By not making those moves and showing our older guys that we are committing to really competing right now, it made end up blowing up our chemistry anyway.
You said that above. Where was your statement during the Cavs game about the Celtics' chemistry getting blown up?
I will wait for that one versus game-play comments about forcing shots at the rim.
In the last week, IT has talked about being a Lakers fanboy, called out Crowder, and now called out Stevens. Those who were a little weary of giving IT a 5 year max before are now beginning to officially flip the switch.
Also now that the deadline has passed with Boogie officially done as a possibility and George/Butler being too expensive, I think many are now looking ahead toward the future rather than an immediate rebuild. This isn't wonderful for guys like IT and Horford (although I would gladly keep Horford for the duration of his contract), but AB, Smart, Brown, and Crowder could be here to stay along with the BKN picks and possibly Yab/Zizic. I would also love to bring in Hayward if he would come (not likely with IT gone, I know).
Honestly, the idea of a 'dynasty' has become more appealing now. I would never want to dump IT for peanuts or let him walk for nothing, but it might not be a terrible idea to gauge his value out there this summer. I don't think this is sacrilegious.
Pretty much this, especially the bolded part. TP.
Couple of things about this from you gentlemen
- Paul Pierce was a Laker fanboy. You can't help what teams NBA players loved growing up. So he said he would love to play for the Lakers some day, so what? Nerlens Noel said he would like to play for the Celtics. Should the Mavs not offer him a contract because of it. DeRozan said he wanted to be a Laker, he resigned in Toronto. I simply pay little attention to it.
- I think its a stretch to say IT threw Crowder under the bus. He described the play as he saw it.
- He criticized bad rotations. Not the time or place to do it but he wasn't wrong. And given I am pretty sure you were both okay with bringing Boogie aboard, I find it a tad bit hypocritical to want a player like that, who constantly is criticizing coaches and front offices in the name of competitive spirit, and yet want to trade IT because he did something similiar.
- Trading a star away after spending years trying to find a star is counterproductive. The only people flipping a switch ready to teade IT are fans who aren't really fans of IT. No one in the front office is ready to trade IT. He will be signed to a max, though my guess it is a 4 year max not 5.
- Lastly youth doesn't equal dynasty. There is zero guarantee that keeping these picks and developing them over the next 4-6 years will equate into one championship, never mind a dynasty. The list of teams that had lots of high picks and didn't become a dynasty are too much to mention.
1. I really have no problem with the Lakers stuff at all, and that has no bearing on my current mood towards IT. I've long said that I don't blame players that want to go play for their teams back home, such as Paul George in LA. Family is important. I'm a person that lives 8 hours from my family, and I can testify to how much I hate it, especially for my kids. It's not the exact same situation with IT, but it's similar. So I don't hold the Lakers stuff against him in any way.
2. I completely disagree. I think that play was completely IT's fault, and I detailed why (pretty logically and infallibly, I think) in my response to "mmmmm." And I think the video evidence pretty clearly backs it up. But once again, it's no big deal; every star makes mistakes like that. But him blaming that on Crowder is just beyond irresponsible to me. Crowder was the true leader that night in accepting blame for that.
3. Nope. While sometimes calling out the team for playing crappy or soft is necessary, coaches are off-limits in my book, at least to the media. You never publicly challenge the authority of the coach; that just reeks instability and dysfunction to me, just look at the whole Schroeder situation in Atlanta. I thought it was shameful when Lebron would do it, and I feel the same with IT.
And to bring up the Boogie situation just doesn't make sense to me, because it's not analogous in any way. In fact, the only way in which it is analogous is with Boogie and Mike Malone - who Boogie absolutely adored and never publicly questioned or criticized like this. Trying to compare the Boogie/Karl situation with something like this is just disingenuous and not applicable. Stevens is nothing like Karl; he's the epitome of professionalism. I've disagreed with some of his rotation decisions, but he's clearly brilliant and a top-5 coach in the league.
You don't bring your complaints to the coach about rotations through the media; you be a big boy and talk to the coach about your issues yourself. Furthermore, a star as flawed as IT has no room to be publicly criticizing anything. We're not talking about Lebron, KD, or Kawhi here; we're talking about a one-way star who might legitimately be the worst defender in the league. I'm not sure that he has any room to criticize anything given his shortcomings (pun half intended) defensively and how much he relies on his teammates and coach to cover for his defensive woes.
4. Don't be so certain. Danny's love for IT is well-known, but Danny is also big on chemistry and character. This is the third time that IT has criticized the coach publicly, and he's just as big of a fan of Brad as he is IT (see the whole Boogie sage and Brad not wanting to coach him for verification of this). I can't imagine that this sits well with Brad being called out publicly again, so when it comes to paying IT, I'm sure the coach is going to have an opinion. People are fooling themselves if they really think that Danny and Brad aren't concerned about these recent actions of IT, because that's not the actions of a true leader.
Also, I'm not arguing we should trade him for beans. We should gauge his value this summer, especially if we get Fultz or Ball, but that doesn't mean we should take 25 cents on the dollar for him. I'd make a good trade for him if it is there, but I wouldn't force anything. If it's not there, then just play out next year and see how things go. But if Fultz would prove to be ready to start and contribute at a high level after a year, I'd have no problem letting IT walk for the max elsewhere. None whatsoever. His trade value has never been high anyways, so it's not like you're losing out on much in the end.
5. True. But I'm okay with risking it. I also don't think you can win a chip with IT as your first, or even second, best player. He's just too much of a defensive liability to be reliable in the playoffs. When the going gets tough, the opposition will simply force switches and iso IT to death, and there won't be a [dang] thing he can do about it. We've already seen it multiple times this year, and we'll see it quite often in the playoffs.
There's risk in everything you do, even trading for stars now to try and win now. But there's a pretty good chance that Danny will be able to land (if he hasn't already) a franchise-level talent with one of those Brooklyn picks. I honestly already think he has in Brown. The amount that this kid has improved from the beginning of the season until now is just astronomical, and I think he has star written all over him. He might never be an MVP, but I see no reason why this kid couldn't be the best two-way wing in the game in 5 to 6 years. And I think Fultz might have an even greater ceiling, with Jackson;'s ceiling being pretty high, too.
Topic: IT Complaints: Fallout & Future (merged IT kvetching threads) (Read 31467 times)