Kemba Walker (Kemba to formalize agreement on Sunday, pg 40)

[Who]

Another undersized score first PG. Great. Love those.

Always been a scorer. Not a playmaker or floor general. Frequently over-dribbles (ball stopper) and stagnates the offense (difficult for other scorers to play with). At his best when surrounded by 3&D role players that let him do whatever he wants with the basketball.

I have been impressed with his work ethic and how much he has improved throughout his career. He was an empty stats guy for the first chunk of his career but he has turned that around and become a quality player in his own right.

Not the type of player you want to build your team around. And I question how easy he is to play with given his style of play.

[Moranis]

Unreal you guys wanting Kemba so bad.  Let's move on as quickly as possible whatever the cost so we have good feelings again

It’s not about feelings, it’s about building a winning team.

Yea, to be honest I find it very confusing why any team would not want a top 15 player in the NBA that was still performing exceptionally with a horrible supporting cast in Charlotte.... he is also 29.. what is the issue of him signing with us?

It is all just a matter of if that is the best use of the cap space.  It might very well be, but it also continues Boston's trend of signing good to very good free agents, but not landing any great ones and at the end of the day you need great players to really contend for championships.  Walker is a very good player, but he isn't making this team a contender, so is the team better off using the cap space in a different manner.  I think that is the question.

It's a fair question, but is there any alternative way to use the cap space that you can think of that would help us more? Unless you think KD or Kawhi are coming here, I'm not sure what else we can do

I think I'd take a flyer on Cousins.  He at least has the potential to be great (and then sign someone like Rubio to man the point).  That said, the other option would be using the cap space as a dumping ground to collect assets, which can be used in the future (either as players to build around Tatum or as assets in trades).  Again, Walker may very well be the best use of the cap space, especially if Cousins isn't interested, but as we saw last year (with Horford) Boston isn't a contender so adding a player similar to Irving isn't going to make the team better (Irving is slightly better than Walker, though he is less healthy so they are probably about a wash as to total value).

Yuck.

Yea, I mean we basically could have had Cousins for 5 million dollars last year. The fact that we did not offer a contract of any sort (from any reporting I saw) suggests that we were not really interested. Cousins would also be 29 when the season starts and I am not sure if he is going ever be the same as he was. I think we have to hope that we can get a capable vet center at small money or the exception and then see what we could swing the memphis pick and smart or others from over the course of the season.

And that team isn't a contender.  That was the point I was making on why some may have hesitation signing Walker.  If the goal is to win a title, I don't think Walker is how you spend your money.  C's would probably be fun and certainly would be in the playoffs, but that shouldn't be the goal.  The goal should be winning a title and I don't really see a realistic path to title contention by using all of the cap space on Walker (and it is all of the cap space).  Cousins and Rubio probably don't lead to a title contender either, but I think that route would have a greater chance since Cousins has shown the ability to be a truly great player (and frankly Cousins and Rubio still might not equal the salary of Walker so there might be someone like Kanter also available - like all in the 10-12 million range).  Yes Cousins was great pre-injury and yes it is a tough injury to come back from, but he is now more removed from it and year 2 is almost always a lot better than year 1 (from a health/performance standpoint - which also applies to Hayward).

So what team is better and more likely to win a title in the next season or 2.  The one that gives Walker 32 million or the one that gives Cousins 12 million, Rubio 10 million, and Kanter 10 million (or however you shake it out).  Same amount of money being spent. 

[dreamgreen]

I'm fine with Walker he can be a beast, hope he does not become a ball pounding ball hog. But what in the world are we doing about an empty back court??

this is also a worry I have about him

But watching games in depth.... he is different than Irving

- goes to the line more. Doesn't shy away from contact
- doesn't always need to dribble/pound the ball before passing
- has a good spot up 3 point shot
- a terror in transition

- Also of course, a better defender.  Physical and more consistent effort

Those 2 are big ones! It's the reason KI is not a top 5 player he's soft. Walker will be far better in that regard.

[mmmmm]

It's not a reason to sign Walker, but there would be some delicious irony in Irving leaving, only for us to sign the guy who's basically his closest replacement except with better chemistry, leading us to a deep playoff run while Irving either (a) languishes in BKN for a year while KD rehabs, or (b) goes crawling back to Lebron.

I truly hope you are right and we have good chemistry. Still a lot of mouths to feed. Kemba jacked up 20 shots a game last year in Charlotte at low efficiency. I'm really hoping he'll take that number of shots down considerably (along with his Usage%) to spread the ball around.

If he plays the same as last year in Charlotte he won't work here IMO.

A scoring efficiency of 55.8% is not 'low efficiency'.   It is well above average, especially at his high 31.5% USG.  His TS% has been between 55.4% - 57.2% all of his past four seasons.   That's similar to Kyrie's efficiency before he came to BOS.

Put him on a roster with much better offensive weapons around him like he'd have here and that TS% likely improves. 

[Tr1boy]

I’m not sure why we would target a high price PG when we have a starting quality PG who bleeds Celtics pride on the roster. we have a much greater need for a center.

I’d much rather absorb Adams or Capela into space and sign a mid level type back up point guard.

OR

you can sign Kemba and use the mid level to sign Vonleh

Adams nor Capela fit into CBS system (starter).  He wants guys who can shoot (thats why even Baynes was encouraged to shoot the open 3). Adams is 0-7 in 3 pt shots for his career.  Capela also doesn't shoot the 3

If those kind of centers fit into the system

Danny/CBS would have drafted Bidatze or Bruno Fernado.  Not Grant Williams imo

[lbgreen33]

Prime Kemba Walker?

Yes SIR, please.

Dude just turned 29 in May...currently in his prime...

"IF" Kyrie is indeed out the door - why NOT Kemba? Why isn't the voting like 70 yes's and 10 or 20 no's?

The last player - IIRC - that was in a similar situation (age and contract-wise) with Kemba that we won the bidding war on was none other than Al Horford...and Big Al was HUGE for us during his time here..

Get Kemba if we can.........

Dude has Celtic DNA in him...hard worker...low-maintenance...team-player....seems to STILL be improving...

Nearly EVERY player that has walked through Coach Stevens' doors has improved in BOS...Kemba would be no different.

Get him, give him the rock and get the heck out the way.

I can get behind this man.

Until he becomes a ball dominant pg and complaints come in that certain players aren’t developing.  Then we’re stuck with an older version of kyrie/IT on a bad contract.  Yippppeeee!

Did you ever consistently watch him play?? I watched every game he played at Uconn. Went to games as well. Watched him every chance I could in the NBA. He took the shots when he had to!! That often resulted in a win! He is a great passer and great at finding the open man. He is a winner and would be a great Celtic, we can only hope it happens!

[nickagneta]

It's not a reason to sign Walker, but there would be some delicious irony in Irving leaving, only for us to sign the guy who's basically his closest replacement except with better chemistry, leading us to a deep playoff run while Irving either (a) languishes in BKN for a year while KD rehabs, or (b) goes crawling back to Lebron.

I truly hope you are right and we have good chemistry. Still a lot of mouths to feed. Kemba jacked up 20 shots a game last year in Charlotte at low efficiency. I'm really hoping he'll take that number of shots down considerably (along with his Usage%) to spread the ball around.

If he plays the same as last year in Charlotte he won't work here IMO.

I think you have to consider that Horford's, Rozier's and Morris' shots are now up for grabs. That's 30 shots that need to be distributed. I am not sure a starting center gets more than 8-9 shots in this offense and if Langford and Williams are added to the rotation(or vet mins that get PT over the rookies) they aren't taking a lot of shots. I think those shots could give Hayward, Brown and Tatum somewhere between 3-5 more shots a game.  I can easily see

Kemba 18 FGA
Brown 13 FGA
Tatum 16 FGA
Hayward 13 FGA

And then people like Smart, the starting center, and the 7th man in the rotation all getting 8 FGA each then smaller numbers for players lower on the Totem pole.

[celticsclay]

Unreal you guys wanting Kemba so bad.  Let's move on as quickly as possible whatever the cost so we have good feelings again

It’s not about feelings, it’s about building a winning team.

Yea, to be honest I find it very confusing why any team would not want a top 15 player in the NBA that was still performing exceptionally with a horrible supporting cast in Charlotte.... he is also 29.. what is the issue of him signing with us?

It is all just a matter of if that is the best use of the cap space.  It might very well be, but it also continues Boston's trend of signing good to very good free agents, but not landing any great ones and at the end of the day you need great players to really contend for championships.  Walker is a very good player, but he isn't making this team a contender, so is the team better off using the cap space in a different manner.  I think that is the question.

It's a fair question, but is there any alternative way to use the cap space that you can think of that would help us more? Unless you think KD or Kawhi are coming here, I'm not sure what else we can do

I think I'd take a flyer on Cousins.  He at least has the potential to be great (and then sign someone like Rubio to man the point).  That said, the other option would be using the cap space as a dumping ground to collect assets, which can be used in the future (either as players to build around Tatum or as assets in trades).  Again, Walker may very well be the best use of the cap space, especially if Cousins isn't interested, but as we saw last year (with Horford) Boston isn't a contender so adding a player similar to Irving isn't going to make the team better (Irving is slightly better than Walker, though he is less healthy so they are probably about a wash as to total value).

Yuck.

Yea, I mean we basically could have had Cousins for 5 million dollars last year. The fact that we did not offer a contract of any sort (from any reporting I saw) suggests that we were not really interested. Cousins would also be 29 when the season starts and I am not sure if he is going ever be the same as he was. I think we have to hope that we can get a capable vet center at small money or the exception and then see what we could swing the memphis pick and smart or others from over the course of the season.

And that team isn't a contender.  That was the point I was making on why some may have hesitation signing Walker.  If the goal is to win a title, I don't think Walker is how you spend your money.  C's would probably be fun and certainly would be in the playoffs, but that shouldn't be the goal.  The goal should be winning a title and I don't really see a realistic path to title contention by using all of the cap space on Walker (and it is all of the cap space).  Cousins and Rubio probably don't lead to a title contender either, but I think that route would have a greater chance since Cousins has shown the ability to be a truly great player (and frankly Cousins and Rubio still might not equal the salary of Walker so there might be someone like Kanter also available - like all in the 10-12 million range).  Yes Cousins was great pre-injury and yes it is a tough injury to come back from, but he is now more removed from it and year 2 is almost always a lot better than year 1 (from a health/performance standpoint - which also applies to Hayward).

So what team is better and more likely to win a title in the next season or 2.  The one that gives Walker 32 million or the one that gives Cousins 12 million, Rubio 10 million, and Kanter 10 million (or however you shake it out).  Same amount of money being spent.

There is some talk that we would be able to add Capela to the team with Walker (it is unclear if this would come from a trade exception with Rozier, sign and trade etc).
Does a team of
Walker
Brown
Hayward
Tatum
Capela

= title contender?

I think it does. It needs Tatum to be an all-star and Hayward to return to all-star level, but I don't see why that team couldn't be in contention post warriors breakup.

[arctic 3.0]

I’m not sure why we would target a high price PG when we have a starting quality PG who bleeds Celtics pride on the roster. we have a much greater need for a center.

I’d much rather absorb Adams or Capela into space and sign a mid level type back up point guard.

OR

you can sign Kemba and use the mid level to sign Vonleh

Adams nor Capela fit into CBS system (starter).  He wants guys who can shoot (thats why even Baynes was encouraged to shoot the open 3). Adams is 0-7 in 3 pt shots for his career.  Capela also doesn't shoot the 3

If those kind of centers fit into the system

Danny/CBS would have drafted Bidatze or Bruno Fernado.  Not Grant Williams imo

If our starting 4 is Hayward/Tatum we are going to need a beast in the middle.

[footey]

I’m not sure why we would target a high price PG when we have a starting quality PG who bleeds Celtics pride on the roster. we have a much greater need for a center.

I’d much rather absorb Adams or Capela into space and sign a mid level type back up point guard.

OR

you can sign Kemba and use the mid level to sign Vonleh

Adams nor Capela fit into CBS system (starter).  He wants guys who can shoot (thats why even Baynes was encouraged to shoot the open 3). Adams is 0-7 in 3 pt shots for his career.  Capela also doesn't shoot the 3

If those kind of centers fit into the system

Danny/CBS would have drafted Bidatze or Bruno Fernado.  Not Grant Williams imo

If true, why did we draft Robert Williams first round last season? Not for his 3 point shooting.  Things change, Tr1boy.

[wdleehi]

Is there a better chance in signing an All-Star level player before the cap room is gone? 

Is there anyone better next year?   


The Celtics have two major holes now at PG and C.   Only PG has a player worth a max contract at this point.   

[ederson]

Is there a better chance in signing an All-Star level player before the cap room is gone? 

Is there anyone better next year?   


The Celtics have two major holes now at PG and C.   Only PG has a player worth a max contract at this point.

AD will be free agent next summer 😂😂😜

[Roy H.]

... we have a starting quality PG who bleeds Celtics pride on the roster ...

We might be stretching the meaning of “bleeds Celtics pride” here. Pouting, whining to the media, not playing defense, playing selfish offense... That’s not the ideal Celtic.

[keevsnick]

I'm very torn. On the other hand he is older, smaller and about 10% as a basketball player than Irving and it was obvious we weren't contenders last year. On the other hand he has been healthier than Irving, will only be a 4 year max and seems like a great guy.

But if we sign him that means we lost Horford, Irving, Baynes, Morris, Rozier and replaced them with Kemba. We would only have the Room Exception to get a big in the front court, and we probably need two. We could in theory get creative in sign and trades to get trade exceptions, ect, but that kind of this isnt completely up to us. In other words we are in a bind team building wise.

But he is a top 20 NBA player, and you don't really want to turn down a guy like that if you can get him. It just seems like he locks us on a path where it will be hard to get that top 10 level player you need to win it all, brown Tatum or Mem pick need to hit.

[arctic 3.0]

... we have a starting quality PG who bleeds Celtics pride on the roster ...

We might be stretching the meaning of “bleeds Celtics pride” here. Pouting, whining to the media, not playing defense, playing selfish offense... That’s not the ideal Celtic.

LOL, I was referencing Marcus Smart. Who could possibly associate my comment with kyrie?