Author Topic: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.  (Read 2994 times)

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Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #30 on: November 06, 2018, 03:51:11 PM »

Online Moranis

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Jamal Murray scoring 48 points killed the Celtics.  That and the C's bench getting crushed by the Nuggets bench.

Again - global assessment, not just a single game. Haywardís poor play certainly didnít help last night, but clearly Murray going off and the bench struggles (along with Bradís poor decision-making in the 2nd) were the primary culprits.
Jayson Tatum is the only starter with a positive on/off difference on the year at 11.1.  Brown is -1.7, Horford is -9.0, Irving is -9.2, and Hayward is -9.8, so while Hayward has been bad, he is in the same general range as Irving and Horford in the badness department.  Those 3 also all have a negative +- on the season.  Hayward has a better ORTG than Brown and has the 3rd best DRTG on the team and is the best starter (along with Horford) in that category.  He has a better TS% than Brown, a better VORP than Brown, a better WS than Brown, etc.

The simple reality is that Hayward is really not any worse then any of the other starters (except Tatum) when it comes to playing actual winning and losing basketball this year. 

Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #31 on: November 06, 2018, 05:27:26 PM »

Offline Boris Badenov

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Jamal Murray scoring 48 points killed the Celtics.  That and the C's bench getting crushed by the Nuggets bench.

Again - global assessment, not just a single game. Haywardís poor play certainly didnít help last night, but clearly Murray going off and the bench struggles (along with Bradís poor decision-making in the 2nd) were the primary culprits.
Jayson Tatum is the only starter with a positive on/off difference on the year at 11.1.  Brown is -1.7, Horford is -9.0, Irving is -9.2, and Hayward is -9.8, so while Hayward has been bad, he is in the same general range as Irving and Horford in the badness department.  Those 3 also all have a negative +- on the season.  Hayward has a better ORTG than Brown and has the 3rd best DRTG on the team and is the best starter (along with Horford) in that category.  He has a better TS% than Brown, a better VORP than Brown, a better WS than Brown, etc.

The simple reality is that Hayward is really not any worse then any of the other starters (except Tatum) when it comes to playing actual winning and losing basketball this year.

What's more, it's clear that he is trying to make plays and move the ball for a better shot, because he understands that our downfall has been settling for the first decent look we get.

Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #32 on: November 06, 2018, 07:21:21 PM »

Offline BringToughnessBack

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Put yourself in Hayward's shoes for minute:

*He needs to find a sense of comfort in his own body after a brutal injury.  He probably fears reinjury and questions if he'll ever play at the same elite level.

*He has missed an entire season of play at the highest level. He needs time to find his rhythm and adjust to NBA speed again.  He's probably relearning muscle movements after that much time off.

*He's probably concerned with fitting into a team he just watched succeed at a high level in his absence.   He now needs to find his role without disrupting that chemistry -- which he was robbed of last year -- and now he has to figure it out in the context of all these other challenges.

You psychopaths lack empathy.    :)

Not too mention never played regular season minutes with any of these players.

Brutal are we.....Hey Mr Brady, Mr Ortiz, would you mind heading to the minor leagues while you come back from a brutal injury instead of gaining valuable minutes with your new teammates?

Are we really this crazy over a few losses....by playoff time, we will be fine...probably by mid January at the latest.

I actually thought I saw glimpses of old Hayward last night. Not worried in the least.

Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #33 on: November 06, 2018, 07:30:23 PM »

Offline footey

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Letís be patient with Hayward. He clearly is not 100%, and probably wonít be for a couple of months. That was most evident when he got his shot blocked from behind last night. He has no lift. It has affected his confidence.

Gordon needs to play within his limitations and gradually, as they dissipate, he will one again be the guy he was in Utah. A stud.

Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #34 on: November 07, 2018, 07:16:24 AM »

Online IDreamCeltics

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Letís be patient with Hayward. He clearly is not 100%, and probably wonít be for a couple of months. That was most evident when he got his shot blocked from behind last night. He has no lift. It has affected his confidence.

Gordon needs to play within his limitations and gradually, as they dissipate, he will one again be the guy he was in Utah. A stud.

There's plenty of time to be patient with Hayward when he's playing in Maine.  He needs to get better, but more importantly he needs to stop being selfish and let the team gel.   

Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #35 on: November 07, 2018, 07:25:42 AM »

Offline gouki88

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Letís be patient with Hayward. He clearly is not 100%, and probably wonít be for a couple of months. That was most evident when he got his shot blocked from behind last night. He has no lift. It has affected his confidence.

Gordon needs to play within his limitations and gradually, as they dissipate, he will one again be the guy he was in Utah. A stud.

There's plenty of time to be patient with Hayward when he's playing in Maine.  He needs to get better, but more importantly he needs to stop being selfish and let the team gel.   
Just stoppppp dude

Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #36 on: November 07, 2018, 07:48:58 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Can we send the OP to Celticsblog our G league now?   JK

Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #37 on: November 07, 2018, 07:47:14 PM »

Online CelticSooner

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Instead of making a new thread I'll just ask this question here.

How much trade value do you think Hayward has at this moment? A 1 for 1 deal with no salary matching involved, which type of talent could the C's net in return? Just curious.

Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #38 on: November 07, 2018, 07:48:44 PM »

Offline gouki88

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Instead of making a new thread I'll just ask this question here.

How much trade value do you think Hayward has at this moment? A 1 for 1 deal with no salary matching involved, which type of talent could the C's net in return? Just curious.
It would probably depend a lot on the team. I reckon a team like Houston or Toronto would love him in this no salary matching required scenario, as he can only really get better. As it stands his value would have to be at its lowest point in basically 5 years though

Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #39 on: November 07, 2018, 08:50:09 PM »

Online moiso

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Instead of making a new thread I'll just ask this question here.

How much trade value do you think Hayward has at this moment? A 1 for 1 deal with no salary matching involved, which type of talent could the C's net in return? Just curious.
Maybe Butler since heís looking for a trade.

Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #40 on: November 08, 2018, 08:51:49 AM »

Online IDreamCeltics

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Instead of making a new thread I'll just ask this question here.

How much trade value do you think Hayward has at this moment? A 1 for 1 deal with no salary matching involved, which type of talent could the C's net in return? Just curious.
Maybe Butler since heís looking for a trade.

Not even close. 

I'd say he's around Trevor Ariza, Wilson Chandler, or Jae Crowder in terms of trade value right now.  He's a solid veteran forward who lacks the athletic ability to win games on his own or make wow plays, but you could still plug him into most teams and have a solid contributor.


This was the danger of offering max money to a player who was 27 and peaking in value without ever sniffing a spot among the top 15 players in the league.

it obviously worked out as badly as possible for the Celtics and no one wanted this, but it is what it is.   

Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #41 on: November 08, 2018, 11:52:24 AM »

Offline green_bballers13

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Trade Hayward? Yes, but just to dump $ to pay someone else a lot of money. Otherwise, I don't see the point in moving an appreciating asset (coming off injury) that has respect in the locker room and has a link to the coach. He's a good locker room guy. He's not playing that well, but he's been contributing in the hustle categories.

The Celtics have a chance to win the whole thing this year. I still think patience is the name of the game with this young team. Hayward seems like the kind of guy that will go off in a big playoff game. Look at Hayward's time in Butler, then compare that athlete to what you see today. He has certainly improved as a pro and I have faith that he can recover from a bad injury.

Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #42 on: November 08, 2018, 01:24:34 PM »

Offline unclebay

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He's coming back from an injury,  I don't know if any of you recall, where he SNAPPED HIS ANKLE IN HALF. He's already catching lobs which is a huge step. He's gonna get back to the player he was it just takes some time. And some of you are talking about trading him? Really?
The lack of foresight from some of you on this board is astounding. Mind-boggling.

Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #43 on: November 09, 2018, 08:13:09 AM »

Online IDreamCeltics

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Another 8 points, another $360,000 game check for Hayward. 

Re: Hayward is Killing Us. Needs Some Time in the G League to Rebuild Himself.
« Reply #44 on: November 09, 2018, 08:24:52 AM »

Online GreenEnvy

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Another 8 points, another $360,000 game check for Hayward.

Youíre troll game is weak. Maybe go back into old threads and see how to really get under peopleís skin.

Hayward is like 4 months removed from a second surgery. That was a setback that many tend to overlook.

Heís getting there. Heís going to get back to the player he was. Thatís not unrealistic at all. Heís got the intelligence and talent to not need to rely only on athleticism, which he will continue to get back.
I AM A CELTIC

 

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