Author Topic: Brads comments on series vs Nets  (Read 16160 times)

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Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #75 on: May 21, 2021, 03:36:50 PM »

Offline Somebody

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If they play like they played a few games this yr where they had great Ball movement, cutting to the basket, hitting their open shots, rebounded and played tenacious D ,then they have a shot at a game or 2 but I'm not holding my breath that they won't revert back to Hero Ball that's been allowed by Brad all yr. If that happens, then it will be a Sweep and the Games won't even be close. I'm hoping the Former.   

I would love to see the analytics on this. Good ball movement is prettier, but I wonder:  is it more effective on this team as currently constructed?

Part of me thinks that our best chance at winning is just to give Tatum the ball on every possession and have him make something happen. I am at the point where I prefer a contested Tatum shot to a wide open one from anybody other than Kemba or Fornier.
The analytics on this would answer that it depends on team construction. If you're a team with one or two MVP-level quarterbacks (basically players who can get into that band of players who're above your typical All-NBA player like Kyrie or Lillard with just their offence) and not much else, you should really play through them and mould your supporting cast around them to optimise their strengths (there are different ways to build a heliocentric system, eg. with Jokic you want a lot of players who can cut and move off the ball while you'd want spot up shooters and rim finishers around LeBron) because this style of play can consistently create high quality looks compared to other ways with the same cast of players.

But if your MVP-level quarterback is a bit special like Bird or Curry who can create a 'frictionless offence' with fantastic on-ball work and amazing off-ball abilities or you don't have that type of guy but have multiple stars (our Celtics team says hello), you try and build a more 'balanced' offence where the best player doesn't hold the ball all the time to let multiple players on the court make reads and attack favourable angles/matchups to grind out high quality looks (obviously a team with Bird/Curry would still run a lot of things through them, but a combination of heliocentrism and letting other teammates make reads at times would get the most out of the team as their mix of on and off-ball skills would be optimised). This is especially important for the latter because their best player isn't getting the offence to the heights needed to win a title by himself (unless the team is defensively-slanted and doesn't need a top offence to win titles), so he needs co-stars to share the offensive load and give the team multiple threats who can score and create so that opposing defences can't load up on one player, ensuring that the team can consistently create quality looks.

One major gripe I have with Brad this season is that he hasn't been utilising Brown all that well. It was common this year to see him have a huge quarter of feeding off of scraps (and he'll get a few possessions on the ball because teammates sense that he's hot) and proceed to stand in the corner the next 1-2 quarters in a way that almost looks instructed. This wasn't even because Tatum and Kemba were in front of him in the pecking order - we could have Smart, Teague or FastPP out there and they can still be running PnRs over and over while Jaylen is either in the corner or at the wing as an emergency bailout isolation scorer.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2021, 03:48:02 PM by Somebody »
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Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #76 on: May 21, 2021, 05:30:15 PM »

Offline cltc5

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How about instead of being pc come out and say something g inspiring like...we’re gonna fight like the dickens! Lol

Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #77 on: May 21, 2021, 06:00:12 PM »

Online Roy H.

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One major gripe I have with Brad this season is that he hasn't been utilising Brown all that well. It was common this year to see him have a huge quarter of feeding off of scraps (and he'll get a few possessions on the ball because teammates sense that he's hot) and proceed to stand in the corner the next 1-2 quarters in a way that almost looks instructed. This wasn't even because Tatum and Kemba were in front of him in the pecking order - we could have Smart, Teague or FastPP out there and they can still be running PnRs over and over while Jaylen is either in the corner or at the wing as an emergency bailout isolation scorer.

I wonder, though, how your observations played out over the course of the season.  There were definitely plays where Jaylin ended up in the corner, but I doubt it happened as much as you think it did.  JB put up over 19 FGAs per game, so he definitely got significant touches.  (Tatum ranks eighth in the NBA in front court touches; Jaylen is 22nd.). He was also extremely efficient per touch, which leads me to believe he was used mostly properly.



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Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #78 on: May 21, 2021, 06:31:50 PM »

Offline tenn_smoothie

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Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #79 on: May 21, 2021, 06:37:49 PM »

Offline tenn_smoothie

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Oh wow the bias is shining through with Goldstar and tenn surprise surprise.


Yep, I have a bias - I have hardly tried to hide it.

But, for future reference Rock, I don't think Brad Stevens is good enough to win a title.
Allowing your players to continuously make the same dumb plays over a few seasons is not good coaching.

How many of that is on the players and how many on the coaches? because from what fans of other teams say, the Celtics are more disciplined than their teams. Sure if you narrow your views to only focus on the Celtics vs your supposed "perfect way to play" it will get skewed. But at some point you have to realize what the coach could do is limited. What is he supposed to do, sit them every time they dont follow? Because if that's the case no one will play. Players will have bad habits, and at some point no matter what coaching it is they will stay the same. And you as a coach have no other choice but to play those players because you have minutes to manage and you have no other option.


So, the coach's role is to beg his players to play the right way and hope for the best ?? Ridiculous.

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Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #80 on: May 21, 2021, 06:48:07 PM »

Offline tenn_smoothie

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If they play like they played a few games this yr where they had great Ball movement, cutting to the basket, hitting their open shots, rebounded and played tenacious D ,then they have a shot at a game or 2 but I'm not holding my breath that they won't revert back to Hero Ball that's been allowed by Brad all yr. If that happens, then it will be a Sweep and the Games won't even be close. I'm hoping the Former.   

I would love to see the analytics on this. Good ball movement is prettier, but I wonder:  is it more effective on this team as currently constructed?

Part of me thinks that our best chance at winning is just to give Tatum the ball on every possession and have him make something happen. I am at the point where I prefer a contested Tatum shot to a wide open one from anybody other than Kemba or Fornier.

Pretty sure that when the Celts have surprised us with moving the ball the entire game and having players moving as well, they have won. Also seems like when our offense is dominated by Jason and Jaylen's iso dribble-the-air-out-of-the-ball approach, the Celts struggle, with the rare exception being games where they shoot the lights out. Just my memory, I could be wrong.
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Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #81 on: May 22, 2021, 06:17:58 PM »

Offline Somebody

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One major gripe I have with Brad this season is that he hasn't been utilising Brown all that well. It was common this year to see him have a huge quarter of feeding off of scraps (and he'll get a few possessions on the ball because teammates sense that he's hot) and proceed to stand in the corner the next 1-2 quarters in a way that almost looks instructed. This wasn't even because Tatum and Kemba were in front of him in the pecking order - we could have Smart, Teague or FastPP out there and they can still be running PnRs over and over while Jaylen is either in the corner or at the wing as an emergency bailout isolation scorer.

I wonder, though, how your observations played out over the course of the season.  There were definitely plays where Jaylin ended up in the corner, but I doubt it happened as much as you think it did.  JB put up over 19 FGAs per game, so he definitely got significant touches.  (Tatum ranks eighth in the NBA in front court touches; Jaylen is 22nd.). He was also extremely efficient per touch, which leads me to believe he was used mostly properly.
That was where my 'feeding off of scraps' comment is relevant - Jaylen found ways to score and create in spite of his role on the team by being a freight train in transition, a deadly catch and shoot scorer, making the most of his bailout isolation possessions, etc. A high efficiency per touch can definitely imply that a player is being used in an optimal role, but in Jaylen's case I see a player who's so good that he made a sub-optimal role look like an optimal one, and there's always the argument that a guy who's so efficient in a limited role should get an opportunity to play in an expanded role considering that Jaylen is a pretty skilled player from the eye test.
Jaylen Brown for All-NBA

Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #82 on: May 22, 2021, 08:04:16 PM »

Offline ozgod

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They were the Yankees of the NBA.
Oh, the Celtics are still the Yankees of the NBA, I mean, the last Yankee title was 2009(C's 2008) while their biggest rivals have won multiple championships, the Yanks have played in some recent ALCS's(like ECF's) while not making it back to the World Series(NBA Finals) and generally have fans that expect way too much given how competitive baseball(basketball for the Celtics) has become at the top of their league.


Celtics have way better uniforms

Celtics don't make their players style their hair a certain way so that they all look like extras from a mob movie set in the 1930s.
Celtics, Yankees and Canadiens probably have the best unis in all North American sports. Outside of North America, I always liked the Argentinian soccer national team's uniform the best.

I was (am) partial to the Brazil soccer uniforms, but the old style ones with the green collar and cuffs...very 70s

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Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #83 on: May 25, 2021, 10:02:19 PM »

Online Goldstar88

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Well, like Brad said “ Those guys are the best of the best, and going into that, if I'm a fan and just a general fan of the NBA, I have a hard time seeing them lose.”

Maybe he was just managing fans expectations. Trying to let us down easy...  :-\
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Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #84 on: May 25, 2021, 10:08:02 PM »

Offline liam

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Well, like Brad said “ Those guys are the best of the best, and going into that, if I'm a fan and just a general fan of the NBA, I have a hard time seeing them lose.”

Maybe he was just managing fans expectations. Trying to let us down easy...  :-\

Yeah, remember when in 1969 Bill Russell said " The Lakers just have a better team" and just rolled over.

Me either!

Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #85 on: May 25, 2021, 10:25:19 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Well, like Brad said “ Those guys are the best of the best, and going into that, if I'm a fan and just a general fan of the NBA, I have a hard time seeing them lose.”

Maybe he was just managing fans expectations. Trying to let us down easy...  :-\

Yeah, remember when in 1969 Bill Russell said " The Lakers just have a better team" and just rolled over.

Me either!

Brad hasn't rolled over, either.  The Celts simply can't compete, particularly without JB.

As he said, "we're going to have to play great, we're going to have to play great together and we're going to have to be really, really sound on both ends of the floor."

His assessment was right on.  Without great play, we don't stand a chance.


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Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #86 on: May 25, 2021, 10:52:19 PM »

Offline gouki88

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Well, like Brad said “ Those guys are the best of the best, and going into that, if I'm a fan and just a general fan of the NBA, I have a hard time seeing them lose.”

Maybe he was just managing fans expectations. Trying to let us down easy...  :-\

Yeah, remember when in 1969 Bill Russell said " The Lakers just have a better team" and just rolled over.

Me either!
Given how stacked the 60s Celtics were I'm not quite sure that's an apt comparison
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Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #87 on: May 25, 2021, 11:23:09 PM »

Offline radiohead

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I can’t believe Kyrie brought up the race card in relation to game 3 in Boston. Wow.

Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #88 on: May 25, 2021, 11:28:16 PM »

Offline Kuberski33

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Well, like Brad said “ Those guys are the best of the best, and going into that, if I'm a fan and just a general fan of the NBA, I have a hard time seeing them lose.”

Maybe he was just managing fans expectations. Trying to let us down easy...  :-\

Yeah, remember when in 1969 Bill Russell said " The Lakers just have a better team" and just rolled over.

Me either!

Brad hasn't rolled over, either.  The Celts simply can't compete, particularly without JB.

As he said, "we're going to have to play great, we're going to have to play great together and we're going to have to be really, really sound on both ends of the floor."

His assessment was right on.  Without great play, we don't stand a chance.

Roy you probably remember the phrase 'Celtics Pride'.  Doesn't exist with this bunch. Why should the fans care if the players don't?

Re: Brads comments on series vs Nets
« Reply #89 on: May 26, 2021, 12:24:35 AM »

Offline footey

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Difference between game 1 and game 2 was Harris. He destroyed us.