Author Topic: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...  (Read 70828 times)

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Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #150 on: August 26, 2017, 04:24:07 AM »

Online Ogaju

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Anyone else laughing knowing IT isn't getting a brinks truck from anyone? Offer him 2 years 10 mill

I am laughing because I've been saying for the longest time that he's not getting a max deal.  I think that Thomas played hurt in the playoffs and refused surgery because he doesn't want the team to play without him.  When he first went down early in the season there was talk that the team was better without him.   When we beat Cleveland in the playoffs there was talk that the team was better without him.   The truth is that the team played differently without him and in a way that's better but again in a way it's not.  Thomas was the only player on the team last year that was the legitimate 20-point a game score and could get his own shot anytime he wanted.  However after turning over two-thirds of the roster we are left with a team where Thomas is not the only one that can get 20 points a game and is not the only one that can get his own shot.  So while last year's Celtics team desperately needed Isaiah Thomas this year Celtics team , who can't use a 20-point game score, doesn't have the same level of Need for Thomas that we had last year.  And the biggest issue for Thomas with that is in regards to his usage when Thomas is a high-usage player we see that he plays an All-Star level but when Thomas is a lower usage player because the team doesn't need him to do what he's been doing for Boston he's not an All-Star player and he is that guy that went from Phoenix to Sacramento to us.  Because Thomas really only impacts the game and one way and that's scoring when he's not doing it at a high level he is a complete and utter liability.  Take for example of player like Marcus Smart or Tony Allen a defensive specialist would not scoring any points is still providing very useful skill to the team.  Even a player like Kelly Olynyk when he wasn't scoring over 20 points his presence on the floor his ability to stretch the floor his ability to defend that a higher level than many people give him credit for his basketball IQ visibility to set up plays all these little things that he was doing setting a good screen to allow another player to make a shot these are all reasons why Kelly Olynyk earn Court time even when he wasn't scoring lots of points.  Danny gave up more than Oklahoma did to get Paul George and more than Minnesota did to get Butler because Boston and Cleveland both know that Thomas is done last season was a one-year wonder and with his hip he's going to lose a step and the way he plays just losing one step he has nothing left to give.  Other players can still play and contribute in a meaningful way after having lost a step, like for example Grant Hill, but Isaiah Thomas losing just a little bit of a step he's completely useless on the court.

So let me get this straight, a defensive specialist who can't score is still very useful, while an offensive specialist who can't defend is not?

Defensive players are a tad bit overrated. Even the best defenders get scored on. And the worst defenders' player do miss. But how many defensive specialists can you give the ball to and have them create/make their own shot?

To put it simpler. You and I would be terrible NBA players on both sides. But don't you think we'd be more inclined to get get a stop (most likely just a miss, hopefully contended but most likely not) than to actually score?

Scoring will always be harder to do. Would you rather be up one with 10 seconds to go and their ball or down one with 10 ticks, your ball?

And saying IT was a "one-year wonder" shows your ignorance. Prior to this past season, he was a multi-season 20ppg and all-star. Guys with that resume - and not a 29ppg, All-NBA, conference finalist, MVP-caliber season under their belt - get max contracts. Just think, how many 20+ppg all-stars aren't making (near-)max money that aren't still on their rookie contracts?

Now the hip may be an issue. We'll see how that plays out. But assuming he's healthy, he will get paid.

He did not say anything about IT's defense. All he said is that he only impacts the game by scoring, and since Danny brought in more scorers there is less of a need for IT.

Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #151 on: August 26, 2017, 04:25:50 AM »

Offline RockinRyA

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Ainge will look like a complete idiot if this trade gets voided. Essentially stuck with a disgruntled player with very little trade value. smh
No, he would not look like an idiot. He would be vindicated as he almost got Kyrie for a hobbled PG, a journeyman SF, and a lottery chance. That is a bargain.

This is my take on the issue, too. It just makes the trade look even better from our end, and it highlights why the unprotected Brooklyn pick was probably necessary to get the trade done.

yes, rather than us losing the trade, if IT was hurt, we wouldve won the trade.

Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #152 on: August 26, 2017, 04:50:39 AM »

Offline j804

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http://nypost.com/2017/08/26/not-so-fast-kyrie-irving-isaiah-thomas-trade-in-jeopardy/

Irving is supposed to be in Boston tomorrow for his physical. What a disaster.

If this falls through I'll be so p---ed.
"7ft PG. Rondo leaves and GUESS WHAT? We got a BIGGER point guard!"-Tommy on Olynyk


Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #153 on: August 26, 2017, 05:05:08 AM »

Offline biggs

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Yup, time for hardball Danny. Put some protections on that pick, or give them the Lakers pick. If they don't bite, walk away. This offer will still Trump any other offer in the league
Truuuuuuuuuth!

Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #154 on: August 26, 2017, 06:10:24 AM »

Offline GreenFaith1819

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Yup, time for hardball Danny. Put some protections on that pick, or give them the Lakers pick. If they don't bite, walk away. This offer will still Trump any other offer in the league



Agreed.

No one can offer CLE more than we did.

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Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #155 on: August 26, 2017, 06:18:55 AM »

Offline Jvalin

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Yup, time for hardball Danny. Put some protections on that pick, or give them the Lakers pick. If they don't bite, walk away. This offer will still Trump any other offer in the league
Why would they bite? They have a deal in place. If anything, they are gonna ask for more, not for less.


Anyway, I really hope the deal falls through and we keep the pick. Ainge got lucky once in 2015 when he was willing to bet the farm on Justise Winslow. Hopefully, he gets lucky once again. I get that IT is most likely p---ed off at Ainge right now, but still, I don't want us to lose the Brooklyn 2018 pick.

Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #156 on: August 26, 2017, 06:20:38 AM »

Offline mqtcelticsfan

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Yup, time for hardball Danny. Put some protections on that pick, or give them the Lakers pick. If they don't bite, walk away. This offer will still Trump any other offer in the league

Yes, if Cleveland is looking to renegotiate, it definitely makes sense to lower your offer. Cleveland would definitely become more inclined to ignore IT's hip if the Brooklyn pick gets worse.

Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #157 on: August 26, 2017, 06:37:45 AM »

Offline jbpats

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Trade was a mistake from the start. Could care less if it gets voided and hope it does.
Thomas walks away for nothing at the end of the year? Small loss.
Recouping the BRK pick, huge win.
We weren't winning anything with Uncle Drew, I'm not buying he was going to resign so assuming he left in two year what's did we gain? Another ECF loss to Cleveland MAYBE two losses in the finals to the Dubs? This is the Celtics, Eastern Conference champion accolades don't get raised to the rafters.

Our window is 3-5 years out. Tatum, Brown, that Brooklyn pick, lakers pick and Memphis pick are our future and best chance to win a championship. We're not winning anything until the warriors ride off into the sunset.
Stay the course. Patience will virtue, follow the Warriors model, build within and the next Durant will come for pennies on the dollar just to get his ring.

This trade got us nothing but a bad rep in the league.

Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #158 on: August 26, 2017, 06:48:37 AM »

Offline LatterDayCelticsfan

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I reckon we should just hang tight until the front offices get round to doing what they have to do. Assuming anything will  I come if this injury concern. After all this is August in the NBA news cycle.
We have the Timelord and Spacelord. Now we need the Soul Lord, Power Lord, Reality Lord, and Mind Lord

Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #159 on: August 26, 2017, 06:57:23 AM »

Offline RockinRyA

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Trade was a mistake from the start. Could care less if it gets voided and hope it does.
Thomas walks away for nothing at the end of the year? Small loss.
Recouping the BRK pick, huge win.
We weren't winning anything with Uncle Drew, I'm not buying he was going to resign so assuming he left in two year what's did we gain? Another ECF loss to Cleveland MAYBE two losses in the finals to the Dubs? This is the Celtics, Eastern Conference champion accolades don't get raised to the rafters.

Our window is 3-5 years out. Tatum, Brown, that Brooklyn pick, lakers pick and Memphis pick are our future and best chance to win a championship. We're not winning anything until the warriors ride off into the sunset.
Stay the course. Patience will virtue, follow the Warriors model, build within and the next Durant will come for pennies on the dollar just to get his ring.

This trade got us nothing but a bad rep in the league.

Okay, this is simply wrong. There's no way the GS situation is gonna repeat itself. It was only made possible by the massive rise in cap.

Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #160 on: August 26, 2017, 07:05:41 AM »

Offline jbpats

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Trade was a mistake from the start. Could care less if it gets voided and hope it does.
Thomas walks away for nothing at the end of the year? Small loss.
Recouping the BRK pick, huge win.
We weren't winning anything with Uncle Drew, I'm not buying he was going to resign so assuming he left in two year what's did we gain? Another ECF loss to Cleveland MAYBE two losses in the finals to the Dubs? This is the Celtics, Eastern Conference champion accolades don't get raised to the rafters.

Our window is 3-5 years out. Tatum, Brown, that Brooklyn pick, lakers pick and Memphis pick are our future and best chance to win a championship. We're not winning anything until the warriors ride off into the sunset.
Stay the course. Patience will virtue, follow the Warriors model, build within and the next Durant will come for pennies on the dollar just to get his ring.

This trade got us nothing but a bad rep in the league.

Okay, this is simply wrong. There's no way the GS situation is gonna repeat itself. It was only made possible by the massive rise in cap.

How so? Thompson, Curry, Barnes and Green were all Drafted by the warriors. They made that team the desirable destination it is by starting the dynasty.. and simarly their dominance happened after the celtics, lakers and heat rode off into the sunset.
What trade of major draft picks put them there? I didn't see them trading curry for whoever for a chance to beat any of those teams. They waited it out and look
What it got them.

Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #161 on: August 26, 2017, 07:18:16 AM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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Sorry but isn't this WHY we gave up the Nets pick?

In other words, both the Cs and Cavs had to have acknowledged that the hip was an issue and therefore the other parts of the deal had to justify the trade.

I'll be surprised if the deal is refused by the Cavs (the haul is still better than theyll get elsewhere) and I'll be shocked and sick to my stomach if DA parts with an additional assert.   

Bottom line is that the Cavs grade becomes a B and the C's get upgraded to a B+ since this becomes a trade that helps the Cs in both the short and long term.
 

Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #162 on: August 26, 2017, 07:22:57 AM »

Offline KGBirdBias

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Told ya, Ainge is savvy. Even Stevie Wonder knew IT had a bad hip. It looks like Ainge rook'ed Altman.

Sure give the Cavs an extra pick or put protections on the pick but I would be shocked if the trade is voided because the Cavs really want that Nets pick.

You know Irving wants no part of going back to the Cavs.




Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #163 on: August 26, 2017, 07:25:26 AM »

Offline KGBirdBias

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Why wpuld anyone want this trade to fall through. IT wpuldnt be playing for us either with a bad hip. Let the Cavs worry about filling his role until he comes back.

Re: WojBomb - Cavs evaluating options after IT physical...
« Reply #164 on: August 26, 2017, 07:30:01 AM »

Offline jbpats

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Why wpuld anyone want this trade to fall through. IT wpuldnt be playing for us either with a bad hip. Let the Cavs worry about filling his role until he comes back.

Cavs have Rose, role is filled

 

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