum and Brown’s team as Perkins says and this could be great and expecting another step up from our two young stars next year and we now have a center/PF who can dish out assists and space the floor.

Perkins comments below video- He loves it


https://youtu.be/-vOQgwPsSXk

[radiohead]

Big Al seems very happy to be back based on his twitter. Kemba meanwhile has been quiet so far. I haven’t seen any reports or interviews with him after the trade was announced. I wonder how he actually feels about the trade.

[BringToughnessBack]

Big Al seems very happy to be back based on his twitter. Kemba meanwhile has been quiet so far. I haven’t seen any reports or interviews with him after the trade was announced. I wonder how he actually feels about the trade.

OKC will work with him to get him where he wants to go like Paul. Knicks target 1 and he will be very happy in the end. Wonder if he somehow ends up on Sixers as second trade option. Short term, he is surely not happy about being in OKC I would guess as they dont want to win as they develop their young players. AL had to sit. He will be resting a lot until they can jettison him.

[jambr380]

For this to really work out, Horford will only be with us for one season and that's one of the things I don't like about this deal...other than giving up a 1st, obviously. Breaking it down for 22-23:

1. We waive and stretch Al and sign a max player (via s&t if we re-sign Fournier w/ Fournier outgoing). This means no Smart or TL.
2. We waive Al and eat the $14.5M all at once, then sign someone to the MLE saving us a few million $$.
3. We use Al's $26.5M contract in a trade for a clear upgrade w/ the receiving team cutting him and only owing him $14.5M, saving them money.
4. We keep Al and pay him $26.5M.

These are really the only options out there moving forward. And as much as I like Al, keeping him in that 2nd season doesn't seem like plan A.

Also, I absolutely wish the best for Kemba moving forward, but there really better be something very wrong with his knee - like it is much worse than the Cs ever let on - or else this lowers our ceiling considerably. When healthy, Kemba is clearly a better player than Al at this point.

[Rosco917]

Wouldn't it be interesting if we discovered that the "J's" are a "poor fit" with each other.

Say what you want about Kyrie, but he wanted to escape from the Celtics asap. (I agree, he's an ****.) Hayward, who granted had the worst luck possible in Boston, also failed to see the future potential of our dynamic duo, and chose greener pastures.   

I'm mean, both Brown and Tatum are very talented individually, yet don't really play well between each other. (as attested by many an analyst) Their games are actually quite similar. Both aren't willing or nifty passers. Brown can go several games in a row without a single assist. Both aren't great ball handlers either. Both specialize in north-south ISO ball.

No...this can't be.

 

[CelticsWhat35]

Everyone was obsessed about the callousness of Ainge and how it affected the Celtics as a free agent destination, yet Stevens first move as GM is to dump Kemba to Oklahoma after he chose Boston over his home team in New York.

When did the Knicks offer Kemba a max contract?  Kemba didn’t choose the Celtics.  They were the only team that I recall offering him a max contract.  He chose the $$

Kemba Walker, the four-time All-Star point guard who joined the Boston Celtics in 2019 after eight years with the Charlotte Hornets, said the Knicks were "very serious" contenders for his services:

"To be honest, yes. Yes, very serious. Very," Walker said on The Ringer's R2C2 podcast with Ryan Ruocco and CC Sabathia. "... Before Boston actually came along, the Knicks was one of my top priorities.

Right.  The Knicks were serious contenders...until a team offered a max contract

[footey]

Can an Athletic Subscriber summarize this Jared Weiss story about the disfunction of the Celtics.  Apparently Blake Griffin asked one of the Celtic players what it was like playing there and the player said to stay away.  Pretty dramatic stuff.

https://theathletic.com/2660873/2021/06/19/an-inside-look-at-the-factors-that-led-to-the-inevitable-break-up-between-kemba-walker-and-the-celtics/