Does the loss to 76ers show our wings are not good enough?

[Rosco917]

Last evening the entire team had a total of 17 assists. Lebron averages nearly 11 per game alone.

Brown and Tatum have essentially the same basketball IQ, both aren't very good ball handlers, both are improving but hesitant passers, both are looking for "there's." Both are still young players right? So we either wait for them to hopefully mature, or realize that maybe they will never be able to play with each other.

Tatum shooting percentage is .420 nearly the lowest among 20 point scorers in the NBA. (The lowest being Lowery at .406, but he hands out 7.5 assists a game.) Smart while he has improved is shooting at .361. We have several of our most inefficient scorers taking high amounts of shots during the game.   

Kemba while being a heck of an offensive player is not generally regarded as a true PG. He's a "scoring point guard" and that's okay if the rest of the team has play making mindset...unfortunately the Celtics do not.

Too much of the time this team lacks BBIQ and general team chemistry.   

[Fierce1]

Last evening the entire team had a total of 17 assists. Lebron averages nearly 11 per game alone.

Brown and Tatum have essentially the same basketball IQ, both aren't very good ball handlers, both are improving but hesitant passers, both are looking for "there's." Both are still young players right? So we either wait for them to hopefully mature, or realize that maybe they will never be able to play with each other.

Tatum shooting percentage is .420 nearly the lowest among 20 point scorers in the NBA. (The lowest being Lowery at .406, but he hands out 7.5 assists a game.) Smart while he has improved is shooting at .361. We have several of our most inefficient scorers taking high amounts of shots during the game.   

Kemba while being a heck of an offensive player is not generally regarded as a true PG. He's a "scoring point guard" and that's okay if the rest of the team has play making mindset...unfortunately the Celtics do not.

Too much of the time this team lacks BBIQ and general team chemistry.

The lack of assists is because the Celts are very limited on offense.

It's either the 3-point shot from Kemba and the wing players or drives to the basket.

There's no diversity on offense for the Celts.

They are predictable!

[Fierce1]

All Celts fans watching the Celts this season already know that when the Celts are on offense, in a half-court set, they will do their thing at the top of the key.

They do it every time.

At least last season the Celts made a concerted effort to give the ball to Horford in the low post.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

It shows that the combination of Harris-Richardson-Thybulle are outplaying our wings. They have each game we've played them.

The next step in their development is overcoming these type of matchups who seem to have our number.

[Spicoli]

Ainge and Stevens are the problem. Ainge has refused to get this team guys with size and guys who are knock down shooters. Stevens runs a VERY predictable offense and his defensive sets are vulnerable to wide open mid range shots, and corner 3's. Also Marcus Smart needs to be traded asap. He thinks he is way better than he actually is. A very annoying player to watch.

[obnoxiousmime]

J&J have never been playmakers. If they were, combined with their measurables + Jaylen's athleticism they would have been overall #1 picks. The hope is that they will gradually improve that aspect of their game but I don't think anybody is expecting them to become LeBron or Doncic. They don't have that innate instinct or skill for passing that the absolute best players have.

On the plus side, they are not one dimensional because they can defend. In terms of shooting, Tatum is still working on his efficiency but based on past performance he should be better than he has been.

They can be really good #3 or even #2 players on a contender and that is pretty [dang] valuable. If you want to be extremely optimistic, you could even use Kawhi as an example of a player who wasn't a playmaker but was so great at everything else that he could win multiple titles.

The thing is, there's only so many guys out there that are true no. 1s and it's hard to get them. I don't think it's fair to criticize Jaylen and Jayson for not being at that level. You can wonder all you want about whether they are "good enough" but unless you have a realistic plan to replace them with something better, it's not really a useful exercise.

[vjcsmoke]

Well if they had drafted Giannis instead of Olynyk we’d be talking of trading away Brown or Tatum right now OR maybe we’d even have Giannis and Davis on the same team.   Celtics don’t have elite bigs but they are good enough if everyone else plays well.  Repeatedly losing to the Sixers suggest this might be a makeup issue.

[PhoSita]

No, I think it shows

(1) Philly is a bad matchup for this Celts team

(2) The Celts are real tired right now


I won't read into it any more than that.

[greg683x]

so many ridiculous hot takes on this thread.

does this team have weaknesses?  yep.

but most of all theyre just tired.

[gouki88]

so many ridiculous hot takes on this thread.

does this team have weaknesses?  yep.

but most of all theyre just tired.

Who’d have thought they’d be flat in their 5th game in 7 days? Lol. TP

[ozgod]

I think the loss shows that our wings are in a slump, not that they're not good enough. They've been pretty decent for most of the year, but because we've lost 3 everyone's wrist slitting and overreacting again. Let's see where they're at by the end of January.

[nickagneta]

One game proves nothing.

Does the game where Brown and Tatum both went for 30 or more prove anything? Does the game where all three wings went for 19 or more prove anything? Do the two games when Brown was out and Kemba, Jayson and Gordon all went for 20+ prove anything?

I can only imagine how over the top negative this blog would be if this team was playing at the 47-48 win pace most experts predicted for them and had a record of 21-15, instead of playing at the 57 win pace they currently are with their 25-11 record.

Spoiler alert people: This is not a 61-62 win team and never was. They were always going to have a losing streak/stretch of games where they play terrible. They will have another, most likely. They will also probably go on a real nice long stretch of winning basketball. They will probably finish with somewhere around 53-55 wins.

If they do that then as long as they are peaking in late April through to June, that's all that matters.

[PhoSita]

Last evening the entire team had a total of 17 assists. Lebron averages nearly 11 per game alone.

Brown and Tatum have essentially the same basketball IQ, both aren't very good ball handlers, both are improving but hesitant passers, both are looking for "there's." Both are still young players right? So we either wait for them to hopefully mature, or realize that maybe they will never be able to play with each other.

Tatum shooting percentage is .420 nearly the lowest among 20 point scorers in the NBA. (The lowest being Lowery at .406, but he hands out 7.5 assists a game.) Smart while he has improved is shooting at .361. We have several of our most inefficient scorers taking high amounts of shots during the game.   

Kemba while being a heck of an offensive player is not generally regarded as a true PG. He's a "scoring point guard" and that's okay if the rest of the team has play making mindset...unfortunately the Celtics do not.

Too much of the time this team lacks BBIQ and general team chemistry.

Or maybe ... just maybe ...


Assists are overrated.

Almost as overrated as individual rebounds.


The Celts have the 9th best offense in the league.  That rating has been higher but it's gone down a bit due to the slump.

They also have the 4th best defense.


So whatever flaws you want to point out with the core group at the top of this team, so far through nearly half the season they've played at an elite level on defense and a very good level on offense. 

That is the formula for contention, even if the thin bench and the lack of experience among the top guys on the team suggests that we shouldnt' really expect them to contend for the title this season.



There's no question that Jay & Jay have shown a tendency to revert to iso/hero-ball when jumpers aren't falling and things get tough.  They still do that this year even though they're doing it less than last year, when it was a teamwide issue that cost them too many games.


I think DWC is right to focus on matchup specific issues.  Why does the trio of Thybulle-Richardson-Harris do so well against the Celts? 


It may be the case that the Celts have an offense that can really blow mediocre defenses out of the water, but that doesn't have the extra gear necessary to easily get quality buckets against the best defenses.  Even so, in such matchups the Celts' own great defense may be enough to keep the game close enough to come down to a couple clutch baskets.

[Fierce1]

Here's the problem, the Celts are already 0-3 against the Sixers.

Celts lost when both Horford and Embiid were healthy.

Celts lost when Embiid was healthy and Horford was out.

Celts lost when Horford was healthy and Embiid was out.

This is just not one game.

The flaw of the Celtics is magnified when they're facing the Sixers.

[Fierce1]

It's unrealistic to expect the Celtic wing players to score 20 or more every game.

If the Celts can't win when Brown and Tatum are not getting 20 points each then that means the Celts are a one trick pony.

Celts have no diversity on offense if that's the case.

Sixers beat the Celts in the first meeting when the Sixers were not shooting well from outside.

Sixers beat the Celts in the 2nd game when the Sixers shot well from the outside.

And in the 3rd game, the Sixers beat the Celts even their best player, Embiid, was not playing.