Perk said time to move on from Smart

[gift]

Salary reduction is important.

A better pick would be great. Would Orlando take Smart and our pick so we could take Scottie Barnes? Defense, passing and athleticism at power forward?

Yes, please.

No more questionable young guys. If this season has shown us anything, this team needs more proven talent and veteran leadership. I'm totally fine with trading Smart, but I want a player that's going to actually help this team from day 1.

The core of the team is young guys under contract. That's when you load up with young talent. Horford, Kyrie, Hayward are gone. Kemba probably will be too one way or another soon. Unless you're getting a true star, now is the time to acquire more young assets. No reason to reach for a second round or conference finals ceiling.

No reason to become a treadmill, lower seed that gets stuck in mediocrity. Because as long as Tatum and Brown are here, we're not going to be bad enough to bottom out and get high lottery picks. But if we're not giving them valid help, we're not going to be good enough to take the next step.

This team needs to add vets like Phoenix did by bringing in CP3 to pair with Booker and Ayton, or Philly did by bringing in Curry and Green to help stabilize the roster around Embiid and Simmons.

Boston already is a treadmill team though.  The way to get out of that is to add a potential 3rd star and the only real way for Boston to do that is to trade assets to move up in the draft and hope that player hits.

Exactly. Higher lottery picks don't just have a better chance of developing into stars, they generally have more value as an asset to roll into a trade for one. The goal right now should be acquiring a legit third star who fits with Tatum and Brown. That guy doesn't seem to be available right now. So the plan should be to take the next steps toward that goal even if it is a few moves and a couple years away.

[RJ87]

Salary reduction is important.

A better pick would be great. Would Orlando take Smart and our pick so we could take Scottie Barnes? Defense, passing and athleticism at power forward?

Yes, please.

No more questionable young guys. If this season has shown us anything, this team needs more proven talent and veteran leadership. I'm totally fine with trading Smart, but I want a player that's going to actually help this team from day 1.

The core of the team is young guys under contract. That's when you load up with young talent. Horford, Kyrie, Hayward are gone. Kemba probably will be too one way or another soon. Unless you're getting a true star, now is the time to acquire more young assets. No reason to reach for a second round or conference finals ceiling.

No reason to become a treadmill, lower seed that gets stuck in mediocrity. Because as long as Tatum and Brown are here, we're not going to be bad enough to bottom out and get high lottery picks. But if we're not giving them valid help, we're not going to be good enough to take the next step.

This team needs to add vets like Phoenix did by bringing in CP3 to pair with Booker and Ayton, or Philly did by bringing in Curry and Green to help stabilize the roster around Embiid and Simmons.

Boston already is a treadmill team though.  The way to get out of that is to add a potential 3rd star and the only real way for Boston to do that is to trade assets to move up in the draft and hope that player hits.

I disagree that the only way to acquire a 3rd star is through the draft. If that's the case, we're already in bad shape. Even if you manage to move up, you have to hope the guy is an All-Star ready to contribute out of the gate, and that isn't always the case. Contrary to popular belief, we don't have a ridiculous amount of time to develop a player. We've got 2 seasons before Jaylen enters the final year of his deal - there's not guarantee he doesn't ask out especially if the team is still middle of the pack.

[Moranis]

Salary reduction is important.

A better pick would be great. Would Orlando take Smart and our pick so we could take Scottie Barnes? Defense, passing and athleticism at power forward?

Yes, please.

No more questionable young guys. If this season has shown us anything, this team needs more proven talent and veteran leadership. I'm totally fine with trading Smart, but I want a player that's going to actually help this team from day 1.

The core of the team is young guys under contract. That's when you load up with young talent. Horford, Kyrie, Hayward are gone. Kemba probably will be too one way or another soon. Unless you're getting a true star, now is the time to acquire more young assets. No reason to reach for a second round or conference finals ceiling.

No reason to become a treadmill, lower seed that gets stuck in mediocrity. Because as long as Tatum and Brown are here, we're not going to be bad enough to bottom out and get high lottery picks. But if we're not giving them valid help, we're not going to be good enough to take the next step.

This team needs to add vets like Phoenix did by bringing in CP3 to pair with Booker and Ayton, or Philly did by bringing in Curry and Green to help stabilize the roster around Embiid and Simmons.

Boston already is a treadmill team though.  The way to get out of that is to add a potential 3rd star and the only real way for Boston to do that is to trade assets to move up in the draft and hope that player hits.

I disagree that the only way to acquire a 3rd star is through the draft. If that's the case, we're already in bad shape. Even if you manage to move up, you have to hope the guy is an All-Star ready to contribute out of the gate, and that isn't always the case. Contrary to popular belief, we don't have a ridiculous amount of time to develop a player. We've got 2 seasons before Jaylen enters the final year of his deal - there's not guarantee he doesn't ask out especially if the team is still middle of the pack.

It isn't the only way, but it isn't like star players come along very frequently nor does Boston have any really good assets to acquire said player (assuming neither Tatum or Brown is traded).  Now maybe it could be a Harden like trade where 4 1st round picks go out the door, but you can't be wrong on that sort of trade or it will devastate the team. 

And why would the rookie need to be an all star out of the gate.  Tatum and Brown are in the 4th and 5th year and just 23 and 24.  They are still a couple of years away from their prime.  That is when Boston should realistically be looking to compete.  I get it that there is a concern they might leave, well they are absolutely going to leave without drastic changes being made and changes that could realistically lead to championship runs.  I just don't see a path to acquiring an all star level player this summer, so the team should be looking to move up in the draft and hope they find that player.  Or acquire someone on their rookie contract still by taking on a bad contract.  Like taking on Wiggins to acquire Wiseman or the Minny pick.  Or taking on Westbrook to get Deni or Rui.  Things like that.  That is the path to possible contention and it is rapidly becoming the only path to contention. 

[Celtics4ever]

I don't think teams are going to be knocking themselves over to trade for our guys not named Brown and Tatum, and I find the idea of trading them unpalatable at best.  I think Pritchard and Nesmith are safe as well.  Fournier is a free agent but he seems worth possibly keeping.

Kemba, good luck trading that money with the gimp knees
Thompson, another hard sell
Smart, does some good things and some bad things do other teams value him as much as the Boston fans.
Rob, tremendous talent but always hurt.

Rest of the team, other GM hangs up laughing.

Everyone knows we 're in trouble and will drive hard bargains folks.

[SHAQATTACK]

Unfortunately I agree , he has peaked and his defense falls with age from now on .  similar to AB  , but AB s scoring improved as his youthful energy declined .  Smart and his three is giving all of Boston ulcers.

Rather spend smarts value on drafting a big fellow

Semi , waters and edwards  , need to find new careers or go to China with Sully

[wiley]

Not sure for what, but Golden State seems like a good trade partner involving Smart.
Or Spurs.

If traded, wherever he goes I'll wish him well.  Love players who play hard.
Definitely an all time favorite Celtic..

I think with PP and Fournier looking good I think we can finally afford to try to trade Smart for a good return.

[blink]

I don't think teams are going to be knocking themselves over to trade for our guys not named Brown and Tatum, and I find the idea of trading them unpalatable at best.  I think Pritchard and Nesmith are safe as well.  Fournier is a free agent but he seems worth possibly keeping.

Kemba, good luck trading that money with the gimp knees
Thompson, another hard sell
Smart, does some good things and some bad things do other teams value him as much as the Boston fans.
Rob, tremendous talent but always hurt.

Rest of the team, other GM hangs up laughing.

Everyone knows we 're in trouble and will drive hard bargains folks.

The bolded is what I am worried about.  If I am another GM, why do I want to make a deal to get Kemba or Smart?  Why don't I just wait a couple more years and maybe Tatum or Brown will be at a frustration level that they want out.  Only teams I could see interest from are those that feel they are a championship contender already and feel that adding Smart (kemba) really completes their team.  I don't see the market for Kemba and Smart being very big, and I see other GM's probably wanting to rake Danny over the coals.

[nickagneta]

I have brought this up in a few threads. Does Smart + #16 pick get the Celtics into the range to draft Scottie Barnes? Dangerous trade giving up one of the Cs 5 best players and a near lotto pick for a 19year old with a questionable shot but he could be perfect next to Tatum and Brown.

Even if a move like this were possible, getting younger is not going to fix what's wrong with this team.

Except age is not the problem with the team, talent is.  Boston needs talent if it truly wants to compete for a title.

Inexperience and age are definitely a problem with this team. It's not the only problem, but it is a huge problem.

Scottie Barnes isn't exactly a Cade Cunningham, Evan Mobley, LaMelo Ball, Luka Doncic, Jah Morant, Zion Williamson, Trae Young type prospect. It's not like he isn't a project that's going to take years to develop into a star, if he ever does. There's a more than good chance he turns into just another guy.

So not sure adding Barnes changes anything except losing great trade assets that could be used to upgrade the inexperience and lack of production this team has after it's top 6-7 players.

[RJ87]

Salary reduction is important.

A better pick would be great. Would Orlando take Smart and our pick so we could take Scottie Barnes? Defense, passing and athleticism at power forward?

Yes, please.

No more questionable young guys. If this season has shown us anything, this team needs more proven talent and veteran leadership. I'm totally fine with trading Smart, but I want a player that's going to actually help this team from day 1.

The core of the team is young guys under contract. That's when you load up with young talent. Horford, Kyrie, Hayward are gone. Kemba probably will be too one way or another soon. Unless you're getting a true star, now is the time to acquire more young assets. No reason to reach for a second round or conference finals ceiling.

No reason to become a treadmill, lower seed that gets stuck in mediocrity. Because as long as Tatum and Brown are here, we're not going to be bad enough to bottom out and get high lottery picks. But if we're not giving them valid help, we're not going to be good enough to take the next step.

This team needs to add vets like Phoenix did by bringing in CP3 to pair with Booker and Ayton, or Philly did by bringing in Curry and Green to help stabilize the roster around Embiid and Simmons.

Boston already is a treadmill team though.  The way to get out of that is to add a potential 3rd star and the only real way for Boston to do that is to trade assets to move up in the draft and hope that player hits.

I disagree that the only way to acquire a 3rd star is through the draft. If that's the case, we're already in bad shape. Even if you manage to move up, you have to hope the guy is an All-Star ready to contribute out of the gate, and that isn't always the case. Contrary to popular belief, we don't have a ridiculous amount of time to develop a player. We've got 2 seasons before Jaylen enters the final year of his deal - there's not guarantee he doesn't ask out especially if the team is still middle of the pack.

It isn't the only way, but it isn't like star players come along very frequently nor does Boston have any really good assets to acquire said player (assuming neither Tatum or Brown is traded).  Now maybe it could be a Harden like trade where 4 1st round picks go out the door, but you can't be wrong on that sort of trade or it will devastate the team. 

And why would the rookie need to be an all star out of the gate.  Tatum and Brown are in the 4th and 5th year and just 23 and 24.  They are still a couple of years away from their prime.  That is when Boston should realistically be looking to compete. I get it that there is a concern they might leave, well they are absolutely going to leave without drastic changes being made and changes that could realistically lead to championship runs.  I just don't see a path to acquiring an all star level player this summer, so the team should be looking to move up in the draft and hope they find that player.  Or acquire someone on their rookie contract still by taking on a bad contract.  Like taking on Wiggins to acquire Wiseman or the Minny pick.  Or taking on Westbrook to get Deni or Rui.  Things like that.  That is the path to possible contention and it is rapidly becoming the only path to contention.

Whether or not they spend in their primes in Boston remains to be seen. We can't just assume they'll be here for the long term, we see players force their way out of situations on a regular basis. Given Danny's inability to retain talent over the last 3 years and watching a other teams leapfrog us in the conference, I think Danny needs to show some urgency and some innovation for a change.

[PhoSita]

Everyone knows we 're in trouble and will drive hard bargains folks.

This is an important point.  Look at how the Celts basically got nothing in return for Daniel Theis because they had to move him last second at the deadline.  Theis is a useful player and the Celts basically a third string center on an expiring contract for him.


I wouldn't be surprised if other teams drive a very hard bargain this summer if the Celts look to make moves that would give them any kind of luxury tax relief.  If you're a competitor of the Celts, it would make sense to hold off making anything but a truly lopsided deal this summer, because if the Celts are unable to move salary in the off-season, they'll be truly desperate at the deadline next year to dump some guys and avoid a truly monumental tax bill unless the team is really rolling.

[hwangjini_1]

I don't think teams are going to be knocking themselves over to trade for our guys not named Brown and Tatum, and I find the idea of trading them unpalatable at best.  I think Pritchard and Nesmith are safe as well.  Fournier is a free agent but he seems worth possibly keeping.

Kemba, good luck trading that money with the gimp knees
Thompson, another hard sell
Smart, does some good things and some bad things do other teams value him as much as the Boston fans.
Rob, tremendous talent but always hurt.

Rest of the team, other GM hangs up laughing.

Everyone knows we 're in trouble and will drive hard bargains folks.

The bolded is what I am worried about.  If I am another GM, why do I want to make a deal to get Kemba or Smart?  Why don't I just wait a couple more years and maybe Tatum or Brown will be at a frustration level that they want out.  Only teams I could see interest from are those that feel they are a championship contender already and feel that adding Smart (kemba) really completes their team.  I don't see the market for Kemba and Smart being very big, and I see other GM's probably wanting to rake Danny over the coals.

we may never know for sure, but the article i read on celticsblog contradicts this narrative. ainge is widely respected on doing deals that help others (detroit, charlotte) and being up front on what he will and will not accept in trades.

as for kemba, there is a "market" for someone who can score 30 points in a night. the real question is what ainge can get in return, as you mention.

[nickagneta]

Everyone knows we 're in trouble and will drive hard bargains folks.

This is an important point.  Look at how the Celts basically got nothing in return for Daniel Theis because they had to move him last second at the deadline.  Theis is a useful player and the Celts basically a third string center on an expiring contract for him.


I wouldn't be surprised if other teams drive a very hard bargain this summer if the Celts look to make moves that would give them any kind of luxury tax relief.  If you're a competitor of the Celts, it would make sense to hold off making anything but a truly lopsided deal this summer, because if the Celts are unable to move salary in the off-season, they'll be truly desperate at the deadline next year to dump some guys and avoid a truly monumental tax bill unless the team is really rolling.

Didn't everyone know last year that Philadelphia was going to have to make trades and yet they were able to move an albatross contract and got Seth Curry and Danny Green in trades, all major reasons for their turnaround.

I don't buy that teams aren't going to deal fairly with Ainge or demand massive ransoms for trades. If Philly could make great trades when EVERYONE knew they needed to, I don't see why Ainge can't.

[gift]

Everyone knows we 're in trouble and will drive hard bargains folks.

This is an important point.  Look at how the Celts basically got nothing in return for Daniel Theis because they had to move him last second at the deadline.  Theis is a useful player and the Celts basically a third string center on an expiring contract for him.


I wouldn't be surprised if other teams drive a very hard bargain this summer if the Celts look to make moves that would give them any kind of luxury tax relief.  If you're a competitor of the Celts, it would make sense to hold off making anything but a truly lopsided deal this summer, because if the Celts are unable to move salary in the off-season, they'll be truly desperate at the deadline next year to dump some guys and avoid a truly monumental tax bill unless the team is really rolling.

It’ll be easy for someone to talk themselves into the Celtics assets. Other teams are not just sitting in some ideal stasis. They are figuring out ways to improve as well and they will be tempted by good deals and bad like someone is every year.

[Indocelts]

Agreed...I'm so sick of this "Marcus is the heart and soul of our team" crap....Dude does just as many Bad things as Good things on the court...probably more Bad. Perkins is correct.

Can’t agree more.
Shaqting Fool moments, flopping, hero balls... those are not the heart and soul of the Celtics. Embarrasing.

[gouki88]

"I think something drastic needs to happen and it's not firing Brad Stevens," Perkins said Tuesday on Celtics Pregame Live. "I think that Marcus Smart has ran his course. I think guys are tired of hearing his voice in the locker room. I think guys are tired of his ill-advised shot taking at times, some of his turnovers that he has.

"If Marcus Smart could be just a star in his role, and that means bringing that defensive intensity, diving on the floor for loose balls, those hustle plays on the other end, not trying to do so much. You can see it in people's body language, when he tries to do too much it deflates the team. So I do think the Celtics need to look into moving Marcus Smart this summer, to be honest with you. I think it's ran its course."

I don’t disagree.

I actually agree with Perk wholeheartedly, which makes me worry! How could anyone take Smart's 'leadership' seriously when he so constantly blows games single-handedly?