If you would have told me Kyrie would be the starting pg for next season....

[Surferdad]

Nah, I'd rather have 1 year of IT, then sign him to max through his 30s... and a less then 1% chance of getting a player in 2018 that 6 years from now could develop into a Kyrie Irving type talent.

Those two things are better then getting a 25 year champion gold medal all star who hit the most clutch shot in game 7 nba finals history to defeat the greatest team that was ever assembled.

You forgot that that 2020 second round pick could turn out to become another IT4.

Yeah, the brilliant Shannon Sharpe thinks THAT was the most important factor.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BxrfJI4e-Ec
             

[Tr1boy]

I will not stand for this disrespect of NBA Champion Aron Baynes.

Oops.

[Tr1boy]

Nah, I'd rather have 1 year of IT, then sign him to max through his 30s... and a less then 1% chance of getting a player in 2018 that 6 years from now could develop into a Kyrie Irving type talent.

Those two things are better then getting a 25 year champion gold medal all star who hit the most clutch shot in game 7 nba finals history to defeat the greatest team that was ever assembled.

You forgot that that 2020 second round pick could turn out to become another IT4.

Really?? Cmon now

[jambr380]

But, he's got more flaws to his game than a healthy IT does.

IT is not healthy and there is a chance the injury is going to be chronic, sadly.

Yeah, I mean if we could guarantee another 4-5 years like this past one from IT, then nobody would have been happy with this trade. What IT has given us and what he might give us in the future are two entirely different things.

Like everybody, I hated giving up the BKN pick, but that is part of the business and Ainge has earned the right to do whatever he thinks is best (within reason). Making our competitive core younger is probably a really great idea considering GSW likely has at least a couple of more years of easy championships.

[mainevent]

Some of you guys are going to be disappointed by Kyrie's "leadership" and defense, along with his ability and willingness to pass. I'm guessing that those praising him for such things haven't followed Kyrie's career closely.

Somehow I knew you would show up here dousing the flames Lol...by midseason you'll be singing a different tune my brother.  I'd be happy to put a private wager on it if you're game. 

[Roy H.]

Some of you guys are going to be disappointed by Kyrie's "leadership" and defense, along with his ability and willingness to pass. I'm guessing that those praising him for such things haven't followed Kyrie's career closely.

Somehow I knew you would show up here dousing the flames Lol...by midseason you'll be singing a different tune my brother.  I'd be happy to put a private wager on it if you're game. 

About the defense, leadership and passing? I'd be happy to be wrong, but sometimes a player is who he is.  He'll be entertaining on offense, but entertainment and winning don't always go hand in hand.

If I change my POV, that's a good thing, and feel free to call me out on it.

[jpotter33]

Some of you guys are going to be disappointed by Kyrie's "leadership" and defense, along with his ability and willingness to pass. I'm guessing that those praising him for such things haven't followed Kyrie's career closely.

Or it's just as likely that the naysayers will be proven wrong when a change of scenery, more functional environment, and better basketball system peaks Kyrie's potential, making him a more willing facilitator and better defender and leader.

It's not like there's recent precedence with this in Boston and Stevens' system, like say Jordan Crawford, Evan Turner, Isaiah Thomas, and Jae Crowder.

[Roy H.]

Some of you guys are going to be disappointed by Kyrie's "leadership" and defense, along with his ability and willingness to pass. I'm guessing that those praising him for such things haven't followed Kyrie's career closely.

Or it's just as likely that the naysayers will be proven wrong when a change of scenery, more functional environment, and better basketball system peaks Kyrie's potential, making him a more willing facilitator and better defender and leader.

It's not like there's recent precedence with this in Boston and Stevens' system, like say Jordan Crawford, Evan Turner, Isaiah Thomas, and Jae Crowder.

I don't think it's "just as likely" that a guy will dramatically improve just because he's in a different city. It's possible, but 50/50? No way.

[jpotter33]

Some of you guys are going to be disappointed by Kyrie's "leadership" and defense, along with his ability and willingness to pass. I'm guessing that those praising him for such things haven't followed Kyrie's career closely.

Probably you right
But i really appreciate your positivity about Irving in every thread   

He's a great scorer and probably has the best handle in the NBA. He's a legit all-star.

But, he's got more flaws to his game than a healthy IT does.

This just simply isn't true.

And it's comparing apples and oranges without considering context.

It's easy to criticize Kyrie's facilitation in a system that is predicated on iso ball.

I don't understand how people are seemingly forgetting that context matters when we've seen how much it matters in several Boston players the last several years. IT, Crowder, Turner, Crawford, etc. are all players who got substantially better and more team-focused in our system.

It seems much more likely that Kyrie, with his insanely high talent and skill level, will follow this trend than break it.

[jpotter33]

Some of you guys are going to be disappointed by Kyrie's "leadership" and defense, along with his ability and willingness to pass. I'm guessing that those praising him for such things haven't followed Kyrie's career closely.

Or it's just as likely that the naysayers will be proven wrong when a change of scenery, more functional environment, and better basketball system peaks Kyrie's potential, making him a more willing facilitator and better defender and leader.

It's not like there's recent precedence with this in Boston and Stevens' system, like say Jordan Crawford, Evan Turner, Isaiah Thomas, and Jae Crowder.

I don't think it's "just as likely" that a guy will dramatically improve just because he's in a different city. It's possible, but 50/50? No way.

Sure it is.

What are the two biggest knocks in Kyrie's game? His willingness to facilitate/propensity for isolation ball and his defense, right?

What are two things that Boston emphasizes strongly that Cleveland really underemphasizes - ball movement/motion offense and defense.

Given that this exact thing has happened recently with several other Boston players, it's completely reasonable to think the same will happen with Kyrie.

Hell, while not to the extreme of Kyrie due to a bit differing context, IT himself should be a case study for what can happen to Kyrie here.

[Fafnir]

My baseline expectation is that he'll provide similar production to IT offensively (in a different fashion as they're different players).

Beyond that I'm hopeful that the defensive lineup data is correct and while he is a bad defensive PG, he isn't a walking lineup killer on that end of the court like IT is.

If he grows as an offensive player to truly become a top 10 player in the league I'll be estatic, but now we're relying on Tatum/Brown becoming very special or another piece later on.

[green_bballers13]

Some of you guys are going to be disappointed by Kyrie's "leadership" and defense, along with his ability and willingness to pass. I'm guessing that those praising him for such things haven't followed Kyrie's career closely.

Or it's just as likely that the naysayers will be proven wrong when a change of scenery, more functional environment, and better basketball system peaks Kyrie's potential, making him a more willing facilitator and better defender and leader.

It's not like there's recent precedence with this in Boston and Stevens' system, like say Jordan Crawford, Evan Turner, Isaiah Thomas, and Jae Crowder.

I don't think it's "just as likely" that a guy will dramatically improve just because he's in a different city. It's possible, but 50/50? No way.

Ok, your bait worked. I'd love to hear about more of his lack of leadership on Lebron James' team.

[green_bballers13]

Some of you guys are going to be disappointed by Kyrie's "leadership" and defense, along with his ability and willingness to pass. I'm guessing that those praising him for such things haven't followed Kyrie's career closely.

Probably you right
But i really appreciate your positivity about Irving in every thread   

He's a great scorer and probably has the best handle in the NBA. He's a legit all-star.

But, he's got more flaws to his game than a healthy IT does.

I think I disagree w this, but I'm not sure about your list of flaws.

I do know that the 5'8 to 6'3 height difference is a big factor (6-7 inches, depending on your belief of IT's height). Kyrie is tall enough to play good defense and IT might be too small.

Also Kyrie has proven his ability to win an NBA championship. IT has not.

I do not consider IT to be a top 5 passer. Nor do I consider Kyrie to be one. I do consider them both to be top 5 ball handlers.

I feel that you are underrating IT's age and size compared to Kyrie.

[Boris Badenov]

Over the past couple of years Brad Stevens had to deal with the single biggest defensive liability in the league at PG, AND he had to deal with (probably) the biggest offensive liability in the league at SG.

Are we really so pessimistic that Stevens won't be able to manage Kyrie's weaknesses better than his previous coaches?

[Roy H.]

^?Random examples:

1. He demanded a trade from a championship team to get more of the spotlight;

2. He refused to talk with teammates for two days in the playoffs;

3. He "led" his team to a 4-23 record without Lebron;

4. He and Dion Waiters clashed, to the point of a rumored fight. Kyrie allegedly froze Waiters out of the offense;

5. He had "communication issues" with Davis Blatt;

6. He threatened not to re-sign in Cleveland unless they fired Mike Brown;

7. He pouts on the court, which has been noted repeatedly in the media. He skipped Fan Appreciation Night;

Just go back and read media from 2014, before Lebron got there. Kyrie was being savaged by media and other GMs for his immaturity. Byron Scott noted he "changed" (in a negative way) after he made his first All-Star game.